Just found another very worthy video warning about the Hidden Dangers of the Oprah Winfrey theology and her militant campaigning against and adulterating of orthodox Christianity. Please watch this and encourage the producer.
Thanks!
Constance
P.S. My Perspective will air Friday night at 5 p.m. Eastern Time. But, I have persuaded Joe McNeil of the MicroEffect.com to give me what I believe will be a far better time slot where more can listen (it might be harder, however, for Farmer) for 8 p.m. Eastern time, 5 p.m. Pacific time, TUESDAY and THURSDAY -- that will start, God willing, next Tuesday. Tune into www.themicroeffect.com and STAY TUNED!
98 comments:
I'm having trouble posting comments from my MacBook! Never had before. Any suggestions from the techies among us?
Constance
Good post and good video, Constance. Both Oprah and Obama call themselves Christians without understanding what a Christian really is. It’s amazing that seemingly intelligent people don’t understand the logical fallacy in saying that there are many paths to God when they all contradict each other. I remember only too well the lost feeling I had when I was searching for meaning in the New Age. I once read a book by the famed New Age writer, Richard Bach – it was aptly called “Illusions”. One valuable thing I personally learned is that the Lord is faithful and patient to those who genuinely seek Him.
Constance, try clearing your cache and make sure cookies are accepted from blogger.
Constance, I can't help with your MacBook problem but it seems that the entire 'Comments' section has been re-formatted by Google as it now appears very, very different. It might be worthwhile searching around in your Blogger account settings to see if there's possibly an option to revert back to the former default setting???
Thanks for the You Tube link, there's no 'new' news there for me personally but it does give me the opportunity to ask a question please which has been bugging me for some time and I expect you or someone here might be able to help me with.
WHY is it that the NA followers seem to be awaiting a maitreya/savior character when they believe they are themselves gods and do not believe in sin?
~K~
Hi again Constance - the tiny link below might be of help to you. It explains how to embed comments which seems to be what is now happening with your comments section. It also shows a 'pop up window' option for comments which you previously had, so maybe it can help you backtrack. Good Luck and apologies if I'm giving you the runaround ... just trying to hazard a guess here.
http://tinyurl.com/5cq2lb
PS - I see Farmer and Rich have had the same formatting update happen on their blogs too.
~K~
The key phrase for me in the video, taken from the KJV…
“But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any [man] preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.” [Gal 1:8-9]
Woe unto Oprah! But more importantly is the reference to expect a false gospel preached by “AN ANGEL FROM HEAVEN”.
What we should expect to see, when all is ready, are not just proud blasphemous words coming from the mouths of our human world leaders and media personalities, but a false message from a real live “angel.”
Obama, Solana, Blavatsky, Bailey, Oprah, Tolle, Williamson, and all these others, are merely human deceivers engaged in laying the foundation for the coming “angelic” deceiver. Although we know that the foundation is of clay, I don’t think anyone who blogs here would disagree with the fact that a foundation has indeed been laid.
Anonymous 5:36
Yes, in the Age of Aquarius we are all to recognize our god qualities, but as in the book Animal Farm, some gods are more equal than others. In their belief system the more reincarnations one has gone through and the more one has learned, the higher up the scale. In their belief system Moses brought in the Age of Aries with the symbol of the ram. Jesus was a high level reincarnate who came back after some 150(?) reincarnations to bring in the Age of Pisces with the symbol of the fish. The Age of Aries was to be over with. Now some high level reincarnate is to come to bring in the Age of Aquarius, I suppose with all manner of New Age teachings. People of all religions who are expecting a messiah figure will supposedly recognize the value of the teachings of this individual. It isn't going to happen. Lots of claimants in the fringe communities. Whoever appears is going to have lots of competition.
Dorothy
Very nice video....
For anyone who would have any mathematical understanding, I have a question...
If the chances of Jesus fulfilling 8 of the prophecies from the old testament is one in one hundred quadrillion (1/100,000,000,000,000,000), then would that same number also apply if Javier Solana were to fulfill 8 prophecies from the Bible?
nick
Nick,
This is an astute observation regarding Solana, but the question still remains has he truly fulfilled them? We see many things in Javier that COULD BE the fulfillment yet nothing is concrete yet, the reason why is simple, the revealing of the son of perdition is yet to happen. Since scripture states that there will be many fales prophets and many anti-christs we have but one event that will seperate the wannabe's from the man of lawlessness that Daniel, John, and Jesus as well as other prophets described the man. Javier is still the front runner in my opinion, but the enemy is throwing obstacles in the form of other candidates as distractions. For all any of us know Solana is a distraction, but as time dwindles on that seems less likely. Let us not forget either that there are a total of 13 leaders that are reffered to by John in revelation, 10 that are given the power to rule with the beast, the little horn that brags and speaks against God(this is the one everyone is fixated on), as well as two from the beast of the false prophet. The last 2 should be as frightening to all as the man of perdition, as it is they that cause all great and small to worship the first beast, it is they that require a mark to show alleigence to the first beast. I see many things happenening within the current crises that leave me pondering more the identity of the 2 horns of the false prophet. Is it any coincidence that the current atmosphere seems to be heading towards the USA and UN looking to Europe and saying these are the examples we should be following? As if to cause all to marvel and wonder at the example the EU is setting. Is it also then coincidence that after decades of world leadership the US is now lending aid in the form of troops and military to EU goals and aspirations? The picture is still being painted so it is difficult to see for all the broad brush strokes, but what direction are those strokes headed? Any one can see that the United States is about to step back from their role as leading influence in the world, and it seems willingly so. The question then becomes who will emerge as the new influence? If the economic crisis and current peace resolution efforts are an indication Europe seems to be the country with the answers that people want to hear. Lets not forget that per Foster Bailey, Europe is the country of choice for the New Agers. It could all be coincidence, Solana fitting the way he does, Sarkozy pushing for global economic restructuring, US deffering their role on the world stage and lending support to EU missions, but as I have said before these are a whole bunch of coincidences.
JD
WEIRD AGAIN -- I just attempted to post a highly detailed post on all the prophecies and "coincidences" on one highly educated guess named Javier Solana. It did not make it up here and the old format suddenly reappeared!
Constance
Dorothy - thank you, your reply has helped, especially your comment that for NA-ers, "some gods are more equal than others" and the reminder that their reincarnation beliefs are instrumental to their theology ... what a cruel, unforgiving and little god/idol for people to choose to worship.
JD - I have never previously heard Europe referred to as a country ... what a disturbing thought but one that probably sits more comfortably with the EU politicians.
~K~
Constance - I tried posting a minute ago and it all went daft and reverted back to old way.
Blogger did put in a new default setting for the blogs but maybe it's thrown up too many bugs and they reverted back???
YEP - there's an update reference here;
http://buzz.blogger.com/
~K~
Shocking video exposing George Herbert Walker Bush, the New World Order's plans, and concentration camps in the USA:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JPA4DJ5r3qy
To K (3:15 PM):
The European Union (as "the revived Roman Empire") could, at some point in the future, be classified as a "country" --and possibly the most powerful country in the world!!!
Oprah's views are identical to what mainline Evangelicals are now promoting. Mike Bickle, part of the latter day prophets org (heretical--not mainline yet, but becoming more accepted all the time, if not his org at least his heretical beliefs) says it this way:
“The Protestant wing of the western church, which is a tiny percentage of the Body of Christ…, is nearly completely (98%) unaware that the Holy Spirit is restoring contemplative prayer (using Eastern Mystical Meditation practices to reach and commune with God, also that God is in all and that all are seeking the true god in their own way, eventually leads to believing we are god...)—center stage—to the church… The Holy Spirit is restoring this precious jewel (contemplative prayer) to the body of Christ. This is the God ordained means of attaining the fullness of God.” (audio message Contemplative Prayer pt1 by Mike Bickle on the Mike Bickle Teachings blogspot)
And his advice to questioning, spiritually languishing and anguishing souls is this, “Don’t evaluate yourself, don’t evaluate others. Just keep going after it.” --"it" is mystical union with god using his other's heretical practices -- (audio message Contemplative Prayer pt1 by Mike Bickle on the Mike Bickle Teachings blogspot)
In plain language that means don’t read or listen to anything discerningly or analytically. Don’t question anything or anybody—not even yourself. Just go with what feels right.
Discernment is worth more than gold!
Dave in CA
To anonymous 3:26 PM
Hhhm, the EU bods are certainly chiselling away at us! We've lost our old British passport to a European Union one and our driving licenses have been messed with too!
Thankfully we still have the British pound sterling and amazingly the UK has recently been given the 'freedom' to sell in pints, pounds and ounces again. It sure is wacky over here!
~K~
Constance,
I am very much looking forward to your detailed post on all the prophecies and "coincidences" concerning Javier Solana.
Waiting in anticipation!
K,
I refer to EU as a country out of a point of view that, the EU as a whole refers to member countries as states, their is a fully functional government unto itself, add to that despite a no vote by Ireland the Libson treaty (a constitution) has been ratified, which even now moves are made to enact. Under the Libson Europe seeks to speak as one voice, if that doesn't describa a country I don't know what does. Here in the states when we went from individual sovereign states to a union, the process was implemented slowly, ie the states didn't lose their ability to circumvent laws made bt the union immediately, it was done over several years, until some states caught on to what was happening and suceeded thus starting a civil war. What is happening with europe is no different, consolodation of power makes it easier to control the people. Empire may be a better descriptive term for the EU, but in todays society countries are empires unto themselves.
JD
Dr. Solana refers to 2010 Free Trade Agreement in the M.E.:
http://tinyurl.com/65lvkq
or
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20081023/wl_mideast_afp/mideastsyriaeudiplomacy
Hi ~K~
In response to your coment,
"WHY is it that the NA followers seem to be awaiting a maitreya/savior character when they believe they are themselves gods and do not believe in sin?"
LOL! THAT IS A VERY GOOD POINT!
I tried twice again to post and after a lengthy composition and attempt to post, was bounced. It might be an EXCELLENT IDEA to do a cut and paste of your post before submitting it so in case it is lost in cyberspace, it is retrievable for posting later.
Constance
Here's what they are told:
"I'm evolved, you're evolved, but I [whatever New Age guru is speaking with them] am MORE EVOLVED. This Maitreya [Betraya to us] is the MOST EVOLVED . . .
And they are taught and believe that their "Maitreya" is going to usher in a New Golden Age == JUST LIKE THE ONE USELESS (Ooops, Eustace) MULLINS DESCRIBES IN THE WORLD ORDER published by the Ezra Pound Institute of Civilization, Staunton, Virginia. Ezra Pound, for the record, was an active Theosophist and Social Crediter [sic]!
Constance
It seems appropriate here to point out that Solana is trying to get a Free Trade Agreement with an organisation called the Gulf Cooperation Community whose aim, according to wikipedia, is to have an economic union by 2010.
Hi All,
I saw this New Age video on Slice of Laodicea. It's called:
Manifest Obama: Movement Calls for Daily One-Minute ‘Presidential’ Meditation
"You are a sanctuary of a sacred vision for a renewed America."
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=02c_1224641941
Blessings,
Deannie
Hi All,
You REALLY need to watch this video on WND regarding the Weather Underground's plans for "reeducation camps and the elimination of 25 million die hard capitalists";
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=78929
Also,this brings to mind the following verse in Daniel:
"Thus he shall act against the STRONGEST fortresses with a foreign god, which he shall acknowledge, and advance its glory; and he shall cause them to rule over many, and DIVIDE THE LAND FOR GAIN" Daniel 11:39 (emphasis mine)
I've always wondered if the United States would be the Strongest Fortress and if we would be the spoils divided up by Antichrist and given to his supporters. I've wondered if our possible economic crisis and mortgages bought up by the government might be a prelude to others "owning" us. This back the "Jospeh Principle" article that was recently posted.
Just a thought. Blessings,
Deannie
I should add, the reason the Weathermen video reminded me of the verse in Daniel is the part about China, North Vietnam and Russia carving up pieces of the US to run. I don't think that is the threat anymore but what about the Antichrist? I don't understand how it all plays out, but that verse somehow seems pertinent to the US. Why aren't we defending our borders? Why illegal immigration (even to the point of 5 million mortgages to illegals)? What about a NAU? I'd love others' interpretations.
Deannie
Thanks for the links Deannie. The
following falls into the same category as the "Manifest Obama"
video but on a global scale.
Heads up everybody:
Use your own discretion as you check the links included below.
HARMONIC CONVERGENCE 2008 STYLE
The Gaiafield Project is the “host” of WiseUSA ’08.
It’s was more than obvious as I read - the formation of this “subtle activists” non-profit
organization has as its goal - by way of a mass meditation event
called WiseUSA - to influence the upcoming Presidential election.
The GaiaField Project, “aims to weave a multi-hub planetary network of spiritual peacemakers and communities who will regularly participate in large-scale globally-synchronized meditation and prayer events to support planetary healing and transformation in alignment with the principles set out in the Earth Charter.”
Home page of the GAIAFIELD PROJECT. Make sure you view the video
on the site. It is also available on YouTube.
http://www.gaiafield.net/
http://www.gaiafield.net/about
http://www.youtube.com/
watch?v=qCzffrwiZ5E
WiseUSA O8 is, “ a global non-partisan program to bring the world together in meditation and prayer during the US 2008 election season.”
The “Emergence – Program Schedule” began October 1,2008 and will run thru November 6th. This event is “the heart” of the Gaiafield.
“The program starts on Wednesday, October 1st with a series of teleconferences and audio webcasts featuring spiritual teachers from around the world. It will culminate in a 13 day intensive program that runs from October 25th to November 6th. This interactive program will peak on November 2, 2008 in a Global Ceremony featuring meditation, prayer and music which will simultaneously bring together public gatherings in Washington D.C., San Jose, and other major cities. These locations will be linked by videoconference and the event will be broadcast live online to hundreds of groups and tens of thousands of individuals worldwide.”
This is the initial September 19, 2008 press release
http://www.gaiafield.biz/
files/ReleaseFINALFINAL-2.doc
Featured speakers include:
David Spangler - Lorian Association, Findhorn Foundation
http://tinyurl.com/5rs755
http://lorian.bigmindcatalyst.com/cgi/bmc.pl?page=pubpg1.html&node=1009
Marianne Williamson –
http://marianne.com/
James O’Dea - I was surprised to read O’dea has resigned as President of the Institute of Noetic Sciences. Here is the recent announcement from founder Edgar Mitchell.
http://tinyurl.com/6o6t2a
http://www.noetic.org/main/
HomePage/edgar_statement_
2008-08-14.htm
Corinne McLaughlin – The Center for Visionary Leadership – “Spiritual Politics”
http://visionarylead.org/
James Twyman - The Beloved Community, founder of The Seminary of Spiritual Peacemaking. “The Peace Troubadour”
http://emissaryoflight.com/
_.aspx?t_t=5
Joseph Giove - Founder of Common Passion. (listed first on CommonPassion advisory board is Ervin Laszlo also Barbara Fields, Ph.D., Executive Director, The Association for Global New Thought)
http://commonpassion.org/
Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain…
“Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God. 7And the peace of God, which transcends all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus.” Philippians 4
-Rudi
http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=309653051843388
http://www.investmentnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20081007/REG/810079894
Congress wants to get at 401K money. Is any private property safe these days?
Deannie
I have been gaining quite an education reading this blog over the past several months. I have been compiling information from Constance, and others and trying to put it into an easy to follow format for my family and friends. In doing so, I came across 2 items.
An article on Obama’s website describes Obama’s favorable disposition towards the AoC. It states, “The Alliance of Civilizations has already been putting machinery in place to constructively work towards the goals and vision presented by Barack Obama.”
http://tiny.cc/AFNmc
On Barbara Marx Hubbard’s own blog (July ’08), she is nearly giddy with “cognitive ecstasy” as she arrogantly writes, “I had thought we were aiming at the transformation of the American presidency by 2012. However, it is now clear that 2008 is the year of the Big Shift.” She continues and references “the radical nature of our political opportunity as seen by the unprecedented ascendency of Barack Obama.”
http://tiny.cc/OMY6t
Having just read through Hidden Dangers of the Rainbow twice, I noted how Constance shows the limitless networking ability of the NAM. The potential network of Barak Obama with the endorsement and friendship of Oprah Winfrey, Oprah’s popular influence, and promotion of Marianne Williamson, Williamson’s alliance with Barbara Marx Hubbard and Neal Donald Walsch and Hubbard’s powerful and influential political connection with Dennis Kucinich is alarming. Add to this Colin Powell’s connection with Javier Solana’s military power and Obama’s favorable disposition toward the Alliance of Civilization agenda—we have a recipe for unprecedented spiritual apostasy in our time.
I have been drawn back to active Scripture memorization. Here is one that gives me hope referencing the “calling” when Christ returns in victory over those who cause tribulation and is glorified in His saints, “Wherefore also we pray always for you, that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfill all the good pleasure of his goodness, and the work of faith with power: That the name of our Lord Jesus Christ may be glorified in you, and ye in him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ.” 2 Thess. 1:11,12 Halleluja!
YesNaSpanishTown- Yikes! I had missed the July 8 entry on BMH blog. Great scripture too! Gracias!
-Rudi
YesNaSpanishTown, BMH and evolution!
Just as biological evolution is a lie so is “spiritual” evolution a lie. The movie 2001 clearly imagines what Christians are hindering, the spark of Humankind’s divinity. Lesser humanoids had to pass into extinction, and I’m confident that some DNA researcher will find the Gene for Christianity; I expect a pregnancy test will be developed to test for this gene and THEY will either recommend or demand abortion.
YesNaSpanishTown, Rudi, what did you think about the earth symbol at the lower right at the end of the article: Obama-like or what?
EVOLUTION, OBAMA, NEW AGE LEADERS
Time to repost this information for itself and because it links to the Barbara Hubbard information which was new to me. Thanks for posting that.
Evolution is being discussed by top New Agers at http://www.thedarwinproject.com/about/about.html (See below.)
They are talking about basing a NEW idea of evolution based on Darwin. Check out that website and then look at the pages from the book Bankrolling Evolution which I talk about at the very end here which promotes Obama. It sounds like a classier version of the physical perfected Aryan man concept.
OBAMA SUPPORTED BY TOP NEW AGE LEADERS
INSTITUTE OF NOETIC SCIENCE AND POWER
This is a good place to put the information I shared on the radio show
as it shows a connection between the IONS and political power today.
It's all in the networking, ideas promoted at one base carried over
from one base to another.
Shift in Action builds itself as an upgrade action of IONS. It has quite a full set of links, one of which is www.shiftinaction.com/community_links Another is the Luminaries link. http://www.shiftinaction.com/luminary_links or
http://tinyurl.com/5eeqoj
Now all Luminaries are not equal. Note that the names are listed by the
first names. The one I want to concentrate on is Riane Eisler. http://www.shiftinaction.com/discover/luminaries/riane_eisler or
http://tinyurl.com/6htgek
"Dr. Eisler serves on many boards, commissions, and advisory councils,
including the Editorial Board of World Futures, the Global Council of
the International Museum of Women, and the International Editorial
Board of The Encyclopedia of Conflict, Violence, and Peace. She
co-founded the Spiritual Alliance to Stop Intimate Violence (SAIV) with
Nobel Peace Laureate Betty Williams (with Council members such as Queen
Noor of Jordan, Archbishop Desmond Tutu, Harvard theologian Harvey Cox,
and global leaders such as Jane Goodall)."
She is also a Fellow of the World Business Academy http://www.worldbusiness.org/, a member of the World Commission on Global Consciousness, http://globalspirit.org/, and a Founding member of General Evolution Research Group.
What I will follow here is the Center for Partnership Studies which she founded with her husband, David Loye. http://partnershipway.org/
David Loye is a Futurist, the name used before New Age came to the
surface. Futurists had a huge network. Loye was a former faculty member
at Princeton, home of the Bollingin papers and other New Age material
at their press, as well as Peter Singer. Loye was also Co-founder of
the New Society for the Study of Chaos Theory. Chaos Theory is a NA
study in itself.
Now two offshoots of Center for Partnership Studies are the
aforementioned Spiritual Alliance given under Eisler's bio. Another is
the Darwin Project. To get an idea of the support this organization
has, look at www.thedarwinproject.com/about/council.html or
http://tinyurl.com/5sguz5
Here are given the names of 50 leading American, European and Asian
scientists. Now what they are supporting is not what is generally
thought of as Darwin's ideas. Instead they are promoting social
Darwinism, what might be called the caring and sharing New Age ideas.
The extension of these beliefs are found in another political system we
are all familiar with.
Now we finally get down to public business. Loye wrote a book called
Bankrolling Evolution, A Program for a President. It can be found at http://benjaminfranklinpress.com/hotbooks.html or
http://tinyurl.com/668dy4.
What's the book about? It shows how and why an Obama presidency can put
the power of a new science of healing behind a drive to build a better world.
Dorothy
world. It also has a strong attack against McCain. The book is a report
to the Council. It is also offered to Obama support groups. It really
doesn't matter if Obama can be openly shown to support these ideas.
They support him. The network is powerful enough to control him.
A tip of the hat to the person who finds the comment in the book that Muslims and Christians can be violent. I forgot to copy it.
Dorothy
Dave in CA,
I thought it was interesting that Mike Bickle would refer to Catholicism as a "wing" of Christianity...
Catholicism comes MUCH CLOSER to Christianity than Kansan City "prophet" Mike Bickle. The Catholics (like everybody else) have their faults to be sure, but at least they have it straight who God is and that Jesus Christ died for our salvation.
I'm not so sure about Mike Bickle with his "12 apostles"!
Constance
Many, many thanks to Dorothy for the brilliant post showing linkages between IONS (and to all, be sure to remember the linkages between Fellowship Foundation aka "The Family" aka "Cedars" aka "Prayer BreakfastNetwork" AND "The Institute of Noetic Science," such linkages going back to Paul N. Temple's involvement with the Abraham Vereide network starting in 1944.
Constance
Many, many thanks to Dorothy for the brilliant post showing linkages between IONS (and to all, be sure to remember the linkages between Fellowship Foundation aka "The Family" aka "Cedars" aka "Prayer BreakfastNetwork" AND "The Institute of Noetic Science," such linkages going back to Paul N. Temple's involvement with the Abraham Vereide network starting in 1944.
Constance
Constance and friends,
Thanks for all your research. Constance, you have strong words re: Mike Bickle. "...at least they have it straight who God is and that Jesus Christ died for our salvation...I'm not so sure about Mike Bickle with his "12 apostles"!
I have been looking for documented sources of information on the Dominion movement and need some questions answered. I am in a delicate situation with this. Is there anyone here who can correspond with me?
Some of those I minister with are big fans of Mike Bickle. I have become very disenchanted with all the prophetic words, etc. I don't follow Bickle, but many of my fellow church members do. I do not have critical or defensive intent in my questioning--just sincere need to know. What makes you question Mike Bickle's salvation message?
YesNaSpanishTown
I read Eckhart Tolles "A New Earth"
It is IMO written to deceive Christians, there are biblical references all over the place and even I found myself saying that it sounds believable, there is a power over these demonic writings. Tolle stops short of admitting that the book was channeled, but he admits that he had to relocate because the consciousness told him to, in order to receive the words to the book.
My pastor asked me to talk to the ladies of our church about the Oprah webinar series with Tolle, I used much of Constance's research in my presentation- thank you Constance for all of your efforts to open our eyes to the dangerous teachings of the New Age. I know that many of the women in the group I spoke to were totally clueless about Oprah, and the far reaches of the New Age movement.
I am likewise concerned about her endorsement of Obama and his cozy relationship with New Age groups and the rise of the cult like following he seems to be acquiring among folks in our country who are unaware of where it may all lead.
God Bless
Gert
Constance you are no alone with the problem, me too having more and more trouble these days publishing new articles or I work on a post and everything suddenly disapears. Looks as if we are doing something very right on track!
Need some good nerves and a lot of patience...Very looking forward to read your next one!
Björn
It may be server problems, wherever they are, but Herb Peters site won't come up for me.
Horus, the Falcon God, and 13 Pigeons
Stay with me here folks, thanks to Bjorn’s blog, I’ve made a complete circle….right back to where I started, in the "green zone".
National Pigeon Day was celebrated in NYC, June 13, 2009.
http://www.nationalpigeonday.blogspot.com/
One of the speakers was author Charles Patterson, who included the following quote in the preface of his book, "Eternal Treblinka: Our Treatment of Animals and the Holocaust", slated for publishing in 13 languages.
"Animals are innocent casualties of the
world view that asserts that some lives are more
valuable than others, that the powerful are entitled to
exploit the powerless, and that the weak must be
sacrificed for the greater good." [AIDS and animal activist Steven Simmons]
Some pigeon facts from the blogspot:
“Pigeons and doves are universal symbols of peace, love and tranquility throughout recorded history.”
“Science now tells us that the pigeon has been found to be able to remember hundreds of faces and are equal to higher order animals, such as dolphins and porpoises in their cognitive abilities.”
”For centuries domestic pigeons were revered, until the 1960's and 70's when there was a concerted effort and false campaign employed by the pest control industry so that they could be exterminated, thereby creating a billion dollar industry.”
So, why should we care about the fate of pigeons?
Hard to corroborate this, but posted on Bjorn’s blog, and at least one other blog I could find, is an account that says on October 8, 2008, NYC Police responded to a call and found 13 dead birds in front of the entrance to 11 Wall St. The birds were presumed to be pigeons. I don’t have to tell you that Wall Street’s subsequent financial meltdown has sent shockwaves around the world. No, I’m not saying the dead birds caused the meltdown. I am also not saying that symbols have any power in and of themselves. All I am saying is that symbols do have significance.
Bjorn has an interesting post that links the 13 Pigeons to the sun-scarabeus cult symbol within W.B. Mershon’s 1907 book, “The Passenger Pigeon”.
http://freiberg.blogspot.com/search?q=13+pigeons
One blogger I read wrote that the 13 dead pigeons laying at the foot of Wall Street symbolically represented the original 13 American colonies. Their corpses are a sign that the revolution is finally over, with all financial power returning to Britian. This not so amusing (to many) 200 year experiment to create a republic based on Judeo-Christian laws, “one nation, under God”, instead of one nation under a “worldly king”, has finally failed.
Read the following poem. Then, after reading it, listen to the same poem on the audio recording:
Reasons for the Mass Destruction of Pigeons in Venice
http://qarrtsiluni.com/2008/10/13/pigeons-in-venice/
http://tinyurl.com/6hlwt4
After listening to the poem, consider:
“We are the ones” has been used as an Obama campaign mantra. [See related videos on You Tube.]
“We” in the poem, and in the campaign mantra, obviously refers to the elite, the enlightened ones, those who have now attained the ability to carry out “the plan”.
The pigeons obviously are the rest of us.
Is anyone really surprised that Obama friend Bill Ayers and his 1960’s Weatherman terrorist group called for the elimination of 25 million “conservative” Americans?
The occult “elite”, the Mdm Blavatsky’s, the Alice Bailey’s, et al, all longed for the day when it would be feasible to eliminate all those who could not be converted to their way of thinking, all the “bitter clingers”, all those neanderthal’s who are “stuck” in the mud conservative family oriented and God honoring. (Or as the Alliance of Civilization labels us, those uncouth fundamentalists!)
Of course the actual number needing to be eliminated today is much higher than it was 40 years ago. Environmental groups such as Earth First, and Defenders of Wildlife, and their leadership, (activists like Dave Foreman, author of the Wildland’s Project), have long dreamed of a “sustainable” world with a vastly reduced human population. [See Georgia Guidestones.]
Just ask Al Gore what an ideal global population would be. His buddy, Undersecretary of State Tim Wirth, publicly acknowledged way back during the Clinton years, that no more than a billion people should be inhabiting this planet.
While the exact number of pigeons needed to service the needs of the “elite” in a “sustainable” world is debatable, clearly billions must be sacrificed. For the greater good, of course.
For more on this subject, see Bjorn’s blog at:
http://freiberg.blogspot.com/2008/08/gaia-needs-ethnic-cleansing-from-us.html
Oops, correction, NPD, June 13, 2008. Silly me.
Some posting and access thoughts...
I followed a wee bit of Apprising Ministries problems with hosting and publishing of opinions regarding Pastor Ken Silva and Rick Warren apologist Richard Abanes, so it's becoming clear that personal and corporate bodies do not like opposition, in any form:
http://tinyurl.com/4ytf9r
http://tinyurl.com/6f3xsp
yesnaspanishtown,
The link below is to an in depth article on Mike Bickle written by Pastor Bob DeWaay.
http://tinyurl.com/5a6uga
oldmanoftheski,
Here is a quick click to Wikipedia, regarding the Georgia Guide Stones. These state that the human population should not exceed 500,000,000...
http://tinyurl.com/ywbewa
I too, fully expect a "crisis" in the opening weeks, months, of an Obama administration. Some say widespread riots and civil unrest due to the economic crash and massive layoffs in the workforce. Others predict something on the order of a terrorist attack, or a "bird flu" pandemic, that many will (correctly) attribute to a release of bioweapons. Whatever the "crisis" turns out to be, we've already been warned most Americans won't like Obama's response. Gee, what could that mean?
I figure backyard farmers like me will find that our own neighbors will be turning us in to the authorities because we refuse to kill off a handful of (healthy) chickens, give up our shotguns, or drive 55.
Germany Threatens Ireland:
(excerpt)
"To the most careful watchers of the EU, this comes as no surprise. It merely reinforces the claim of some of the more astute observers, such as Rodney Atkinson in his book Fascist Europe Rising, that the development of the EU has paralleled that of the Third Reich. As the Trumpet has long forecast, the results will be even more devastating than those of the Nazi/fascist era."
http://www.thetrumpet.com/index.php?q=5603.3921.0.0
(Thank you to Johnny at
http://saynotoglobalgovernance.blogspot.com/ for locating the above.)
Here is a good link for info on Bickle.
http://herescope.blogspot.com/search?q=bickle
The following has been issued by the Council of the European Union (where Dr. Solana is Sec.-Gen.):
(quote)
Council Conclusions on setting up national alert platforms and a European alert platform for reporting offences noted on the Internet
2899th JUSTICE and HOME AFFAIRS Council meeting
Luxembourg, 24 October 2008
(skip)
INVITES EUROPOL to:
(1) establish and host a European platform which will be the point of convergence of national platforms and will have as its purpose to:
(a) collect and centralise information about offences noted on the Internet, supplied by
national platforms and first analysed by them to determine whether the offences are
European or extra-national in nature and hence need to be notified to the European
platform2;
(skip)
1 This Decision is expected to be adopted before the end of 2008.
(skip)
INVITES THE COMMISSION to:
(1) consider financial support for related national and transnational projects."
(end quote)
http://tinyurl.com/6evkjj
or
http://www.consilium.europa.eu/ueDocs/cms_Data/docs/pressData/en/jha/103537.pdf
We need to preach the gospel to Catholics so they can be born again. Demons know that Yeshua died for the Church. Contemplative prayer is communing with demonic spirits and is an abomination to God.
These statements are simplistic and harsh. God is harsh and has made a few things very easy to choose between.
Steve
Thanks to Young Grasshopper who first put me wise to FBI Agent Larry Grathwohl and his infiltration and investigation of the Weather Underground.
Thursday, October 23, 2008
TERRORISTS AND COMMUNISTS SUPPORT WHO?
"Seantor (sic) Obama's relationship with Weather Underground terrorist Bill Ayers is now well known. So is his relationship with Mike Klonsky, founder of the Maoist "October League." Mr. Klonsky was blogging in Senator Obama's website as recently as June 25, 2008. In 1991 Klonsky and Ayers founded the "Small Schools Workshop" in Chicago. They received nearly $2 million in funding from the Joyce and Woods Foundation and the Chicago Annenberg Challenge when Barack Obama sat on the boards of those organizations--indeed, Senator Obama was the chair of the board that oversaw funding decisions when he was at Joyce/Woods.
Today the "American Thinker" linked to a video of a man named Larry Grathwohl, an FBI agent who infiltrated the Weather Underground in 1969-1970. In the video Mr. Grathwohl claims that the Weather Underground discussed mudering up to 25 million Americans if they ever came to power in the United States. After viewing the video I did some googling of Mr. Grathwohl and came across this 1977 story in the New York Times, discussing the Weather Underground. Excerpts below:
FBI Asserts Cuba Aided Weathermen
The New York Times
October 9, 1977
By NICHOLAS M. HORROCK
WASHINGTON, Oct. 8 - Cuban espionage agents operating in the United States and Canada supplied limited aid to the Weather Underground, a militant antiwar organization, in the late 1960's and early 1970's, according to a top-secret report of the Federal Bureau of Investigation
The following were some of the key points:
-Three years before militant members of the students for a Democratic Society split off to form the Weather Underground Organization in 1970, North Vietnamese and Cuban officials were influencing radical antiwar strategy through foreign meetings. Many of these meetings were held in Communist countries, including Hungary, Czechoslovakia and North Vietnam,
-The conduit for contact in the United States was a group of intelligence agents assigned to the staff of the Cuban Mission to the United Nations in New York. These agents arranged for American youths to be inculcated with revolutionary fervor and, occasionally, to be trained in practical weaponry by Cuban military officers through the so-called Venceremos Brigades.
-After the Weathermen went "underground" in 1970 and many of them were being sought by the F.B.I. on criminal charges, Cuban intelligence officers were in touch with them from both the New York mission and the Cuban Embassy in Canada.
-Cuban officials helped several Weather Underground adherents who feared arrest in the United States to travel to Prague, Czechoslovakia, and then to reenter the United Slates surreptitiously. The report linked the growing militancy of certain members of the Students for a Democratic Society, which resulted in the so-called Days of Rage in Chicago in 1969; to North Vietnamese advice the year before to choose youngsters who would battle with the police.
The report noted that the objective of Cuban intelligence officers in the General Directorate of Intelligence (known by its initials in Spanish as the D.G.I., Cuba's equivalent of the C.I.A.) was not always the same as that of the young members of the Weather Underground.
It said the ultimate objective of the D.G.I's participation in setting up the Venceremos Brigades "is the recruitment of individuals who are politically oriented and who someday may obtain a position, elective or appointive, somewhere in the U.S. Government, which would provide the Cuban Government with access to political, economic and military intelligence...
A man who was publicly described as the most effective informer the F.B.I. ever placed among the Weathermen, Larry Grathwohl, reported to the bureau that a code system for communications had been set up by the Cubans, the report said.
"In February 1970, leading WUO member Bill Ayers told fellow underground WUO member Larry Grathwohl that if communication could not be made through these Canadian numbers, an individual should get in touch with the Cuban Embassy in Canada in order to establish contact with other members of the WUO," the report said.
Why is a candidate for the President of the United States palling around with Communists and terrorists? Why do they support him?
Posted by Gibbons J. Cooney
Posted by Fr. John Malloy, SDB at 5:34 PM
http://tinyurl.com/5lhuzz
_______________________________
ANOTHER COMMUNIST IN OBAMA'S ORB
Meet Michael Klonsky, Obama's "social justice" education expert.
(a.k.a. Another reason why Johnny can't read? Or think?)
By Andrew C. McCarthy
....Here’s what you need to know. Klonsky is an unabashed communist whose current mission is to spread Marxist ideology in the American classroom. Obama funded him to the tune of nearly $2 million. Obama, moreover, gave Klonsky a broad platform to broadcast his ideas: a “social justice” blog on the official Obama campaign website.
To be clear, as it seems always necessary to repeat when Obamaniacs, in their best Saul Alinsky tradition, shout down the opposition: This is not about guilt by association. The issue is not that Obama knows Klonsky … or Ayers … or Dohrn … or Wright … or Rashid Khalidi …
The issue is that Obama promoted and collaborated with these anti-American radicals. The issue is that he shared their ideology.
Klonsky’s communist pedigree could not be clearer. His father, Robert Klonsky, was an American communist who was convicted in the mid-Fifties for advocating the forcible overthrow of the United States government — a violation of the Smith Act, anti-communist legislation ultimately gutted by the Supreme Court. In the Sixties, Klonsky the younger teamed with Ayers, Dohrn, and other young radicals to form the Students for a Democratic Society. It was out of the SDS that Ayers and Dohrn helped found the Weatherman terrorist group.
Klonsky took a different path, albeit one that led inexorably to a new partnership with Ayers, which Obama mightily helped underwrite. Upon splitting off from the SDS, Klonsky formed a Maoist organization, first known as the “October League,” which ultimately became the “Communist Party (Marxist Leninist).”
Klonsky was CP(ML)’s chairman. He was so highly thought of by Mao’s regime that he was among the first Americans invited to visit Communist China. When he was feted there in 1977, a year after Mao’s death, the communist leadership hailed Klonsky’s party as “reflecting the aspirations of the proletariat and working people.”
Klonsky was a regular guest of the Chicoms until 1981, when the relationship soured over the post-Mao leadership’s free-market reforms. (Yes, Klonsky is apparently more committed to communism than China’s own Communist Party.) So what was a Leftist radical without platform to do? Why, what else? He became an American college professor specializing in education.
...read entire article....
http://tinyurl.com/6jpru2
_______________________________
HOW IS IT UNDER THAT BUS COMRADE KLONSKY
http://globallabor.blogspot.com/2008/06/how-is-it-under-that-bus-comrade.html
or
http://tinyurl.com/5nrg8u
_______________________________
oldmanofthesky - thanks for pointing to my article with the pigeons and doing so much research here - "one worldy nation under one king" - interesting enough the name of the chief of the bank of England here: MER(o)VIN KING.
here the corrected link to my article in tiny:
http://tinyurl.com/5l9z3l
Björn
Check out www.worldnetdaily.com
for WND's new evidence on Obama:
"Newspaper shows Obama belonged to socialist party Democrat's campaign denied allegations,but new evidence indicates membership"
--WND
"Democrat: Obama's grandma confirms Kenyan birth -- 'This has been a real sham he's pulled off for the last 20 months'"
--WND
Listen,
If anyone has knowledge about the Illuminati, you have to watch this. At 3 minutes 10 seconds you will not believe your ears!
http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=902540383&play=1
JB in CO
Anonymous 2:00 P.M. and All
Carrie Tomko also blogged about Obama's ties to the "NEW PARTY" just this past Tuesday, October 21, 2008.
FUSION VOTING AND THE NEW PARTY
Like an unborn baby in the Democratic womb, the New Party nestled within the Democratic Party and gave birth through the fusion method to the candidacy of Barak Obama. Fusion is one political system that Obama supporters do not want to see aborted.
Obama would like to distance himself from ACORN. He would like us to think ACORN played only an insignificant role in his nomination. Apparently that isn't the case. Where is the mainline news media on this one?
To understand how it happened, it is necessary to understand fusion voting....read entire article....
http://tinyurl.com/5q4mlv
_______________________________
I am out of town on laptop today. I won't be able to see video or be in the chat today. I will probably will have much to digest when I get back home. 57 post were a lot to read already.
to: YesNaSpanishTown
A good place to start looking for information on dominion theology would be:
http://www.lighthousetrailsresearch.com/dominionism.htm
You can also search the site for blog articles on Bickle, etc.
Dave in CA
JB in CO you are a brave soul.
Let's see how fast you get skewered here for bringing Paulson's connection to the Illuminati to our attention.
Anonymous 2:00 you also don't belong here.
Don't you recall that we are not supposed to talk about Obama's birth certificate issue here because Constance thinks the whole things is ridiculous?
JB in CO,
The CNBC Market Outlook report is the first time I've ever heard the words, "I think there’s a bunch of wrong moves by Hank Paulson and the illuminati of the country, if you will..." as stated by Jeffrey Saut, Chief Investment Strategist of Raymond James. Wonder how long he'll have his job. The things that come out of a person's mouth when they are in a state of panic!
Hi Setterman,
"Just as biological evolution is a lie so is “spiritual” evolution a lie."
Based on the "scientific findings" linking one's "genetics" or "biological makeup" to everything from gambling to nearly every known form of deviant behavior, the suggestion you make regarding the discovery of a gene responsible for ones religious makeup is not beyond my imagination. The "discovery" in 1993 of a genetic predisposition for homosexuality, was only the beginning. The Centre for Addiction and Mental Health in it's 2007-2008 Report (click through to page 4 (6 of 28)) is saying pedophilia might be the result of faulty wiring in the brain. "unable to choose one's sexual interests is different from being unable to choose how one acts." Yeah, whatever. Give the brilliant researchers time to do more studies. I’m sure new discoveries will bring future resolutions up for a vote before our elected officials.
I haven’t done a “background check” on everything Gregory Kouki of “Stand to Reason” has ever written, so my apologies
if he doesn’t pass everyone’s smell test. Chances are from my own Christian viewpoint, I’d find myself at odds with him in some things he’s written. I don’t necessarily agree with everything included in this piece, but in this particular commentary titled, “Searching for the Sin Gene”, he makes some reasonable points. By the way, give me the link to the “earth symbol” you referred to. I’m not following
by looking at the various article links above. Thanks! –Rudi
Searching for the Sin Gene:
http://tinyurl.com/5tknn9
http://www.str.org/site/News2?page=NewsArticle&id=5563
Centre for Addiction
and Mental Health Report:
http://tinyurl.com/6ywcl5
http://www.camh.net/
Research/Research_publications/
Research_AR_2008/Research
_AR_07_08.pdf
my blog is banned in Turkey since yesterday.
Dear Bjorn,
Very scary! Concerned that we'll be at risk for much more of this kind of tyranny with the possibility of the new Presidential Administration.
-SV
Interestingly enough, some BO supporters seem to think that the "conservative blogosphere" is "impending death" as well.
Link-
http://tinyurl.com/55ykfv
-SV
To Constance at 7.50pm.
Thank You for the 'more, more and morest' info. :) Also the Ezra Pound mention - I'm interested in learning more about what was going on in and around London at the turn of the last century. It's interesting too to see how involved quite a few of the poets/writers were around this time.
I'm quite a little night owl so the new time slot at 0100hrs GMT might even suit me better.
Many thanks again for the specific help and all that you continue to do.
---
Farmer - That's amazing that Turkey have banned your blog. I'm not totally surprised though as 'publishing' has always been an incredibly strong tool.
Good Luck to you with the new time slot on Constance's radio show.
~K~
To Anonymous 4:35 PM:
Sorry, but "the jury is still out" regarding Obama's place of birth.
And, if it's ever proven true that he was born in Kenya, he can not be President of the United States, or even Senator of Illinois.
I'm sure that the NWO will make sure that their "golden boy" stays protected until after November 4th.
Farmer,
Best way to sell books here in USA is "banned in Boston" -- "banned in Turkey"? That's an even greater inducement to read carefully!
Constance
Best place for "domionism" info is
www.endtimespropheticwords.com, Miram Franklins site.
another good site is www.deceptionbytes.com
I see a lot of commentary here pronouncing the doom and gloom with Obama getting into office. But I am fairly certain that it doesn't matter who gets into office other then the path we head toward the same direction.
Also shame Young Grasshopper felt driven from making comments...
DEPARTMENT OF PEACE
Thanks to littlegreenfootballs
http://www.thepeacealliance.org/content/view/50/127/
This is the list of the organizational endorser of the Peace Alliance's efforts to set up a Department of Peace. New Ager Dennis Kucinich pushed this as part of his presidential campaign in 2004.
If I can get to it, some time ago I made an effort to get early peace movement books documenting the early role of New Age organizations which pushed this effort at the academic level. Hopefully I will be able to post on this in the near future.
Dorothy
KUCINICH PEACE MOVEMENT EFFORTS
Sorry I forgot the link.
http://kucinich.house.gov/issues/issue/?IssueID=1564
Dorothy
SV, concerning the end of conservative blogosphere article, Mary Mapes makes this statement: “A hated Republican in the White House was the best thing ever to happen to the Kos-'n-Olby crowd.” She is right! George W. is kinder to the Clintons (Bill now seems to be campaigning hard for the big “O”), Ted Kennedy and the Democrat party than to his own party; he sunk half of it in 2004 and is doing his best to destroy it completely in 2008. “W” has not been true to a Nation of Laws and not of Men, and he’ll have to answer for that one, especially with the torrent of prayers blanketing him. The vitriol from the left is tapping into “the love of money” frightened populace, and are making it quite fashionable to take from the rich. Since I’m poor that should serve me well, but sure hope most of that stolen money comes from Hollywood.
Paraphrasing Dorothy, depending how this election goes, we can take a jet plane or a slow boat to the NWO.
Farmer,
Congratulations on getting banned in Turkey.
But I cant understand how they accomplish that.
Is it the ISP that does the filtering?
You know, all of you are so worried about Barack Obama. But, he might not even win. He doesn't hold that much of a lead. I'm suspicious of all these polls. Polls are taken via landline telephones just as they always have. However, not everyone has a landline phone. Some people just use cell phones. Pollsters have not figured out how to overcome some of the challenges to gathering data in the 21st Century.
If Obama was some kind of superhuman politician, why isn't he that much in the lead, assuming he is in the lead. McCain seems to have more superhuman qualities considering all the comebacks he's made during his entire campaign. Two years ago, no one saw McCain even winning the nomination, yet here he is.
Whoever wins the election, the sun will rise on November 5th like always. The moon will still be revolving around the Earth. Like always God will be in control. Like Sarah Palin so wisely said, the election is in God's hands.
Hi Constance,
In response to your comment:
"Catholicism comes MUCH CLOSER to Christianity than Kansan City "prophet" Mike Bickle. The Catholics (like everybody else) have their faults to be sure, but at least they have it straight who God is and that Jesus Christ died for our salvation.
I'm not so sure about Mike Bickle with his "12 apostles"!"
______________________________
Thank you!
I don't know anything about Mike Bickle and I ordinarily try to avoid criticising and/or undermining the beliefs of others.
Ergo, this comment is not intended as a criticism, per se, but rather as a clarification of authentic Roman Catholic Christology for the benefit of those who, for whatever reason, are misinformed. This is not directed at you, Constance, because you already KNOW what authentic Roman Catholics believe about God and Jesus Christ.
I would be the first one to say that we Catholics have our faults. Moreover, if anyone wants to make a second career or new "religion" out of saying bad things about the Catholic Church, he doesn't have to go around making up lies. All he has to do is to tell the truth.
However, the validity of my faith does not depend upon the personal sanctity of those who I believe have been charged with the mission of preaching and teaching it. My faith depends upon the ONE LORD Jesus Christ Who has revealed it! It is Jesus Christ Who is the "WAY, THE TRUTH AND THE LIFE."
John 14:6
Despite whatever differences we Catholics may have with other Christians with regard to theology and ecclesiology we nevertheless define an AUTHENTIC Christian as one whose CHRISTOLOGY is embodied in the Chalcedonian Creed and/or the Nicene Creed.
We Catholics recite the Nicene Creed every Sunday at Mass after the first reading from the Old Testament, the Psalms (which are sung in my parish), the Second reading from the New Testament and then the reading of the Gospel.
________________________________
NICENE CREED
I believe in one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.
And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds; God of God, Light of Light, very God of very God; begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father, by whom all things were made.
Who, for us men and for our salvation, came down from heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Spirit of the virgin Mary, and was made man; and was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate; He suffered and was buried; and the third day He rose again, according to the Scriptures; and ascended into heaven, and sits on the right hand of the Father; and He shall come again, with glory, to judge the quick and the dead; whose kingdom shall have no end.
And I believe in the Holy Ghost, the Lord and Giver of Life; who proceeds from the Father and the Son; who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified; who spoke by the prophets.
And I believe one holy catholic and apostolic Church. I acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins; and I look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen.
_____________________________
The Council of Chalcedon is one of the seven ecumenical councils accepted by Eastern Orthodox, Catholic, and many Protestant Christian churches. It is the first Council not recognized by any of the Oriental Orthodox churches.
The Chalcedonian Creed is also known as the "Doctrine of the Hypostatic Union" which is a spiritual antidote to the poisonous "severing of Christ" - which is the "spirit of the antichrist."
____________________________
CHALCEDONIAN CREED
"We, then, following the holy Fathers, all with one consent, teach men to confess one and the same Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, the same perfect in Godhead and also perfect in manhood;
truly God and truly man, of a reasonable [rational] soul and body;
consubstantial [co-essential] with the Father according to the Godhead, and consubstantial with us according to the Manhood;
in all things like unto us, without sin;
begotten before all ages of the Father according to the Godhead, and in these latter days, for us and for our salvation, born of the Virgin Mary, the Mother of God, according to the Manhood;
one and the same Christ, Son, Lord, only begotten, to be acknowledged in two natures, inconfusedly, unchangeably, indivisibly, inseparably;
the distinction of natures being by no means taken away by the union, but rather the property of each nature being preserved, and concurring in one Person and one Subsistence, not parted or divided into two persons, but one and the same Son, and only begotten, God the Word, the Lord Jesus Christ;
as the prophets from the beginning [have declared] concerning Him, and the Lord Jesus Christ Himself has taught us, and the Creed of the holy Fathers has handed down to us."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chalcedonian_Creed
______________________________
In closing I would suggest that perhaps the following passage from the Gospels that I have preached to me every Sunday needs to be preached to certain misinformed Protestants (you know who you are):
_________________________
John said to Him, “Teacher, we saw someone casting out demons in Your name, and we tried to prevent him because he was not following us.” But Jesus said, “Do not hinder him, for there is no one who will perform a miracle in My name, and be able soon afterward to speak evil of Me. For he who is not against us is for us. For whoever gives you a cup of water to drink because of your name as followers of Christ, truly I say to you, he will not lose his reward.”
Mark 9:38-41
Wow what if BO lost the election and won a World seat?
Like the US isn't hurting enough yet.
To Susanna @ 11:13 AM:
BRAVO!!!
I couldn't have expressed it better.
Regarding Oprah's Theology, and Mike Bickle, and the other forms of apostasy too numerous to mention, I've ceased to be astonished by them.
Since the late seventies and the John Todd phenomenom, (I was and still am a creator, manufacturer and dsitributor of audio recordings) I realized the church had a built in defence against being awakened. I was called all manner of things then, since I sought to be accepted within the ranks of membership and wanted to be liked. However when I began to quietly distribute tapes of Todd messages about the Illuminati and it's plans for world domination, I was harshly and thoroughly censored and censured.
I learned very quickly that the roots of apostasy had already been well entrenched then (1976 - 1979).
There were members of that church who seemed sincere in worship but in bible studies showed another side of themselves.
These tended to be the intellectuals, doctors, entrepeneurs, judges, nurses, etc.
(I'm not suggesting all who practise these professions are NA!!!)
I also learned head on challenges of New Agers, an unwise thing to do if one lacks a strong spiritual support system, as the reaction from those challenged was swift and powerful. My own inner flaws, mostly hidden became inflamed and in short order I suffered terrible questions about my own faith and my salvation.
The power of 'christians' to curse is incredible, especially when that curse is posited as a prayer to "help so and so to see rightly" meaning to see as we do.
I recognized there were witch covens right in our congregation, and others I had ocassion to visit.
I knew their methodology, having practised it myself before Jesus set me free.
Starting in the mid sixties I spent a number of years opening myself to demons through LSD, MDA, Cannabis, etc. and 'sat' under the guidance of a witch whose first question to me was "Do you believe in God", to which I answered, "Well, I believe in a 'higher power'". This satsified him and I began my 'apprenticeship'.
Something was wrong however, and I was never able to follow him into the places he tried to lead me. Something within me would rise up and I would be filled with fear for my very existance.
He finally broke it off with me and I was left with a horrible sense of hopelessness.
I still tried to practise 'imposing my will' through mental projection on others, and also to take drugs.
In 1975 Jesus finally and clearly stepped into my life and has been Lord since. That's not to say I haven't backslidden because I have.
As a christian I treid to meld many of the occult experiences I had to Paul's Christology. I attributed feelings and inner cations to the Holy Spirit.
I have often been drawn towards occult ideology many times, and always the Holy Spirit stopped me.
When I got involved in the Dominionist movement, and the New Apostolic Movement, I nearly got lost completely.
I wanted so badly to be affirmed (They always seek the unaffirmed) to be healed (they always seek the wounded) to be used, (they always seek the disenfrnchised) I was willing to set aside my concerns.
God finally reached me again but I was very reluctant to listen. I was sooo seduced.
Satan's message is powerful and seductive, and does not appear as evil. He does not appeal to wrong motives but to right motives wrongly used.
Even something as innocent as asking God to bless OUR endeavours can be a hallway to deception.
We are to seek HIS will, HIS Kingdom and HIS Righteousness.
There will only be a few who hold fast to the gospel once delivered.
The question "Will Jesus find faith on the earth when He returns"? is not rhetorical.
He may not! If "even the very elect MAY be deceived" is to be taken as truth we are in serious trouble.
I daily acknowledge before God my awareness of my susceptibility to deception. I ask Him to search me, Know me and reveal to me any thing not pleasing to Him. To examine me deeply and expose any 'agreements' I have made with unbelief or with wickedness and to grant me the Grace of a deep, and true and lasting repentance.
Only by understanding how 'easily I am misled' can I hope to avoid the snares which cover the earth and it's peoples.
I hope any who see themselves in my story will reach out to those who adhere to the truth. Syncretism is hard to detect. A thorough knowledge of the Bible and an honest awareness of one's one propensity for sin are essential. These are what you must look for in anyone you reach out to. That means you yourself must pursue these.
Primegood
Primegood said: “A thorough knowledge of the Bible and an honest awareness of one's one propensity for sin are essential.”
A worthy testimony that reminds me of Nettleton’s COME, THOU FOUNT OF EVERY BLESSING: “Prone to wander, Lord I feel it, Prone to leave the God I love: (and we all sing) Here’s my heart, O take and seal it, Seal it for the courts above.”
Thanks!
“love one another deeply, from the heart.” I Peter 1:22B
Primegood, a wonderful testimony, thank you and may God bless you.
IsitILORD
It is the reality of sin which connects us to the necessity of salvation.
Those who 'deny sin' do so because it's weight is absolutely unbearable.... on one's OWN shoulders.
The notion that once one is 'saved', one need no longer visit the cross, is Satan's finest scheme.
It is the 'enemies of the cross' who are behind the NA. Many can claim to love and embrace Jesus, but only those who in following Him embrace the cross, find the relief and rest they crave.
"I AM crucified with Christ, nevertheless I live, yet NOT I, but Christ lives in me".
My failures as a 'Christian', numerous and deadly, cannot keep me from the bosom of my Father, because He sacrificed His Son.
I refuse to let sin separate me from my only source of Joy. I run to the cross, confess, die anew, claim the Blood and am free.
(This is) Anathema to those who hate the cross.
To any who think the weight of their sin bearable, I say, you are deceived. Mental gymnastics, meditations, mantras only serve to numb the senses, dull and sear the conscience. Until you taste the wine of true release, you know nothing of freedom.
"Today the cross full fills my view.
It's vacant call reserved for me.
My sin hates nails which hold it to.
My soul, blood drenched, does love that tree.
For from it's limbs, my Master's form
Was gently lowered, with tender care
And laid in stone no longer warm
Yet even the cleft can't hold Him there.
His rising gathers all who know
He purchased freedom to be free
I shout to all who've never known
I AM Alive. Christ lives in me."
Primegood
Primegood et al, hit on some great points....how do we not allow ourselves to become deceived (hypnotized)? Acquiriing and maintaining a right relationship with our God- through knowing his word, admitting our sin, building our faith, strengthening our fellowship, etc.
I remember (way back as a young man) attending a cocktail lounge show on Sunset Blvd. where I witnessed an impressive performance by one Pat Collins, a popular hypnotist with the in-Hollywood crowd. Ms. Collins began the show by attempting to hypnotize the entire audience. The majority fell under her spell, including many of my own friends sitting next to me at my table. Several audience members, those who “achieved the deepest trances”, were selected to go up on stage and be “the show”. I turned out to be one of the “resistant types”, the minority who do not easily go under “the influence”. Ms. Collins admitted that some people are highly resistant to being hypnotized.
Laying our prejudice aside for a moment, I would like to get the input from the bloggers here regarding the thinking as presented in the essay I’ve linked to below. While I do not endorse the author, or the particular org., they, (Global Research) does post a worthwhile piece from time to time. Granted so many related sites, i.e., Infowars, Prison Planet, Alex Jones, etc. often present unsubstantiated conspiracy theories pieced together from assorted known but selectively slanted (intentionally misinterpreted) facts. But you have to give them credit for being on top of some things, i.e. Bilderbergers, etc. and for posting an occasional piece that is right on the mark. Anyhow, I am not interested in a critique of particular individuals, or their websites, or the cultlike following they may have built. (It could be argued that Constance has built somewhat of a cult following here!)
Considering Constance’s viewpoint that there are only two kinds of people, “the hypnotized and the hypnotizers” this particular article should give us hope that there is indeed a “third” type of person, those who either cannot be hypnotized, or are so extremely resistant to being hypnotized that the effort to do so is so great that it outweighs the benefit of even trying. For lack of a better term, I would call those that fit into this category, “the martyrs”.
The article is:
Psychological Control: States of Mental Disempowerment
Part II: Deconstructing the Power of the Global Elite
by Dr. Judith H. Young
Here’s the link:
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=10687
http://tinyurl.com/6fot4v
In my view, Dr. Young does a great job of identifying some important strands of the web, i.e. in particular, the Bertrand Russel/Aldous Huxley statements about our dependence on"technology".
oldmanoftheski
Thank you for the comments and the link. It is a compelling, well written document.
If I may I will comment on the piece you reference.
Indeed she makes many valid points, and as expected posits a mainly humanist response. This of course is what distinguishes Christians from the world. Not our hatred of evil. Most humanists hate evil. Not our unwillingness to accept the prevalent paradigm. Most humanists have resistant world views.
No it is in our refusing to fashion a 'new view of reality' in the crucible of chaos. We need no new reality.
We are IN Reality if indeed IN Christ. Whether tormented or feasting in Glory. In this, we ARE martyrs!
The present expression of violence against the soul of mankind is the same bowl poured out on Calvary. The attempt to dehumanize Jesus, to demonize Him, to reduce Him to an object of contempt and disgust, is the same poison at work today.
His response is and must be our response. "I KNOW that He is able to keep THAT which I have entrusted to Him".
Remembering our 'purer' instincts is still grasping at filthy rags.
The blood and fecal stained garment of Jesus is no more holy than our own child-like memories of the good old days.
Yes the exposers of defilement stand with their own shame on display. Any who truly know Christ like Paul "boast in my weakness".
The fundamental principal of freedom is not in seeing the faces of the captors for what they are, but looking full on the face of the reedemer. They price has been paid. Turn away from lies. Even half truths are no use.
I would agree that there are three groups, and hence use my influence to point attention to the Redeemer to Whom I belong.
"Turn your eyes upon Jesus, Look full in His wonderful face, and the things of earth will grow strangely dim, in the light of His glory and grace".
Jesus breaks the hypnotists spell and even the self hypnotic spell so many maintain.
Satan laid his snares eons ago, and enlisted us to tend them. We police ourselves and others to ensure escape impossible.
Wake Up! Forget the count of 3!
Now is the day of salvation.
Primegood
Yes, there may be a “third” type of person, a segment of the world’s population
who after finding themselves trapped in the web begin using their “inherent instincts of preservation” to try to disengage
themselves or escape. I agree that the advancement of technology in all its forms, has had an accelerated influence in shaping the worldview of the masses over the last 75 or so years. I’m sure we have all been affected to some degree. Even with awareness of the “big web” some reasonable people have become snared in the fringes, but have managed to escape and tried to alert others. The web is simply repaired and restructured. How much better though to have avoided the web and it’s alluring design in the first place. I’m sure there are a few who believe by using pure human reason, they have managed to avoid any influence or manipulation. However, nothing reaches the reasoning centers of the brain without passing through one or several of our five senses. We guard our minds and the beliefs we form by filtering what primarily comes in through our eyes and ears. God’s word is the filter I have placed over my mind and heart to help me determine what I allow my mind to absorb as truth. Thanks Oldmanoftheski. It was a bit difficult for me to evaluate this without noting who the author is and who she uses as background sources. You know, like trusting the fox to guard the henhouse. She does though, motivate some serious thought. Also thanks Primegood for more of your wise insight.
-Rudi
“For the ear tests words
as the tongue tastes food.
Let us discern for ourselves what is right;
let us learn together what is good.” Job 34
Dear "Primegood":
A POWERFUL post. Thank you and God bless you. Ditto to Susanna!
Constance
Primegood, and Rudi, thanks for sharing your insight. Very encouraging thoughts!
The point I have often tried to make on this blog is that many people, (and everyone knows someone who fits into this catagory), already embrace their servitude, not even realizing they have become ensnared. Indeed, “numbed down” as described in Dr. Young's essay, conveys very well what I've been trying to say. Granted, most of us are not “comfortable” with the growing level of corruption we see in the cultural and political system in which we live. Many people, including a fair number of the bloggers here, have admitted to feeling powerless to do anything about it. Is it really “quiet desperation” we feel, or is it “programmed toleration”? Maybe the more accurate term is “depressed resignation”.
The watchman sounds the alarm, calls for vigilance. Over and over the trumpet sounds. Many look outward and are capable of recognizing looming threats on the horizon. Yet, by conscious choice, we ignore the more subtle strands of the web that already entangle us. No one wants to acknowledge that maybe we’ve become accustomed to a certain level of pain and discomfort, which may have at first caused alarm and panic, and now feeds only apathy and depression. We tolerate evil all too easily because, after all, we tell ourselves that we don’t live in a perfect world.
How many conservative, church going folks, work in hospitals right down the hall from where abortions are performed? How many vote strictly Republican no matter how sleazy or corrupt the individual politician is? How many care more about their own declining 401K's than their neighbor's sick child?
Consider those mighty “prophets of old”, who’s job it was to call the people to action, a task which always started with self examination. Only after sufficient repentance could the people progress to taking action to deal with the perilous situation they were in. No one should presume the authority to ask the people to tear down a temple to Baal without knowing that the people do indeed, practice reverence for God Almighty.
Dr. Young wrote, “Rather than allowing our disbelief and horror to disable us, including our horror over dehumanization efforts that attempt to degrade the majesty of the human species, we must find the outrage needed to confront and eradicate it as an evil that is so aberrational as to be itself sub-human.”
That’s a fine definition of what it means to be “salt and light”. I look around and am saddened that so many of God's people have become numb, or should I say, luke warm. At times I am repulsed by my own tolerance for evil. Perhaps the pot is near tepid enough to create a real "tipping point".
Oops. Clicked wrong button and forgot to put my name on previous post.
Sounds like someone is as mad as hell and "I'm not going to take it anymore."
Ah, Hollywood has assimilated our righteous anger. In Bill Maher’s Movie "Religulous”,
He interviews a Christian who will only say that God will come and rid the world of sin. What would You have said? My answer has been to say: that if God were to rid the earth of sin and evil at this time, He would have to get rid of you and me. “As it is written, ‘There is none righteous, no not one. . .they are together become unprofitable.’
“They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and world hears them. We are of God, he that knows God hears us; he that is not of God hears not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error. Beloved let us love one another. . .”
The complexity of love requires that we hate evil. Thus we have this passion which often merges with the evil itself. Thus the sharpest sword, the Word of God rightly understood, is how we move forward: when we smell anything other than love we MUST stop, but we don’t. There is pride in them-there bones, there is self-preservation, fear; let us say God will deliver us and even if He doesn’t we will not worship money or any other idol.
The confusion also rears it head when Nations must defend its citizens and we citizens must consider atom bombs. Many books on this subject I’ll leave that for another day.
Oldmanoftheski, I managed a day off from the work-grind and have managed a bit of exploration into the blogosphere; a comment made by the following ‘artist’ reminded me of what you seemed to have felt as of your last post.
From Geolibertarian:
“As I suggested before, he may not be fully aware of what the "jig" even is, so perhaps his anger was the anger a person feels when he is made to sense, deep down, that he unwittingly allowed himself to be duped into serving an evil agenda he actually opposes.
Take Freemasonry, for instance. As Alex and others have often said, the vast majority of Freemasons are exposed only to the outermost layers of their organization, while believing all the while they've been exposed to the innermost layers. (A family member of mine is a "Worshipful Master," so I know this from first hand experience.) This is why they're not putting on an act when they deny that there's anything sinister about Freemasonry, but are expressing a sincere belief.
Human psychology being what it is, it is therefore a virtual given that they will feel resentment toward anyone who makes them start to realize what they're actually part of. They'll immediately go into "denial" mode, and become increasingly hostile if you continue to press the issue. Sort of like the denial that a housewife goes into the first time someone tries to gently inform her that her husband has been molesting her 12-year-old daughter from a previous marriage.”
I’m afraid that the worship of Obama is the same thing, and when it comes crashing down we better be ready to help them.
You put your finger right on it Setterman, the "denial mode". That is exactly what I see happening in the "church" today. The most oft quoted mantra I hear echoing through our sacred halls these days is the declaration that, "God is in control." Yet when sickness or disaster strikes, the first thing out of these same mouths is "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me!"
Yes, we humans are fallen creatures, prone to sin and doubt. "Born again believers" on the other hand, are supposed to be infused with "His spirit". All too often the evidence of that "infusion" is lacking. Why is that?
I do believe God is in control, but I also believe He doesn't excuse our apathy or our lack of diligence. As if, when evil flourishes, we can simply wash our hands and proclaim, "it's God's will".
I have friends who have disconnected their cable, stopped using the computer, and are home schooling their kids.
As for me and my house, well, I do "my share" of ministry "work". Personally, and through my church, I support missionaries who have given all they owned to the poor and traveled to Asia to minister to those in greater need. But I'm still watching football, while trying to chase my public schooled children out of the room whenever the Viagra and in your face sexploitation commercial images or the latest occult video game movie trailers barn storm into my living room. Is it just me, or has anyone else noticed more and more outright evil influences slipping into our homes through the media? Good grief people, you can't even watch the "Weather Channel" without coming under assualt!
From my reading of scripture, it is clear that "we are the ones" who determine the tipping point. It is "we" who are in denial. "Don't worry, be happy". Keep watching football. The "Rapture" will take us out of here before things get really nasty. Oh oh, is that a financial collapse I'm seeing? Oh oh, is that another war, another famine, another earthquake? Where oh where is this second coming we are expecting?
When I proclaim we should start "looking up", I am NOT referring to the rapture. I'm a post-trib-pre-wrath guy because that makes the most sense to me. Looking up means asking for more of His spirit, more faith, more power, to do more work while we are here on this earth.
Time is only short for the Devil and all those who belong to him.
Setterman wrote:
The complexity of love requires that we hate evil.
Thus we have this passion which often merges with the evil itself.
Thus the sharpest sword, the Word of God rightly understood, is how we move forward:
when we smell anything other than love we MUST stop, but we don’t.
There is pride in them-there bones, there is self-preservation, fear;
let us say God will deliver us and
even if He doesn’t we will not worship money or any other idol.
my response:
Amen!
This propensity to meet evil with evil, especially when born out of a desire to do good was what Jesus warned about.
"Cut off ears", "Call down fire from heaven".
This IS the deception we must awaken to.
The capacity to see in His visage, a champion of right which issues violence for violence.
The way He lived was entirely by design. Never because some event triggered something hidden inside.
He KNEW righteousness becasue He WAS righteousness.
We know about it.
Jesus said in the book of John "The prince of this world is coming and he has nothing in me".
Oh that we could claim the same.
God help us to "love not our own lives".
We hate perversion and forget that the pervert was in the package Jesus paid for.
we despise the corrupted and forget the deceiver has been busy twisting their own capacity for self examination.
Was GWB's re-birth real? Was mine?
If I held power can I be sure I would not use it to fulfill my own interests?
Or the notions of righeteousness I cling to?
The 'World of Christianity' itself is such a hodgepodge of perceptions, an intentional strategy of Satan.
Our absorption of culture, and our water-cooler mentality, binds us to it's controlling power.
We shun the things which challenge our snooze.
We want to be liked by our kids so we go easy on them when we admonish them BECAUSE we don't want our own compromise exposed!
We can't have it both ways.
To be crucified with Christ is not just about the obvious evil, but the apparently innocuous and even apparently good.
We exculpiate ourselves while excoriating others.
No Mea Culpa here!
No! Instead it's "my religion is true, my ways tested, my heart pure!"
"The heart IS deceitfully wicked, above ALL things, WHO CAN KNOW IT?"
This is the problem. WHO CAN KNOW IT?
It was Israel's desperate humiliation which brought them on their faces and God to their rescue.
We must face the truth.
We are mostly oblivious to the subtle (we expect evil to be OBVIOUS) deceptions we embrace.
Our righteousness is as filthy rags.
The playing field did not remain level. The spirit of lawlessness released into the world is ramping up the matrix of lies.
Oh God! Be merciful to ME, A SINNER!
Saved by Grace? Absolutely! Spirit Filled? Mercifully!
Prone to wander? Unfortunately all too often!
Whenever I can look around and find wrong and not look within and find it's twin, I need a 'shake & wake'.
I firmly believe God's purpose in exposing His Bride to the evil of the world is to expose the evil hidden in Her own skirts.
Can you imagine the shame of Jesus 'rapturing' His church, and His church, no longer under the "evil one's" spell, seeing their own utter lame nakedness?
Travelling through the air streaming filth and abominations?
I don't think so!
We need to exploit the crisis', to see how the bancruptcy without is a shadow of the bancruptcy within.
To see how we hedge our bets.
To uncover the buried cache of idols, saved for a rainy day.
To accept that even while we are saved, we are not yet sanctified!
Oh God! Be merciful to ME, A SINNER!
Anything less will only be a comforting pat on our own back because "WE" are "so ready" to meet Him.
I am terrified of seeing Him face to face because of the brief glimpses I have had of my own heart.
Not because(I fear) He will reject me! He won't ever reject me.
But the sin will no longer be invisible.
It will cover me for ALL to see.
Like Peter I will cower under the weight of my own shame.
If Peter had been able to see what he would become I doubt He would have ever judged another.
Oh God, PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, Grant ME the grace of a Deep and True, and lasting repentance.
I want purity, because I am corrupted.
I want holiness because I am mingled with worldliness.
I want to be love because I am so selfish.
I want to be healed of this leprosy of the soul.
And in case you wonder, if any met me in person, talked with me, broke bread with me you would likely think..
"My what a nice man".
But I see what I hide from you.
I NEED a saviour!
I belong to Jesus!
Thank God for the cross!
Please forgive my long winded-ness
Primegood
For once I am speechless!
Oldmanoftheski, Setterman, and Primegood- Your words here are priceless, a treasure.
-Rudi
"That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked at and our hands have touched—this we proclaim concerning the Word of life." 1John 1
I think we would all do well to consider God’s servant, Job. I doubt none of us walk as uprightly as he. Job’s reaction to the evil that befell him, the reaction of his wife, and the reaction of his friends, reveal much about what we can expect in the coming years.
Oprah & Charles Manson - Bunkmates?
What does the world's most powerful Television personality and the world's most hated cult murderer have in common?
Well in simple terms, Oprah and Charlie both beleive they are god. Or gods, since they are different persons.
No one needs an introduction to Oprah Winfrey. Her influence in the boardrooms and bedrooms of not only the USA but most western countries has been phenomenal.
Some, particularly younger readers may not really remember Manson.
(from wikipedia)
Charles Milles Manson (born November 12, 1934) is an American criminal who led what became known as "the Manson Family," a quasi-commune that arose in California in the latter 1960s.
He was found guilty of conspiracy to commit the Tate/LaBianca murders, which members of the group carried out at his instruction.
Through the joint-responsibility rule of conspiracy, he was convicted of the murders themselves.
In several investigative publications, He was shown to have been a member of religous cult known as The Process Church of the Final Judgment.
On his website page Something Wicked This Way Comes --For Real , James Whisler writes:
"The ' I am God ' crack rings of satanic egoism and was known of after a fashion in the Process. Manson told people he was God and Jesus Christ.
Robert Moore, Process founder wanted to be known as Jesus Christ. The satanic cult Temple of Set, founded by Lt. Colonel Michael Aquino, teaches is members that they can achieve Godhood.
One former mind controlled victim claims that Aquino was a member of the Process Church, although I could not confirm this anywhere and it is doubtful that Aquino would ever admit to it. Surprisingly enough, Aquino does defend the Process, but of course, he defends all things evil.
Lt. Colonel Jim Channon, a member of Aquino's Temple of Set, was in charge of Theta Mind control programming at Ft. Lewis, Washington for a time.
Ft. Lewis is also one of the locations where the D.C.Sniper suspect John Allen Muhammad served time in the military. The Theta programming is a branch of Monarch programming related to psychic warfare. " It is the marriage of occult practices with state of the art science."
http://tinyurl.com/6qhclb
Although the benevolence of Oprah's doctrine appears on the surface totally different from Manson's, the underlying spirtual dogma is identical.
In a nutshell, Christian theology is in error, the 'God of the Bible' is a fable.
Find your own way to God.
Oprah's insistance that it's impossible for there to be only one way to God demands that Manson's way be as valid as hers.
She can't refute his claim without denying her own, though I'm sure she would find some creative back-pedalling to try to do so.
The Jewish leaders who handed Jesus over to the Romans earnestly believed it was for the good of the people that Jesus be put to death.
Hilter firmly believed the death of Jews was justified for the good of the homeland.
Manson believed the violent overthrow of society was good for the world.
Oprah belives whatever is good for each individual is good.
The Bible however says:
Isaiah:45:21: Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time?
have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour;
there is none beside me.
Isaiah:45:22: Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth:
for I am God, and there is none else.
Primegood
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