Saturday, March 21, 2009

Javier Solana's Coming Attractions? Mid 2010 maybe?


Caption: Solana rebuffs Russia. What a guy!

THIS JUST IN FROM MY GOOGLE JAVIER SOLANA ALERTS:




"The foreign policy chief of the EU Javier Solana announced in Brussels on Monday that the EU would sever ties with Israel if it will not be committed to establishing a Palestinian state. "




And with that, this recent USA news:






Headline News
Thursday, March 19, 2009 Israel Today Staff
Obama about to betray Israel, says former intel official


A former top US intelligence official warns that the Obama Administration is about to break America's long ties of friendship with Israel, and maybe even take steps toward the dissolution of the Jewish state. Speaking on condition of anonymity to Douglas Hagmann of the Northeast Intelligence Network, the source said: "I have every reason to believe, based on what I’ve seen at my level of [security] clearance especially over the last several years, that Israel will soon be completely on their own… or worse." He went on to note that the betrayal likely won't happen in one
dramatic moment, but rather subtly, behind the scenes, and over the course of several years. The Obama Administration is preparing to "provide more support to Arab countries [with] financial and military aid, undercutting Israel’s defense efforts all while pushing Israel to succumb to the pressure of unreasonable demands designed to end with their political annihilation as a nation," said the source. Israeli officials have of late noted a
marked increase in the pressure from Washington to more rapidly acquiesce to Arab land-for-peace demands, and US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton has clarified that Washington is none to pleased with incoming Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's refusal to commit to the creation of a sovereign Palestinian Arab state with Jerusalem as its capital.[1]




What if?


1. The original treaty was the Treaty of Association signed between the European Union and Israel on November 20, 1995?


2. The man who signed that treaty was the same man handed a job created with Section 666 of the Europa codified documents?


3. The 10 Nation member WESTERN EUROPEAN UNION were to have have handed that same man control over that organization on November 20, 1999?


4. That same man now controlling the Western European Union, a ten nation federation, obviously "partly strong, partly weak" were to introduce a bill into his Assembly that it, the 10 nation Permanent member federation, named "Recommendation 666" which, inter alia, proposed giving that man the power to convene the Council of the European Union (the controlling body) "in the event of an emergency"?


5. That same man were to be given sole powers and discretion to shut or open the European Space Agency?


6. That same man had founded and convened the "Barcelona Process" of 27 nations, 12 from North Africa and the Middle East; 15 from Europe?



7. That same man had been handed unprecedented NATO powers on January 30, 1999.



8. That same man had been on the USA's subversive list for many years?



9. That same man was to have been made the new head of NATO only 6 months after sending Spanish warships against Canada and only a few days after threatening the USA over Yugoslavian issues?



10. That same man were to be overseeing a program to train all judges, policemen, court administrators for the nation of Iraq, "EUJUSTLEX"?



11. That same man had been heard saying that he was working on "a permanent peace solution for Israel and the Middle East."



12. That same man were to be presiding over a program, European Neighbourhood Policy," that was to begin on January 1, 2007 and last until December 31, 2013, with a midterm review scheduled for mid 2010?


13. What if that ENP Program was a 7 year clarified and reconfirmed treaty?


All of these "what ifs" are very real events that obviously require closer attention.



Shouldn't anybody having those and many, many more powers have more public press and scrutiny than they now get? Why are so Americans, so many Christians, even so many Europeans unaware of his very name?



Good question. I'd watch Solana's threatened Israeli developments if I were you! I wouldn't go back to sleep just because the EU threatens to boycott Durban II because of "anti-Semitism."



Stay tuned -- things are happening so very fast! If you haven't been able to find my two books, free internet versions for pdf downloading are available by clicking here. If you need an Adobe ® PDF file reader an Adobe reader to open the files, here's a link for that as well.


I again conclude by quoting now deceased Orthodox Russian priest, Fr. Seraphim Rose, “It is later than you think. Hasten now to do the work of the Lord.”


CONSTANCE






[1] http://www.israeltoday.co.il/default.aspx?tabid=178&nid=18449


Comments:
Shabbat shalom everyone,

I just want to point out that there is more news coming out about Gaza indicating the Israelis soldiers were given free reign to inflict damage..for "holy war"

http://tinyurl.com/coywmb

EU nations are experiencing record levels of antiseimitsm and this news will only increase hatred towards Israel.

This reminds us of some of the behavior in the Abu Ghreib prison stories. Is there a pattern here, where people in authority are encouraging soldiers to do things that will come back to bite them later on and cause Muslim rage.

Don't know if these stories are true or not but they have come out in several papers the last day or two.

Joyce
 
I am watching a very strange History.com program on King David, portraying him as a vicious, bloody monster. If this is a film trend, anti-Semitism is being whipped up indeed.

Constance
 
In this article it says they forced a Palestinian to strip naked:

http://tiny.cc/sbqzr

It says there is a "religious war" against Gentiles. Interesting wording..

I'm not condoning this behavior if it happened, but I find it interesting that young men and women who have to join the Israeli army at 18 are being encouraged to do things that are humiliating to Muslims. Bear in mind that the hostage negotiations have been going on over Giliad Shalit.

Hamas wants Israel to release people that are responsible for gross acts of terror..

In the meantime Obama is sending warm messages to Iran..

http://tinyurl.com/c8nz9x

Iran wants to set up a Muslim caliphate. About a week or so ago, Morocco, a Muslim country cut off diplomatic relations with Iran, but US wants to play nicey, nice with them.

http://tinyurl.com/dzosc7

All Muslim nations with a monarchy like Saudi Arabia and Morocco which are predominately Sunni are concerned that they will experience what Iran did during the Iranian revolution when the Shah was overthrown.

The schism between Sunni and Shiite Muslims occured after the death of Mohamed. The Shiites claimed that Ali, should be the next leader..

http://tinyurl.com/dzosc7

It's important to understand this because Iran is all Shiite, Iraq is about 60% Shiite and once the US leaves Iraq Iran will be controlling a very large block of territory. For years the CIA maintained a balance of power by supporting Sadam, whose small Sunni minority ruled with an iron fist and was at war with Iran.

With the overthrow of Sadam, the greatest risk was empowering Iran in the Gulf region. The Sunni monarchies are very concerned about this. Iran works through Syria, Hizb'allah, Hamas to create instability in the region and throw off the more moderate Muslims.

Iran would like to see the entire world under sharia law and will stir up trouble in the Muslim countries who are dealing with the West. Countries like Bahrain have significant Shiite minorities. These countries have a difficult balancing act to maintain power. Dealing with the US, the "great Satan" , Israeli's friend and supporter of course provides many opportunities to stir up the dissatisfied masses in these countries.



Joyce
 
A Crucified Man;

http://www.youtube.com/
watch?v=8oxbYxNPKYw

For the message about the cross is nonsense to those who are being destroyed, but it is God's power to us who are being saved.
1 Corinthians 1:18

~K~
 
Constance,
There is some truth in the fact that David shed a lot of blood. The Scriptures say this:

1Chr. 22:8 “But the word of the LORD came to me, saying, ‘aYou have shed much blood and have 1waged great wars; you shall not build a house to My name, because you have shed so much blood on the earth before Me.

However, having said this, David was a man after God's own heart even with all of his mistakes of adultery, murder etc.

David loved God's Word and was a man of great faith. David did more to unite the kingdom, whereas Solomon divided it and it was "ripped from the hand" of his descendant Rehoboam.

I'll have to watch this film, but it sounds like it might twist the story. Israel was supposed to take possession of the land and drive out the enemies, like the Philistines who stood in opposition to the true and living God. There were those who sacrificed children to Molech and all kinds of abominations committed in the land.

Israel was to be a people consecrated to God to be a LIGHT TO THE NATIONS, so that the nations would know the true God of Israel, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. As long as Israel was faithful to God, He would bless them and give them victory. When they went whoring after other gods as in the case of King Manasseh who shed blood but was not righteous, God scattered them amongst their enemies.

God did not let David build His house, but He loved David. The kings he got angry at were ones like Manasseh:

2Chr. 33:6-7aHe made his sons pass through the fire in the valley of Ben-hinnom; and he practiced witchcraft, used divination, practiced sorcery and bdealt with mediums and spiritists. He did much evil in the sight of the LORD, provoking Him to anger.Then he put athe carved image of the idol which he had made in the house of God, of which God had said to David and to Solomon his son, “In this house and in Jerusalem, which I have chosen from all the tribes of Israel, I will put My name forever;

God is jealous for His Name, and when someone misrepresents Him He punishes them. Manasseh after being led by hooks and chains into Babylon, repented and turned back to God.

2Chr. 33:13 When he prayed to Him, He was moved by his entreaty and heard his supplication, and brought him again to Jerusalem to his kingdom. Then Manasseh bknew that the LORD was God.

God really does chastise those He loves, and He loved David too, which is why David was confronted by the prophet Nathan.

Most people think, God is a God of love and He doesn't punish sin, but God is also a holy God and He will judge the gods of this world as He did with Egypt.. Murder is forbidden in the Bible, but God told Israel to go and possess the Land and cleanse it of the all the people who were committing iniquity in it so that He could dwell with HIs people in the center of the earth and the nations would turn to Him and follow Him.

When we read about all the violence in the Tanach, it's important that we understand what God's plan was and don't take it out of context.

Many of the nations God judged were involved in the most horrible forms of sin, like sacrificing their children to Molech. Israel eventually did many of the same things because they did not remain "holy and set apart, unto Him" and for this they were scattered and punished, because God will not be mocked.

As much as God is a God of compassion , He is also holy.. a point much forgotten in today's world.
Joyce
 
The problem is that most people don't understand the plan of God, the election of Israel, the promise of Yeshua, etc. This is the spiritual cause of anti-semitism. Israel, herself doesn't completely understand their election.

The election was to be a blessing to all the families of the earth, through the seed ( Yeshua) and the literal seed Israel, which would be scattered and gathered up in the Last Days. This is the great harvest which will ultimately bring glory to God, when He accomplishes all that He said He would in His Word.

The lack of understanding on the part of Muslims and many others, leads to jealousy, hatred and anti-semitism. It is very spiritual in nature.

If the world understood God's redemption plan, and His election of Israel and His salvation in Yeshua ( whose name means salvation) then it would be different today, but Satan has blinded the eyes of the unbelieving so that they cannot see...

May we cease from our labor today and rest knowing that Yeshua has accomplished it all for us and that we can truly have wholeness, shalom, in Him.

Joyce
 
One of the first things I read this morning was this:
And Israel Today is reporting that the Obama administration is not just cool to Israel. It alleges that President Obama "is about to break America's long ties of friendship with Israel, and maybe even take steps toward the dissolution of the Jewish state."
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?pageId=92394
Then I read Constance’s new post, and I was remembering David Wilkerson’s warning to America.
We have warned and “THEY” had no ears to hear, and all we can do is weep!
 
Once agin I have to say, thta with each passing day, a piece of the puzzle seems to find its place.
This fall will be a very interesting time.

DouginMI
 
Dear Friends, let us remember, this world is not our home, in our Country righteusness will be the rule of the day, the Lamb will be the Light and He shall reign for ever and ever!

With Abraham, we continue to look for that better country who's builder and maker is God....eye hath not seen, ear hath not heard, niether has it entered the heart of man, the things God has prepared for those who love Him!

Be encouraged, all these things must come to pass.
 
We need to examine any news about Israel with a very critical eye.

I have already observed how criticisms for bombings and other atrocities committed by Islamic terrorists (Hamas) is less harsh than that leveled against the Israelis who are harshly criticized for acting in what they believe to be their own self-defense.

There are also hints that Islamic terrorists may be teaming up with neo-Nazis in Germany.

Benjamin("Bibi")Netanyahu has already been vindicated with regard to his opposition to the Gaza Plan which was not even put to a referendum in Israel.
The Gaza strip became a base for Islamic terrorists after the Israelis cleared out - just as Netanyahu said it would be.

It is Netanyahu's belief that surrendering more territory is not only redolent of the appeasement of Hitler prior to the Second World War, but it would also create more terrorist strongholds from which Israel could be attacked in the future.

I am not in any way pretending to be an expert in Israeli affairs, but it seems to me that Solana and the EU should not underestimate the resolve on the part of many members of the Jewish community NOT to allow the history of the Holocaust to repeat itself.

Below is a comment that echoes something I read many years ago:

Arab countries who are massed against Israel need to understand that Israelis are not going to allow themselves to be destroyed or suffer another diaspora. They no longer have the "Masada Complex" (where they will commit suicide rather than surrender); they have the "Samson Complex" (where they will bring down the region rather than surrender).

http://tinyurl.com/cazcvj


Given past incidents like the "oil for food" scandal and other similar fiascos which suggest that the EU may be little more than a cesspool of corruption, why should Israel trust the EU to preach to them about "doing the the right thing?"

At the end of the day, it occurs to me that Solana and the EU may be more concerned about Bibi's "peace plan" than Bibi is about theirs.
 
P.S.


Wednesday, January 21, 2009

NEO-NAZIS PLAN GAZA "HOLOCAUST" VIGIL IN BERLIN

http://tinyurl.com/dcjpjw
 
Last night I came across something I had never heard of, it's called Web Bots. Apparently some kind of computer program scans the world wide web, then picks up and examines repeated key words, then based on the data they make predictions.

They predicted 911 and Katrina, along with various other world events. Someone used a term in the last thread that I thought was interesting "techno witchcraft". I think some technology, such as the 6th sense boarders on this. However, as far as web bots, I can understand the method and why it may make sense.

Oh my, the predictions of the web bots are not good. One thing they predict is not so much a coming revolution but a coming evolution (between now and 2012). When I heard that, I put my hands over my mouth and said "oh my word!".

I don't know what to think about this. Does anybody have any thoughts?
 
WEb bots are used a censorship tool. They hunt for keywords inside web data -

DouginMI
 
From The News Media Journal

On January 27th 2009 President Barack Obama signed an executive order allocating 20.3 million dollars to bring Palestinians related to Hamas terrorist organization to the United States as refugees.

This executive order appeared in the Federal Register volume 74, number 221e1615
 
Doug, are you aware of the predictions made by web bots and what do you think of them?
 
This a.m. I heard on the radio a mention that the Pope is encouraging the folks in Angola to turn to Christ and not the witch doctors or voodoo or whatever the newscaster said.
 
The news on Javier Solana is breaking as fast ss all other developments. Refresh your page for links on Solana rebuffing Russia!

http://www.eubusiness.com/news-eu/1237630622.41

Constance
 
12. That same man were to be presiding over a program, European Neighbourhood Policy," that was to begin on January 1, 2007 and last until December 31, 1913, with a midterm review scheduled for mid 2010?

Ahem, while I think the blog post was very informative for someone who wants to review the situation, I do think the date should be corrected to December 31, 2013.
 
Susanna,
I would agree that the news that comes out about Israel will be manipulated, but it's important to remember that even if they were justified in defending themselves, which I utterly agree, that doesn't not mean that there isn't some agenda behind the way the military operation was performed. It might depend on why the operation was done, at the particular time it was done. Was there a political agenda behind this war or was it truly self-defense.


The media is definitely slanted, but there is also the possibility that some of these very young soldiers were given a green light to do things that would humiliate the Palestinians. We definitely saw that in the Iraq War. The humiliation of Muslims causes rage in the Muslim world.. It seems kind of suicidal for Israel to do this, unless there are some in the government who want to push Israel to give up land, or wanted to slant the elections in a certain direction.

Albert Pike knew that the 3rd World War would be religious in nature. Is it possible that there are some in positions of power who deliberately provoke this sort of religious war? Just a thought.

Tactically speaking, Israel could have handled the operation in a way that would have won the war of public opinion. They do have reasonable explanations for all of this. It is known that these type of guerrilla wars are very difficult to fight without hitting civilians. Now with this new information coming out true or not, it will appear that Israel just acted with brutality. Whether they did or did not the news stories will create more anti-semitism.

There are people who I know who are Israelis that don't trust the Israeli government 100% and others who would stake their life on the idea that Israeli does all it can to avoid killing civilians. Logically speaking, young people who have seen friends and family killed can become callous. This is the nature of war.

You are right in saying the media goes very easy on Hamas. Recently for the first time when a Palestinian man bulldozed people in Jerusalem ( 3rd time this year) the US did not utter a peep about it being a "terrorist attack". This is a first in the history of US/Israeli relations.

Very few of us really understand what it is to live under the constant threat of terrorist attacks against our civilian populations, so that's important to keep in mind.

The bottom line is in spite of the fact that one of the leaders of PLO the supposed "good guys" who Israel is willing to negotiate with, said PLO has NEVER recognized Israel and Hamas should not either, and yet the world is still pressuring Israel to "stop the occupation". The world does not recognize Israel's Biblical right to the land. This is certain, and the world doesn't mind if the Muslims build minarets on the high places. It's quite amazing how the spiritual landscape remains the same century to century.

There are Palestinian mothers who are willing to "sacrifice their children to Molech" which defies every instinct that those of us who believe in the God of the Bible have.

The insanity of pursuing negotiations with a people who are bent on the destruction of Israel does not make any sense whatsoever and forcing Israel to give up land so that they will have indefensible borders doesn't either, unless you read the Bible and realize that the prophecies are being accomplished in our generation.

Joyce
 
Now Hamas is telling US what it should do:

http://tinyurl.com/dbsx99

Maybe Iran, Hamas and Hizb'allah will be nice to us if we "obey".

The scary part is that Obama will probably listen. The Bible does say that all the nations will turn on Israel.

Joyce
 
Dear Anonymous,

You are so right, 2013, not 1913!

BACKWARDS IN TIME? lol

Constance
 
In light of this morning's most stunning news story, I wanted to post a small portion of Jerry Golden's report, which also came out today....I'm not sure that he has even seen the article about the US severing ties with Israel, nevertheless, his concerns are very well justified.
**********************************
It’s the Sabbath here in Israel a day we would like to rest and reflect on the important things in our life, our relationship with God, our family and friends it is a day to also rest in the spirit and take a break from the stress the past week brought. But rest hasn’t come to me on this Sabbath for there is within my spirit an urgency, one that drives me forward in preparation for ministry ahead of us, not knowing the complete story and only knowing that without the guidance of the Rauch Hakoddesh (Holy Spirit) there is no chance we will be successful in saving Jewish lives.

All day I’ve had thoughts of massive military might gathering all around us, I’ve seen in my spirit horrible things and somehow I know the time of these events are near, very near. For the day is also near that Israel will be standing all alone with no friends to come to her rescue, and it will be God alone who can save us, and even He will hold back until there has been a cleansing in the hearts of Israel.
 
This is a developing story headlined on Drudgereport. Forget socialism, I think this is called communism.

Things are moving so fast, it's ominous.
**********************************
Obama will call for increased oversight of 'executive pay at all banks, Wall Street firms and possibly other companies' as part of sweeping plan to 'overhaul financial regulation', NY TIMES reporting Sunday, newsroom sources tell DRUDGE... Developing...
 
Just my thoughts,

Regarding the recent EU, US, Israel developements. We have all known this time was coming and truth be told I can not bring myself to fret over this issue. Israel the nation as it stands today, is a nation without the Spirit of our Lord. Ezekiel told us it would be this way until the appointed time. I stand behind Israel's existence, but its actions are still of this world.

Prophecy tells us when all other nations come against Israel, our Father uses this event to show His glory. Only at this point will Israel return to her Father. I for one greatly anticipate this day, and while I am saddened that the US has fallen so far, my hope does not lie within this nation. These events if anything should inspire great reverence for the Lord, as He is showing us that our redemption is truly near.
 
Czech Presidency leads EU summit to agreement on anti-crisis measures

After the negotiations in Brussels chaired by Czech PM Mirek Topolánek, the heads of state and government of the EU reached an agreement on measures that are to help the EU overcome the impacts of the financial and economic crisis.

“We can achieve that with three specific packages – with a budget of five, 50 and 75 billion euro”, said President of the European Council Mirek Topolánek, explaining that: “five billion has been allocated for specific projects that are to achieve specific goals – to increase the energy security of the EU and promote innovations; 50 billion has been earmarked to increase guarantees to help the countries that face difficulties with their balance of payments, and 75 billion euro represents the proposed voluntary loan to the credit fund of the International Monetary Fund.”

“We have prepared for the G20 summit in the spirit of solidarity, trust and unity”, said President of the European Commission José Manuel Barroso at the joint press conference with reference to the upcoming summit of economic powers, adding that “our coordinated approach to the financial crisis is a contribution to the necessary global solution”.

http://tinyurl.com/dc8dss


I have yet to see what these projects actually entail, but rest assured they can't be good!
 
Joyce,

As I have said in my earlier comment, I do not pretend in any way to be an expert on Israeli affairs, so I want to say at the outset that this comment is not in any way intended as a challenge to yours.

I am simply sharing some additional information I have read in various places.

This is in reference to your comment:

In the meantime Obama is sending warm messages to Iran..

http://tinyurl.com/c8nz9x

Iran wants to set up a Muslim caliphate. About a week or so ago, Morocco, a Muslim country cut off diplomatic relations with Iran, but US wants to play nicey, nice with them.

http://tinyurl.com/dzosc7

__________________________

IMHO, Obama is either deliberately anti-Israel or he is CLUELESS!

When did playing "nicey nice" with Hitler ever pay off?

In that context, it is certainly interesting to pay attention to the history of Iran.

First of all, many people don't realize that the Iranian people are not regarded as true Arabs by other Arabs. Ergo, it may be that not all Arab countries will necessarily be willing to play ball with Iran

Until 1935, Iran was known as Persia.

The name of the country was changed to reflect the connection of its people to the original so-called "Aryans." (a.k.a. "master race" in some quarters )

At the time of the name change, Persia's leader, Reza Shah Pahlavi, was a big fan of Adolph Hitler.

On 21 March 1935, the ruler of the country, Reza Shah Pahlavi, issued a decree asking foreign delegates to use the term "Iran" in formal correspondence.

Members of the Persian intelligentsia were not happy with this decree, seeing a pro-Nazi motive behind it. After Dr. Hjalmar Schacht, the Nazi Economics minister, commented on the Aryan origin of Persians, Reza Shah's ambassador in Germany encouraged him to issue the above-mentioned decree, asking all foreign delegates to use the word "Iran" as used by Iranians inside the Iran (meaning "Land of the Aryans") instead of "Persia" in formal correspondence.

As the New York Times explained at the time, "At the suggestion of the Persian Legation in Berlin, the Tehran government, on the Persian New Year, March 21, 1935, substituted Iran for Persia as the official name of the country. In its decision it was influenced by the Nazi revival of interest in the various Aryan races, cradled in ancient Persia. As the Ministry of Foreign Affairs set forth in its memorandum on the subject, 'Perse', the French designation of Persia, connoted the weakness and tottering independence of the country in the nineteenth century, when it was the chessboard of European imperialistic rivalry. 'Iran', by contrast, conjured up memories of the vigour and splendour of its historic past." A few years later some Persian scholars also protested to the government that changing the name of the country in Western languages had separated the country from its past and its culture.

To avoid confusion between the two neighboring countries: Iran and Iraq, which were both involved in WWII and occupied by the Allies, Winston Churchill requested from the Iranian Government during the Teheran Conference for the old and distinct name "Persia to be used by the United Nations [i.e., the Allies] for the duration of the common War." His request was approved immediately by the Iranian Foreign Ministry. The American side, however, continued using "Iran" as it had at the time little involvement in Iraq to cause any such confusion.

In 1949 Mohammad Reza Shah announced that both "Persia" and "Iran" could officially be used interchangeably. Nowadays both terms are common; "Persia" mostly for historical and cultural texts, "Iran" mostly for political texts.


http://en.wikipedia.org/
wiki/Iran_
naming_dispute

During Benjamin Netanyahu's recent campaign in Israel, he ran on a platform that promised, among other things, not to allow Jerusalem to be divided in any "land for peace" deals.

Netanyahu specifically mentioned Iran and its proxy, Hamas, in the context of their being a greater danger to Israel if Jerusalem were divided and the Golan Heights surrendered.

http://www.israeltoday.co.il
/default.aspx?
tabid=178&nid=18197
____________________________

NETANYAHU: IT'S 1938 AND IRAN IS GERMANY

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/787766.html
____________________________

NETANYAHU - SECURITY

http://en.netanyahu.org.il/Themes-of/security/
____________________________

Netanyahu has implied that those Israeli politicians who are zealously crusading for "land for peace" deals are the Israeli equivalent of Neville Chamberlain at Munich. (a.k.a. the infamous act of appeasement of Adolf Hitler negotiated on September 30, 1938 by Neville Chamberlain)

While it may be true that as a politician, Israeli hardliner Avigdor Lieberman is no prize, it is a little hard to stomach seeing Lieberman being demonized while little is said about the legitimization of Hamas when the people voted it in during the 2006 Palestinian election.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/01/26/news/
vote.php

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avigdor_Lieberman


Not much different from the way in which Hitler and the Nazi Party were legitimized by the German people who voted for them in 1933.

http://fcit.usf.edu/
HOLOCAUST/TIMELINE/
nazirise.HTM

There are certanly lots of components to the Israeli/Middle East mosaic.
 
I have a question, please, can somebody shed some light on this. My sister and I are trying to understand the war of Ez. 38, also known as Gog and Magog. It says in Ez. 39:9 "Then those who dwell in the cities of Israel will go out and make fires of the weapons and burn them, shields and bucklers, bow and arrows, clubs and spears and they will make fires of them for seven years."

First of all, modern day weapons are not made from wood.

Secondly, how can they be burning wood for seven years if the war doesn't start (at the least) at the beginning of the 70th week?

It sure seems like we could be seeing world events moving towards such a war but how can there be time for them to burn wood for another 7 years? This has me completely stumped.

Constance do you have any thoughts?

Somebody Please help!
 
Jaclyn, that one is currently beyond me as well. I'll have to wait and see for the interpretation of that one.

Constance
 
Thanks for your prompt response, everyone I have talked to is perplexed by that one. It's my understanding that there will be some people left over after Armageddon, (although that doesn't seem plausible) or was this an exaggeration to impress upon the reader just how widespread the carnage would be?

I guess there will remain some mystery.
 
One can only imagine what was going through Ezekiel's mind as he was seeing his incredible vision. To put what he saw in human language, based on what he knew. The same can be said about John and Daniel. What a time they must have had putting it down on paper!
 
Hi Jaclyn, Constance, & everyone,

I just wanted to propose a possible explanation for Ezekiel 39:9.

First, Russia and every country / state they support have either given or sold the AK-47 rifle to them. There are millions of these rifles and they all have wooden butts, or stocks. Also hundreds of popular pistols have wooden grips. Many swords, knifes and bayonets have wooden handles. There is only so much ammo to around during a world war, and when ammo disappears, which you can almost guarantee in the next, third world war, soldiers will use their standard issue rifle bayonet, which which would appear to look like a spear to Ezekiel, or fight with your knife, or attach your knife to a piece of wood to make a spear, or use a sword, just like most Japanese infantry carried in WWII. Guess what, with so many third world countries still using horses and camels, when petrol runs out, every country will using animals as well. I found the Bible right on target here, and am not the least bit surprised about how primitive thing might get. Keep in mind too metal burns as well.
 
Thanks anonymous, very interesting analyses!

Now can you explain how they will burn the weapons for a seven year period?
 
JD - EU

Mark Mardell blogged about where some of this money is going on his BBC blog. He seems very unimpressed with it all.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markmardell/

~K~
 
hello all,


You all may have seen this. Just in case you hadn't I wanted to pass it along.

http://tiny.cc/H7Pdr

"The U.S. House of Representatives has approved a plan to set up a new "volunteer corps" and consider whether "a workable, fair, and reasonable mandatory service requirement for all able young people" should be developed. "

More at link
 
Here is a scarey article over at FP forum-

http://www.fulfilledprophecy.
com/discussion/viewtopic.php?
f=8&t=48085

6 posts • Page 1 of 1
Death penalty For Rioters
by Holy Now on Sat Mar 14, 2009 4:43 pm

http://www.indymedia.ie/article/86592
Professor exposes hidden death penalty clause in treaty

I am writing from India where a recent disclosure regarding the reintroduction of the death penalty for rioters on ratification of the Lisbon Treaty is receiving much debate.
Despite the British Press seemingly pro referendum stance they have failed to report on this very important disclosure. The exposure of this hidden Death Penalty clause could have made a big difference in last weeks commons vote.

An email I have received from a UK labour MP leads me to believe the majority of MP’s are also in the dark over this issue.

On 20th Feb 2008 a caucus meeting was held at the German Parliament in Munich to discuss the Lisbon Treaty.

At this meeting a previously unmentioned paragraph was bought to light by Professor Schachtschneider, Humanities Faulty -University of Nuremberg.

Professor Schachtschneider, explained that the undisclosed paragraph means on ratification of the Lisbon Treaty the DEATH PENALTY will be reintroduced to Europe. The Death Penalty will be applicable for the crimes of RIOTING, CIVIL UPHEAVAL and DURING WAR. (When are we not at war and who will define riot and upheaval?)

Professor Schachtschneider made the point that this clause is particularly outrageous as it had been cleverly hidden in a footnote of a footnote and would not have been detected by anyone other than an exceptional expert reader.

It is obvious that this hidden footnote is intended to destroy any future chance for people to stand up against abuse maltreatment or exploitation by government and those in authority. This is immediately significant when one considers the anti war demonstrations that will take place all over Europe if Iran is attacked.
skip
The fate of millions or ordinary Europeans is now in the hands of the Irish people, it is only right that when they place their vote they do so with knowledge of the FULL content.
Tony Blair sold the UK for the promise of being the main contender for the EU presidency. The people of Ireland realize this and most normal Europeans believe the Irish will not vote their vote away into the hands of this lying warmonger or his ilk.
Related Link: http://www.larouchepub.com/hzl/2008/351 ... sb....html
Exalt the Lord our God and worship at His holy mountain, for the Lord our God is holy.
Psalm 99:9

That was the post. But then a later poster tried the link, but the article it came from was no longer available.
 
Jaclyn,

Last year sometime, there was an article that I printed, but it may still be available on line, how they were talking disarmament of chemical weapons, and once they started burning the weapons cache they had, it was going to take 7 years to fully burn the weapons.

I would believe that at least some of the weapons in the Ezek. 38/39 war are chemical in nature because it says they can't bury the bodies for 7 months, they just place markers where the bodies are and they come back later. Perry Stone had some good information on this, but it seems this is exactly what happens with chemical weapons.

Leana
 
Dawn,

I have been watching for this since it was talked about during the election. I found some interesting articles about it:

http://www.opencongress.org/roll_call/show/5358

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=92288

http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/9374

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h111-1388

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/03%20...%20d-service/

I don't have time to tiny url them at the moment, but I will later if need be.

Hope that helps
Leana
 
K,

Thanks for the link, however I am a bit more concerned than Mardell. These "green projects", and "internet" issues he is downplaying may very well be Smart Grid, and "Internet of things" technologies. Sorry but this article wreaked of the typical police officer at a traffic accident saying 'move along, nothing to see here'. To me the BBC is no different from the media here in the US, distractions. Only the BBC does a better job of masquerading as a news outlet.
 
Thanks Leana, thats very interesting, do you know where I read that article?
 
Jacklyn @7:19,

Interestingly, considering your post, there was a picture no more than two days ago in the Washington Post, of weapons being burned in a huge bonfire.

Don't remember the country--but I do remember that they had been seized from some formerly warring parties. They appeared to be rifles, semi-automatics, and perhaps RPG-launchers.

That quote from Ezekiel came to mind to me too.
 
All,

On Ezekiel, I am in agreement with many of the theories thus far. Chemical and even nuclear weapons even of the crudest fashion could provide the 7 years of fuel. What a way to spend the first part of our 1000 years with our Messiah though. lol
 
Jaclyn,

Protestants may or may not agree with this, but for what it is worth, this is what the Catholic Encyclopedia has to say about Gog and Magog.

Gog and Magog

Names, respectively, of a king and of his supposed kingdom, mentioned several times in Ezekiel 38 and 39, and once in the Apocalypse (20:7). In the first passage of Ezechiel we read the command of Yahweh to the prophet: "Son of man, set thy face against Gog the land of Magog...and prophesy of him...Behold, I come against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Mosoch and Thubal" (38:2-3). A similar command is found also at the beginning of chapter 39. These two chapters contain repeated reference to Gog and Magog, but they furnish only vague and uncertain indications as to the identity of the ruler or the location of the country. In chapter 39 Gog is represented (verses 5 and 6) as being accompanied in his invasion of the land of Israel by the Persians, Ethiopians, and Libyans, Gomer, and...the house of Thogorma; and in verse 15 we read: "And thou shalt come out of thy place from the northern parts." From the number and variety of the peoples mentioned in this connection some writers have inferred that the name Gog may be only a generic appellation, or figure, used in Ezechiel to designate the host of the enemies of Israel, and in the Apocalypse to denote the multitude of the foes of the Church. Others conjecture that it may be a local title expressing the royal dignity, such as the name Pharaoh in Egypt. But it seems more probable that both names are historical; and by some scholars Gog is identified with the Lydian king called by the Greeks Gyges, who appears as Gu-gu on the Assyrian inscriptions. If this be true, Magog should be identified with Lydia. On the other hand, as Mosoch and Thubal were nations belonging to Asia Minor, it would seem from the text of Ezechiel that Magog must be in that part of the world. Finally, Josephus and others identify Magog with Scythia, but in antiquity this name was used to designate vaguely any northern population.


http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/06628a.htm

As Constance says it is pretty vague. The reason for this is because God will never do or say anything so demonstrable as to interfere with the operation of free will in man.

For the Bible to explicitly say that "such and such" a country or countries WILL NECESSARILY BE the last "evil empire" - or to say that "so and so" WILL NECESSARILY BE the antichrist - would be to embody a kind of determinism that would preclude the operation of free will in man - including the man who is to become the "son of perdition."

Another thing to consider is the fact that chastisements - including, perhaps, the advent of the antichrist - HAVE BEEN DELAYED on account of the willingness of the people to repent.

Recall Ninevah in the Book of Jonah!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonah
 
Jaclyn,

I am sure this is a similar article to the one I found before.
http://www.southerner.net/fast/fear.html

What I took from this is that you burn Chemical weapons to dispose of them and that if you had a huge amount of weapons to burn, and unless you had enough proper incinerators, it could take 7 years to dispose of all of the weapons. I know they do have incinerators today that also can generate electricity, so melding the two in the future is possible

Thanks,
Leana
 
According to astronomers, March has been an extraordinarily busy month for close calls. Last week a 30 meter space rock whizzed past our planet just outside of our highest stationary satellites, within 90,000 km of the earth. Just yesterday, on the very first day of spring, another massive rock, this one big enough to wipe out half the planet, silently flew past us with nary a notice from the major media outlets.

From spaceweather.com:

"On March 20th, asteroid 2009 DO111 flew past Earth about 288,000 miles away--just beyond the orbit of the Moon. About the size of a football field, the dangerous space rock was visible in backyard telescopes as it raced through the constellation Cassiopeia shining like a 13th magnitude star. March has been a busy month for flybys with at least nine asteroids passing within a million miles of Earth. Stay tuned for more."
 
another explaination, First I would like to state that the president of Israel Perez although behind the scenes now, truely works against Israel an hopes and worked towards dividing Jerusalaum, as he has tried to do for most of his career.
Next, to bring about a permanant peace in the area soon the UN will bring in UN troops of all nations. This is when God will turn them to fight each other.
as you know Hamas and other muslims and possibly israeli will not only object, but will destroy as many of their conventional weapons as possible perhaps leaving these troops with more rudimentary weapons that do burn for 7 years.
This will not be the Gog MaGog war, that war will be fought in the Hormoze area of Iran,Afganistan,Pakistan. as was pinpointed by the sages many many years ago. It will most likely begin when Israel through desperation will attack Iran reactors, and will hit Bazra Iraq, causing the sacrifice to God.
Yvonne
Yvonne
 
Constance

http://www.eubusiness.com/news-eu/1237630622.41

This page cannot be found or deleted could you shed some light on it please.

I'm finding when I try to open pages I get a massages of 404 this is now happening alot lately.

God bless you all
In His Service
 
Obama to attend AOC meeting in Turkey soon

"Erdogan told in an interview with a news channel that he had invited Obama to attend a meeting of the Alliance of Civilizations initiative in Istanbul on April 7 and said it was meaningful that the U.S. president not only accepted the invitation, but decided also to pay an official visit to Ankara the day before. "

http://www.hurriyet.com.tr/english/world/11242954.asp?scr=1

Wow there is really just way too much going on right now.

RonC
 
Jaclyn, regarding the question of Gog and Magog, in my opinion probably one of the best studies of this subject is Doug Berner’s The Silence Is Broken. Berner discusses the wood and cavalry problem and also the pros and cons of the various theories held by different people. Is it allegorical? Was it fulfilled in the past? Is it pre 70th week, during the week, part of Armageddon or post-Millennial? Berner is pretribulational but don’t let that deter you. He does have some good thoughts regarding a subject that is heavily debated. You can also download a PDF copy of his book for around $6:25.
 
JenJen,

As anybody doing intense research on controversial subjects soon learn, a cute little game of "now you see us, now you don't" is too often played and for that reason, I recommend archiving all immediately to your hard drive and then making multiple backups elsewhere. When something becomes embarrassing, often it is promptly removed.

Constance
 
To JenJen,

Obviously EUObsever pulled the story, BUT, click on the picture which was it and you can read the bulk of it anyway. Like I said, archive EVERYTHING!

Constance
 
No nedd to worry about the missing article,
it's also on afp:
http://tinyurl.com/d2atmq
and xinhuanet:
http://tinyurl.com/dywvk5

Björn
 
Hi Jaclyn, You and your sister aren't alone. I sure don't have the answer and from what I looked at tonight, many others have been puzzled as well with that particular verse in Ezekiel 39. Type "they will make fires of them for seven years." or something similar + "weapons" in a search and you'll find MANY sites whose focus is Bible prophecy have
the same questions, especially about the "wood weapons" Nobody,
can say they have the answer for sure. I did see one thing that was very interesting. Try doing a search on a material called
"Lignostone". Röchling Engineerng Plastics (some said it was a Dutch Co. but from what I found it's German)is the Company who discovered it in 1915. Over the past 100 years high technology has allowed for developing many uses for this compressed wood product.
Here is a PDF from Röchling Engineering with some history of the company as well as showing some of the ways Lignostone® and Durostone® are being used.
(Page 23)

http://tinyurl.com/d6nhnk

http://www.formaterm.se/pdf/REP-KG.pdf

*******************************

In Chapter 2 of Herb Peters excellent book,
"Recommendation 666" he shares 8 Keys he had found helpful for "unlocking" and understanding Bible Prophesy. In my opinion, God
gave Herb great insight. Key No.8
in particular,really stuck with me
when I've hit something difficult to understand. Key No. 8 is
"Follow the Road Signs"

I'll quote Herb himself:

" Perhaps one of the biggest mistakes we students of prophecy make is failing to recognize the difference between details and prophetic road signs. So my last key is: Follow the road signs. Although God has given us many amazing details of the future in the Bible, we must learn to recognize the difference between details and road signs. When we fail to follow the prophetic road signs, it’s easy to get hung up in the details and go off course. PROPHETIC ROAD SIGNS ARE EVENTS THAT WERE FORETOLD IN SCRIPTURE AND ARE NOW DOCUMENTED IN HISTORY. But, too many times, we focus on events that are questionable."
..."So remember, learn to recognize and follow the prophetic road signs before attempting to fill in the details." (page 17)

**"Recommendation 666: The Rise of the Beast From the Sea"
Herbert L. Peters

Chapter 2: Eight Keys to Unlocking the Prophecies

Herb Peters Book is available to purchase from Amazon or Barnes & Noble. Herb also kindly made his book available for on line reading.


http://tinyurl.com/cjt2kk

http://www.fulfilledprophecy.com/page/recommendation-666-the-rise-of-the-beast-from-the/

-Rudi
 
yesterday Hungarys Prime minister offered to resign, after coming back from the EU financial summit where SOlana was also present. The financial situation in Hungary is catastrophic and the populaton suffers a lot.
http://tinyurl.com/d6pn5u
 
From AFP (3/20/09):

The US budget deficit will reach a record 1.845 trillion dollars in fiscal 2009 that ends in September, equivalent to 13.1 percent of economic output, the budget arm of Congress forecast Friday.

The Congressional Budget Office's (CBO) latest estimate was far steeper than its prior forecast in January of a deficit of 1.2 trillion dollars.

The new projections were based on the budget plan presented by President Barack Obama's administration to Congress in February.

The budget deficit for the 2008 fiscal year was a record 459 billion dollars, or 3.2 percent of gross domestic product.

The CBO estimated that for the current fiscal year, which began last October 1, spending would soar 34 percent from the past year, to 4.004 trillion dollars, and revenues would plunge 15 percent, to 2.159 billion.

The deficit would remain high in the 2010 fiscal year, at 1.379 billion dollars, before falling below the trillion-dollar mark in 2011, to 970 billion dollars.

The CBO is an independent body of Congress charged with providing lawmakers with economic analysis to aid in budgeting.
 
From Global Research (3/21/09):

Forget AIG Bonuses — The Next Bailout is Here

Democrats from Andrew Cuomo to Barney Frank to Barack Obama are demanding that the 418 AIG employees who received bonuses give them back. Sure, it’s outrageous that the very people who drove AIG off the cliff, along with a whole lot of other financial firms, walked away with million-dollar bonuses paid with taxpayer bailout money. But as the Wall Street Journal opinion page points out, "Taxpayers have already put up $173 billion, or more than a thousand times the amount of those bonuses, to fund the government’s AIG ‘rescue.’"

And there is more to come.

The Obama Administration is putting the finishing touches on another big bank bailout. Called the Public Private Investor Partnership (PPIP), it is the brainchild of the Treasury Secretary from Wall Street, Tim Geithner. Under the plan, the government will give our money to hedge fund managers to buy "toxic" assets for more than they are worth. The banks that created these toxic turkeys will use the money from the sales to recapitalize themselves. Everyone comes out ahead except, of course, the taxpayers, who are essentially funneling money to hedge funds to buy bad assets for more than they are worth. The other bonus for the banks in this plan, as Yves Smith points out, is that they get to avoid giving the toxic assets any real market value. Less transparency and more transfers of wealth from taxpayers to hedge fund managers.

So much for the "free market."

Yves Smith writes: "This is what readers ought to be upset about. The AIG bonuses are rounding error, and a done deal. This (the PPIP) is billions to avoid price discovery . . . "

$750 billion, to be precise–plus what remains of the $700 billion bank bailout Congress already approved.
 
Constance

Thank you so much and yes I will save research to my hard drive in future.

All of you who post here are doing a fantastic job it's a credit to you all.

As I live in Australia we are far removed of what is going on and really not many know what is going on , so because of this I like to print out information to pass on to others who want to keep up to date so again thank you team and God bless you all.

PS Constance hope your husband getting stronger and feeling better.

jen
 
Farmer 3:07

When in Hungary last summer I noticed so many blank faces, and people were sighing as they waited for the bus. When I mentioned this to the woman at the "tourist house" were I was staying, she began to cry, and she explained to me how the government basically told the people of Hungary that if they did not like circumstances there, they could leave! Pray for the Hungarian people!
 
Thank you all for helping me work through my question, your opinions are so appreciated!

I agree with JenJen, the various postings provide such a valuable source of information!
 
On the burning of weapons:

Wesley`s Notes:

The weapons _ The warlike provision, instruments, engines, carriages, and wagons. Shall burn _ It may be wondered why they burn these weapons, which might be of use to them for defence; but it was done in testimony that God was their defence, on whom only they relied. With fire _ In such a country, where the need of fire is much less than with us, it will not seem incredible, that the warlike utensils of so numerous an army might be enough to furnish them with fuel for many years.

Yesterday was a gorgeous sunny day here in Vermont, and as we drove through beautiful countryside on a dirt back road, smoke rising from sugaring operations. Passing over covered bridges I though what this must have been like over a hundred years ago? Horse drawn carriages, farming with horses, as the Amish, and other people in different nations still can be seen doing, and quite successfully! It made me think of the millennium, when our technology, and science will be gone, and a wonderful world of beauty, peace, tranquility and true diversity will be restored to the earth!!! When you think about our science, and technology for all its supposed advancements, really has brought with it more problems than solutions. It has made the beast system what it now is. It has brought us to the brink of destruction, and made the enslavement of the worlds peoples our current threat. I'm sure that the cleanup of the mess we have made will take several years, but it will all be worth the labor. Then we can embark on a sailing vessel bound for Israel were our Savior, and King we can see!
 
If the leader of Iran has publicly stated - and he has- that his entire life is devoted to bringing forth the muslim mahdi - you now understand that no matter what he says anywhere at anytime - oe does anywhere at antime - this is his ultimate goal and his ultimate driving force.

DouginMI
 
Quoting from Ezekiel 38, it sure seems like the war will indeed be fought in Israel in the last days.

v.8 After many days you will be summoned; in the latter years you will come into the land that is restored from the sword, whose inhabitants have been gathered from many nations to the mountains of Israel which had been a continual waste; but its people were brought out from the nations, and they are living securely, all of them.

v.16 and you will come up against My people Israel like a cloud to cover the land. It shall come about in the last days that I will bring you against My land...

v.18It will come about on that day, when Gog comes against the land of Israel,” declares the Lord GOD...

Ezek.39:4 “You will fall on the mountains of Israel,...

v.11 “On that day I will give Gog a burial ground there in Israel, the valley of those who pass by east of the sea...

As I understand it, the valley of those who pass by the sea is also called the Valley of the Passengers, an area in the mountains on the way to Jordan. Also they mention the Bashan, which is the Golan Heights.

The timing of the event will be when God pours out His Spirit on the whole house of Israel.
 
On AIG bonuses, Obama, and the fall out.

Since it has now come out that the Obama administration not only knew about the bonuses, but helped these guys procure them I have had some rough ideas that I would like feedback on. By now most of us realize that our financial down fall has been controled from the on set. In fact in many ways our leaders have barely tried to disguise this issue.

I am seeing this mess as a way to legitimize complete nationalization of these financial institutions. I see this as the only plausible solution they can put forward at this point to prevent these type of situations in the future. However one might ask, then why the leak of the administrations involvement? This may very well be a way to stir malcontent amongst the populace. These new agers generally will reveal pieces of the puzzle to the public, to give crisis its foundation. Only to turn and provide the solution. Order out of chaos, if you will.

One can be assured that since this piece has made the loop, the solution has already been predetermined. With things like the latest postings about Project Megiddo, and the hidden "death penalty" clause for civil unrest in the EU, (which is eerily similar to the FEMA powers available here) things seem to be going as planned for this unholy union. One thing that encourages me is more and more people seem to awakening to what is happening. This can be seen through simple searches of youtube, google video, and even google itself, regarding the new age, theosophy, UN, NWO, and all the trappings. The amount of info available regarding these issues is growing at a incredible rate, along with the amount of different people making this knowledge available.

Our Lord has begun waking those asleep, and calling people to Him. Though we all are about to suffer greatly for our faith, we must not forget to rejoice in Him, for He is showing us the finish line!
 
Shem, I'm jealous that you live in such a beautiful part of the Country! Covered bridges are so gorgeous.

Leana, I agree with you, It seems to me this battle will be fought in Israel, and it also seems like the players are moving into their positions, but I could be wrong.

JD, Absolutely, I agree, they create the crisis, then use it as a pretext to strip more freedoms, all in the name of keeping us safe.

I'm waiting for the American people and "conservatives" to quite calling them inept, but call them corrupt, that is what they are. These are smart people (smart like a fox), it took a lot of time, patience and planning to pull this off, and they seem to be moving at brake neck speed, possibly trying to take advantage of Obama's high poll numbers which are dwindling by the day.
 
My logic tells me that the internet is one of the biggest problems for the NWO as information, can be so freely and quickly spread to the public.

Here is a youtube on Jay Rockefeller's concerns about the internet, he claims it creates an "awesome" threat to our security and safety. I wonder if they are just laying the groundwork for massive regulation or worse.

http://www.southerner.net/fast/fear.html
 
I hesitate to mention this, but almost nothing seems to bizarre for the world in which we now live.

I just stumbled accross this article stating the UK Military is releasing some of their documents as they relate to UFO sightings.

A part of the article reads:
"These latest documents are the first containing information written by defence intelligence staff to be made public."

The entire article can be read here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7954001.stm

I am almost positive I saw an article the other day stating that the Obama administration is being asked to allow the Military to release some of their documentation on UFO sightings.

No, I don't believe in UFO's, however, it seems really strange to see both governments considering this at the same time.

I know they always have a method to their madness. Will "supposed" UFO's play a part in the coming deception?
 
This article was just posted on
Worldnetdaily.com

FROM WND'S JERUSALEM BUREAU

"Will the Jews return to Temple Mount? Prominent rabbi ascends site, opposes ban on visits to area"

Wouldn't it be something if the sacrifices resumed?!

article can be read here:

http://worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=92578
 
Dear Friends,
Just had the unfortunate privilege of having my communique' censored. I won't mention the server, but it starts with an A_ and ends with an L.
Sent links to friends and family (all of whom have this server), and they each came back- rejected for, roughly paraphrased,: "complaints of objectionable content".
The links I sent to them were re: the recent discussion we had with OMOTS about that nasty little WEB.
I wouldn't have given it a second thought, but with each resend, I changed the content a little and attempted to resend to each one.
All of them were rejected with the above explanation.
We are living in difficult times, friends.
We each need to be protected with the full armor of God in Ephesians chapter six.

By His Grace,
-SV
 
Jacklyn,

I don't doubt the existence of UFO's, however I do not believe they are little green men from outer space. I personally believe they are demonic manifestations, wrapped in a nice convienient lie! So in essence I believe what these documents are proclaiming is the existence of fallen angels.

Some have even drawn connections between the massive amounts of sightings which escalated around the time of the satanic sacrifices known to most as the holocaust, which for those who don't know literally means burnt offering. Not to mention this would also make our time as it was in the days of Noah! i.e. we now have the physical manifestation of the fallen on our planet, just as it was during the pre-flood period. One can also draw a direct corrolation between the rise in sightings and the growth of theosophy, NA, occult, or whatever label you want to put on demon worship.

To answer your question, in a way yes I believe UFO's will play a pivotal role in the deception, however they are already a huge chunk of the deception, even if they play no more of a role. This "disclosure" allows them to say UFO's planted the seed of creation here on earth. Which in essence would attempt to take glory from our Father, only to give it to Lucifer and his minions. Which conviently fits with the plan!
 
SV, I'm a little slow, I'm racking my brain but can't figure out what OMOTS is, the suspense is killing me! The fact that your e-mail was returned is eery. You know, a couple of times I have tried to send e-mails (one had a FEMA logo copied and pasted on it) and it was like my computer ate the e-mail. It didn't send it, or come back to me, it was just gone. The server said something like "there was a problem and we will address it". It made me a little creeped out but I just dismissed it. Hmmm, maybe we see a pattern starting.

By the way, what is OMOTS?
 
JD, I believe people are definitely seeing things, I have wondered if perhaps they are seeing holographics or top secret military exercises? Just a thought.
 
Confusion reigns over possible eurozone bailout plan

This one leaves me both perplexed and a little tickled! It seems the EU bailout plan we were already discussing here has left many leaders in a state of conusion, as most of them have no clue as to what the money is being allocated for. Many assume it is to help struggling economies, as was stated by German politician Otto Bernhardt. However many of the EU elite including Barroso say no such plan exists! The full context of the article explains better, however there is one quote that caught my attention.

'In a speech delivered to Microsoft's headquarters in Brussels on Thursday (19 March), Mr Cowen said the government plans "highly favourable business supports, tax regime and infrastructural supports," in a bid to turn Ireland into a "smart" economy.'

http://euobserver.com/9/27816

Now exactly what do they consider a "smart economy"?
 
Jacklyn,

OMOTS= Oldmanoftheski, a very valuable contributor to this blog!
 
AOL is heavily monitored by the government. When we were on it, I learned that they were reaching into my computer regularly because they find what you are interested in and sell the information. If you do a search you'll find there are a lot of sites that list complaints with it. Also add aohell into the search. I've had lots of my emails returned when I had more links than aol wanted to put through. Finally we just got disgusted and quit it.
 
UN to criticise Israel over Gaza.

The UN investigator into human rights in the Palestinian territories is set to present his latest report to the UN human rights council in Geneva.

It is the first such report since Israel's incursion into Gaza.

Richard Falk has been highly critical of Israel in the past, and his new report is no exception. ... Full story;
http://news.bbc.co.uk/
1/hi/world/middle_east/7958452.stm

~K~
 
Susanna,
You are correct in saying that the other Muslim nations don't trust Iran. They do not even have the same language. Iranians speak Farsi.

I have heard officials from Israel say that Iran poses the single greatest risk to Israel today. Not only does Iran pose a nuclear risk, but Iran has been aiding and abetting Syria, Hizb'allah and Hamas.

What is most interesting though is that Russia is the one supporting Iran in its efforts to go nuclear and Russia just last week provided Iran with the S300 long range weapons:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SA-N-6_Grumble

In many ways Russia probably poses the biggest threat to Israel because one has the sense that without Russia, Iran would not be quite so powerful and sophisticated if it were not for the help of Russia.

Russia threatened the US during the Bush administration to not attack any more countries, knowing full well, that the US would have liked to go after Iran.

Iran's response to Obama was to mock him. So much for dialogue.
____________
Today's Al Jazeera Zoellick is predicting depression:

http://tiny.cc/2Xlws

It's a well known fact that a constant flow of bad news will depress the economy further by causing people to panic. Psychology plays a big role in people's spending patterns. If we weren't on schedule to go into depression, it looks like we will be pushed into one. Bearish sentiment will drive people out of the equity, real estate and other markets leaving great bargins for those sitting on wads of cash..

Conventional wisdom says, don't follow the crowd, but are we in a different environment or are the herds being manipulated big time?

I don't have the answer to this. I'm just asking questions.

Market psychology has a way of fulfilling its own prophecies. As people panic, stop spending, stop lending, jobs are lost, depression could become a reality, but you can be sure there are those who will become wealthier in the midst of this downturn.
_______________________________


As for Ezekiel 38-39. Magog, Meshech, Tubal etc. are part of the table of nations in Genesis 10 that are descendants of Japeth, one of Noah's 3 sons. Remember Ham's son was cursed. Very 5 of chap 38 is talking about the descendants of Ham.

Here is the Anchor Bible Dictionary definition of who Gomer is:

GOMER (PERSON) [II, 1074] [Heb goœmer גֹּמֶר]. The name of two people in the OT.
1. Oldest son of Japheth and grandson of Noah who was the father of Ashkenaz, Riphath, and Togarmah (Gen 10:2; 1 Chr 1:6). In the 6th century B.C., the Bible pictures Gomer’s descendants as being allied with those of Togarmah in support of Magog, Meshech, and Tubal, brothers of Gomer in the early genealogies. They are to be defeated as part of God’s judgment on Gog, king of Magog (Ezek 38:2–6). These peoples are probably to be identified with the CIMMERIANS (Akk qimmiraia; Gk kimmerioi). These were Indo-Europeans from the Ukraine in south Russia, forced out of their homeland by the descending Scythians. They, themselves, advanced upon the Urartians in the region of Lake Van in the 8th century B.C., and also threatened the Assyrians. Pushing W into Asia Minor, the Cimmerians conquered Gordion and its Phrygian king Midas (676 B.C.). They then defeated Gyges of Lydia at his capital, Sardis (644 B.C.). Some of the Cimmerians apparently settled in Cappadocia, which was called Gomir by the later Arameans. Defeated by the Assyrians in the mid-7th century B.C., the Cimmerians intermarried with their neighbors and disappeared from history in the 6th century B.C.

Interestingly enough Gomer is also the name of the woman that the Prophet Hosea married who committed adultry, a symbol for the Northern Kingdom of Israel who committed spiritual adultery. I do not believe the similarity in names is merely a coincidence. Hosea, her husband is told to marry her in spite of her adulteries and then gives prophecies against her offspring. The name of her children mean "you are no longer my people" and "I will no longer have compassion on you".

This is a sign that God will judge the Northern Kingdom. Some believe that when the Northern Kingdom was judged, they ended up being mixed in with the Scythians and Cimmerians as they were scattered. One of the sons of the Gomer is Ashkenaz. Interestingly enough this is the name for Jews who come from Russia or Northern Europe. There is some controversy about their origins.

Sorry this is long, but it helps to understand:

CIMMERIANS [I, 1025] [Gk Kimmerioi Kimmerioi]. The Greek name of a group of Indo-European nomadic people possibly to be identified with the descendants of the biblical Gomer in the “Table of Nations” (Gen 10:2–3) and mentioned as providing part of the forces of Gog (Ezek 38:6). The Cimmerians, as they are called in Classical literature, lived on the steppes of Russia. Josephus wrongly equates the Gomerians with the Celtic Galatians (Ant 1.123). Homer indicates that the Cimmerians were from a foggy land possibly located along the northern shore of the Black Sea on the Crimean peninsula (Od. 11.13–19; cf. Strabo 7.4.3).
There is much debate over the history of the Cimmerians prior to the 8th century B.C. It is thought that they occupied the steppes north of the Caucasus Mountains from the 18th to the 13th century B.C. Then it is likely that they moved south to the area of the Caucasus mountain range and resided there from the 13th to the 8th century B.C. The Cimmerians were pushed south from the Ukraine region of Russia by the Scythians who, in turn, were being pressed westward by other peoples from farther east.
Several cuneiform texts from the late 8th to the early 7th centuries B.C. record Cimmerian conflicts with Urartu and the Assyrians. The Cimmerians attacked the Urartians twice, once during the reign of Rusa I, king of Urartu (734–714 B.C.) and a second time in 707 B.C. These attacks weakened the Urartians and allowed the Cimmerians to move farther west into eastern Turkey. The threat of the Cimmerians worried the Assyrians and an elderly Sargon II (722–705 B.C.) led an attack against them during his campaign in Tabal. In 679 B.C. Esarhaddon managed to defeat them near Tabal.
The conflict with the Assyrians caused most of the Cimmerians to move further west to central Anatolia. There they attacked Sinope, a Greek colony located along the shore of the Black Sea. In ca. 676 B.C. they destroyed Gordion, the capital of the Phrygian kingdom and home of the legendary King Midas. Strabo records that Midas, distraught over the defeat, committed suicide by drinking bull’s blood (Strabo 1.61).
The Cimmerians led three attacks against Gyges, king of the Lydians, the first being between 668 and 665 B.C. It was after this first attack that Gyges pleaded for military aid from the Assyrians. The second Cimmerian attack against Lydia came in 657 B.C. The death of Gyges and the fall of Sardis, the Lydian capital city, came as a result of the third and final Cimmerian attack. The Cimmerians pushed on into Ionia and attacked Smyrna, Magnesia, and Ephesus.
The Cimmerians, under the leadership of Lygdamis (Strabo 1.61; known as Tugdamme in cuneiform sources), then attacked Cilicia in southeastern Turkey. The Assyrian king Ashurbanipal (668–631 B.C.), reportedly killed Tugdamme in battle. Shandakshatru, the son of Tugdamme, then submitted to Assyrian authority and the Cimmerians were no longer an independent entity. The name Gimmiraia, however, survives in the Akkadian portion of the Behistun inscription. Cappadocia, later called Gomir by the Armenians, may have been the home of some Cimmerians after their submission to the Assyrians.

ASHKENAZ [I, 490] [Heb }as¥ke∑naœz אַשְׁכְנׇז; }as¥kanaz אַשְׁכַנַז]. First “descendant” of Gomer who is the first “offspring” of Japheth in the Table of Nations (Gen 10:2–3). In Jer 51:27, Ashkenaz appears—along with Ararat and Minni—as a kingdom called upon to oppose Babylon. The name is identified with the neo-Assyrian Ishkuza (is¥-ku-za-a-a; cf. Parpola AOAT 6: 178), who appeared between the Black and Caspian Seas in the 8th and 7th centuries B.C., driving out the Cimmerians (cf. GOMER; this association is reflected in Genesis 10) and threatening the Assyrians. For Herodotus, these people came to be called the Scythians. The correspondence of the consonants in Ashkenaz, Ishkuza, and Scythian is obvious; although the reason for the nun in the biblical name is not clear (Westermann Genesis 1–11 BK, p. 506; Wenham Genesis 1–15 WBC pp. 217–18). The use of a prosthetic }alef in the Sem forms may suggest an initial consonant cluster in the name which was unacceptable to Sem.
Although cultural associations reach back into the 3d and 2nd millennia B.C., present archaeological evidence for a distinctive Scythian culture begins in the 7th century B.C., especially at Nemirov Gorodische, an agricultural settlement between Odessa and Kiev (Yamauchi 1976: 242; 1982: 63–85). Possible portrayals of Scythians appear on 9th century reliefs of Ashurnasirpal II, but the first neo-Assyrian mention of the Ishkuza occurs during the time of Sargon II in the 8th century B.C. Driving back the Cimmerians, the Scythians were able to push S to dominate “Asia” (E Turkey) and Media in the latter part of the 7th century B.C. (Millard 1979). About this time, a Scythian raid against Egypt was stopped by Psammetichus I (Hdt. 1.105). For the later history of the Scythians and the question of their identification with the enemy from the N mentioned in the first part of Jeremiah, see SCYTHIANS.


Supposedly some of the Ashkenazi Jews were converts, but it's possible that they were Northern Tribes associating with Judah ( see Eze 37:15-28)

Many Jews who were in Russia came back to Israel since the state was founded in 48. There are Israelites in China and India, Afghanistan, etc. another words all the places that Israel was scattered seem to be the places that will enter into judgement with God in the latter days.

Joel 3:2 I will agather all the nations
And bring them down to the valley of Jehoshaphat. Then I will center into judgment with them there On behalf of My people and My inheritance, Israel, Whom they have dscattered among the nations; And they have divided up My land.

If we read Ezekiel 38-39 in the context of Ezekiel 37 we find some interesting elements. Ezekiel 37 is the chapter of Israel's restoration. It starts out talking about a physical restoration after the image of dry bones, and proceeds to talk about a spiritual restoration where God will put His Spirit in the whole house of Israel and "raise it from the dead". This calls to mind some of the verses in Romans 11.

As we go to the second half of the chapter, which I share often on this blog, we see an additional piece of information about the two sticks, or two branches if you will, calling to mind imagery from Zech 4. These two sticks are identified clearly as the two houses of Israel. Zech 11 speaks specifically of the union between Judah and Israel being broken. First the covenant was broken because of sin, then the union.

What we know historically was that the House of Israel in several waves was taken into Assyria, which would be the Persian Empire. From here we know that the Assyrians divided and scattered the House of Israel/Northern Kingdom. This was roughly 700-800 years before Yeshua. We also know based on the prophecies of Hosea, they did not come back but will at a future date..

The Babylonian exile was in 536 b.c. and Judah did come back at least in part, and never lost her identity entirely although there are some from Judah today who don't know who they are either.

The historian Josephus talks about this grouping of nations in Eze 38-39 as referring to the Scythians.

This would be the region of Northern Israel's exile.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scythians

Since God will enter into judgement with the nations who scattered His people,

Ezek. 39:22 “And the house of Israel will know that I am the LORD their God from that day onward.
Ezek. 39:23 “The nations will know that the house of Israel went into exile for their iniquity because they acted treacherously against Me, and I hid My face from them; so I gave them into the hand of their adversaries, and all of them fell by the sword.

God will restore the Northern Kingdom/House of Israel in the latter days:

Ezek. 39:24 “aAccording to their uncleanness and according to their transgressions I dealt with them, and I hid My face from them.”’”
Ezek. 39:25 ¶ Therefore thus says the Lord GOD, “Now I will restore the fortunes of Jacob and have mercy on the whole house of Israel; and I will be jealous for My holy name.

When we see the expression "whole house of Israel" we know God is talking about all the tribes, not just the Southern Kingdom of Judah.

Now, Israel did not stay put in Assyria. Historically speaking the Northern Kingdom was scattered and displaced to the point where they became unrecognizable to themselves. God will be faithful to bring back all the tribes and identify them once again. We know this from the Millennial Temple in Eze 48-49 and from the book of Revelations where first the 144, 000 are identified and the names on the doors of the new Jerusalem are the tribes of Israel, so if you want to go in you must enter by a gate with the name of one of these tribes:

Rev. 21:12 1It had a great and high wall, with twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels; and names were written on them, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the sons of Israel.

Most people think it's "the church" that goes in, but actually there is no "church gate" if you read carefully.

God says He will bring back scattered Israel from the four corners of the earth, but He says He will come into judgement with those nations who scattered her in Joel.

This war of Eze 38-39 seems to be referring to that. It looks like the descendants of Japeth, as well as Cush and other peoples, are part of this contingent of nations who scattered Israel. It corresponds with Chapter 20 of Revelations which is after the millennial reign.

The historian Jospehus said the tribes of Israel were beyond a mythical river Sambyton..

If we look at the history of the Scythians, there are interesting implications of what may have happened to the Northern Israel tribes. Eventually these tribes went all over the earth, because God says they would be scattered to the four corners of the earth:

Is. 11:12 And He will lift up a standard for the nations And assemble the banished ones of Israel,
And will gather the dispersed of Judah From the four corners of the earth.

Ezek. 34:12 “As a shepherd cares for his herd in the day when he is among his scattered sheep, so I will care for My sheep and will deliver them from all the places to which they were scattered on a cloudy and gloomy day.


ezek. 39:27-29 “When I abring them back from the peoples and gather them from the lands of their enemies, then I shall be sanctified through them in the sight of the many nations. “Then they will know that I am the LORD their God because I made them go into exile among the nations, and then gathered them again to their own land; and I will leave none of them there any longer. “I will not hide My face from them any longer, for I will have apoured out My Spirit on the house of Israel,” declares the Lord GOD.

This is an amazing prophecy. The nations who have scattered Israel will be forced to give up Israel and they will be judged for coming against Israel. israel will be cleansed from her sin and the nations will know who God really is, the God of Israel. Those nations who scattered Israel are descendants of Japeth and Cush.

God's promise to Abraham:

Gen. 22:17 indeed I will greatly bless you, and I will greatly multiply your seed as the stars of the heavens and as bthe sand which is on the seashore; and cyour seed shall possess the gate of their enemies.

I won't post all of Psalm 106, but it explains how the seed of Israel was scattered into the nations:

Psa. 106:27 And that He would cast their seed among the nations And scatter them in the lands.

Is. 27:12 In that day the LORD will start His threshing from the flowing stream of the Euphrates to the brook of Egypt, and you will be gathered up one by one, O sons of Israel.

When we can see this theme in the Bible, we can see how God comes into judgement with the nations who do not attach themselves to Him and His people, and who have scattered and come against His people, even though He sovereignly permitted this.

One very important point is that we should not spiritualize God's literal promises away. If God said He would restore Israel, He will do it and in fact is doing it today. Replacement theology says God is done with Israel and is now dealing with the church. There are too many passages that are so clear right up to the book of Revelations indicating that God has never stopped dealing with ALL Israel, Judah and the House of Israel.
 
Since UFOs are back, I'll paste an older post which I think expresses my humble opinion: years ago Oprah had a group of alien abductees on her program, at least one of them, a woman whose name I forget, related how frightening her encounters were. When we read Whitley’s COMMUNION or watch FIRE IN THE SKY, the tenor is always evil, always bizarre and creepy. Somehow the participants seem to come away with an unexplained pleasure in their experiences. What is that? All these people seem to get weirder and weirder. “In God is no darkness at all.” I chose the “Lily of the valley,” the “Light of Life,” the Rose of “Sharon.” I chose to “behold the beauty of the Lord.”
 
Hi Jaclyn.

I think on the same lines as you. When I was a little girl here in OZ. I saw lights on the horizon as did my mother many yrs ago. It took my fascination and still did up to a few weeks ago. "but as your thoughts have wondered if perhaps they are holographic", I’m with you on this one.

I see deception from the Governments and NASA with project blue beam and other agencies world wide. On the news a few months ago there was a presentation of Prince Charles on stage only it was a hologram. I also wonder if all the Chemtrails is another part of the puzzle to bring it all together For when the Antichrist comes into power ..


http://educate-yourself.org/cn/projectbluebeam25jul05.shtml

www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkpT-gSSS54

http://www.rb59.com/prophecy-news/

You might know these sites already but there is more and more UFO sightings then ever before.
 
JenJen, it's funny you mention project blue beam, I just learned about it a couple of weeks ago and was blown away. I tend to think we are seeing governmental, top secret technology and it's purpose is very evil.

By the way, how is life in Australia? My daughter is about to marry and Aussie citizen and will be living there for a couple of years. Nowadays we are interested in anything "Australian".
 
PAGING JOYCE:

Wondering what you can tell me about these apparent Messianic congregations and/or projects:

1. Congregation B'rith Hadoshah
http://www.brithhadoshah.org

2. Messianic Jewish Israel Fund"

3. http://www.mjaa.org/ (Messianic Jewish Alliance of America)

Thanks!
Constance
 
Dear Anon 1:22,
Thanks for the info. It makes me glad that I've never been with A_L and I've warned my family & friends who are that they should consider an alternative server.

By His Grace,
-SV
 
I use AOL and I must say that it is not really by choice, but I am thankful to even have access to the internet.

Begs the question.

If someone tried to convict you of being a Christian would there be enough evidence to convict you?

I am not afraid of what man can do to me and like Daniel, My God will protect me and even if he does not rescue me from danger and persecution I will not bow down and worship the gods of this world.

So we just continue to speak truth. Keep working while there is light because night is coming when no man can work.

I am enjoying this blog.

Thanks for everyones input.
Valerie
Knoxville, TN
 
Consolidation seems to be the mantra nowadays, I think of John Lenon's song, "Imagine". Imagine no religion, imagine there's no God, I don't know all the words but I know it ends with the ultimate goal......"and the world will be as one".
***********************************

The full article can be read here. http://watchmannewsletter.typepad.com/news/

Foundations join forces with Alliance of Civilizations
Alliance of Civilizations (Link) (March 21, 2009)

On 20-21 February, a group of Foundations met in Marrakech to discuss the creation of the UNAOC International Network of Foundations. The purpose of this meeting, generously hosted by the Guerrand-Hermes Foundation for Peace, was to bring together a number of heads and representatives of foundations from all over the world to discuss recent trends and developments in the work done on intercultural dialogue, cooperation and diversity promotion; and to have final discussions on the creation of an international network of foundations involved in these themes. Around fifteen Foundations took part in the Marrakech meeting.

The Alliance of Civilizations INF aims to bring together foundations which work to build and cooperation among religions, cultures and peoples. It promotes knowledge exchange, collaboration and advocacy. By bringing together public, private and corporate foundations and individual philanthropists around the world, INF encourages collaboration among complementary initiatives, especially across regions.

INF will begin by focusing on the following areas, as identified by foundations around the world in the first set of Alliance's INF meetings: education, media, the arts, intercultural and interfaith dialogue, youth leadership, and conversations on religious and political issues.
 
To Anonymous (1:27 PM):
Re: "If someone tried to convict you of being a Christian would there be enough evidence to convict you?"


The issue won't be about "convicting" someone on his/her religious affiliation, but rather about WHO will be willing to accept or reject taking the "mark" in their right hand or on their forehead. Those refusing to take this mark will be unable to buy or sell anything.
 
That 3:22 PM message is directed to Valerie. (Sorry, I just noticed your name).
 
FYI: UFOs are a great DECEPTION and are demonic in nature.
 
Here is some encouraging news for a change.

The following article relates to the last thread but I wanted to make sure everyone got a chance to see it.

MassResistance PLAYS PIVOTAL ROLE IN HELPING STOP "CIVIL UNIONS" BILL IN HAWAII SENATE

Was homosexual lobby's strategy for eventual "gay marriage"

March 13, 2009


MassResistance played a pivotal role in helping stop a major "civil unions" bill in the Hawaii Legislature, according to sources on both sides of the issue.

At 9:00 a.m. on February 24, the Judiciary and Operations Committee of the Hawaii Legislature convened a public hearing on Bill #444 which would legalize homosexual civil unions in that state. It was a marathon 18-hour session with over 1400 people testifying that finally ended at 3:30 a.m. the following morning!

According to observers, a number of the attendees had copies of the MassResistance pamphlet "What Same-Sex Marriage has done to Massachusetts", and much of the testimony came from it. All of the committee members had been given copies, and one of the Senators used information from it in his discussions with other members at the hearing.

At 3:30 a.m. when the hearing ended, the committee immediately took a vote. It was a 3-3 tie - and thus the bill got killed in committee! A VICTORY!

Although the bill could be brought back to life by a 1/3 vote of the full Senate (9 members), at this time both sides agree that's unlikely. However, MassResistance has been working with Senate staff and has also had strategy discussions with one Senator to keep that from happening. We have also been working with activists, researchers, and others in Hawaii.

Backlash by homosexual lobby - the usual lies and deception
The success of MassResistance in Hawaii has enraged the homosexual lobby. They acknowledge that we've been effective, and they are fighting back by trying to discredit our report. They are making absurd claims that the facts we present are not true. They are telling Hawaii legislators, for example, that homosexual story books really aren't being read to kids in Massachusetts schools - that MassResistance is just making that up. (Tell that to David Parker!) By the way, they tried that same tacic in California.
...read entire article...

http://www.massresistance
.org/docs/gen/09a/
hawaii/index.html

Here is the homosexual "story book" that IS BEING READ TO KIDS IN MASSACHUSETTS PUBLIC SCHOOLS!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_&_King
 
All,
I have switched to ixquick.com as a search engine. Google is gathering way too much information on users.

Indy
 
After reading the response from another truly anonymous poster, maybe I should clarify what I am trying to say.

Yes, eventually there will be no place to hide and as Christians we will be singled out. I wasn't refering to the Mark of the Beast, only that fighting for privacy is like trying to beat death. Yes, we are being watched by the powers that be both human and demonic. The god of this world has been given control of this world system, but we are not of this world. Soon our momentary light affliction will be over, but those who resist the truth will be destroyed.


Anyone out there with an Alex Jones mentality that says prepare for the worst, fight for your rights, stock up on food and water so you can hold out is acting foolish. There will be no way to beat the system, so to speak ,and that is why we are looking for a better city whose architect and builder is God.

My point was that more and more those who stand for the truth are going to stand out and suffer persecution and I believe this will happen before the Mark of the Beast is implimented.

Good day to all,
Valerie
 
From Infowars (3/23/09):

NSC advisor Jones: “I take my daily orders from Dr. Kissinger”

Last week a caller to the Alex Jones Show mentioned a speech transcript posted on the CFR website where U.S. National Security Adviser Jones declared the following:

Thank you for that wonderful tribute to Henry Kissinger yesterday. Congratulations. As the most recent National Security Advisor of the United States, I take my daily orders from Dr. Kissinger, filtered down through General Brent Scowcroft and Sandy Berger, who is also here. We have a chain of command in the National Security Council that exists today.

Jones made the remark at the 45th Munich Conference on Security Policy at the Hotel Bayerischer Hof on February 8, 2009.

Mr. Jones is basically telling us the National Security Council is run by Henry Kissinger. The NSC is the principal forum used by Obama for considering national security and foreign policy matters. Biden, Clinton, Geithner, Gates, Mullen, Emanuel, Summers, and others are listed as participants, but not Henry Kissinger.

In 2006, the Associated Press reported that Kissinger advised Bush and Cheney, a fact included in Bob Woodward’s book “State of Denial.”

In other words, the Bush and Obama administrations — never mind the “change” rhetoric — receive the same advice (instructions) from the ruling elite.

Earlier this year, Kissinger went on the floor of the stock market to declare Obama had a chance to create a New World Order.

Said Kissinger:

He can give a new impetus to American Foreign policy, partly because the perception of him is so extraordinary around the world. I think his task will be to develop an overall strategy for America in this period when really a New World Order can be created — it’s a great opportunity, it isn’t just a crisis.

Kissinger — along with David Rockefeller, Paul Arthur Allaire, and Richard Holbrooke — directs the American Friends of Bilderberg. He is also connected to the globalist Aspen Institute, the Committee of 300, the Trilateral Commission, and sits on the advisory board of JP Morgan Chase.

“Kissinger has been patiently waiting since at least 1973 for his New World Order egg to hatch,” notes the August Review.

Kissinger earlier praised Obama’s picks for economic recovery, and why not?

Obama picked Trilateral Commission wonder boy Timothy Geithner to be Secretary of the Treasury. The rest of the team are protégés of Robert Rubin, also a Trilateral and former Treasury Secretary under Clinton.

Obama’s top foreign policy advisor has been Zbigniew Brzezinski, the co-founder of the Trilateral Commission with David Rockefeller.

Finally, before Obama was elected, Kissinger went on the Charlie Rose Show and talked about the New World Order:

But never mind. It’s all a crazy conspiracy theory, never mind another indication that the one-worlders control the president, this time admitted by top NSC honcho James Jones, who just so happens to be a member if the Trilateral Commission.
 
Constance,
I personally do not agree with the MJAA's position on who is Israel, but there are many things I would agree with them on quite a few things. It's an old organization but from what I know they do not recognize the fact that much of Israel is scattered in the nations and unrecognizable as Israel, so they would say that the Jews are "all Israel".

This position cannot be supported based on clear Scriptural statements about the Northern Kingdom being "mixed with the Gentiles nations" and unrecognizable as Israel, not to mention promises of a future restoration. ( Eze 37:15-28 being just one of many examples).

From their mission statement, they talk about "Jewish holidays" which I would prefer to call "Biblical holidays". By saying these holidays are only for Jews, they maintain the wall of separation that they claim has been brought down. We are one assembly, so there should not be a distinction. The wall of separation was a wall in Second Temple Judaism used to keep Gentiles separated if they had not gone through ritual conversion.

Orthodox Jews recognize that Northern Kingdom is scattered in the nations and will be reunited to Judah ( the Jews) one day, so they do understand this but also refer to Northern tribes as "Jews" which they were NEVER called in the Bible.

I don't want to knock them as an organization because like other Messianic organizations they are instrumental in restoring Hebrew roots of the faith. Many different organizations are working towards this end, all from slightly different perspectives.

Congregation Brith Hadosha seems to hold to the same views as MJAA, so I would have similar comments about it but am not familiar with it.

The MJIF is helping Messianics in Israel, from what I can see on their site. This is a good thing because many Christians for example support Israel, but not the believers. Messianic believers have a lot of difficulties economically and otherwise in Israel and we should always support the body first. These are our brothers and sisters, so I think it's a good thing to support them. . I cannot vouch for this particular ministry, personally, but the general idea behind it seems good to me. Too often people support the Jews who are not believers only and forget about their brothers and sisters in Yeshua. I do think it's good to help Jews who are not believers too, but I see a lot of Christian Zionist organizations who support the secular gov't which is not always worthy of support. This is a common complaint of Messianics in the Land.

I know many different kinds of Messianics who I consider my brothers and sisters, just as I consider many Christian believers my brothers and sisters. We may not agree on some of the finer theological points, but we are all in different parts of our journey and if someone is born-again we are part of the the body.

I am saddened to see that many Messianic brothers and sisters do not acknowledge the fact that their brother Joseph ( Ephraim/10 tribes) are still "in the nations and are being called out in the Last Days and will receive anew their tribal identities. This is changing somewhat and I see more Jewish believers who are willing to admit that the Jews are not the whole family.

Sorry I can't be more helpful about those specific organizations, but I hope that helps.

Joyce
 
Thank you, Mrs. Cumbey, for your ministry.
Watch and pray!
Bro. Jeff
 
I have always maintained it is better to stand on the streets corner and be seen and heard, rather thian try to find a place to duck and cover. It is harder to get rid of the one on the street corner than the one already hiding.
Here I am - unapolgetically standing up fully for the gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ and against the pwoers of dearkness and thier overlord.
Hebrews 13:6
"so that we may boldly say, the Lod is my helper, I will not fear, what can man do to me?"
I love it when am threatened with enternal bliss in the evrlasting presence of the Lord God.

DouginMI
 
How can you be so sure UFO's are demonic or a deception? I believe they are, but I have nothing to base this on, other than the fact that ufology has a lot in common with new ageism. I have to admit I'm an avid watcher of "UFO Hunters" and wonder what these people have been drinking. Never in all my life have I seen a UFO or any other paranormal activity.

I do sometimes wonder if the prophet Elijah was swept up by a UFO. That would explain a lot.
 
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
 
http://tinyurl.com/5qetmr


EU must keep Sunday says Catholic Church

The Catholic Church wants Sunday observance enshrined in EU law. The European Parliament is debating changes to its Working Time Directive. The Vatican wants a clause in this law that would force every citizen in the European Union to rest on Sunday.

A hideously socialist piece of legislation, the Working Time Directive currently makes it illegal for those working, with some exceptions, in the EU to work for more than 48 hours a week. Workers in the UK are currently allowed to opt out of its provisions.

The bill is being revised. During the second reading, in October, seven Members of the European Parliament tabled an amendment saying that the minimum rest period “shall in principle include Sunday.” The Brussels-based Commission of the Bishops’ Conferences of the European Community (comece) agrees, recommending the directive should say “the minimal weekly rest must include Sunday.”

The amendment stated, “The likelihood of sickness in companies that require staff to work on Sundays is greater than in companies that do not require staff to work on Sundays. The health of workers depends, among other factors, on their opportunities to reconcile work and family life, to establish and maintain social ties and to pursue their spiritual needs. Sunday, as the traditional weekly rest day, contributes to these objectives more than any other day of the week.”

The amendment never went to vote, drawing criticism from Catholic bishops across Europe. Piotr Mazurkiewicz, secretary general of comece, was incensed. The protection of Sunday, he said, “is a cornerstone of the European social model and an issue of central importance for workers and their families.”

The Working Time Directive will be discussed once more in December, and Europe’s Catholic bishops want this issue brought up.

The pope has been a strong advocate of the revival of Sunday keeping. “Without Sunday [worship] we cannot live!” Pope Benedict xvi declared during a mass on September 9 last year, stating that it was a “necessity” for all people.

The prospect of a European government so powerful that it could declare one specific day a day of rest is a frightening one. This would be an EU willing and able to enforce lifestyle changes on its subjects, whether they liked it or not. It would be a Europe that enforced a state religion—Catholicism. The enforcement of Sunday worship will be the mark of a powerful, Vatican-allied, European superpower.

For more information, see our article “The Pope Trumpets Sunday” •
 
Joyce, concerning the other ten tribes of Israel, I've been doing some googling on this. Some info is contradictory, but I am especially impressed with the evidence that almost all Irish were Hebrews before Christ's time. There were several waves of immigration, the Milesian, the Scoti, and so forth, and all were either of Judah or of Dan or another tribe. The twin sons of Judah, Perez and Zarah, are described as fathering nations, with Perez being in the Messianic bloodline and Zarah having parted from Moses before the Exodus, going to Crete, Spain, and finally Ireland, while another tribe (I am not clear as to which) went to Scythia and from there again migrated to Spain and Ireland. Later the Celts came in. As I am half Irish from the ancient Munster and Ormond areas of Southern Ireland, this interests me. Apparently these S. Irish folk had Christianity long before Patrick, usually of a type where a village grew up around an abbey; the abbots were often married. They had a long tradition of written and oral history which preserved the knowledge of their wanderings.

Mariel
 
Rude poster at 8:31,

The G-20 news was posted in the last thread! If Drudge is just now getting to it, then they are behind.
 
Mariel,
Some of what you are describing sounds like British-Israelism. I do not go along with British-Israelism. there are some elements of what I said that could sound like British-Iraelism, but there are many differences. I don't doubt that there could be Israelites in Ireland, as well as every other nation on earth because God said they would be gathered from the four corners of the earth.

British Israelism says that it is mainly British Empire and that the sceptre stayed in the British Royal family and Jeremiah went to Ireland and a lot of other claims that cannot be supported.

Some legends in Ireland have grown up around this and around Jeremiah's.

British Israelism has some racist tendencies and says the tribes are only in the West. That's not what I'm saying, and I don't think that Jeremiah went to Ireland either.

I don't believe he brought Zedekiah's daughter there and that the bloodline of David was continue this way. The sceptre will never depart from Judah is fulfilled by Yeshua Himself.

So, while some of what British -israelism says might resemble what I am saying because the scattering part did happen, the other things I do not go along with at all.

Scripture does say that Israel was divided into 2 parts and the Northern Tribes were scattered and will be gathered at the end of time. I believe through the preaching of the gospel to all the nations of the earth they are saved and will be identified by God at a later date. There is nothing in Scripture that indicates that they will try to find their identity.

That doesn't mean there might not be some Irish with Israelite roots though. In fact I know some who do.


Joyce
 
Could this be a prelude to global currency. Look at this IHT article:

http://tinyurl.com/cqnerx

Joyce
 
Someone sent this:

"The pope has been a strong advocate of the revival of Sunday keeping. “Without Sunday [worship] we cannot live!” Pope Benedict xvi declared during a mass on September 9 last year, stating that it was a “necessity” for all people."

The Bible speaks of the Shabbat over 90 times, not all are the weekly Shabbat because there are other shabbats, but most are. Nowhere in the Bible are we commanded to keep Sunday.

It's the fourth commandment to which Yeshua said, "if anyone annuls the least of these commandments they shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven".

The Sabbath started from the creation, so it is not "jewish" although Jews have kept it for thousands of years.

Yeshua said Sabbath was made for man. If it was made for us why would we want to cancel it.

Yeshua is our Sabbath rest so when we keep it, it's about Him.

It's for the foreigner:

Is. 56:6 ¶ “Also the foreigners who join themselves to the LORD, To minister to Him, and to love the name of the LORD, To be His servants, every one who keeps from profaning the sabbath
And holds fast My covenant;

Yeshua healed people on the Sabbath. It was the day He displayed His power very often.

After Yeshua's death the disciples were still following the Sabbath:

Acts 16:13 And on athe Sabbath day we went outside the gate to a riverside, where we were supposing that there would be a place of prayer; and we sat down and began speaking to the women who had assembled.

Sabbath literally means to cease. If Yeshua paid for our sins in full, we really can cease from our own labors. Sabbath is a great reminded or this truth.

The reason given for Sunday is a Sunday resurrection, but first of all there are some question marks around Sunday morning resurrection, and secondly the Bible NEVER tells us to celebrate the Sunday.

This was passed down from Catholicism to Protestantism and Catholic theologians agree that they don't do it because of Scripture, but because of tradition.

Here are some Catholic quotes about this:

http://tiny.cc/b7061
Joyce
 
God bless you, DouginMI (6:08 PM)!!!
 
I'm not always in agreement with this fellow, but todays' post is interesting:

http://euro-med.dk/?cat=5

Some of his views on Jews in the past have been off base, but today's commentary is interesting.

Joyce
 
One more interesting link from Ander's blog on Religion and Global Governance:

http://tinyurl.com/cvv3h8

..in case you miss it.
Joyce
 
Joyce,

I asked about the Messianic congregations and organizations I did because I reviewed the 990 report of Three Swallows (Paul N. Temple) Foundation. All were recipients of its bounty. I am trying to ascertain why he might have been interested in them.

Constance
 
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
 
From The Sunday TimesMarch 22, 2009
(on Drudge Report)
UK population must fall to 30m, says PorrittJonathan Leake and Brendan Montague
JONATHON PORRITT, one of Gordon Brown’s leading green advisers, is to warn that Britain must drastically reduce its population if it is to build a sustainable society.

Porritt’s call will come at this week’s annual conference of the Optimum Population Trust (OPT), of which he is patron.

The trust will release research suggesting UK population must be cut to 30m if the country wants to feed itself sustainably.

Porritt said: “Population growth, plus economic growth, is putting the world under terrible pressure.
 
http://tinyurl.com/c95dpm

China calls for new global currency

China is calling for a new global currency to replace the dominant dollar, showing a growing assertiveness on revamping the world economy ahead of next week's London summit on the financial crisis.

The surprise proposal by Beijing's central bank governor reflects unease about its vast holdings of U.S. government bonds and adds to Chinese pressure to overhaul a global financial system dominated by the dollar and Western governments.

The world economic crisis shows the "inherent vulnerabilities and systemic risks in the existing international monetary system," Gov. Zhou Xiaochuan said in an essay released Monday by the bank. He recommended creating a currency made up a basket of global currencies and controlled by the International Monetary Fund and said it would help "to achieve the objective of safeguarding global economic and financial stability."
 
China and Russia are calling for a new global currancy.

http://tinyurl.com/cdu44n

"Most recent, about a week ago, the top Russian bank is also pushing for a new global reserve currency."

They seem to be joining forces. Economic and military?


Moscow
http://www.themoscowtimes.com
/article/600/42/375364.htm
 
Dear Constance,
I think that a little moderating is in order.
Cheap Wow Gold, and Rude Poster at 8:31 have been less than helpful in their contribution.

IMHO.

By His Grace,
-SV
 
Constance,
Hmmm. That's very interesting. Yes, I wonder too. If you find out let me know. I'll do some digging too when I have some free time. I'm pretty busy at the moment, but would like to look into that when I have a few seconds to breath.

Off the top of my head the one thing that comes to mind is that if the goal is to infiltrate organizations with believers, they will certainly not leave out Messianic ones. Why not start with one of the ones that has been in existence for a while?

Joyce
 
Joyce, you don't have to do any digging. Just ask other family members, like your husband what they know.
 
I know presstv news is very pro islam. but you gotta look from their side too.

http://www.presstv.ir/sections.aspx?sectionid=3510203


From the White House:
Another 1 trillion dollar money flush to buy up toxic assets, but now their very confident

US and EU allies seeks plan to create a new chief exec role to bypass Afghan president

Democratic congresswoman Ellen Tauscher, says an Iranian missile 'threat' has been exaggerted as the white house moves to reconsider a defense shield in Europe

Janet Napolitano
US Homeland Security Secretary says the erection of a wall on Mexico border could not stop drugs and violence from spilling over to the US. She said the United States was developing "a whole inventory" of other actions, including using more law enforcement personnel, and enhancing security in a border area which is a traditional battleground for rival drug cartels.
( What??? Law enforcement, like ones who went to jail? Enhancing security? They haven't done that yet? And best, when did it become a traditional( emplys ancient) battleground

Iran blames Israel for Lebanon blast.

Slim majority of US Jews want war on Iran:

Russia says no sign iran has military objective, and Iran not planning to build A-bomb

EU doubles its emergency fund

Israel's lunatic fringe rejects Obama's plans

Extremists stir bloody clashes in Israel

Yemen sentences 'Mossad spy' to death
A Yemeni court sentences an activist to death and hands jail sentences to two others persons who worked for Israeli intelligence services.


Syria: War with Israel still on the go

'Israel should evacuate Arab land'

'Israel to return Golan Heights'

Putin threatens to review EU ties

Labor party to join Netanyahu government

Filipino students protest to get US out of filipines.

Yvonne
 
This is definitly a get the public used to the idea.thing.

Tuesday, March 24, 2009 Schenectady mayor considers options, martial law over police woes
Updated: 03/19/2009 06:07 AM
By: Steve Ference

SCHENECTADY, N.Y. -- Schenectady Police Chief Mark Chaires said, "This is unprecedented - all these officers getting in trouble at the same time for all these different reasons.



Five Schenectady police officers recently accused of everything from driving drunk to beating up a man are leading city officials to look at taking drastic action to fix a department tainted by the few who may have acted illegally, like Darren Lawrence and Michael Brown who are accused of driving while intoxicated.



Chief Chaires said, "Those two officers, we're definitely going to seek termination, and we're not ruling it out with any of the officers who are out there.




Mayor considers options, martial law over police woes
After a number of scandals have sent Schenectady officials scrambling to clean up the police department, there are now a number of options being discussed. They include disbanding the department, restarting with a new county-wide police force, or even bringing in the National Guard. Our Steve Ference sat down with the police chief and mayor to find out more about the options - and how likely it is that something like martial law could be pursued.

Police Chief Mark Chaires told us you basically have to fire yourself - essentially a million dollar fine in lost benefits over a lifetime.



Still, Schenectady Mayor Brian Stratton said, "We believe there are five officers now who could face possible termination."



But it's not just the threat of termination. Mayor Stratton told us he's looking at all options, including disbanding the police department - basically starting over.



"It's something we're certainly looking into. I think the public has had it up to here," said the mayor.



Currently, officials are reviewing the legal options and planning to present a full report in early April - options like a consolidated county-wide police force or bringing in the State Police.



The mayor said there is another option - and that would be declaring martial law. The governor would have to declare it and then the National Guard would come in. The mayor said it's more for a transition to a new police force if that were to happen.



He said, "It may be that as a stopgap measure, that you would need military forces - State Police, National Guard."



Mayor Stratton said the temporary measure would last until the new police force took over.



Schenectady's Corporation Counsel John Van Norden said, "If you abolish the police department you still have a need - not an obligation - but a need to police the community. You would need something in transition. Declaring martial law would be one way to bridge the gap."



"It's a contrived scenario," said the mayor. "But it's not beyond the realm of possibilities if you go that particular route."



Chief Chaires said, "When I think of martial law, I think of rioting. I think of Watts riots and things like that. I haven't seen anything that rises to that level. I was a little surprised to hear that."



But whether the National Guard needs to be called in or not, we'll take a more-in-depth look on Thursday at the county-wide and State Police options, as officials try to deal with an unprecedented situation in unprecedented ways.
Yvonne
 
There is an update on Carrie Tomko's condition at her blog. Her daughter put it up. Unfortunately it is good news. Let her know our thoughts are with her and are prayers are going to God to help her.
 
Three cheers for Catholic pro-lifers who are willing to do a lot more than grumble about Obama being asked to speak at Notre Dame. Over 90,000 signatures on a petition against it already.

http://tinyurl.com/c2gz7f
 
Sorry for the typing error. As anyone going over to Carrie's blog is finding out, it is not good news which is what I meant to write.
 
Constance
after some reseach I found that the brith hadoshah messianic is served by Rabbi Lowinger, He is also NE Regional Director and Serves the Exec Comm of the Messianic Jewish Alliance of America. He is on Steering Comm of the IAMCS and Holds an Ordination with IAMCS, He is a board member and officer of the Resource center for Jewish Ministry in Cinn. OH and serves on the Board of the Messianic Times Newspaper
at his site was links to Sid Roth websight and additional links to Curt and Christie Landry who is CEO of the House of David Inc and CEO of My Olive Tree US
Further info on the Messianic Times Newspaper in Canada are following:
It is the belief of most of these churches that the conversion of Jews is one of the prerequisite conditions needed to bring about the Second Coming of Jesus. With the millennium around the corner, many of these groups feel that they are living in the end times and that the Messiah will be here soon. This millennial belief is what some sociologists refer to as PMS, or "pre-millennial syndrome". Others have dubbed it "millennium madness". This syndrome manifests as a great sense of urgency amongst some fundamentalist Christian churches to convert Jews as quickly as possible because the millennium draws near, but the Jewish community has yet to "repent" and to join the ranks of Christianity. This spiritual emergency to convert the Jews has led to a dramatic increase in deceptive and aggressive proselytizing activity in 1998, which threatens to be even greater in 1999.

The two most commonly reported publications were the Messianic Times and an antisemitic flyer called the Last Call International,
B’nai Brith received dozens of calls from members of Jewish communities who were outraged at being targets of the aggressive dissemination of this publication in their neighborhoods. This activity of specifically targeting the new Russian Jewish immigrant community is particularly insidious. Many Jews from the former Soviet Union lack concrete Jewish education that was prohibited during the Communist era, and they are ill-prepared to counter the arguments and appeal of the missionaries, particularly those disguising themselves as practising Jews.

What started off as one complaint at the League quickly mushroomed. The pamphlet was distributed in a senior citizens home with primarily Jewish residents, some of whom were Holocaust survivors. The Last Call International states that the Holocaust will happen again if the Jews do not repent: “A mighty persecution is coming again, Jews are going to be taken into Concentration Camps...God is showing these things before it happens so we can turn up to him and repent...” reads the unsolicited message.
This "millennium madness". is the cornerstone of the webmaster.com on all of these sights run by Keven Geoffrey serv.
IAMCS-about us page shows Hope to establish a worldwide PRAYER FELLOWSHIP.
Following that info I found MJAA of America and MJAC both fellowship alliances This leads to the Joseph Project- aid to new immig in Israel that are messianic, to plant olive trees, etc. Jo kaplan is exec dir of the Joseph Project and in 2008 A person who worked for 20 yrs at World Vision donated thousands of dollars in med sup. etc to Israel for, Magen David , ZAKA,Minsitry of welfare for immigrants, and To give to Bet Avot (Nursing homes of the elderly and institutions for the disabled.
Would this be a reason for Paul N Temple to be donating money. for the One New Man,"millennium madness" Joseph Project to continue?
Yvonne
 
AOL is based in McLean, VA which is awfully close to spooksville, Langley, as well as several other Defense Intelligence Agencies.........
 
This link is on FP about the spying Fusion Centers.The gov. is encroaching us.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/first100days/2009/03/23/fusion-centers-expand-criteria-identify-militia-members/
 
Yvonne,

I want to quote you here:

"This syndrome manifests as a great sense of urgency amongst some fundamentalist Christian churches to convert Jews as quickly as possible because the millennium draws near, but the Jewish community has yet to "repent" and to join the ranks of Christianity. This spiritual emergency to convert the Jews has led to a dramatic increase in deceptive and aggressive proselytizing activity in 1998, which threatens to be even greater in 1999."

I don't see this at all in the movement with the exception of perhaps an organization like Jews for Jesus who is quite aggressive in their approach to targeting Jews, with very expensive advertising campaigns in cities like NY. Jews for Jesus, is actually closer to the church than to some of the Messianic groups.

The folks in the movement are probably no different than people on this blog, in terms of seeing the "signs of the times". As for them believing they have to "convert" Jews, this is just not true because someone would be foolish to think that they can "convert" anyone, and the Messianics I know have no desire to make anyone "Christian".

The important point of the movement is that the first believers were Jews, and never needed to "become Christians" because they were just Jews who found their Messiah.

It sounds like you have read a Jewish publication about Messianics as your source.. Perhaps not the most objective source of information. There are some Christian groups that call themselves Messianic, and have been very aggressive in trying to reach the former Soviet Jews, but they would not be considered "Messianic" by most people's standards.

One of the problems in the movement, which has been resurrected after 1900 years, is there are many groups who are called Messianic, but their beliefs and practices vary widely. There are those that are as Torah observant as Orthodox Jews, to those that resemble Christianity. There are some who think Torah is only for Jews, and others who think it is for everyone.

Trying to put Messianics into one neat box is like trying to put Christians, and Jews into one neat box.

There are New Age types donating to all kinds of organizations. I suspect this has to do with their desire to infiltrate these organizations.

Most of the Messianic Jews that donate for causes in Israel genuinely have a love for Israel and the Jewish people. They may not all be so discerning about sources of funds, just as many churches are not always so discerning about the source of funding.

They also believe they are called to bless Israel and stand for Israel because for so many centuries Christians have not. Christian Zionists do do a lot for Israel too.

I think many Messianics recognize the prophecies coming to pass in our day, and are trying to be obedient to God in standing for Israel. You can call this Millennial madness if you want, but I know many Israelis that are grateful for the help they have received and I know of organizations that have done amazing work in Israel.

Many are responding to this:

Gen. 12:3 And aI will bless those who bless you,
And the one who curses you I will curse.
And in you all the families of the earth will be blessed.”

Many are also aware of the fact that we are entering into a time of "Jacob's trouble", so some might call this Millennial Madness, and others might call this the realization of the prophecies. Anti-semitism has increased dramactically for those of us who are watching and believers in Yeshua are called to stand with Israel and pray for the peace of Jerusalem.

Personally, I don't believe Jews need to be "converted". I do believe when God touches them, and removes the veil they can see Yeshua as the promised Messiah.

2Cor. 3:13-16 and are not like Moses, who used to put a veil over his face so that the sons of Israel would not look intently at the end of what was fading away. But their minds were ahardened; for until this very day at the breading of the old covenant the same veil remains unlifted, because it is removed in Christ. But to this day whenever Moses is read, a veil lies over their heart; abut whenever a person turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.

When they read the Torah, they do not see Yeshua, until God Himself removes this veil. Moses was in face to face relationship with God and when He came down from the mountain, after receiving the tablets for the second time, Israel could not look upon him because his face had been transformed from being in the presence of God. Moses saw Yeshua's coming, just as he looked upon the Promised Land but did not go in.

Today, in simple language, God is removing the veil from many Jews eyes, including rabbis who are studying the newer covenant in secret in Yeshivas in Jerusalem. I have met some of these rabbis and they know the truth. They are still Jews and still rabbis...

It's by revelation, not by "conversion".

Joyce
 
Well in the process of looking for info on Paul Temple I stumbled on this. Kind of interesting:

http://tinyurl.com/ckdpuz

They are connected to Club of Rome.

Joyce
 
Some of you may be familiar with these links to Paul Temple, but in case you're not:

http://www.worldbusiness.org/hot-off-the-press/

http://tiny.cc/HkVHe

http://tiny.cc/07kFc

http://tiny.cc/acSuV

Joyce
 
Dodd's Wife a Former Director of Bermuda-Based IPC Holdings, an AIG Controlled Company

No wonder Senator Christopher Dodd (D-Conn) went wobbly last week when asked about his February amendment ratifying hundreds of millions of dollars in bonuses to executives at insurance giant AIG. Dodd has been one of the company's favorite recipients of campaign contributions. But it turns out that Senator Dodd's wife has also benefited from past connections to AIG as well.

From 2001-2004, Jackie Clegg Dodd served as an "outside" director of IPC Holdings, Ltd., a Bermuda-based company controlled by AIG. IPC, which provides property casualty catastrophe insurance coverage, was formed in 1993 and currently has a market cap of $1.4 billion and trades on the NASDAQ under the ticker symbol IPCR. In 2001, in addition to a public offering of 15 million shares of stock that raised $380 million, IPC raised more than $109 million through a simultaneous private placement sale of 5.6 million shares of stock to AIG - giving AIG a 20% stake in IPC. (AIG sold its 13.397 million shares in IPC in August, 2006.)

Clegg was compensated for her duties to the company, which was managed by a subsidiary of AIG. In 2003, according to a proxy statement, Clegg received $12,000 per year and an additional $1,000 for each Directors' and committee meeting she attended. Clegg served on the Audit and Investment committees during her final year on the board.

IPC paid millions each year to other AIG-related companies for administrative and other services. Clegg was a diligent director. In 2003, the proxy statement report, she attended more than 75% of board and committee meetings. This while she served as the managing partner of Clegg International Consultants, LLC, which she created in 2001, the year she joined the board of IPC. (See Dodd's public financial disclosure reports with the Senate from 2001-2004 here.)

Dodd is likely more familiar with the complicated workings of AIG than he was letting on last week. This week may provide him with another opportunity to refresh his recollections.

Kevin Rennie, a former Republican state senator, is a columnist for the Hartford Courant. He can be reached at kfrennie@yahoo.com.

From: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2009/03/dodds_wife_a_former_director_o.html
 
Joyce,

(and anyone else who actually takes the time to read her comments)

It sounds to me like you have a lack of understanding in the area of salvation. All persons are saved by faith in Christ Jesus the Messiah. The Old Testament Saints were looking forward to Him being revealed and trusted God's promise and provision by Faith. The New Testament Saints are also trusting in the sacrifice of Christ by faith. It has nothing to do with what name humans choose to call themselves by. So it is only semantics to say that some people say that Jews must become Christians.

No, they must put their faith in God's provision for appeasing God's wrath against their sin, the precious blood of Christ which cleanses us from our sin and covers us with His righteousness.

So in one sense you are right that the Jews don't need to become Christians, but if they deny that Jesus Christ came in the flesh as God's provision for their sin, they are of the Spririt of Anti-Christ and still in their sins.

I hope this makes sense. I write this more for those reading this blog than for Joyce, who has closed her mind to anything other than her own opinion.

The Jews are precious in the sight of God on the account of the patriarchs, and He will bring them to repentance, but until that time, they are enemies of God. We are to pray for them and love them, but they are enemies of the Cross. That is why Scripture says to love your enemies and pray for them.

I hope these comments are helpful and I don't intend to attack Joyce, just to point out the error in her theology and it's logical conclusion which takes away from the necessity of the Work of Christ that was accomplished on the Cross for all time for all people.
 
Joyce, why not ask your husband to ask his networking buddy, that is if our lead is correct. We all know World Business Academy is New Age. We're more interested in the kind of information Constance has come up with in connection with Temple, i.e., The Family. After all, the Messianic Alliance could turn down donations from sources they have little in common with after they check them out. Messianic Alliance is not a little mom and pop operation with no staff.
 
Re:Joyce 2:08 AM

You are correct that when they read the LAW they are blinded to the Glory of Christ, because they are trying to be righteous by obeying the Law and bringing condemnation on themselves.

But to this day whenever Moses is read, a veil lies over their heart; abut whenever a person turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.

So when they are willing to investigate the claims of Christ by reading the Gospel Message, believing that Jesus was the CHRIST, the veil is taken away!

But because Judaism teaches them that righteousness comes through the Law, they do not come to Christ to receive of His gift of righteousness. Pride keeps them from humbly admitting that they are not able to keep the Law 100% like Christ did.
 
FYI

Timothy Geithner just spoke to the Council on Foreign Relations. Hopefully you will be able to see a replay on CNN. I caught the last 30 minutes.
 
This is terrible! You can read the full article here:

http://www.thevoicemagazine.com/politics/512-obama-youth-brigade-church-attendance-forbidden.html

Obama Youth Brigade: Church Attendance Forbidden
By Jonas Clark

The Bill would forbid any student in the brigade to participate in “engaging in religious instruction, conducting worship services, providing instruction as part of a program that includes mandatory religious instruction or worship, constructing or operating facilities devoted to religious instruction or worship, maintaining facilities primarily or inherently devoted to religious instruction or worship, or engaging in any form of religious proselytization.” That means no church attendance or witnessing.

Again, is this what America voted for? Here is part of the HR1388 Bill’s wording:

SEC. 1304. PROHIBITED ACTIVITIES AND INELIGIBLE ORGANIZATIONS.

Section 125 (42 U.S.C. 12575) is amended to read as follows:

SEC. 125. PROHIBITED ACTIVITIES AND INELIGIBLE ORGANIZATIONS.

(a) Prohibited Activities- A participant in an approved national service position under this subtitle may not engage in the following activities:

(1) Attempting to influence legislation.

(2) Organizing or engaging in protests, petitions, boycotts, or strikes.

(7) Engaging in religious instruction, conducting worship services, providing instruction as part of a program that includes mandatory religious instruction or worship, constructing or operating facilities devoted to religious instruction or worship, maintaining facilities primarily or inherently devoted to religious instruction or worship, or engaging in any form of religious proselytization.
 
Anonymous 9:58
Yours is one opinion among many, and you are entitled to it. You base your beliefs on your holy books. Followers of other religions base their beliefs on their holy books, and every group thinks their is the final word. I think the Jews are pretty safe as long as you are worried about what is going to happen in the afterlife and don't feel a need to physically do anything to Jews now in the here and now as the Muslims seem to want to happen to Jews and Christians.

It's because certain individuals within different belief systems can manipulate followers for their own power grabs that something like the Alliance of Civilizations can come to power to the detriment of everyone.

Why do I say this? Because Jews with a few exceptions were forced to control their missionary work after being physically attacked by the Christians coming to power during the first hundreds of years when Christians gained political and religious power. They are as adamant in their belief about Christians as you are about Jews.

As Christianity matured, most Christians learned that conversions couldn't be forced no matter how strongly they believed Christianity was the one true religion.

However, Muslims seem not to have matured as a religious group with the results we see around us. The Messianic community needs a hundred years or more to mature before they learn to stop being disruptive inside the Jewish community with their teaching methods.

Just keep in mind that while there may be individuals in every group who are not truly bonded to their core group and are open to conversion, the core religious group believers are just as firm that they have the truth as you are.

Be careful when you go chest to chest with others. Ideas have consequences, and overly forceful presentations of beliefs almost ask for control by Alliance type people.
 
anonymous 10:40, I find your post rather disturbing! Any time any one finds justification for AOC, red flags go off.
 
US willing to look at China currency proposal
By Krishna Guha in Washington and Peter Garnham in London

Published: March 25 2009 14:19 | Last updated: March 25 2009 14:19

The US is willing to explore China’s proposal to give a synthetic global currency a larger role in the international financial system, Tim Geithner, US Treasury secretary, said on Wednesday.

But Mr Geithner said any change would be evolutionary and that the synthetic currency, called the International Monetary Fund Special Drawing Rights (SDRs), would not replace the dollar.

http://tinyurl.com/c6ltf3
 
What does AOC stand for?
 
What does AOC stand for?
 
AOC stands for "alliance of civilizations"

I will add this to the mix -

1 John 2:21-24

21I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.

22Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

23Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.

24Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye also shall continue in the Son, and in the Father.

I think that the Word of God settles it - it is clear and unmistakable - you do not even need to speculate or interpret it.


DouginMI
 
To: DouginMI,

I am really confused about your comment about the AOC. I went to the website and I have no idea what you are refering to.

My comment was about the spirit of Anti-Christ. There is a final anti-Christ that will arise, but there are many who follow the spirit of anti-christ who because they have rejected Christ as coming in the flesh have denied the Father.

Scripture is very clear that those who deny the Son are also denying the Father. You cannont claim God as your father if you reject Jesus Christ.

Jesus told the Jewish leaders that they were of their father the devil. Why was this true? Because they did not recognize Jesus as their Messiah.

The Scripture you quoted did not seem to contradict what I said, so what scripture am I misinterpreting?

I do thank you for answering my question, but I don't understand your hostility.

If I am in error, I do care and do want to be careful not to distort the truth. I am not above reproach that is for sure and God is still teaching me many things. I am willing to listen, study, research and pray about all things, no matter what it is to find out God's truth. God wants us to come to the knowlege of the truth, and I know that I personally do not have a corner on the truth, but He does.

Looking forward to some clarification and I would ask for mercy and kindness if a rebuke is in order.
 
Here we go...

Geithner 'open' to China proposal:

Geithner, at the Council on Foreign Relations, said the U.S. is "open" to a headline-grabbing proposal by the governor of the China's central bank, which was widely reported as being a call for a new global currency to replace the dollar, but which Geithner described as more modest and "evolutionary."

This kills any idea that the current financial "crisis" is anything but a planned event to take us to a new financial order.

Dave in CA
 
PAUL TEMPLE, THE FAMILY AND ABRAHAM VEREIDE

The purpose of this post is simply to review information on Paul N. Temple, The Family and Abraham Vereide - along with Vereide's pro Nazi and pro-fascist affiliations just prior to and during World War II.

As many of the regular readers and commenters here may already be aware, thanks to Constance Cumbey, Paul Temple is not only one of the co-founders of the Institute of Noetic Sciences, but he is also connected to The Family.

INSTITUTE OF NOETIC SCIENCES

The Institute of Noetic Sciences (IONS) was co-founded in 1973 by former astronaut Edgar Mitchell and industrialist Paul N. Temple to encourage and conduct research and education programs on mind-body relationships for the purpose of expanding "human possibility by investigating aspects of reality—mind, consciousness, and spirit." Institute programs include research in what they call "extended human capacities," "integral health and healing," and "emerging worldviews". This includes research into spiritual energy, meditation, consciousness, alternative healing, spirituality, human potential, psychic abilities and life after death, among others..........

Criticism

Research supported by the Institute of Noetic Sciences has been criticized as lacking in strict "peer-reviewed empiricism". In an article that critiqued the New Age movement's detachment from the mainstream scientific community, Thomas W. Clark, founder of the Center for Naturalism, referenced work supported by the Institute as suffering from "what humanist philosopher Paul Kurtz calls the 'transcendental temptation' [that] drives the flight from standard, peer-reviewed empiricism into the arms of a dualism that privileges the mental over the physical, the teleological over the non-purposive."

The skeptical organization Quackwatch includes the Institute of Noetic Sciences on its list of questionable organizations. The list outlines nine criteria they feel are useful in determining the reliability of groups offering health-related information.

The Committee for Skeptical Inquiry have also criticized distance healing research supported by the Institute of Noetic Sciences, citing a ten-week study in their critique of parapsychologist Elisabeth Targ where "healers directed their psi energy to the [AIDS] patients by using prayer or meditation."...............

SEE ALSO

Gaia
Parapsychology
Near-death experience
Energy (esotericism)
Placebo


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki
/Institute_of_
Noetic_Sciences
__________________________

THE FAMILY

(Pay attention to the Paul N. Temple connection)

This is a movement that in the past been known by a multitude of other names, including The Fellowship, The Fellowship Foundation, National Fellowship Council, Fellowship House, The International Foundation, National Committee for Christian Leadership, International Christian Leadership, and the National Leadership Council.

It is an informal, international movement that is centered around the life and teachings of Jesus as the common ground across all religious and political divisions. The group, without any formal membership, has relationships that span from poor communities in developing countries to prominent members of the United States Congress. It is best known for its role in organizing the annual National Prayer Breakfast, at which the President of the United States customarily makes an address..........

.......The movement was founded in Seattle in 1935 by Abraham Vereide, a Norwegian immigrant and traveling preacher who had been working with the city's poor, and who feared that "socialist" politicians were about to take over Seattle's municipal government. .........

.........The movement has had some involvement with the "Cultural Creative" Movement in the form of Paul N. Temple, a former Standard Oil executive who was also instrumental in founding the Institute of Noetic Sciences as well as the World Business Academy. In 1987, The Family co-sponsored a conference, Bridging Through Christ, at the Goldlake New Age center near Boulder, Colorado. Barbara Marx Hubbard and Doug Coe co-chaired the event; David Spangler, Findhorn Community representatives, and Conservative Baptist Seminary representatives including Vernon Grounds and Gordon Lewis participated. The catalyst appears to have been Paul N. Temple, who co-founded the Institute of Noetic Sciences and is a major funder of both IONS and The Family through his "Three Swallows Foundation." The address of 133 C Street, SE, is the mailing address for Doug Coe, and the address given on the 990 IRS form of the Three Swallows Foundation.........

......The movement organizes the U.S. National Prayer Breakfast, held each year on the first Thursday of February in Washington, D.C.. First held in 1953, the event is now attended by over 3,400 guests including dignitaries from many nations. The President of the United States typically makes an address at the breakfast. The event is officially hosted by members of Congress. Democrats and Republicans serve on the organizing committee, and leadership alternates each year between the House and the Senate
....

http://tinyurl.com/ys5ezj
___________________________________

The following are links to Constance's posts on Abraham Vereide and THE FAMILY in her five-part series entitled THE HIJACKING OF EVANGELICALISM:

http://cumbey.blogspot.com/
search?q=abraham+vereide

See also.....

http://tinyurl.com/cwld9v


One of the very interesting things Constance mentions is the fact that Paul N. Temple, who was an executive of Standard Oil, was directly associated with Abraham Vereide. Standard Oil had ties to I.G. Farben during World War II. I.G. Farben became infamous when it became known that it was the manufacturer of "Zyklon B", the cyanide-based insecticide which was used in the Nazi concentration/death camps to gas the Jews to death prior to and during the War.

I.B. Farben was collectively/corporately cited as being a "Nazi Collaborator."

In 1941, an investigation exposed a "marriage" cartel between John D. Rockefeller's United States-based Standard Oil Co. and I.G. Farben...........

Of the 24 directors of IG Farben indicted in the so-called IG Farben Trial (1947-1948) before a U.S. military tribunal at the subsequent Nuremberg Trials, 13 were sentenced to prison terms between one and eight years. Some of those indicted in the trial were subsequently made leaders of the post-war companies that split off from IG Farben, including those who were sentenced at Nuremberg
........read more.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IG_Farben

One can only wonder how much influence Temple may have had in the "rehabilitation" of I.G. Farben war criminals.
_______________________________

In a note preceding Part V of her series, Constance writes:

Author’s Notes: this was originally to be a four part series. Parts I and II dealt with modern “merging and blending” of Washington’s “Fellowship Foundation” and Paul N. Temple’s “Institute of Noetic Sciences.” Barbara Marx Hubbard said in her 1988 Seattle Unity Temple speech that “now all the resonating core groups with outwardly different purposes are merging and blending and coming together to do The One Work.” It was clear that she was working closely with both Paul Temple and the Fellowship Foundation, both groups of which he had and continues to successfully bridge.

The problems, however, are much older. They are clearly multi-generational. According to the Billy Graham Center archives, Paul Temple’s own involvement with Abraham Vereide dated back to 1944. Meetings of the group which included clear proponents of “We are gods” (Frank Laubach) date back earlier to 1943 and perhaps even earlier.


http://cumbey.blogspot.
com/search?q=
abraham+vereide
________________________

On the following link, Constance mentions Wayne Madsen and links to the INSIDER MAGAZINE site containing his work entitled
EXPOSE: THE "CHRISTIAN" MAFIA.

Another prominent internet researcher, Wayne Madsen, charges that the Fellowship is using Jesus as a cynical logo in pursuit of cynical political pursuits. He goes so far as to call it a monstrous criminal plot to seize control of the “biggest prize of all – the United States government.”

http://cumbey.blogspot.
com/search?q=
wayne+madsen
_________________________________

Here is Wayne Madsen's biography....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wayne_Madsen
_______________________________

Here is the link to Madsen's article EXPOSE: THE "CHRISTIAN" MAFIA:

http://www.insider-magazine.com/
ChristianMafia.htm

In his expose, Madsen has a great deal to say about Abraham Vereide and his pro-Nazi and pro-fascist views:

ROOTS OF THE FELLOWSHIP

The roots of the Fellowship go back to the 1930's and a Norwegian immigrant and Methodist minister named Abraham Vereide. According to Fellowship archives maintained at the Billy Graham Center at Wheaton College in Illinois, Vereide, who immigrated from Norway in 1905, began an outreach ministry in Seattle in April, 1935. but his religious outreach involved nothing more than pushing for an anti-Communist, anti-union, anti-Socialist, and pro-Nazi German political agenda. A loose organization and secrecy were paramount for Vereide. Fellowship archives state that Vereide wanted his movement to "carry out its objective through personal trusting, informal, unpublicized contact between people." Vereide's establishment of his Prayer Breakfast Movement for anti-Socialist and anti-International Workers of the World (IWW or "Wobblies") Seattle businessmen in 1935 coincided with the establishment of another pro-Nazi German organization in the United States, the German American Bund. Vereide say his prayer movement replacing labor unions.

A student of the un-Christian German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche, Vereide's thoughts about a unitary religion based on an unyielding subservience to a comnposite notion of "Jesus" put him into the same category as many of the German nationalist philosophers who were favored by Hitler and the Nazis. Nietzsche wrote the following of Christianity: "When we hear the ancient bells growling on a Sunday morning we ask ourselves: Is it really possible! This, for a Jew, crucufied two thousand years ago, who said he was God's son? The proof of such a claim is lacking."

One philosophical felow-traveler of Vereide was the German Nazi philosopher Martin Heidegger, a colleague of Leo Strauss, the father of American neo-conservatism and the mentor of such present-day neo-conservatives as Richard Perle and Paul Wolfowitz. Strauss's close association with Heidegger and the Nazi idea of telling the big lie in order to justify end goals - Machiavellianism on steroids - did not help Strauss in Nazi Germany. Because he was Jewish, he was forced to emigrate to the United States, where he began teaching neo-conservative politics at the University of Chicago. It is this confluence of right-wing philosophies that provides a political bridge between modern - day Christian Rightists (including so-called Christian Zionists) and the secular-oriented neo-conservatives who support a policy that sees a U.S. - Israeli alliance against Islam and European-oriented democratic socialism. For the dominion theologists, the United states ifd the New Israel, with a God-given mandate to establish dominion over the entire planet.

Neither the secular neo-conservatives not Christian fundamentalists seem to have a problem with the idea of American donmination of the planet, as witnessed by the presence of representatives of both camps as supporters of the neo-conservative Project for a New American Century, the neo0conservative blueprint for America's attack on Iraq and plans to attack, occupy, and dominate other countries that oppose U.S. designs.

What bound all so-called “America First” movements prior to World War II was their common hatred for labor unions, Communists and Socialists, Jews, and most definitely, the administration of President Franklin Delano Roosevelt. Vereide’s Prayer Breakfast Movement, pro-Nazi German groups like the Bund, and a resurgent Ku Klux Klan had more than propaganda in common – they had an interlocking leadership and a coordinated political agenda.

Not only was Vereide pro-Hitler, he was the only Norwegian of note, who was not officially a Nazi, who never condemned Norwegian Nazi leader Vidkun Quisling, a man whose name has become synonymous with traitor and who was executed in 1945. Vereide and Quisling were almost the same age, Vereide was born in 1886, Quisling in 1887. They both shared a link with the clergy, Vereide was a Methodist minister and Quisling was the son of a Lutheran minister. The Norwegian link to the Fellowship continues to this day but more on that later..

...Such glogal ecumenicalism is a founding principle for today's Fellowship. With total devotion to Jesus and not nesessarily His principles at its core, the Fellowship continues to reach out to Moslems )including Saudi extreme Wahhabi sect members), Buddhists, and Hindus. Its purpose has little to do with religion but everything to do with political and economic influence-peddling and the reconstruction of the world in preparation for a thousand-year Christian global dominion. Post-millenialist Fellowship members believe that Jesus will not return until there is a 1000-year pure Christian government established on earth. It is this mindset that has infused the foreign policy of George W. Bush and his administration. the desire for a thousand year political dominion of the world is not new. Hitler planned for a "Thousand Year Reich" over the planet. It is not a coioncidence that Hitler desired and the so-called Christian dominionists/reconstructionists now contemplate a thousand year reign. the Christian dominionists are the political heirs of Hitler, the Norwegians Vereide and Quisling, buchman, Opus Dei founder and fascist patron saint Josemaria Escriva and their political and religious cohorts
.......read entire article......

http://www.insider-magazine.
com/ChristianMafia.htm

Last but not least, here is a review of Jeff Sharlett's Book, THE FAMILY:

http://tinyurl.com/dcnucs

See also.....

http://www.harpers.org/archive/2003/03/0079525
 
Anonymous 12:47 -
some had asked what the AOC stands for - I was simply answering that question -
The posting quoting 1st John was directed toward Anonymous 10:40
No - there was no misinterpretation - I just wanted the biht light of Scripture included. By doing that - it removes the "opinion" status - and puts it squarley in the realm of Truth.
Thats all I was trying to do, absolutely no hostility - none at all.
I apoplogize, and please forgive me if it was taken that way.

DouginMI
 
To DouginMI,

Thanks for the clairfication, I see where I messed up. I had confused your comments with the one who origianlly brought the AOC into the blog.

I appreciate your response very much.
 
Hi Anonymous 2:51,
These are words to live by when discussing any issue.


2nd Timithy 2:24-26
24And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,

25In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

26And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

No mess up - just a clarification maybe?
the Lord Jesus Christ lives

DouginMI
 
I don't know if this has been posted, but this is an article I read at Fulfilled Prophecy. Apparently, the change in the Israeli government, won't mean a change in the peace process:

http://tinyurl.com/cd4qfg

This is very distressing.
 
Susanna-

Your quotes/reference to Wayne Madsen provides an interesting context for evaluating Vereide, but it is riddled with historical inaccuracy. The national KKK had fallen apart by the time Vereide brought his Prayer Breakfast ministry to the national arena. The local KKK in Seattle was never organized, but instead the KKK was a rural phenomenon in WA that attracted men like loggers who were traditionally shut out of fraternal organizations. Initially, in the 1920s, it was the fraternal lodges particularily the Masons who organized the KKK in Oregon and Washington. Their target was the Catholic Church. Vereide's anti-Wobbly fervor was a completely different crusade. I have spent days looking at the rise of the KKK in the Pac NW including reviewing historical documents in special collections. There was no evidence of Seattle buisnessmen or Methodist/Protestant involvement in the Klan. The Wobbly Movement acted in violent anarchist ways. It was a major threat to all buisness. Madsen's "expose" smacks of leftist propaganda.

How was Vereide connected to I.G. Farbin directly?
 
Ok everyone:
I am reading a lot of they, them, their, in all your comments, lets be a little more clear shall we.

So in one sense you are right that the Jews don't need to become Christians, but if they deny that Jesus Christ came in the flesh as God's provision for their sin, they are of the Spririt of Anti-Christ and still in their sins.

You should probably consider there are many religions in this blog, your personally insulting them and me with your ignorance.
Yvonne
 
sorry the last post was to anon 9:58AM

To Joyce You were not quoting me in your post to me you and I were quoting http://www.bnaibrith.ca/publications/audit1998/audit1998-07.html
Yvonne
 
Thanks for understanding Yvonne. Also thanks for the last link to the very descriptive piece about the confrontation between the Jewish community and the Messianic community in Canada.

If every time some Christian said that the truth was non-Christians were connected with the antichrist, every non-Christian said that Christians were really pagan believers, the wars would really start. We don't need that.
 
Anonymous 5:33

RE-ELECT
Kissinger / Brzezinski 2012 !
 
anon 9:58AM
Try to think clearly, why is it the One World Order insists that Jews must be removed first?, Why do the Messianics insist that they must turn all the Jews first? Why is the New Age so determined to infiltrate the christians and turn them against the Jews, And why is it that the Anti-Christ moves the world and not just himself to destroy and lay low the Jew?
Because they know God has never ever broken a single covenant to these people.
Yvonne
 
http://gingiedmonds.com/Home_Page.html

The Montana plane crash, the family members who died there and the abortion connection. The message here is overwhelming. Please read the story.
 
I grew up in Seattle and my mother's family had been Wobblies, and my grandfather was a Socialist member of the Montana legislature before that.
My grandfather even went to jail with Debs in the Pullman Strike, for striking, which was illegal.

I never heard of this Vereide character. Possibly I can't even spell his name.

Maybe it is because our family studiously avoided all Christian connections, and Vereide's group claimed they were united around Jesus.

My family was poor and broken from their attempts to reform the world and were sick of the whole thing, perhaps. I can really resonate with that...politics doesn't help anything.

Mariel
 
The Madsen article is a mess. Typical perhaps of stuff out there pointing to deceptions and start throwing in a bunch of junk and really ends up as cause for dismissing the original premise verses being made more aware of truth. It was typical hatchet journalism with lots of facts that may or may not be verifiable and some that are just plain wrong or lumping a lot in with one. There is very real, wrong and works of the enemy going on her with the family. These kinds of articles that twist things in the name of exposure just is sad and how the enemy goes about this.

Also note in that article the comment minimizing things that point kids to new age...
 
Anonyous 9:58,

You may not be reading my comments as carefully as you think. I will repeat, Jews do not have to become "Christians". The earliest followers of Yeshua were all Jews. Later on some god-fearers joined in from the nations. The Jews continued to be Jews who found their Messiah. When you read the Apostolic writings you have to be careful about terminology. Paul was a Benjaminite i.e. a Jew. He never stopped being a Jew.

Salvation was always by faith. Abraham was justified by faith before Yeshua was born, so the issue is what do we look to for our salvation? The patriarchs themselves were justified by faith. Moses, Joseph, David, etc.. Same thing. They all believed in God's promises and it was credited to them as righteousness as Hebrews 11 clearly states.

We are not "justified" by works of law. Works of law was an expression which in the 2nd Temple period meant specific conversion to join the community of Jews. i.e. circumcision was a common benchmark of conversion in Second Temple Judaism. However, Abraham was justified before he was circumcised, so his faith is what was credited to him as righteousness. Works of law does not mean "obeying Torah". Obeying Torah, ( the teachings, not law) is what we do when we love God. It never saved us because we need faith to please God.

The Patriarchs and others like Moses and David looked forward to the coming of Yeshua. They had the gospel preached to them. Abraham said it" God will provide the sacrifice".

Yeshua says:
John 5:46 “For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me, for ahe wrote about Me.

In response to the other anonymous poster who said:


'You are correct that when they read the LAW they are blinded to the Glory of Christ, because they are trying to be righteous by obeying the Law and bringing condemnation on themselves.

But to this day whenever Moses is read, a veil lies over their heart; abut whenever a person turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.

So when they are willing to investigate the claims of Christ by reading the Gospel Message, believing that Jesus was the CHRIST, the veil is taken away!

But because Judaism teaches them that righteousness comes through the Law, they do not come to Christ to receive of His gift of righteousness. Pride keeps them from humbly admitting that they are not able to keep the Law 100% like Christ did."
10:09 AM

I would word what you said a bit differently. The veil does not allow one to see that Yeshua is the Torah that became flesh. He is the Word who became flesh and dwelt among us in John 1.

Most of the Jews that I know and talk to, know that they sin, so it's a fallacy to say that Jews think they can observe Torah 100%. They believe in God's grace too. This is another misnomer.

The inability to see Yeshua in the Torah is because of God's sovereign plan. Blindness in part has come to Israel until the "fulness of the nations".

When we say things like this, it's as though we are saying we are more humble because we accept Yeshua, to which I say nonsense. If I accepted Yeshua, it's because God by His grace opened my eyes. He will open the eyes of others too. We can proclaim the message of truth, but salvation ( Yeshua's name) is from Him.

There is another problem with the way Christians have traditionally read the newer covenant. The word Jews is not understood in the context of the writing. Daniel Gruber in his book "Copernicus and the Jews" does a good job explaining how that has created problems over the centuries, including some of the accusations of Jews being "Christ-killers" In the context of the gospels Yeshua was usually being very hard on a specific group of religious leaders who were corrupt.

Many Jews believed and were zealous for Torah:

" Acts 21:20 And when they heard it they began aglorifying God; and they said to him, “You see, brother, how many 1thousands there are among the Jews of those who have believed, and they are all zealous for the Law; "

Because of our theology, sometimes we read a verse like this and don't stop to think about what Paul was saying. Observing Torah was never meant to save anyone.

We are coming up to Passover.. When God saved Ancient Israel, it was by HIS strong right hand, not by their good works. They were delivered from Pharaoh just as today those of us who believe in Yeshua are delivered from HaSatan. That is the same grace, the same God, yesterday, today and forever.

AFTER God saved Ancient Israel, He took them into the Wilderness and began to speak words of love to them like a husband. Torah was meant to be teaching, instruction and pointing them to Yeshua, not to be thrown away when Yeshua came, but to be written on our minds ( leb).

This is the newer covenant where God, when He gives us our new identity writes His Word on our mind, instead of on tablets of stone.

What's missing without Yeshua is the new birth. When we believe in Him, our old man dies and we become new creations raised up with His identity.

I think we have to be careful the way we think about Jews and what is said about them in the newer covenant. If we don't read it attentively we will do what has been done for centuries and not understand..

God gave us His loving teachings and instructions and now through Yeshua we have the power to live them out, knowing that they are all about Him. This doesn't earn our salvation. He is our salvation, but if we want to know Him we will keep His commands:

Matt. 5:17 ¶ “Do not think that I came to abolish the aLaw or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill.
Matt. 5:18 “For truly I say to you, auntil heaven and earth pass away, not 1the smallest letter or stroke shall pass from the Law until all is accomplished.
Matt. 5:19 “Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches 1others to do the same, shall be called least ain the kingdom of heaven; but whoever 2keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

I want to point out again here that the world "fulfill" in this passage does not mean" finished" it means to fill with meaning, to fill up completely.

Yeshua never even hinted or suggested that we should stop obeying Torah. He was Torah, and lived Torah with 100% perfect interpretation. Now if we want to be His disciples, we should look at how He lived out Torah because HE was the greatest teacher that ever lived.

Paul did not contradict Yeshua, but often Paul is read out of context. Paul wrote letters to particular assemblies to address particular situations that were going on in their city. If we do not understand who and what he was addressing exactly, we will misinterpret his remarks.

When he was accused of disobeying Torah and teaching others to, he went and did an animal sacrifice and the rites of purification, a Torah command.

Paul did teach that we are never justified by "works of law" i.e. ritual conversion for inclusion in the community. Salvation was by faith, not by being circumcised, which was one sign of Second temple Judaism that "included you in the community".

Many of Paul's epistles are being written to mystics, gnostics, ascetics. We must read carefully, and learn about the context or we will misinterpret.
Most modern day Christian interpretations of Paul can be disproved by other verses because as Peter said:

2Pet. 3:15 and regard the patience of our Lord as salvation; just as also bour beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, wrote to you,
2Pet. 3:16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, bin which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.

When Peter says this the context of his letter is to walk blamelessly:

2Pet. 3:14 ¶ aTherefore, beloved, since you look for these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, spotless and blameless,

There is our salvation which comes by faith, and this faith should motivate us to walk in obedience. Walking in obedience is a result of our faith. How do we know what to obey? God's word tells us through His teaching and instructions and when we give proper interpretation to them:

Psa. 119:160 The sum of Your word is truth,
And every one of Your righteous ordinances cis everlasting.

David did not obey Torah perfectly. He killed, committed adultery etc. but he knew that God's Word was a lamp to his feet. All of Psalm 119 talks about treasuring and keeping God's Word. It is everlasting. That means eternal!!!! Because Yeshua is the Word..

We should criticize Jews who don't have a revelation of Yeshua. If we know Him, it is only because He revealed Himself to us.

Rom. 11:17 ¶ But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive, were grafted in among them and became partaker with them of the rich root of the olive tree,
Rom. 11:18 do not be arrogant toward the branches; but if you are arrogant, remember that ait is not you who supports the root, but the root supports you.


Joyce
 
correction: I meant to say "We SHOULDN"T" criticize Jews who don't have revelation of Yeshua. That was a typo. Should be obvious from the context.

Joyce
 
Yvonne,
You said "Why do the Messianics insist that they must turn all the Jews first? "

To me it seems perfectly logical that the gospel goes first to the Jew. Yeshua came first to His own:

Rom. 1:16 ¶ For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the cJew first and also to the Greek.

Your other comments that were a quote from B'nai B'rith were not in quotations I don't think, so I might have misunderstood you.
Joyce
 
Anon 6:16 P.M.

Thanks for your input.

Another thing I would like to point out is that no one should assume that all Fundamentalists and Evangelicals are necessarily involved with The Family.

The Family appears to be a very particluar international organization with a very particular "dominionist" sociopolitical agenda disguised as something "Christian."

As Constance has said in the very title of her series, this is the "hijacking of evangelicalism."

Regarding your comment on the KKK, they may have been somewhat down during the 1930's but they were definitely not out.

According to Wayne Madsen, Vereide had a close relationship to Senator Ralph Owen Brewster who was believed to be a member of the KKK.

See also:

http://www.harpers.org/archive/2003/03/0079525

Brewster's affiliation with the Klan is also mentioned in Brewster's biography:

In the Senate, he (Senator Brewster) was good friends with Joseph McCarthy of Wisconsin. His association with McCarthyism eroded Brewster's political support as McCarthy's anti-communist excesses became increasingly unpopular. His (Senator Brewster's) association with the Ku Klux Klan also cost him support in liberal Republican circles.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Owen_Brewster

Here is a link to the Ralph Owen Brewster Papers. Check out Governor's papers, 1924-29.

https://library.bowdoin.edu/arch/mss/robsd.shtml

According to the following article:

In the 1920s and 1930s, a violent and zealous faction of the Klan called the Black Legion was active in the Midwestern U.S.. The Legion wore black uniforms and targeted and assassinated communists and socialists.

In southern cities such as Birmingham, Alabama, Klan members kept control of access to the better-paying industrial jobs but opposed unions. During the 1930s and 1940s, Klan leaders urged members to disrupt the Congress of Industrial Organizations(CIO), which advocated industrial unions and was open to African-American members. With access to dynamite and skills from their jobs in mining and steel, in the late 1940s some Klan members in Birmingham began using bombings to intimidate upwardly mobile blacks who moved into middle-class neighborhoods. "By mid-1949, there were so many charred house carcasses that the area [College Hills] was informally named Dynamite Hill." Independent Klan groups remained active in Birmingham and were deeply engaged in violent opposition to the Civil Rights Movement....


http://tinyurl.com/cyqc5u
______________________________

BLACK LEGION

The Black Legion was an additional organization within the Ku Klux Klan and operated in the United States in the 1930s. The organization was founded by William Shepard in east central Ohio. [1] The group's total membership was estimated between 20,000 and 30,000, centered in Detroit, Michigan, though the Legion was also highly active in Ohio, and one of its self-described leaders, Virgil "Bert" Effinger, lived and worked in Lima, Ohio....

....The Black Legion was organized along paramilitary lines and had five brigades, 16 regiments, 64 battalions, and 256 companies. Although its members boasted that there were one million legionnaires in Michigan, it probably had only between 20,000 and 30,000 members in the state in the 1930s, one third of whom lived in Detroit.

Black Legion was also the name of a 1937 Humphrey Bogart film, featuring a fictionalized version of the group.

Members wore black uniforms with skull and crossbones insignia and were allegedly responsible for numerous murders of alleged communists and socialists, notably Earl Little, Malcolm X's father...


http://en.wikipedia.org/
wiki/Black_Legion_(political_movement)
________________________________

Also, as mentioned by Wayne Madsen, during the 1930's when Hitler was coming to power in Germany, the pro-Nazi Amerikadeutscher Volksbund, which was headed by Fritz Kuhn, was busy recruiting members in the U.S from the German-American community.

The following is from a TIME article dated March 14, 1938:

Origin of the Nazi movement in the U. S. antedates the Hitler regime by ten years. In 1923 the Teutonia Society, patterned vaguely on Klan principles, was the biggest of a dozen or so similar groups whose members gave aid to the National Socialist Party in Germany throughout the late 20's. In 1933 these groups were merged as "Friends of New Germany," run by Heinz Spanknobel, a Nazi party member. Herr Spanknobel, indicted by a New York Federal Grand Jury for failing to register as the agent of a foreign nation, speedily fled to Nazi Germany. In 1934 a Congressional Committee investigated the Friends of New Germany, found it "for ail practical purposes the American section of the Nazi party." The Friends changed this name to Amerikadeutscher Volksbund in 1936, resumed functioning under the leadership of a sleek, pompous, garrulous ex-chemist named Fritz Kuhn whose offices in Manhattan are decorated by portraits of Franklin Roosevelt and Adolf Hitler.

Germans are by nature joiners. How much the Bund is actually an undercover wing of Naziism and how much the innocent modern equivalent of an old-fashioned Turnverein is highly debatable, even among Bund members. Major operations of the Bund are week-end outings, where members in grey uniforms with Swastika brassards are drilled in German military tactics, sing German songs, listen to speeches in favor of Adolf Hitler. Dues of $9 a year partly go to buy camping sites, of which the Bund has 27 in as many cities. They also pay the salaries of Führer Kuhn and the district leaders whom he appoints. Major Bund centres are New York, Milwaukee and Los Angeles.
....read entire article....

http://www.time.com/time
/magazine/article/0,9171,
759273-2,00.html

See also:

GERMAN AMERICAN BUND

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_American_Bund

FRITZ JULIUS KUHN

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fritz_Julius_Kuhn

Vereide's activities were not confined to Seattle. Ultimately, they were international.

Vereide was not connected to I.G. Farben. At least not directly. According to Madsen, and Constance, who have both cited the Fellowship archives maintained at the Billy Graham Center at Wheaton College in Illinois as their source, as far back as 1944, Veriede was directly associated with Paul N. Temple who was an executive for Standard Oil.

http://areyouaware.wordpress.
com/2008/10/31/
history-of-the-fellowship-foundation/

Standard Oil had direct ties to I.G. Farben during World War II.
I.G. Farben was named as a Nazi collaborator after the War and 24 of its directors were tried for war crimes.

Of the 24 directors of IG Farben indicted in the so-called IG Farben Trial (1947-1948) before a U.S. military tribunal at the subsequent Nuremberg Trials, 13 were sentenced to prison terms between one and eight years. Some of those indicted in the trial were subsequently made leaders of the post-war companies that split off from IG Farben, including those who were sentenced at Nuremberg.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IG_Farben
This is a historical fact.


In 1946, Vereide, too, toured the world, traveling with letters of introduction from a half dozen senators and representatives, and from Paul G. Hoffman, the director of the Marshall Plan. He traveled also with a mandate from General John Hildring, assistant secretary of state, to oversee the creation of a list of good Germans of “the predictable type” (many of whom, Vereide believed, were being held for having “the faintest connection” with the Nazi regime), who could be released from prison “to be used, according to their ability in the tremendous task of reconstruction.” Vereide met with Jewish survivors and listened to their stories, but he nevertheless considered ex-Nazis well suited for the demands of “strong” government, so long as they were willing to worship Christ as they had Hitler.

http://www.harpers.org/archive/2003/03/0079525

Paul N. Temple himself admits his
association with Vereide, although he claims to have first met Vereide in Washington D.C. in 1951:

During my stay in D.C. I met a man named Abraham Vereide who had been a
Norwegian minister who had come to the United States and settled in Seattle
where they were having a lot of trouble at that time with the Communistdominated (sic)
union. He had organized a group of men that became a prayer
group. They met and tried to work together to try to solve this serious problem
in Seattle. He also worked for Goodwill Industries. He had been ordained
as a Methodist minister. He had been working for the down and outs, but it
occurred to him that the up and outs had problems too. He decided to move
to Washington to see what he could do to create a leadership led by God.
Eventually it happened....
..read more...

http://www.worldbusiness.
org/fileadmin/
PublicationArticles/
Merchants.pdf
 
Now Joyce, you said you would answer Constance's question when you had time. It appears you had a lot of time to do your last post. Did you ask your husband about the Messianic Alliance getting money from Three Swallows yet? Somehow I had a thought he might know. I could be wrong.
 
Hi Yvonne,
I am not here to say anybody should do anything - I simply quoted a fractional part of the Word of God.
Nothing more - nothing less.


DouginMI
 
DouginMI
My Statement was to one of the many Anonomous, Anonomous 9:58 AM
who said this " but if they deny that Jesus Christ came in the flesh as God's provision for their sin, they are of the Spririt of Anti-Christ and still in their sins".
I have no problems with anyone reciting from the bible, so long as they know that any statement can be taken from its context and used for their arguement, whether it means that or not.
As to the Messianics: You can go to any of their sites, and they are all connected, and they all have the same purpose to convert the the jew first,said in many ways but none here is stupid.
From Joyce: "The folks in the movement are probably no different than people on this blog, in terms of seeing the "signs of the times". As for them believing they have to "convert" Jews, this is just not true because someone would be foolish to think that they can "convert" anyone, and the Messianics I know have no desire to make anyone "Christian". "
Then Joyce states:"To me it seems perfectly logical that the gospel goes first to the Jew. Yeshua came first to His own:
*Christian: to believe Jesus is one true God.
*Sorry to Jews this is breaking the first commandment. And it is idolatry. No matter how many ways you state that God and Jesus is or are the same entity,or coerse the bible to prove your stance on this issue.
No doubt messianic can take advantage of the Old and dieing, demented,weak, infirmed,hungary and scared as the Messianic's are doing. And with the financial aid of the New Age. What does this say? and Who is of the Anti-Christ?
Yvonne
 
Yvonne,
Yeshua and the Father are echad.

When the veil is lifted the Jews can see this, but without Yeshua there is a partial blinding. Certain things can only be discerned spiritually.

When you are born again and Torah is written on yoru heart, you can see that this is not idolatry. I'm am familiar with the Jewish thinking on this subject.

Good thing that today, God is lifting this veil and it is not just the old and helpless. There are rabbis in Yeshivas in Jerusalem studying this and coming to faith. They get it.

There was a famous rabbi who died several years ago at 106 and he left a letter which was opened a year after his death, explaining from the Scriptures exactly why Yeshua is exactly who He said He was.

He quoted from Isaiah and explained how Messiah ben Joseph and Messiah ben David are one and the same. This man had a revelation and his information was available on a website for a while until some of the Jews got upset and took it down. I'm sure those who looked up to him have not forgotten.

His funeral was a huge parade to the Mount of Olives, so I'm sure he had quite a few followers. Those followers will have to look at the same questions now about Yeshua and the Father being absolutely echad.

Through Yeshua we have the forgiveness of sins and the restoration to our position in the Lord. He came to undo what the fall created. Only God Himself could defeat HaSatan and redeem the world for Himself, beginning with Israel.

Yeshua was the fulness of deity in bodily form. His decision to lay down His life for us, and it was His decision totally, is the most loving act anyone can do. Legally God made away to redeem the world because Satan had become prince of this world, once many violated God's instructions.

If we reject such a great salvation as the book of Hebrews says.

Heb. 2:2-4 For if the word spoken through angels proved unalterable, and cevery transgression and disobedience received a just dpenalty, ahow will we escape if we neglect so great a bsalvation? 1After it was at the first cspoken through the Lord, it was dconfirmed to us by those who heard, God also testifying with them, both by signs and wonders and by bvarious 1miracles and by 2cgifts of the Holy Spirit daccording to His own will.

Joyce
 
Susanna

I am glad to see there is no known association between the Washington/Oregon KKK of the 1920s-30s and Abraham Vereide. As a rabid anti-communist and anti-unionist, Vereide would have supported Sen. Brewster of Maine who aided McCarthy. Brewster's was infamous for his opposition to Howard Hughes. The Maine Senator was a Freemason, a group associated with the rise of the second KKK, but while he accepted KKK political support, Brewster always denied membership. Madsen offers little support for his allegations.

The connection between Paul Temple and Standard Oil is obvious, but do we know of any direct correlation between I.G. Farben and Temple? I womder if Temple is not directly connected to the Rockerfellar Fund or David Rockerfellar given the Standard Oil tie.
There is a peice missing.
 
Anonymous 3:17 AM

You are right. There are lots of pieces missing.

I am not totally unsympathetic with regard to certain misgivings you may have about Wayne Madsen's articles.

As you said, Madsen doesn't cite many sources for what he claims.

I used his article about the Fellowship Foundation as a starting off point for my research with a "keep the wheat and leave the chaff" proviso - something that Constance is always reminding us all to do so that we don't wind up throwing out the baby with the bath water.

The "wheat" is what I have been able to independently verify. The "chaff" was what I am as yet unable to independently verify.

The direct connection between Paul N. Temple and Abraham Vereide is, as I have said, supported not only by the Fellowship archives, but also by Paul N. Temple's own testimony.

Interestingly, in 2003, right after Jewish journalist Jeff Sharlet (who actually infiltrated The Family) published his book THE FAMILY, restrictions were placed on the Fellowship Archives limiting free access to all the documents.

Here is a link to the relevant Wheaton College page so you can see for yourself what I am talking about:

RECORDS OF THE FELLOWSHIP FOUNDATION - COLLECTION 459

http://www.wheaton.edu/bgc/
archives/GUIDES/459.htm

But here is a mystery.....that might possibly lead to one of the "missing pieces" you are alluding to.

According to the articles I have seen - including Madsen's - that cite the Fellowship Archives, Paul N. Temple's direct association to Abraham Vereide goes all the way back to 1944-1945.

However, according to the interview with Paul N. Temple featured in the World Business Academy-MERCHANTS OF VISION site, Temple claims that he didn't meet Vereide until about 1951 when his Princeton friend Jim Bell introduced him to Vereide.

So what was Temple doing in 1944?

At the World Business Academy site,
Temple begins by recalling the bombing of Pearl Harbor:

On December 7, 1941 I remember the great consternation of all the freshmen in this house. They all came around to ask me what did it mean that the Japanese had sunk so many of our ships in Pearl Harbor.

I didn't have a clue, but I tried to console them as best I could. As a result Princeton went onto a wartime basis almost immediately. Classes all year 'round. They also opened a Naval Officers Training group, V12, so I enrolled in that. We were in Navy whites and bell-bottom trousers. As a result I managed to complete all of the courses necessary for a degree, except for a few, and then when I went directly from
Princeton to Columbia Midshipmen's School (they turned out 120-Day Wonders).

Princeton gave me credit for a couple of the courses I took at Columbia, such as navigation and damage control. So after the war I never had to go back to Princeton to finish my studies. I received a degree in the mail! I never
participated in a graduation ceremony, but I have that certificatehanging around in my office today.

I went directly into active service from Columbia as a shavetail ensign USNR in February of 1944. I reported to Norfolk where boarded a Landing Ship Tank (LST) that joined a convoy heading for the Mediterranean.

____________________

Whether through mumps or some unspecified injury, Temple wound up having to have knee surgery
____________________

While on this kind of duty I caught the mumps and spent a couple of weeks in an army hospital in Naples. I think I caught them because I had inspected
the LST on the way across the Atlantic. There were a number of seamen who
had been exposed to the mumps before they reported on board. Just walking through that isolated compartment was enough to infect me. That was an interesting experience because, having the mumps, they wouldn't let you
walk around in the hospital. The mumps would sometimes migrate to unpleasant places. Practically every night we would first hear bombs dropping,and one came so close to the hospital the glass of water on the little table next
to my bed started waltzing around and fell on the floor. The sequence of events was that the bombs would drop, the anti-aircraft guns would start shooting, and then later on the air raid warning siren would go off. They had it exactly backwards.
Somehow we survived that experience and I went back to the little flotilla of LCI's. Before I came to the hospital my knee had become swollen. They took
X-rays and found out I had pieces of loose cartilage in the joint. Therefore to my
surprise my term of service in the landing craft proved to be much briefer than I had expected. I found myself on an airplane back to a base hospital in North
Africa, in Oran, Algeria, on the edge of the Sahara desert. I spent several months there. They decided that they didn't have anyone capable of operating on my
particular problem so eventually they gave me orders to fly back to a naval hospital in St. Albans, Long Island.
My shipmates were envious as could be. I felt bad about it at first. When I got back and told the story to my parents my father named my knee "Woodrow."
President Wilson had run for re-election on the slogan, "He kept us out of war."
I did have my knee operated on, and they never sent me back to Active Duty.
Instead they sent me out to Glenwood Springs, Colorado, to the old Hotel Colorado,and I spent the winter of 44/45 there as a patient. My only activity was
to get my knee massaged every day. I then took a bath in the hot spring pool.
Two or three times a week I taught a class to the seamen on national politics and things of that nature.
Finally I was surveyed back to duty. My orders came back to the effect that my services in a limited capacity (which is what they recommended) were not required and "you are hereby honorably discharged."
Again, here I was in mid-1945 totally unexpectedly out of the Navy.
I went back to Denver and got a job in the Remington Arms plant making fuses. I was a
safety inspector until the war was over.


http://www.worldbusiness.
org/fileadmin/
PublicationArticles/
Merchants.pdf
______________________________

Now guess who had taken control of Remington Arms in 1914?

PERCY ROCKEFELLER, nephew of John D. Rockefeller, who, along with Percy's father William Avery Rockefeller, Jr., founded Standard Oil! Hmmmmmmmm!

http://tinyurl.com/cmmzdn

http://tinyurl.com/cux68m

PERCY AVERY ROCKEFELLER

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Percy_Avery_Rockefeller
________________________________

During the Great Depression, Remington was purchased by the DuPont Corporation, which had made its fortune with improvements to gunpowder. Dupont also had ties to I.G. Farben during the War.

I.G. FARBEN
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IG_Farben

I.G. FARBEN TRIAL
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki
/IG_Farben_Trial
_______________________________

As for Vereide, he is said to have "won Prince Bernhard of the Netherlands for Christ."

One might be justified in wondering about Vereide's boast since Prince Bernhard was a leading wartime Nazi who is reported to have served as secretery to the board of directors of I.G. Farben.

It is truly fascinating to get into all the corporate "begats" here.

In any case, according to Jeff Sharlet - author of THE FAMILY - after the War, Vereide was a very busy boy:

In 1946, Vereide, too, toured the world, traveling with letters of introduction from a half dozen senators and representatives, and from Paul G. Hoffman, the director of the Marshall Plan. He traveled also with a mandate from General John Hildring, assistant secretary of state, to oversee the creation of a list of good Germans of “the predictable type” (many of whom, Vereide believed, were being held for having “the faintest connection” with the Nazi regime), who could be released from prison “to be used, according to their ability in the tremendous task of reconstruction.”...read more..

http://tinyurl.com/d2qmye

IMHO, this sounds like the principles by which "Operation Paperclip" functioned.....with the definition of "good German" being left open to whatever definition happened to fit the wickets at any given moment.

At the end of the day, we may never know with any certainty whether or not there was any direct relationship between I.G. Farben and Paul N. Temple.

But interestingly, after Temple graduated from law school in 1948, his first assignment was to a partner who spent full time working for Standard Oil of California (as Chevron was known in those days).

Because of my
experience in appellate argument in the law school I had thought that I might get involved in that kind of activity in a large law firm. But no, the partner I worked for spent most of his time reviewing debentures
and other legal documents. He was what they call a "flyspecker." So I
also spent most of my time reviewing legal documents for Standard Oil of California.
...

Given the aforementioned Remington Arms Rockefeller Dupont connection.....Hmmmmm!

Temple also knew Jim Bell at Princeton and claims that Jim Bell introduced him to Abraham Veriede.......in Washington.

Finally, with regard to I.G. Farben itself:

The Economic Power of I. G. Farben

Qualified observers have argued that Germany could not have gone to war in 1939 without I. G. Farben. Between 1927 and the beginning of World War II, I.G. Farben doubled in size, an expansion made possible in great part by American technical assistance and by American bond issues, such as the one for $30 million offered by National City Bank. By 1939 I. G. acquired a participation and managerial influence in some 380 other German firms and over 500 foreign firms. The Farben empire owned its own coal mines, its own electric power plants, iron and steel units, banks, research units, and numerous commercial enterprises. There were over 2,000 cartel agreements between I. G. and foreign firms — including Standard Oil of New Jersey, DuPont, Alcoa, Dow Chemical, and others in the United States, The full story of I,G, Farben and its world-wide ae-tivities before World War II can never be known, as key German records were destroyed in 1945 in anticipation of Allied victory. However, one post-war investigation by the U.S, War Department concluded that:

Without I. G.'s immense productive facilities, its intense re. search, and vast international affiliations, Germany's prosecution of the war would have been unthinkable and impossible; Farben not only directed its energies toward arming Germany, but concentrated on weakening her intended victims, and this double-barreled attempt to expand the German industrial potential for war and to restrict that of the rest of the world was not conceived and executed "in the normal course of business." The proof is overwhelming that I. G. Farben officials had full prior knowledge of Germany's plan for world conquest and of each specific aggressive act later undertaken ....3
....read more...

http://www.reformed-theology.org/html/books/
wall_street/chapter_02.htm

Truly a fascinating story, wouldn't you say?
 
Hello Constance. first a big thank you for putting your books free on line

I have posted the link for you books and your web site it was on a conspiracy site but don’t knock it that’s where I first heard about you lol.

Any way I found two links I think you should look at I can’t vouch for them it could be nothing, and I don’t want to waste anyone’s time. But if it’s true, it’s a worry.

Keep up the great work
All the best a new fan.

JERUSALEM – President Obama and his administration told Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas during a meeting last week the U.S. foresees the creation of a Palestinian state with Jerusalem as its capital, according to a top PA official speaking to WND.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=99664

Obama Says It's Time To Divide Jerusalem

http://filesfromtoni.blogspot.com/2009/05/obama-says-its-time-to-divide-jerusalem.html
 
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