Thursday, November 06, 2008

Obama and EU's Solana -- hand in hand through the New Age?

Yesterday I posted Javier Solana's effusive congratulatory congratulations to Javier Solana. The message enumerated some of the projects Solana hopefully planned to work with the USA's new presidential elect: Barack Obama. "The Projects"? Middle East, Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, climate change, non-proliferation . . ."

According to an article appearing today in EUOBERVER.COM, "[T]he Obama administration will play a big role in 'reinventing the international system, especially on the financial side, in strong partnership with the EU.'"

The speaker was David J. Rothkopf, a former trade official for the Clinton administration and claimed "expert on foreign affairs and emerging markets." The sponsor of the event was a long time internationalist operation known commonly as the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace."

The speech sounded so very much like Javier Solana's suggestions to the Brookings Institution in his Washington, D.C. "Managing Global Insecurity" speech of March 21, 2007.

It's all getting so very cozy out there. If Richard Lugar and Senator Charles Hagel are put up front, I expect even tighter relations with Javier Solana and the Obama administration. I also bear in mind that Joe Biden was quoted in the past as saying he wished he could vote for Javier Solana for President.

Maybe he did!



Anonymous said...


I fear that we might be seeing the pro-death brigade of the New Age, come out in full if they don't get their way.

Following up from the previous discussion of Rahm Imanuel

As an Illinois Congressman, Emanuel has voted against abortion restrictions with the same gusto as Obama, including a vote to strike down the 2003 federal partial-birth abortion ban. That year, he also voted against prohibiting U.S. tax dollars from subsidizing abortions. In 2004, he voted against the Unborn Victims of Violence Act, which nonetheless passed.

Another similarity between Obama and Emanuel lies in their support for homosexuality: in both 2004 and 2006 Emanuel voted against the Marriage Protection Amendment. Obama also refused to protect true marriage in his years as a legislator.

In 2005, Emanuel voted against parental notification and consent laws regarding abortions for minors. He then voted to protect federal funding of Planned Parenthood in 2007.

In more news gay activists threaten to burn down Mormon and Catholic churches over gay marriage ban.


Dawn said...


When I read this article I could help but think about carbon credits (aka redistribution of wealth).

Maybe I am reading to much into it. But that is what I saw. This is the beginning or how they will sell it.

Makes me wonder about Texas. I read some time ago that they have a grid system that can be separate from the rest of US.

Dawn said...

oh yes, I was struck with the statement of the person in your building. You mentioned that he said that Mr. Obama has so little foreign experience that the other guy would be the one leading.


OV! said...

LUKE 10:18
"And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as LIGHTNING fall from heaven."


Strong's Greek 913 & Hebrew Dictionary
Barak bar-ak'
an Israelite:--Barak.
baraq baw-rak'
a primitive root; to lighten (LIGHTNING):--cast forth.

Hussein \hu(s)-sein\ is pronounced hoo-SAYN. It is of Arabic origin, and its meaning is "good; small handsome one".

Strong's Hebrew Dictionary
1117. Bamah
Bamah baw-maw'
a place in Palestine:--Bamah. See also 1120.
Bamowth baw-moth'
heights of BAAL.

So we get:


OV! said...

ps, im NOT saying he IS satan, but a TYPE of antichrist, yes. not THE ACTUAL ANTICHRIST.
TYPE meaning what he says, policies, what he does and believes. there have been many TYPES throughout history that played this role.
i think God is letting us know what he really works for.

keep watching...

Anonymous said...

The CFR will make up a significant portion of the forgein ploicy crowd for Obama.
Richard Haass has been his forgien policy advisor - you can find his views and writings at - heres is a quick one him - he thinks all cvountries need to give up at leats a portion of their sovereignty to maintain a new order.


Anonymous said...

Last month we found out the World Bank’s computer system had been compromised for well over a year. Yesterday we learn that Chinese, Russian, and perhaps Israeli hackers have been uninvited guests viewing the Obama team’s internet communications for several months trying to determine what his policies are going to be. Well, isn’t it nice to know that the Europeans are taking the lead when it comes to “security” and “privacy” issues?

I like to use Scroogle Srcaper for all my internet searches, but last couple of days it’s been opening real slow, or not at all. The administrator of Scroogle warned users that Google could take them out any time they wanted. Going back to the next best engine, Ixquick, I noticed they now claim to have been awarded the first “European Privacy Seal”, in recognition of Ixquick’s efforts to protect user privacy. Of interest is the link “more information” which leads to another link, AOL Stalker, which demonstrates the ease of tracking Internet users.

With much closer ties with the EU expected, I would expect to see a push for a new "secure" internet being one of the first proposals coming out of the Obama adminstration.

I’m sure the “European Privacy Seal” will make everyone sleep better at night knowing their anonymous blog postings, emails, bank records, and search queries are all kept “private”.

Yeah, right.

Anonymous said...

Off topic editorial in Ivestor's Business Daily regarding Global Warming:

"Climate Change: It's been a bad year for global warming alarmists. Record cold periods and snowfalls are occurring around the globe. The hell that the radicals have promised is freezing over."

The editorial goes on to cite numerous record breaking cold temperatures and snow fall. It would seem God is mocking them.

In Him,


Anonymous said...

Newsbusters has an article regarding Senator Obama's choice for FCC Director:

"Henry Rivera, a longtime radical leftist, lawyer and former FCC commissioner, is expected to lead the push to dismantle commercial talk radio that is favored by a number of Democratic Party senators. Rivera will play a pivotal role in preventing critics from having a public voice during Obama's tenure in office."

Maybe we should return to referring to him as "the can of peas" - just a thought.



OV! said...

also, i think the LOGO Obama choose for his campaign is interesting. its basically the SUn rising. the "MORNING STAR".

Isa 14:12
How art thou fallen from heaven, O LUCIFER, son of the MORNING! [how] art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

Hebrew #H1966 dictionary:
LUCIFER = "light-bearer"
1) shining one, "MORNING STAR", Lucifer.

he also continues to talk about the DAWN of a NEW ERA, or "NEW AGE".

Dawn said...


I heard this audio on Glenn Beck this morning. It is from a documentary made in Finland. Note: This is a different link than was originally posted. I do not necessarily agree with everything else on this person's blog, but this information on this post is important.

Stop Common Purpose said...

Barack Obama is a Communitarian, although you will not have heard him use the term during his election campaign. Americans will get a shock when the truth of his hidden agenda becomes known and they find out his real intentions. Bear in mind that Obama is simply a front-man for the New World Order Communitarians.

More here: Common Purpose Communitarian philosophy

Anonymous said...


Just noticed that the video you linked to is on the front page of Drudge.

That poor, poor little girl, and that teacher--what a lying hypocrite.

Thank God, via Drudge, it's getting some publicity. Maybe some people will actually wake up?

Anonymous said...

To: OV!

Obama may be "working for" Javier Solana!!!

OV! said...

well, they are both working for the NWO, the forces of evil. this cycle will continue to contract like labor pangs and get BIGGER and CLOSER and FASTER until the climax or the appearance(BIRTH of new age) of ANTICHRIST claiming to be God standing in the temple showing signs and wonders in the sight of men.

Anonymous said...

FYI: Barack Obama is holding his press conference on TV now on all channels.

He is already talking about how our present economic crisis "requires a GLOBAL response."

Anonymous said...

I shouldn't have watched . . .

Boy, Obama could charm the socks off a snake!!!

He is "smooth as silk" . . . with his knowing the names of all the reporters questioning him (like JFK), etc.

We can only pray to God for a miracle conversion (yea right . . . like THAT'S going to happen).

What stood out to me the most though was that he mentioned that this economic crisis is going to "require a GLOBAL response" (red flag).

Anonymous said...

Hi All,

You should read this post at Lighthouse Trails blog:

"Now that the election is over, Lighthouse Trails has a question, and that is, What about the Department of Peace?

Right now in Washington DC, a group of New Age lobbyists are working diligently to get the government to establish what they are calling the U.S. Department of Peace. The chief lobbying organization--The Peace Alliance--was founded by New Age leaders Marianne Williamson and Neale Donald Walsch. In essence, the Department of Peace, should it become a reality, will be a means to enforce New Age based hate crime legislation."

"The legislation could very well lead ultimately to what Barbara Marx Hubbard calls the selection process, which is based on the New Age belief in order to stop the crises and turmoil in the world, all must go along with the plan, and resistance of any kind will be intolerable."

"Lighthouse Trails believes this governmental body will dovetail at some point with Rick Warren's global P.E.A.C.E. Plan. We can say this with the utmost confidence because of Warren's efforts to bring about what he calls a three-legged stool reformation where government, business (economy), and religion will come together to solve the world's major problems. In addition, because of Obama's support of Warren's P.E.A.C.E. Plan and his support for the $845 billion Global Poverty Act (which is bound to happen now), it's very likely that Warren's peace plan will get a financial shot in the arm from an Obama administration."

Read the entire article.

On Him,


Anonymous said...

Sorry, my closing should read In Him. I'm really struggling with typing these days.


Anonymous said...

From (11/07/08)
Meet some of president elect Obama’s leading foreign and domestic policy advisors and likely administration members, every one of them a prominent member of the Council On Foreign Relations.

Will these people bring about “change” or will they continue to hold up the same entrenched system forged by the corporate elite for decades?

Susan E. Rice - Council on Foreign Relations, The Brookings Institution - Served as Assistant Secretary of State for African Affairs under Clinton from 1997 to 2001. Former Secretary of State Madeline Albright is a longtime mentor and family friend to Rice. Critics charge that she is is ill disposed towards Europe, has little understanding of the Middle East and would essentially follow the same policies of Condoleeza Rice if appointed the next Secretary of State or the National Security Adviser.

Anthony Lake - CFR, PNAC - Bill Clinton’s first national security adviser, who was criticized for the administration’s failure to confront the genocide in Rwanda in 1994 and now acknowledges the inaction as a major mistake.

Zbigniew Brzezinski - CFR, Trilateral Commission - Brzezinski is widely seen as the man who created Al Qaeda, and was involved in the Carter Administration plan to give arms, funding and training to the mujahideen in Afghanistan.

Richard Clarke - CFR - Former chief counter-terrorism adviser on the U.S. National Security Council under Bush. Notoriously turned against the Bush administration after 9/11 and the invasion of Iraq. Also advised Madeleine Albright during the Genocide in Rwanda.

Ivo Daalder - CFR, Brookings, PNAC - Co-authored a Washington Post op-ed with neocon Robert Kagan arguing that interventionism is a bipartisan affair that should be undertaken with the approval of our democratic allies.

Dennis Ross - CFR, Trilateral Commission, PNAC - Served as the director for policy planning in the State Department under President George H. W. Bush and special Middle East coordinator under President Bill Clinton. A noted supporter of the Iraq war, Ross is also a Foreign Affairs Analyst for the Fox News Channel.

Lawrence Korb - CFR, Brookings - Director of National Security Studies at the Council on Foreign Relations. Has criticized manor of the invasion of Iraq but has detailed plans to increase the manpower of the United States Army to fight the war on terror and to “spread liberal democratic values throughout the Middle East”.

Bruce Reidel - CFR, Brookings - Former CIA analyst who wishes to expand the war on terror to fight Al Qaeda across the globe. Considered to be the reason behind Barack Obama’s Hawkish views on Pakistan and his Pro India leanings on Kashmir.

Stephen Flynn - CFR - Has been attributed with the idea for Obama’s much vaunted “Civilian Security Force”. Flynn has [3] written: “The United States should roughly replicate the Federal Reserve model by creating a Federal Security Reserve System (FSRS) with a national board of governors, 10 regional Homeland Security Districts, and 92 local branches called Metropolitan Anti-Terrorism Committees. The objective of this system would be to develop self-funding mechanisms to more fully engage a broad cross-section of American society to protect the country’s critical foundations from the widespread disruption that would arise from a terrorist attack.”

Madeline Albright - CFR, Brookings - Currently serves on the Council on Foreign Relations Board of directors. Secretary of State and US Ambassador to the United Nations under Clinton. Did not take action against the genocide in Rwanda. Defended the sanctions against Iraq under Saddam Hussein. When asked by CBS’s 60 Minutes about the effects of sanctions: “We have heard that half a million children have died. I mean, that’s more children than died in Hiroshima. And, you know, is the price worth it?” Albright replied: “I think this is a very hard choice, but the price — we think the price is worth it.”

Anonymous said...


I found this article and believe it shows exactly what wealth is being targeted for spreading. This article goes into the current plan for the government to seize 401k and other personal retirement savings.


Anonymous said...

Obama is a puzzling character, why would he appoint a pro-Israel chief of staff, who supports the Iraq war? Isn't the New Age, anti-Israel all the way.


Anonymous said...

Equally puzzling is the Jerusalem Post reported on 11/05/08 that 78% of Jews voted for Obama vs. 21% for McCain.

How do you explain that one?

Anonymous said...

Could the "crisis" predicted by Sen. Joe Biden and Mr. Colin Powell, within 6 mo's following inauguration on 1/21/09, have anything to do with the AMA agreement, dated 11/15/05, signed betweeh Israel, the U.S. and the EU (Dr. Solana signed on the EU's behalf), which has a mid-point of 4/28/09, Israel's Memorial Day (which might also qualify as in the "midst" of the 7-year ENP).

(For those who follow occult connections of the NA, the AMA agreement matches "perfectly" with the 12/21/12 date.)

Link to FP thread re. same:

OV! said...

"Obama is a puzzling character, why would he appoint a pro-Israel chief of staff, who supports the Iraq war? Isn't the New Age, anti-Israel all the way."

all Jews are not the same people(!);

REV 2:9
I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which SAY THEY ARE JEWS, and ARE NOT(!), but are the synagogue of SATAN(!).
REV 3:9
Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which SAY THEY ARE JEWS, and ARE NOT(!), but DO LIE(!); behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

they only CLAIN(!) to be jews.

the word jew can mean either of the tribe of JUDAH or a resident of the LAND of Judea but that doesnt mean you are a desendent of Judah!

for example, im an american, but im also romanian, and also live in oregon. so i can say im an oregonian, or a romanian and an american. all are true but my bloodline is romanian.
same with the jews. not all of them were of the tribe of judah when they came out of the Babylonian captivity. a lot of them were babylonians or hybrids and brought back with them the teachings of babylon and mixed it with the Torah. thus they have the Talmud. which all it is, is ancient babylonian, cabala mystery teachings.

and to speek out about the Zionists or the Kenites(sons of Cain) is not to speak against Mr. & Mrs. average everyday "Jew." The average Jews are the victim of the Kenite(sons of Cain claiming to be jews), though the Kenite identifies himself as a Jew. Confusing? It really isn't. It is the same model like their (Kenite's) Satanic Illuminati, Illuminati hid within Free Masonry, separate and apart; just like the Kenites hide within Jewry separate and apart; just like they did in the Old Testament with Israel:

"And the families of the scribes which dwelt at Jabez; the Tirathites, the Shimeathites, and Suchathites. These are the Kenites that came of Hemath, the father of the house of Rechab." (1 Chron 2:55).

Kenites have a very active part in your life; you are enslaved to him and do not even perceive it. He ultimately holds the note on your car and home; he sets the price for your food and oil; the interest rates for your money which you let him use to make his money. He makes your laws, runs your country's war machine; he makes Presidents, and "pro-choice" laws; he stirs racial animosity, he is the guarantor on your insurance policies, he's also your taxer. He tells you what is acceptable for you to think and say, and then sets up the apparatus (Political Correctness, 'hate' speech laws, etc.) to condemn and punish you when you disobey.

"There is nothing in your life that he does not control. He corrupts your churches, he takes away your crosses from government lands that you fund, he takes God out of your schools and inserts 'alternative lifestyle' reeducation in His place. He is your master and yet he is invisible. He has muddled your history books, omitted the true and inserted lies. He drew the Christian nations into war against each other in the Worlds Wars. He foments all wars and revolutions―he is above all a revolutionary―for his credo is, "Destroy everything; whatever is, is wrong."

"...This second movement aims for the establishment of a new racial domination of the world...the moving spirits in the second scheme are Jewish radicals. Within the ranks of Communism is a group of this party, but it does not stop there. To its leaders Communism is only an incident. They are ready to use the Islamic revolt, hatred by the Central Empire of England, Japan's designs on India and commercial rivalries between America and Japan. As any movement of world revolution must be, this is primarily anti‑Anglo‑Saxon...The organization of the world Jewish radical movement has been perfected in almost every land." ― The Chicago Tribune, June 19, 1920.

He poisons your children with unsafe (and unnecessary) drugs and inoculations, he poisons (sedates/makes docile) you with fluoride in your water, emasculates your men with feminizing hormones in your plastic food containers and masculinizes your women with other chemicals. He was behind the women's movement, the racial integration laws, the Social Welfare System―he is above all a Marxist Communist.

"Some call it Marxism ― I call it Judaism." ― The American Bulletin, Rabbi S. Wise, May 5, 1935.

And he is not done with you. His motto is, "Out of chaos, order." Thus he must destroy your world so that his may rise from it's ashes: "Pluralistic chaos, out of which the Phoenix of the New World ORDER can arise. Resurrected from the ashes of the Mysteries of the past.". He above all promotes social reforms, for they all play into his hand of destroying everything that was once holy, true, and good.

He is the friend of the gay, the lawless, the Atheist, the criminal; he shall make your world theirs. He is the enemy of Christianity, God, and Jesus Christ; he seeks to make that world his own and his god satan's. He attacks every tenant of your Christian Bible, yet he is esteemed as the chosen of God by the ignorant and the indifferent. The Bible paints a very different picture of these people and their great-ancestor satan, the serpent of old.

The Kenite(those who CLAIM to be jews(of Judah) and are not but are of the synagogue of satan) is everything spiritually and morally vile.

OV! said...

again, ISREAL(the land in the middle east) is ONLY part of the tribe of JUDAH and a lot of SO CALLED jews living in that land. not all are REAL jews decedent from JUDAH.

you have to separate JUDAH and ISRAEL when you read the scriptures.

ISRAEL(10 tribes) after the captivity MANY went over the Caucasus mountains to establish europe and later America. which is why were are CHRISTIANS and founded a CHRISTIAN NATION. which is why our many says IN GOD WE TRUST.

JUDAH(tribe) along with a lot of babylonians returned to the land of judea.

sure that geographical location today is NAMED ISRAEL, but its NOT. its only PART true ISRAEL and part true Judah. not all that have returned there are "jews" of Judah, but only CLAIM to be.

OV! said...

ouch, i need to spell check before i publish my comments. ha.

Anonymous said...

This should peak everyone's interest.

Rebbetzin Esther Jungreis: Prepare for the Coming of Messiah


OV! said...

my point being, TRUE JUDAH(jews) teaches the TORAH/NT.

FALSE JUDAH(claim to be jews but are of satan/babylon) teach the TULMUD and are ANTI-CHRISTIAN.

both live in the land we call ISRAEL today, but not all are real jews. the ones in control(bankers/money changers) are the one in charge and running things(NWO).

this is why you have so called christians like bush and obama line themselves up with the leaders of land of israel(those who claim to be jews). because they arent REAL DESCENDANTS/PROGENY of JUDAH.

they only CLAIM to be.


the NEW AGE isnt new but OLD. its the old mystery BABYLON(!) the great HARLOT.
which is where the TULMUD comes from.

which is why its not confusing, but makes perfect sense. so called "christians" teaming up with so called "jews".

the apostasy at work.

Anonymous said...

Dear Dorothy,
Thinking of you today. You did a marvelous job with your research during the BO campaign.
Don't stay in time out for too long.
We need your input.

Anonymous said...

Khavier Solana? Lost in the translation, or intentional spelling?

"President of Armenia Serzh Sargsyan had a meeting with the secretary in general of European Union Khavier Solana. The officials have discussed a wide range of questions, in particular EU-Armenia relationship, implementation of democratic and economic reforms in Armenia, the negotiations over Nagorno Karabakh conflict, Armenian-Turkish political dialogue.
Regional security and cooperation perspectives have been also discussed by the officials.
Mr. Solana said that stability and peace in the region are principle key points to the development and expressed his willingness to support in negotiations over Nagorno Karabakh conflict and Armenian-Turkish dialogue."



Anonymous said...


This is an article on Yahoo about Barack apologizing over a joke he made about the former first lady consulting psychics. The article is written in a tongue in cheek type manner, in what I see as a possible way to get the general public to accept these occultic practices by our leaders. It also half jokingly refers to Hillary Clinton communing with spirits.


Anonymous said...


Now that it is out of the publics hands, the media is starting to see fit to air some of Obama's and his cabinets dirty laundry. Including the campaign contributions from Fannie and Freddie as well as the fact his newly announced chief of staff was on Fannie's Board of Directors.


Young Grasshopper said...


You did a fantastic job in all of your research leading up to the election. I think we all gave it the best we could, but deep inside we knew it was pretty futile. I hope you are OK and taking a much needed break from your in-depth research. Remember that we can still use this information to help others understand what is coming down. I did just that in a meeting last night, when a woman I know from church tried to tell me about how I had made a mistake in judgment
regarding Obama. PULEEZE!

We still need our watch dog and pit bull to keep us all in line, whenever you're ready to get back here. You've also been in my prayers.

Ov! Regarding your morning star/logo comment- that was one of the first things that aroused suspicions in my mind about Obama. It caused me to start a blog, back in May, in spite of the fact I'd originally supported Obama. Here's the post I did then if you want to read it:


Also, your comments about the Cainites and false Jews I found very interesting. I read a book about the Cainites back in September and it was so deceptive in the way it twisted the bible and perverted Christianity and Judaism that I didn't sleep for weeks afterwards. It's a free download off the Internet no less so how do you warn people that reading that stuff could be toxic? The book also meshes with everything else that you just stated here about the Illuminati roots and how they've laid their plans to control us through the NWO and New Age occult. I happen to agree with you that voicing what you just voiced is not anti-semetic since there are definitely evil people in the world who may claim to be Jews or Christians but are nothing but New Age occultists intent on making us real Jews and Christians slaves. It makes sense in view of the fact that Bush/Obama/Emanuel may have different 'faiths' but they are all of the same rotten fabric.

To everyone: There is a blog I found recently that I really like, and the writer comments here as well. Please check out his blog and especially read his post this week that's called "This is good". It's a very long article but the material contained within the article is excellent. It's from a newsletter written before the election and one thing that caught my attention in the article was a statement about red clothing being worn by Gordon Brown and others. I agree with whoever it was here that said that the Obama family colors on election night was designed to send a signal.Just as George the First sent his signal with his 1,000 points of light speech in his state of the Union message in January 1992. The blog is called in The Shadow of the Tower, by the way.

Regarding the timeline of 12/21/2012 and 11/15/2008-it sounds very logical in view of what I've been thinking for some time now regarding Obama. It would certainly be his first major contract. In reading the comments here regarding the people he is appointing and the organizations he is founding, it leaves little doubt in my mind as to his true intentions.Sadly, and unlike Javier Solana, people actually think he is a very ethical and saintly man, and are enchanted with him to a degree that defines explanation. I stopped watching him speak months ago, and I'd advise everyone else to do the same, as anonymous 3:20 said, he can charm the socks off a snake! If you missed the Ron Paul interview link that someone left the other day, it refers to the date and meeting on 11/15/2008 as being key to the end of American sovereignty. Here's the link:

As far as picking a pro-Israel chief of staff, if Obama is going to broker a peace treaty with Israel down the road, he's going to need to lay some pro-Israel groundwork now, in order to allay any remaining suspicions about his Muslim roots.

Sorry, so long. Just my opinions.

Dawn said...

According to this Fox news article

Both Lugar and Hagel are on a short list of possibles for Sec of State. They also have Hagel on the list for Defense Sec.

Nothing is final of course but looks like it might be very cozy indeed.

Anonymous said...

Yes, Dorothy - I agree with "young grasshopper" that we hope you're OK. Your intelligent input is missed on this blog.

Hope you're just taking it easy and getting a well deserved rest from all of your tireless, non-stop research on Obama.

I know that I slept a lot on Wednesday, November 5th. I felt sad and went through a kind of "withdrawal" and felt that I just needed to "grieve" over our election loss.

Constance Cumbey said...

I just gave Dorothy a call and said her public was demanding her -- I suspect she will be back soon -- I hope!


Anonymous said...

I too have post election blues. My heart has been heavy and sickened to a point of sleeplessness. I wonder when we will reap the repercussions of America's choice.

Anonymous said...

Dear Nancy:

We have to just remind ourselves that God is still in charge.

I keep repeating the following phrase over and over again:
"Let go; let God."

As long as we remain close to Him, we have nothing to fear but fear itself.

Anonymous said...

Thanks Ov,I know there are plenty of false Jews and Christians around. I only pray they'll see the light someday. Obama is the most pro-abortion, anti-family President in American history. Even the Clinton's weren't as extreme as him. I am expecting a tough time ahead for Christians who refuse to compromise their values.


Dawn said...

I had sent a private email to Dorothy. But I wanted to publicly say Thank you as well.

I know we are anxious for her to continue to contribute. I get her emails and I look forward to what she has to say.

I have to say though, I wonder if she wouldn't rather us to try to gather information for ourselves.

Yes of course she is a wealth of knowledge. Yes, she has a unique perspective on this blog.

It would be a great loss if Constance or Dorothy were not here but I think we should all continue to use the tools they have given us to look at things.

I hate to be all doom and gloom.
But I would recommend that everyone document everything they can.
Copy things to word files on your computer. Do not forget to have a back up on CDs.

Who knows how long we will have to continue to search freely? Who knows how long it will be before websites such as this one and others will be blocked.

It will certainly become more difficult to find information.

May we all continue to trust God and rely on His wisdom.

Rudi said...

ov!- Some of us remember when you first commented here back in October 2007 you wrote about how it was through your church, Shepherd’s Chapel that you first heard of Constance and her book. I recall from our past communication here that you disregard any and all cautions given by me and several others here, regarding your church and it’s leader Andrew Murray. I really have been happy to see you still read Constances’ blog and choose to participate here in the comments section. I have read your comments with interest, whether or not I agree with your interpretation of scripture. However, in your 6:17 PM remarks you are presenting to everyone here a specific teaching of Andrew Murray called the Serpent Seed Doctrine. You most certainly are free to believe anything you want. I am also free to stand 100% opposed to this teaching as well as warn the readers here to be very cautious about most of the teachings coming from Andrew Murray and The Shepherd’s Chapel.( British Israelism : Anglo-Saxons are the chosen race, and America and Great Britain are the lost tribes of the children of Israel.etc.) I’m sorry to have caused you offense ov!, but you also have, by your preceding remarks regarding the Jewish people offended me and others. The following link is one source of many available for any readers interested in a critique of Andrew Murray/Shepherd’s Chapel. –Rudi

Anonymous said...


The tone of this articles saddens me as it pertains to churches hiring armed guards to keep the congregation safe. There is also mention of terrorism as if congregations should have a constant fear of an attack on their services. This just goes to show how far the world has gone down this hole. It also may be a bit of a fore shadowing of what is to come.


Rudi said...

Response to ov! Regarding your comments and quote attributed to Rabbi S. Wise.

"Some call it Marxism -- I call it Judaism." (The American Bulletin, Rabbi S. Wise, May 5, 1935).
"The above quote is #405 from the anti-Semitic document "1000 Quotes by and about Jews". It is available in similar form from many sources, but not necessarily with the same number.
Anti-Semites have been fond of quoting this statement, which they say, Stephen Wise prominent New York rabbi and Zionist leader, once made. Actually, Rabbi Wise was a life-long foe of Communism; and an official at Manhattan's Hebrew Union College, where Wise's papers are kept, reported that no such statement appears anywhere in Wise's writings. Even George Lincoln Rockwell, American Nazi leader, was forced to admit it was a fake (1)."
1) See "George Lincoln Rockwell: Playboy Interview", Playboy, April 1966, p.79
Reference: "They Never Said It", Paul F. Boller Jr. and John George, New York, Oxford University Press, 1989, ISBN 0-19-605541-1 and ISBN 0-19-506469-0

Anonymous said...

I'll jump in on the argument. According to the Anchor Bible Dictionary, or the International Standard Bible Encyclopedia Kenites are associated with the Midianites. Cain had no descendants because they were wiped out in the flood.. Remember Noah and his 3 sons were the only survivors..

I want to be VERY careful to distinguish British-Israelism and this racist theory from what I say. It is true to say that Jews don't represent ALL Israel because of the division of the kingdom. The Northern Kingdom was scattered and lost it's identity and is in the nations. They are not in Anglo-Saxon nations exclusively although they could be there as well. No one knows except God Himself where they acutally all are, but being associated with Israel is NOT simply a matter of bloodline. It's a matter of faith.

Ruth, who was pure Moabite became part of Israel. Caleb a Kenzizite ( not Kenite) was probably of Canaanite origin but became associate with the tribe of Judah. In fact he became a leader of Judah..

God is not a respecter of persons and it is our faith that saves us, not our bloodline. This is clear if you read Hebrews 11. Abraham was a babylonian, but he believed in God and it was credited to him as righteousness.

Through the seed ( both a singular and plural word) of Abraham, all the families of the earth will be blessed. The seed, Yeshua the Messiah as well as the literal descendants of Israel are to be a blessing to the earth.

There are Jews that are not a blessing to their people, like those who divide the land and are anti-Torah, but that has nothing to do with bloodline, that has to do with faith. There were always those of Israel who were true literal descendants who sinned against God, and those that were righteous. All you have to do is look at the book of Kings and Chronicles to see that...Just as there are those who are not literal descendants but attach themselves to God and His people, like Ruth.

I do believe God will save literal descendants from all 12 tribes because the Bible says this. He will shake Israel out of the nation, but there will be the natural born and those who attach themselves to Israel as there has always been. God is not limited by genealogy and Cain's descendants were destroyed in the flood, only Noah's descendants survived. From Noah's descendants we have the chart of all the nations: Shem, Japeth and Ham.

The corrupt seed business is not supported.. In the book of Genesis it says the sons of Gods married the daughters of men. Ben Elohim is only used one other place in the Bible. This is when Satan and his angels test Job. This verse suggests that the whole world became corrupt at the time of Noah because there was literally demonic possession or through fallen angels that intermixed with the human race. They are called the Nephilim.

The giants or Nephilim were people like Nimrod who built the Tower of Babel and rebelled against God. The "seed theory" is not supported by Scripture. We also know that in the last days it will be like in the time of Noah. With the influx of demonic New Age channeling we can see once again the "mixing of seed". People have given themselves over to demonic possession. If you read any of Alice Bailey ( and I don't recommend it) you will see this is what she encourages people to do..

I firmly believe it is through this opening of doors for demonic possession that we end up with people like the Hitlers of the world, or the New Agers who will assist Satan with his demonic plan. Thankfully, through the blood of Yeshua, His death and resurrection, He made and open and public display of the forces of darkness. It is through appropriating His work of redemption we will be able to stand. In that sense, there is no Jew or Greek, we are all joint heirs in Messiah Yeshua.

This is the transaction that took place when Yeshua breathed the words "it is finished" . He finished one time for all the work of Satan. This was prophesied in the Garden, when God said He would crush the head of the serpent with the seed of the woman. The seed He was referring to was "the seed, that through Israel descended from Abraham, Yeshua".

Through that seed, all the families of the earth will be blessed. Appropriating His work is what brings us victory over the works of darkness, whether we be Greek or Jew. I happen to have Jewish blood, but in the plan of salvation that changes nothing. I come into the kingdom the same way through the blood of my Messiah.

Does God care about the physical descendants of Israel? Absolutely! He sent His one and only begotten Son to die for them. Yeshua came for the lost sheep of the House of Israel, but as this word goes out through the nations, others attach themselves to Yeshua and to His people as well.

Rom. 11:25 For I do not wish you to be ignorant, brethren, of this secret — that ye may not be wise in your own conceits — that hardness in part to Israel hath happened till the fulness of the nations may come in;

"the fulness of the nations refers back to the blessing given to Ephraim in Gen 48, when he would become the "fulness of the nations"... the leader of Northern Kingdom who received the blessing of physical fruitfulness..

Gen. 48:19 And his father refuseth, and saith, ‘I have known, my son, I have known; he also becometh a people, and he also is great, and yet, his young brother is greater than he, and his seed is the fulness of the nations;’

These are the two places in the Bible where this same expression is used, but because of poor translation we don't always see it...I used the Young's literal translation so you can see the connection. Melo Hagoyim in the Hebrew is the same as Pleroma ethos, in the Greek.

When Ephraim, leader of the Northern Kingdom, led the rebellion and the tribes were scattered in the Assyrian exile God said they would become "not a people" but that later He would have compassion on the House of Israel/Ephraim/Northern Kingdom.

That compassion comes through the spreading of the Gospel. The spouse of Israel died, so that Israel could marry again.. In the book of Hosea, it explains that Israel was like a harlot and so God was obliged to divorce the Northern Kingdom because they committed adultery. He could only "marry again" through the covenant which was in the blood of Yeshua. Judah was promised that the sceptre would not part. The blessing of kingship was carried out by none other than Yeshua who came through Judah, who didn't have a "pure bloodline". He had Ruth, the Moabite, Rahab the harlot, Bathesheba, etc. in His bloodline...but He was born of the Spirit of God, ( even though He was there at the foundation of the world) so His atoning death, and that alone is what justifies us.

By the way, back in the Torah, particularly in the book of Deuteronomy, God says that Israel will sin, but He will bring them back in the last days and put Torah on their heart.. Putting Torah on our hearts is the New Covenant. When Yeshua gave us access to the mercy seat, not just in the Temple, but the actual one in Heaven we no longer needed a priest to come into God's presence. He gave us His Spirit so that through His Word, we could discern His will spiritually and in doing so He puts Torah on our hearts, which is the Biblical definition of the New Covenant. In prior times God's Spirit was given, but in limited ways to prophets and kings, now we are the temple of His Spirit. His Word is on our hearts, if we walk in obedience...If we don't, we cannot hear His voice..

Without Yeshua's blood, not one is righteous...In Him we receive His righteousness, so there is no other way to salvation for both Greek and Jew...

God will deal with the literal descendants of Israel, but their redemption can only come through the blood of His Son.


Rudi said...

I forgot the link to the information I just posted above.

Additional note to ov!
I honestly care about you and feel horrible having to address your earlier comments and in the process possibly cause you embarassment. I believe you truly desire to follow the Lord and His Word. Please re-examine the man and real spirit behind the teachings you're trusting as to follow as truth. You didn't give a link to the largest portion of your comments but I easily located the source where the words you wrote originated. Unless your real name is Nick Goggin and the link below is is your website. The website's recommended list of,
"reviewed, reference materials that will enhance your Bible studies" - include some wonderful choices- like Constances' "Hidden Dangers of the Rainbow" - but also some totally anti-Semetic material such as,"The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion:" I going to be praying for the Lord to draw you to Himself and give you discernment as you study His Word.
Grace & Peace to You- Rudi


Anonymous said...

Hi Rudi-

A lurker here coming out of hiding for just a moment.

First I would like to say you were an IMMEDIATE answer to prayer by posting the link to Let Us Reason. Thank you.

One small but important word of correction- the person in question in the Let Us Reason article is Arnold Murry, not Andrew Murray.

Andrew Murry was a famous South African missionary statesman who lived from 1828 to 1917. He is known for authoring many books, such as "With Christ in the School of Prayer", "Humility", "Surrender", and "The Key to the Missionary Problem." In the latter he discusses with appropriate respect and favor the renowned and beloved pioneering missionary to China, Hudson Taylor.

In short Andrew Murray was a good guy from a past generation.

I felt this was important to point out lest someone become confused and maybe pass on incorrect information. Arnold Murray and Andrew Murray are very similar names and since Andrew Murray is a familiar name in the Christian community, it is easy to mistakenly use his name.

Thank you all so much for the great info and links you all post!

Back to lurking.....


Young Grasshopper said...

I'll admit that after reading Ov!'s comments there were things in there that seemed to need addressing. I thought Dorothy or Constance would say something; when they didn't I put my measly two cents in.

I am very glad that Joyce and Rudi have spoken up, as this serpent seed is really going mainstream these days in certain "Christian" circles. That was why I'd asked Constance weeks ago to speak up regarding Sherry Shriner, who interviewed Constance a while back. Sherry mentioned this serpent seed stuff , too, and then after a while you start thinking there must be some basis to it, if Constance went on a radio program of someone who believes it.

After I read the vile book (sorry to keep bringing it up) I asked the pastor of my church what was the mark of Cain. He answered just as Joyce did, that all were destroyed in the flood including Cain's descendants. So that helped me.

One thing I'd like to ask Joyce and others here, as a member of a very small Bible-based evangelical church I have seen some things that I don't necessarily agree with , but have had enough discernment myself to know the truth. Case in point- the Bentley debacle. So many people in my church wanted a revival that they went traipsing up to Lakeland and exposed themselves to this guy. I told them all he was a fraud and they got angry with me!

Anyhoo, that being said, I also feel that the Lord wants me to stay in this church- to provide knowledge of the truth to others. This has become more and more obvious to me in recent weeks, as I was surprised at how many good people in my church voted for Obama! (Not my pastor- I want to make that clear.)

Anyhow, my question is this. I believe in the Trinity and that Jesus promised a Paraclete or intercessor to come after him, which is the Holy Spirit. So I pray to the Holy Spirit for wisdom and discernment every day. I pray that He will guide the things that I do and say and help me muddle through the lies and see them for what they are.

This does, however, involve what some may believe is a New Age concept- that of opening myself up to the leading of the Holy Spirit. I have become worried recently that I am doing something wrong, and that is the last thing that I want to do.

So my question is, what are people's thoughts here regarding the anointing of the Holy Spirit, speaking in tongues and present day miracles?

Just yesterday I was very worried about a personal matter. I prayed to the Holy Spirit for an answer and within 5 minutes I received a phone call with the answer. This happens to me a lot. Am I doing anything wrong by asking the Holy Spirit to intercede on my behalf?

Thanks everyone, for all your help.

Anonymous said...

The kind words of the people who missed seeing my words here shows the wonderful nature of the people who post here. I don't want to single people out by name, but you know who you are.

Yes, this last election did depress me. Over the past years, 29 years to be exact, I've shared information that I thought would help others cut through the manipulative tactics used on the general public. This was not a hobby for me. Even while working full-time and raising a family I put in dozens of hours each week. I researched by gathering handouts, flyers, newspaper articles, (pre-internet that was the only way to do it), talking to people, going to meetings, rallies and pickets to see what was going on, and going to bookstores to see what was being put out for public consumption in the popular arena and in the academic one. I spent much time writing, copying (went through two business level copying machines), mailing. sticking my neck out to reach out to others who should have been aware of what was happening because of the positions they held. Living in the Chicago area, that meant much work, time, energy and money which was given freely to the cause as there was so much going on.

One of the important things in doing research on the history and ongoing activities relating to Humanism, Communist front activity, eugenics, New Age changes, changes in government, in the religious community, in schools, etc. is to have a feel for the community and the topics. Otherwise how would one know what is important and what to discard as irrelevant. Believe me, there is much that can be discarded as the disinformation people flood community with distracting information. I no longer have that feel for things.

This last election left me very depressed, not so much because of the outcome which was expected, but because things moved so swiftly to a what I consider a dangerous outcome that I feel I no longer can grasp the totality of what is occurring. I feel like the helpless, Jews and Christians, must have felt in Nazi Germany. The surface still looks good, but the unexamined dirt under it makes the ground very unstable.

Unlike some Christians and some Jews who are involved in understanding end-time prophecy, I can't ignore the changes, attributing them to end-times where people can live through some short term disasters. Those who think this way may be right, but at this point I don't see it. Instead, imagine end-times lasting through your lifetime. It's happened many times in the past. I don't feel it's all in God's hands either. I can't when I see disasters that could have been avoided if more people chose to make an effort to forestall the disaster. I'm more along the lines of "God helps those who help themselves."

I can't go along with political conservatives who believe that the country will somehow revert when they see the problems Obama has caused. I can't continue to worry about Europe when I see the disaster here.

I don't know what I'm going to do. What has happened makes me feel I have to start all over with the research I do as in the twinkling of an eye things have changed so much. At my age I don't know if I have the strength for that.

We'll see in a few weeks where I stand. I'll probably comment here and there on the blog and in my emails, but right now I'm washed out.

Thanks for caring.


Rudi said...

Hi JH-
Whoa- thank you! That isn't the first time I've made the mistake of having seen two similar names
while trying to find information, and then while typing inadvertently
type the wrong one. I'm so greatful you caught the error and made the correction. Arnold Murray is The Shepherd's Chapel leader.
Andrew Murray was a faithful servant of the Lord. Take a peak at the second on this "Google" list. The heading says Andrew Murray but the article is about Arnold. Thanks again for the sharp eye and pointing out my error. -Rudi

Anonymous said...


Thank you for all your years of service. Your reward will be great in heaven.

Hopefully, we will see you around again very soon.

Anonymous said...

please hear me the rement needs you - we can not as a group afford to loose a person who holds such passion for truth and rightousness, despite what happens in the world. If we faintrd at the outcome of situations, none of us would go beyond our doors each day.
You are valuable to all here who seek to put pieces of the puzzle together. Obama and his minions are not going away - maybe you have the tenacity to keep his administartive movements in the light of day for all.
May the Lord Jesus Christs's will be done - what has happened and what is going to happen is ultimately in His control, and yes there is cause and effect - we all need to ight the good fight, that is why we are here.
But - we all need a vacation sometimes - Hawaii would be nice :-)


Anonymous said...


I agree, we need to be gathering as much info as possible and cd's are a great way to store it, but I am personally recommending that we all print off at least the most important evidence.

I have already lost one computer due to an incident with the baby, and no amount of CD's were going to be read on it.

Keeping in mind that everything I saved on the old computer was in wordperfect, and the new computer is saying that all the files are corrupted that I had saved on CD, it would be great to have alternatives.

God Bless you all, I have been keeping up with the reading, but have not much time anymore for posting.

You are an encouragement! Keep persevering to the end, but in the meantime, you have given so much of yourself, you need to fill back up your reserves.


Young Grasshopper said...

"I can't go along with political conservatives who believe that the country will somehow revert when they see the problems Obama has caused. I can't continue to worry about Europe when I see the disaster here."

I agree. However keep in mind that if all the research that Constance has done on Solana means anything, and all the research that you and even I have done on Obama means anything, then truly our redemption is drawing close.

The reason things are happening so quickly is explained in Revelation 12:12,

"He is filled with fury,
because he knows that his time is short."

The Lord has given the faithful many clues to prepare us. I have never in my life been as certain as I am now that we are in the very last years.

It certainly seems as though Solana (or the One World System) may be the beast from the sea and that Obama is the False Prophet or Beast from the earth. If that is the case then don't worry about long term suffering. Just try to take a step forward in faith, a little baby step, and see if it takes you to a bigger step. That's what I did, and I continue to take baby steps every day in order to grow stronger. It is helping and my stronger faith is a culmination of all the little baby faith steps I've tried to take over the years when I found comfort no where else.

Be encouraged. We all care for you here and could use a big hearty dose of your kutzpah in these days that are coming.

HK-91 said...

"We'll see in a few weeks where I stand. I'll probably comment here and there on the blog and in my emails, but right now I'm washed out.

Thanks for caring.


11:12 AM"


I just want you to know I and many others feel the same as you do! I have talked to a good friend in Wa. St. and he feels as we do also, as well as a few well informed friends I have here. believe me YOU ARE NOT ALONE IN WHAT YOU FEEL!
I as well as many here stand with you and by you and greatly appreciate you and your contributions and frienship.

Please take some time to calm yourself, I'm am doing the same.

What we need now is time to pause for a rest, gather our thoughts and plan from there.

We will all rebound and be able to asses where we are, but it is most important that we stay together and stay in touch here. It is the safest thing we can do.

I know you are weary now, but I also know you are a very strong person, and a good and vital friend.

I can't begin to tell you how helpful you have been to me and I'm sure others here feel the same.

I'm just speaking for myself here ( but I would speculate others think the same) I will stand shoulder to shoulder with you if we are the last two people left on the planet to battle this.

Hang in there Dorothy.


Young Grasshopper said...

It's also possible that Solana is beast number 2, and Obama is beast #1, and it's also possible that none of the above is true either!

It doesn't really matter, the signs are obvious that prophecy is being fulfilled, and it's exciting to realize that we have been chosen to be part of it!

Young Grasshopper said...


I just want to say one more thing and I hope you won't take offense and think I am trying to convert you to my own faith.

But you said:"I'm more along the lines of "God helps those who help themselves."

I was just praying for you and I felt led to share this word with you:

My son, do not forget my teaching,
but keep my commands in your heart,
for they will prolong your life many years
and bring you prosperity.

Let love and faithfulness never leave you:
bind them around your neck,
write them on the tablet of your heart.
Then you will win favor and a good name
in the sight of God and man.
Trust in the Lord with all your heart
lean not on your own understanding:
in all ways acknowledge him,
and he will make your paths straight.

Do not be wise in your own eyes,
fear the Lord and shun evil.
This will bring health to your body and nourishment to your bones.
Proverbs 3:1-9

Sometimes we lean too heavily on our own understanding, when actually we just need to lean on Him.


Anonymous said...

All I can say to you is because I do see all of this as a fulfillment of the prophecies, it helps me to keep it in perspective. It is written that these days would come. All of our activism may help those who think like we do, but it will not change a hair on the head of those who don't. Your information has helped and encouraged people who already understand the times, but the rest are blind. It's because we are in the Last Days, that they don't see. The spirit of delusion that the Scriptures talk about is upon them. That is the great frustration.

As a wise rabbi I know once said. "a wise man ( or woman) knows the hour". The hour is late and I think you are seeing that. It is discouraging, but not hopeless. Because of Yeshua, most of us on this blog understand that our redemption lies in Him, not in the political solutions or in our activism. We know that these things are coming down the pike. It's disconcerting to see that others, even those who claim to believe in the Bible don't always see it, but there is a small minority who do.

I will make a confession...I started writing on this blog originally because of you. When I saw a Jew commenting on all of the events of the day, I wanted to jump in... I wanted to save you, but I can't..only Yeshua can. I know it goes against everything you've been raised to believe, but I pray you will consider the sincere claims of those on this blog who have found a relationship with the risen Messiah and know Him intimately..

He is not a figment of our imagination.. He is Adonai our Messiah, and many of our lives have been changed because of Him, in profound ways. I wish I could share all that He has done in my life to convince you of that, but this is not the place nor the forum...all that to say, Dorothy, your time here has not been wasted and even if you are tired I will say to you in the words of Yeshua, "come to me, all of you who are heavy laden, I will give you rest for my yoke is light.." Yeshua wants to give you the ultimate Shabbat. He is our Shabbat and one day very soon He will return and give us the Shabbat rest..
In His Shalom,

Anonymous said...

Dear Maryanne,

My thoughts on prayer are guided by Yeshua's words. When you pray, pray "Our Father.....who art in heaven " I don't mean we should say mechanical prayers...I don't believe that Scripture gives any precedence for invoking the Holy Spirit. We are to pray to Abba ( our Father). .. If someone has Scriptural evidence to the contrary, I'm open to seeing it but that's what I see in the Bible. I pray in the name of Yeshua, and the Ruach HaKodesh ( Holy Spirit) guides me, but I direct my requests to My Father in Heaven...who is holy... It is through Yeshua we have access to the throne of grace, and the Spirit guides us in all truth, but our prayers should be in accordance with the Scriptures..

If we pray, according to God's will (His Word) then we can approach Him with confidence knowing that we are asking in accordance with His will..Sometimes we might pray things that are not His will and we should not expect Him to respond favorably.

Don't know if that makes sense, but that's a little on prayer. I also believe the Psalms are a great place to look for prayer. David, who wrote a number of the Psalms, was a man after Abba's heart, so we can learn from him and we can even pray the Scriptures knowing that these are definitely God's will.

When I pray, I want to be in agreement with God, and His Word is a great way to be in agreement...There is a certain power in praying back to God what He has promised you. i.e. Lord you said in your Word.........and now I'm asking you to do according to your promise..... Moses is a fabulous example when he intercedes for Israel ( who has just sinned) talking to God about His reputation..God was ready to destroy Israel, but Moses interceded on the basis of God's name...

When we believe God's promises and hold Him to them, in the sense of reminding Him what He told us, like one of our children might ( you promised me such and such) He is happy to respond to our childlike faith....

That's a little bit how I see prayer...I'm talking to my Abba ( father) who promised me such and such, but before I approach Him I have to come in an attitude of praise, of repentance, etc.. He is holy, holy, holy...

I think it is admirable you want to hang in and be a light at your congregation.. It's also important to know if there is a time when you should leave.. That is not a black and white thing, but if you are being drained and don't see that you are making a difference, pray and ask Abba for wisdom according to James 1:5, which He promises to give you...Pray with confidence until you are sure you've heard His voice, either through His Word or through some circumstance that makes it clear. Sometimes it's not clear. I usually stay still..

Be still and know that I am the Lord and my name will be glorified in all the earth..

Don't know if that was really your question, but ...


Anonymous said...

Dear Dorothy,

I have missed you as well.

Don't be sad. At the end of the day, you did your best, and that is all that counts with God.

Remember the words of the Lord spoken through the Prophet Ezekiel:

Again the word of the LORD came to me, saying, “Son of man, speak to the children of your people, and say to them: ‘When I bring the sword upon a land, and the people of the land take a man from their territory and make him their watchman, when he sees the sword coming upon the land, if he blows the trumpet and warns the people, then whoever hears the sound of the trumpet and does not take warning, if the sword comes and takes him away, his blood shall be on his own head. He heard the sound of the trumpet, but did not take warning; his blood shall be upon himself. But he who takes warning will save his life. But if the watchman sees the sword coming and does not blow the trumpet, and the people are not warned, and the sword comes and takes any person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood I will require at the watchman’s hand.’

“So you, son of man: I have made you a watchman for the house of Israel; therefore you shall hear a word from My mouth and warn them for Me. When I say to the wicked, ‘O wicked man, you shall surely die!’ and you do not speak to warn the wicked from his way, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood I will require at your hand. Nevertheless if you warn the wicked to turn from his way, and he does not turn from his way, he shall die in his iniquity; but you have delivered your soul (Ezekiel 33:1-9).

Also there is the story about someone who once asked Mother Teresa if she were disappointed that her mission had not been more successful.

Mother Teresa replied:

"God has not called me to be successful. He has called me to be faithful."

Young Grasshopper said...

Dear Joyce,

That indeed helped a great deal and makes me feel better. I do always preface any prayer with "Heavenly father, please hear my prayer.."

"I pray in the name of Yeshua, and the Ruach HaKodesh ( Holy Spirit) guides me, but I direct my requests to My Father in Heaven...who is holy... It is through Yeshua we have access to the throne of grace, and the Spirit guides us in all truth, but our prayers should be in accordance with the Scriptures.."

I also agree with you here. I believe that by asking the Father, I am guided through the Holy Spirit. I do always end my prayers, by asking the Father to hear them in Jesus' name.

I also always pray that His will and not my own will be done, and I always submit my will to Him before asking for anything. Sometimes this is not what I like, but I realize I am nothing without Him.

There may very well come a time to leave my church. I've been praying on it.

Thanks so much for your help, Joyce.


Rudi said...

Hi Maryanne-
I also am in agreement with what Joyce has shared with you. As a matter of fact, I was also blessed by what she wrote and can't think of a thing to add that would say it any better. Be blessed and encouraged! -Rudi

Rudi said...

Hi Dorothy,
Yes, this past year has been almost overwhelming for many of us. The undeniable
acceleration of world changing events have been literally coming in waves over
all of us. Like yourself, I get tired and sometimes fight discouragement and frustration
because so many are oblivious to any danger in what is occurring around them. You’ve told
me more than once that one person can’t do it all. You have given so much of your time and
contribute so much, not only here, but on the Israel Forum to wake people up. It’s OK to take time to stop and catch your breath and re-focus and rest for awhile. –Rudi

“To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven:
…A time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together
… a time to keep silence, and a time to speak;…” Ecclesiastes 3

OV! said...

hey everyone.

sorry for not listing the source to some of the material i posted. i put them in ("") but ill post the source next time to make it clear.

as far as theology im not sure i would get into a debate here on this blog it would be unfair to constance and to those who are trying to stick with the blog topic. not to mention it would take pages and pages of documentation for anything said.

i am not a racist or am i saying all jews are evil or "serpent seed". at the same time there are those who claim to be jews and are not. thats scripture, not my opinion.

as far as the shepherds chapel church goes, ive been studying with them for 10 years or so. before that i grew up in a pentecostal church. then hoped around to different churches until i found one that actually read the bible through and through with documentation from both hebrew and greek(shepherds chapel). if you have any difference with what they teach i would ask you to prove them wrong as far as serpent seed and other issues.

instead of getting your info about what church is a cult and which isnt i would ask you to hear it directly from the church being accused instead of false rumors. we all know what Christ thinks about false rumors.

i invite anyone to please watch the the 1st 6 chapters of GENESIS bible study videos here(scroll down and on left side watch: "1st 6 chapters of The Book of Genesis" )

you can follow along verse by verse and find out WHY that is taught. you might find its actully scriptural and not made up. and if you still dont believe it then thats fine. to each his own.

as far as the kenites making it through the flood you will find them named AFTER the flood as well.
1Ch 2:55
And the families of the scribes which dwelt at Jabez; the Tirathites, the Shimeathites, and Suchathites. These are the KENITES that came of Hemath, the father of the house of Rechab."

Strong's Hebrew Dictionary
7017. Qeyniy

ynyq Qeyniy kay-nee'
or Qiyniy (1 Chron. 2:55) {kee-nee'}; patronymic from 7014; a Kenite or member of the tribe of Kajin:--Kenite.

See Hebrew 7014
Nyq Qayin kah'-yin
the same as 7013 (with a play upon the affinity to 7069); Kajin, the name of the first child, also of a place in Palestine, and of an Oriental tribe:--CAIN, Kenite(-s).

anyway, God created all his children and loves them all the same. abrahams seed had a specific purpose to preserve the true teachings of God and to bring forth Christ through an unmixed bloodline. thats NOT racsit, thats a fact. then salvation was opened to all by Christ but that still doesnt change the fact that there are those who claim to be of Judah and are not. not my words, Christs words. im just a messenger.

by the way, abraham was NOT a babylonian. he lived in that region for a while, but he was HEBREW.

in Christ>oVi

OV! said...

In Answer to Critics
by Pastor Arnold B. Murray

"I make it a policy to never mention individual denominations, groups or single out individuals by name; however since 1991 several so called "Christian Research" organizations have willingly quoted each others's falsehoods and labels, without direct research, until they are blindly printing outright lies. This has gone on long enough now that I have categorized some glaring examples of such inaccuracies to facilitate making a clear Biblical response. I am not writing this document because I seek nor want any organization's endorsement, but I wish to point out these inaccuracies for intelligent Bible students who love to study God's Word. The Shepherd's Chapel Network now has millions of serious Bible students who study daily with us. It is because I love each of you who desire a deeper study into our Father's Word that I feel I owe this response to you and especially to new students of the Shepherd's Chapel.

I also should point out to those not familiar with the Shepherd's Chapel that we are completely independent; therefore we are not affiliated with any other church, denomination or group. As a matter of record, the only group of which I am a member is with the "Chosin Few" which is a group of Korean War veterans comprised of various military factions who fought in one of the more famous battles of that war. I am very proud to have served as a U.S. Marine in this severe winter battle in which approximately 12,000 of our troops faced a massive surprise attack by an estimated 120,000 of the Chinese communist enemy. Although suffering many casualties, the Marines and our British allies inflicted far more damage to the Chinese and were able to ultimately escape (with our dead and injured) from the Chosin Reservoir where we were at a grave disadvantage. Despite being wounded I survived this war because, I believe, the Lord had further plans and a purpose for my life. I have never forgotten the discipline of the U.S. Marine Corps and the lessons learned in war. If I teach like a Marine DI (Drill Instructor) it is with love because I know first hand the value of well educated and trained troops. In fact the root word behind the word "disciples" is "discipline". The Bible frequently uses military terms to convey how we must prepare to face spiritual warfare. As Christians our ultimate enemy is not "flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places, to wit we must put on the whole armour of God" (Ephesians 6:10-19).

I believe many of the inaccurate perceptions of what I teach at the Shepherd's Chapel could be resolved quickly if those interested would simply request our "Statement of Faith" which has been freely available for many years. If you have not already requested it I would encourage you to do so. But perhaps the best way to evaluate what I teach is to simply listen for a while. One thing you will quickly notice is that I like to field questions which in my opinion is a fine way for the listener to test what is being taught. Since the beginning of my Bible teaching ministry, over 50 years ago, I have always insisted on taking questions from the congregation. This important part of teaching ensures that everyone has an opportunity to ask key questions, then hear and judge the knowledge of the teacher for themselves. Now let's take a look at some of the usual points of criticism that some of these so-called "Christian Research" people seem to steal from one another in their rush to reproduce lies against myself and the Shepherd's Chapel.

The Trinity or Godhead

I teach YHVH ("I Am That I Am" and Hebrew for the Sacred Name of God), Yahshua (Hebrew for God's Saviour Jesus) and the Holy Spirit. When you speak the Truth it is the Holy Spirit manifesting Himself through you. Matthew 10:20 explicitly says "For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you." The meaning, of course, refers to the Holy Spirit as in Mark 13:11 which notes, "but when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do you premeditate; but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye; for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost (Spirit)." I make no apology for teaching the Godhead in this manner, and I certainly do not need an endorsement or approval or further interpretation of my words from any man or group of research witch hunters.

Also, I have never taught that men were little gods. It would be a lie for someone to say so. I do teach all souls were created by our Father. A Christian that would not teach this fact would have a big problem with Scripture. Example: Jeremiah 1:5 says, "Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and ordained thee a prophet unto the nations. Another example: Ephesians 1:4 says, "According as He hath chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world."

Recommended additional study lectures on audio CD:

#30574, "Nature of God, El Shaddai
#30417, "Elect"


To say that I teach racism or practice racism is another outright lie. We have people of all races that attend and study with the Shepherd's Chapel. It is very simple to prove this statement. We televise our annual Passover meetings including video interviews of many of the thousands who attend. Order a video tape of any of these interviews and you will see people of all races which effectively documents the falseness of any charges that I teach racism (a sample of Passover Interviews is also offered at the end of this document). God's Word directly teaches that our Heavenly Father created all the races and that it was good, (Genesis 1:27-28, 31). People of all nations and races shall be in the Temple of the Lord throughout eternity (Revelation 21:22-27).

Serpent Seed

What about teaching Serpent Seed? I make no apology for teaching the Word of God. In Matthew 13, our Lord and Saviour explains the Parable of the Sower directly to His disciples. He is very explicit about exactly who the sower of the bad seed really is. Matthew 13:37-39 states, "He (Jesus) answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of Man. The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; the enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels."

Let no one tell you Christ was speaking in a parable here for He was carefully explaining to His disciples the real meaning of the parable He had previously spoken to the multitude. He talked with them in private, and He used language that a child could understand. Christ's teaching of the seed of the devil (or serpent) was nothing new, it was taught from the beginning of Scripture - Genesis.

In Genesis 3:15 God is speaking to the serpent, "and I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shall bruise his heel." The bruising of the heel took place when Christ was nailed to the Cross. And finally, for those who still want further proof as to who the serpent really is; we read in Revelation 12:9, "and the great Dragon was cast out, that old Serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world." Now can anyone with eyes to see and ears to hear have any doubt or confusion about Satan's own seed?

Recommended additional study lectures on audio CD:

#30146, "Genesis, Chapters 1-6"
#30461, "Seed of the Serpent"


What about the use of the word Kenites? It is a Hebrew word that has only one meaning, "sons of Cain." It does not mean Judah. The word Kenite cannot be translated Judah and is never used of Judah. Anyone saying that I use the word to describe Judah is not telling the truth; it would be a lie, because I have never said this.

Recommended additional study lecture on audio CD:

#30436, "Kenites"

Exclusive Messenger

Some "researchers" say that I claim to be God's exclusive messenger for this era. I have never thought this, much less claimed it. Such a claim is another outright lie. Those "researchers" cannot prove it because I have never said this. A Christian would not think of making up lies about someone, so how should we label these "Christian Researchers?"

Doctorate of Religious Education

I have never claimed to have received a doctorate from Roy Gillaspie. I do not know where some of these "researchers" came up with this. Roy Gillaspie was simply a beloved teacher of God's Word and I have never said or implied any such thing. It is true that I have a policy of not publicly stating where I earned my doctorate because then "critics" cannot judge me by association. I have always publicly stated that my credentials are my ability to teach God's Word. To the extent that our Heavenly Father blesses me with the ability to clearly teach His Word then what higher ordination could there be?


In today's world we need to be vigilant for those who would sow seeds of doubt concerning what God's Word actually says. There is nothing wrong with honest disagreement, this does not entitle one to spread outright lies. Acts 17 provides an example of an honest disagreement when Paul disputed with other Apostles in Jerusalem whether circumcision was necessary for salvation. Galatians 2 offers a second witness to the fact that although there was honest disagreement at the beginning of this meeting there was still fellowship at the end. It may also be surprising to note that this disagreement occurred perhaps 16 years after Yahshua's resurrection. And note that all the problems arose because "certain men from Judea" wanted to stir up discord among Christians by spreading the lie that unless Gentiles were circumcised like them they could not have salvation. In other words they denied salvation through Yahshua alone. The Lord hates those who sow discord among brethren (Proverbs 6:16-19).

Paul, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit gives us good advice in II Timothy 2:15-16 when he says, "Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the Word of Truth. But shun profane and vain babblings for they will increase unto more ungodliness." Let us never be afraid to study together in Christian fellowship in a positive way with an earnest heart felt desire to uncover the Truth of God's Word. Our Heavenly Father has chosen not to give us all Truth and Knowledge on a silver platter. He expects us to study His Word and search out what is true (Proverbs 25:2). Paul also tells us the Bereans set a good example for all Christians as "they received the Word with all readiness of mind and searched the Scriptures daily, whether those things were so". (Acts 17:11).

At the Shepherd's Chapel we study God's Word in a unique verse by verse, chapter by chapter and Book by Book methodology. We don't leave anything out. We hold daily Bible classes on a college level which are freely available to all. I frequently caution all listeners not to believe what any man may teach you unless you first check them out directly from God's Word which is unchanging. You will never go wrong by encouraging daily Bible study which allows the spirit to grow ever stronger in knowledge, wisdom and in discernment.

So to those who desire to join the millions of Shepherd's Chapel listeners who enjoy studying God's Word I welcome you. If you disagree with me, that is quite alright. All I ask is that you be honest in disagreement and careful to document your beliefs. I'll always respect honest disagreement.

Our Heavenly Father has a divine purpose for each of His children. You need to stay in His Word and discover yours. May YHVH Bless each and everyone of you in your deeper study into His Word.

Click here to review the Shepherd's Chapel Statement of Faith
Click here (RM) or here (WM) to view sample Passover Interviews."

OV! said...

Statement of Faith

Anonymous said...

For clarification:

11/15/08: Emergency financial summit in Washington, D.C. (Spain/Zapatero got their seat, by the way, from the French, who had two, and the Economist has just published a lengthy interview with P.M. Zapatero, detailing all Spain's financial successes. See Farmer's blog response section for links.)

11/15/05: Signing of the AMA agreement by the U.S., Israel and the E.U. (Dr. Solana signed on behalf of the EU.) For Bible prophecy afficionados (Jewish days begin the previous day at sunset), 11/14/05 + 2,595 (2,520 + 30 + 45) = 12/22/12 (the Jewish day would begin on Friday, 12/21/12, the beginning of a Biblical Sabbath).


AMA agreement:


Anonymous said...

Is there some sort of competition going on to see who can take up the most blog space? If so, what's the prize. If it's good enough I'll compete also. I've got a good 5-footer waiting.

Anonymous said...

That's nothing. I'll win with my eight foot essay from this on-line book about the Constitution.

Anonymous said...

You'll have to go over the six foot mark to win. I just measured Ovi's post and it was just under five feet.

Anonymous said...

Constance, Rudi, Dawn, HK, Suanna, Joyce, Maryanne, Anonymous, Leana, and Doug for the nice words and encouragement.

I will not be staying away from reading what others post here. All of you post such good information I would be foolish to miss it. It's just that I have to get a fresh perspective on what is happening. I've gone through burnout before and always come back. It's that darn rubberband that ties me to the work.


OV! said...


i didnt know there would be so many comedians on such a serious blog.


thanks to everyone for the concern about what i believe. i send the same concern right back.

trust God, read the bible and pray.

in Christ>ovi

Anonymous said...

Just quickly..the encylopedias have very lengthy explanations of the etymology of the name of the Kenites, but the briefest explanation seem to have to do with their profession. You can't assume they are descendants of Cain because of their name.

Gen. 7:23 Thus He blotted out every living thing that was upon the face of the land, from man to animals to creeping things and to birds of the sky, and they were blotted out from the earth; and only Noah was left, together with those that were with him in the ark.

Where would have Cain's seed come from, if his descendants were completely abolished?

The word yˆnéq in Aramaic means “smith.” Professor Sayce thinks they may really have been a tribe of smiths, resembling “the gipsies of modern Europe, as well as the traveling tinkers or blacksmiths of the Middle Ages” (HDB, under the word). This would account for their relations with the different peoples, among whom they would reside in pursuit of their calling. International Standard Bible Encyclopedia

As for God using the seed of Abraham, there is no doubt, but Abraham's bloodline was never very pure..When we think of all the intermarrying...i.e. Ephraim and Manassah had an Egyptian mother. Moses had a Midianite wife, there was Ruth, ,etc, etc,. God punished the physical descendants of Israel for their idolatry. We can't say that because someone is a physical descendant of Abraham they always walk with God. Within Jacob's own family, there were many problems. God is not limited to Abraham's family either. Look at Jethro...Caleb was a Kenzinnite who happened to associate with the tribe of Judah.

John the Baptist said this as he was immersing people in the Jordan:

But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming for baptism, he said to them, “You brood of vipers, who warned you to flee from the wrath to come? “Therefore bear fruit in keeping with repentance; and do not suppose that you can say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham for our father’; for I say to you that from these stones God is able to raise up children to Abraham. Matt 3:7-9

Being a physical descendant of Abraham is not must be "born-again" in the words of Yeshua:

John 3:6 “aThat which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
“Do not be amazed that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ “The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit.” Nicodemus said to Him, “How can these things be?” Jesus answered and said to him, “Are you athe teacher of Israel and do not understand these things? John 3:6-10

We must be born again...

There will be those from every tribe in Israel represented in the kingdom, but there are also those that are lost. Do you remember the story of Lazarus....I'll post the end of it which makes it very clear, that being a descendant of Abraham is not the entry ticket into the kingdom:

“And he cried out and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool off my tongue, for I am in agony in this flame.’ “But Abraham said, ‘Child, remember that during your life you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus bad things; but now he is being comforted here, and you are in agony ‘And besides all this, between us and you there is a great chasm fixed, so that those who wish to come over from here to you will not be able, and that none may cross over from there to us.’“And he said, ‘Then I beg you, father, that you send him to my father’s house — for I have five brothers — in order that he may awarn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.’ “But Abraham *said, ‘They have Moses and the Prophets; let them hear them.’ “But he said, ‘No, father Abraham, but if someone goes to them from the dead, they will repent!’ “But he said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be persuaded even if someone rises from the dead.’”

We realize that this story is speaking of Yeshua who rose from the dead, but look who Abraham is talking to...a literal descendant of his.

There is no doubt God has a plan for the physical descendants of Abraham, but not exclusively and they have to come in through the same door.. In Noah's ark there was one door, in the mishkan there was one entry way, in the Temple and finally with Yeshua. There is only one way to salvation. I am the truth, the light and the way and no one comes to the Father except by Me..said Yeshua ..God's plan through the physical descendants of Abraham was to bring glory to His Name. Sometimes we did and sometimes we didn't...

I agree with you that Abraham was a Hebrew...He was a Hebrew because he "crossed over" from his life where there was pagan idolatry from Babylon where people worshipped the moon god. He left his home and family to follow the true God of Israel. Not all of his family did that...

The famous hall of faith in the book of Hebrews 11, says that Abraham was justified by faith, but so was Rahab and she was a Canaanite....

Haven't looked at your congregation's site, and I am not familiar with it, but I'll have a look.


Glad that helped!

Glad you can allow yourself to rest...

Anonymous said...


You aren't going to get any quarter here at this blog for your particular "brand" of Christian theology. Nearly everyone here would view the set of beliefs to which you adhere as (and I say this as diplomatically as I can) a distortion of Christianity.

I would encourage you to stop wasting your time, and everyone else's, and stop posting this type of information here. Clearly you are not deprived of fellowship since Shepherd's Chapel has other members.

OV! said...


i never said descendents of abraham were exclusive.

also i noticed you are using the

"International Standard Bible Encyclopedia"

and the

"NIV" bible.

are you serious? i gave you the definition of "KENITES" from the original hebrew language, not some third rate international encyclopedia. id advise you to look up the word in the strongs concodance and a KJV bible to be able to take the words back to the original hebrew and greek languages.

Strong's Hebrew Dictionary
7017. Qeyniy

ynyq Qeyniy kay-nee'
or Qiyniy (1 Chron. 2:55) {kee-nee'}; patronymic from 7014; a Kenite or member of the tribe of Kajin:--Kenite.

See Hebrew 7014
Nyq Qayin kah'-yin
the same as 7013 (with a play upon the affinity to 7069); Kajin, THE NAME OF THE FIRST CHILD, also of a place in Palestine, and of an Oriental tribe:--CAIN, Kenite(-s).

"Anonymous said..."

dont worry ill turn the other cheek and dust my shoes off.
i wasnt trying to convert you i was trying to defend my church from lies and rumors being spread about it before anyone even looks at the church itself to see if those rumors are true or not.
we all know what Christ thinks of rumors and liars, not to mention the 8th commandment.

but thats all ill say, see you on the other side...hope you are on thr right side of the gulf.

Anonymous said...

You might want to do a little more research. ISBE is a respected encyclopedia, but in addition to that the Kenites are not descended from Cain just because there is a connection in the etymology of the word. Hebrew Strong's does not say Kenites are descendant of Cain. It talks about etymology of words, which can have a similar source.

There is never a genealogical link drawn in the Bible, whereas in other cases it is very clear.. Two people's names can have similar etymology.. that doesn't automatically mean they are related. Since logically, and according to Scripture we know the linage of Cain was cut off, and only Noah's survived to say that Kenites were descendants of Cain would be false.


OV! said...


you are NOT reading what the definition says, but assuming it says what you would like it to say. its not an etymology, its a DEFINITION. its not some figure of speech open to interpretation. its specific.

here, read it again.

"a Kenite or member of the TRIBE of "KAJIN":--Kenite.

THE NAME OF THE FIRST CHILD(!), also of a place in Palestine, and of an Oriental tribe:--CAIN, Kenite(-s)."

im sorry, but You might want to do a little more research on the NIV.
do me a favor, look up ACTS 8:37. heres what the KJV says:

ACTS 8:37
"And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God."

when you find it in the NIV, let me know and post it here so we can see how its changed from the KJV.

its amazing, you are on a blog that warns against NEW AGE theology, but yet you are using a new age bible.

the irony.

heres an older TV show about bible versions, but still relevant and informative. its a good start, hope you open your eyes:

in Christ>ovi