Thursday, May 08, 2008

A Cashless, Barbaric, Tasered Society?


A New Tasered Barbaric Age?
Thursday, May 08, 2008
2:44 PM

A just released Canadian Broadcasting Corporation (CBC) story points to Canadian medical alarm over United States litigation by the manufacturers of the nefarious tasering device. Michigan has been considering a bill to allow unlicensed citizen use of these for self-defense. Many of us, seeing the sometimes too frequent police use of the delivery of the painful silencer are terrified at this prospect.

One source claims that there were 208 deaths nationally from Tasering in 2006.

The manufacturer of these devices filed a lawsuit and won a verdict that the coroner reports attributing the cause of death in significant part to the tasering had to be removed from the coroner reports. This is causing alarm in Canadian medical circles. It should cause deep concern among all right thinkers! Enforced judicial historical revisionism of death certificates -- this is a truly revolting development!

Quoting from the CBC story, we read:

"The U.S.-based manufacturer of the controversial stun guns, Taser International, has won a court order in Ohio that forces a medical examiner to change autopsy reports. Dr. Lisa Kohler had found that electrical shocks from Tasers were partially to blame for the deaths of three men in separate confrontations with police. Taser International launched and won a civil suit, forcing Kohler to delete any reference to the deaths being related to electric shocks, and to term them "accidental deaths."

Today, I am sitting in my annual ly attended family law seminar held by the local chapter of the American Academy of Matrimonial Lawyers. Our keynote speaker was Justice Maura Corrigan, Michigan's Chief Justice. She told us that she was on a task force to "track the underground economy." I have more than a passing fear that RFID or "Digital Angel" technology could be advanced as a solution.

Stay tuned!
interesting fox news article:

"'Women are coming to cast spells and do rituals and to impart wisdom to figure out how we're going to end war,' Zanne Sam Joi of Bay Area Code Pink told"
The "god" those women worship are going to give them "wisdom" , er, "get us out of the war" . . . Those poor, poor deluded women -- don't they realize that their "god" got us into it . . . Quoting the psalmist: All of the gods of the heathen are devils . . ."
The last post is DISGUSTING! From a card carrying member of the false gospel called ABC (Anything but Catholic)! !
I'm wondering if Catholic-baiting, New Age published Bro. Eric hasn't paid us a trolling visit. The second to last post sounds something like him!

Constance has a day job -- she doesn't solicit funds by fleecing the sheep and cannot dedicate herself to this 24/7 as those obviously can who are financed by selling their cheap propaganda and tapes to the gullible!

Referring to people such as Bro. Eric and Texe Marrs, two such examples of people trafficing in Catholic-baiting, Jew-hating propaganda!

The test of antichrist was a denial that Jesus was the Christ -- The New Age strategy to pit all monotheistic target groups off against each other was clear. I am seriously debating erasing the last nasty post by the one I suspect was Bro. Eric or one of his fellow travelers -- or in the alternative, I may leave it up as Exhibit A to show how low they will go!



What, precisely, is the undergound economy?


The underground economy would be a cash economy that is not reflected on the books. I can understand concerns over it -- but the cure could well be worse than that disease. The system set forth in Rev. 13 would probably be a sure fire method for "tracking the underground economy."
Rich of Medford and I chatted on the "Bright Blue Rose" piece that I find offensive. I talked with Dorothy about it as well. Dorothy thinks I should delete. Rich and I talked it over. Our observations: 1. The piece can only be described as "demonic"
2. Whoever posted it dared me to erase it -- I would play into his/her hands by doing so at this time.
3. The agenda is to cause dissension on this board.
4. I cannot take advice to forbid people to talk against religion because that would also play into the hands of New World Religion syncretists who would like to see us all harmonically blend into one.
5. So I guess the free but ugly speech will stand for now and God will judge its author and his/her motives.

I was going to bow out of your blog completely because of the nasty comments...but I would just like to put a few more cents in. I don't think that having doctrinal convictions means that we are pitting Protestants against Catholics. As I explained, I myself consider myself a "completed Jew" not a Protestant. I have been Catholic, Evangelical and after discovering my Jewish origins, God gave me a Jewish identity. It's something that He did. I didn't fabricate it. Hard to explain here, because it's been a long process, but clearly His Work.

I can only speak for myself and a few on the blog, I've communicated with directly. Some of us do not see disagreeing with Catholicism as an attack on any of the Catholics on the blog, but a strong doctrinal position against the teachings of the Catholic Church. That is something, I personally have prayed through, thought through for many, many years.

As a lawyer, I know that you have a great capacity to analyze things and you can read the doctrines of the Catholic Church and the Bible and compare the two. If some of the things the Catholic Church says are true, but many aren't, what do we say? Do we just ignore the rest of Scripture and overlook these contradictions?

I can speak for myself in saying that I really appreciate your contributions to exposing the New Age Movement and believe that they are important. The little I know, you took time from your law practice because you thought it was important enough to expose. Bravo for you. I really respect people who take stands on principle. Clearly, your motives were not financial.

I don't know your relationship to those on the blog who have taken offense. I'm guessing they are friends. Regardless, they are human beings and as a believer in Yeshua, I don't think any of us has a right to take shots at another person. My intent has never been to do that. Having said that, I do see biblical precedence for opposing false teachings, false prophets, religious leaders who mislead the masses, etc. I've seen Rick Warren criticized on this blog. I personally have many issues with what he's doing too, but I never saw anyone jump on the people who criticized him.

Why can we not criticize the Pope and the doctrines of the Roman Church? Are they above criticism? If someone wants to criticize the Methodists, the Presbyterians, some of the churches who are appointing gay pastors or doing gay marriage, would anyone here complain? I don't think so.

If this blog is about exposing that which is errant, that which is leading people astray, be it Catholicism or any Protestant denomination or Islam or Buddhism or yoga, etc, etc. let none of us be so sensitive here that we cannot listen to others views without taking it personally. I don't want to bash any person on this blog, but what if my perceptions about the Roman Catholic Church for example are right? What if someone else sees a problem with some other denomination, religion,etc.

In recent years I grew up in a tradition where the debates were lively, sometimes they almost split a group of people, but the issues were laid out on the table. Personally, if the Catholic Church or any other group becomes "untouchable" not in the Hindu sense, then we need to worry. We have lost our objectivity. You know as a lawyer, how dangerous this can be.

If we see dangers in something, like the Catholic Church or Rick Warren's teachings or XYZ group, then we should be free to express this respectfully otherwise I think we might be cutting ourselves off from important information about the prophetic events. Rav Shaul ( as opposed to Paul on this blog said) in his day there the spirit of antimessiah was already at work. He already saw the error that was coming in to the assemblies. There are 7 assemblies in the book of Revelations. There are all sorts of theories about what those represent, regardless we can see that there were problems with most of them, some more serious than others.

I take this as a warning that everyone out there who uses the name "Christian" or "Jesus" doesn't automatically have all the truth. If we want to be alert in the days ahead, I personally believe we may even need to consider our own doctrine and does it stack up totally with Scripture. Truth for me is based on the Scriptures period. Does that mean we don't read other sources of information? Absolutely not, but Scripture is the only basis to determine what is true. In the Last Days the only protection we have against error is the Bible.

Without the Bible, there is no New Age, there is no false messiah, there is no problem. The reason that
most of us are even here reading your blog, is because we read the Bible first and realize something is wrong.

I will respectfully preserve my right to write over 250 words, when I feel like it. I will respectfully preserve my right to criticize the Catholic Churches doctrines or any others for that matter that don't reflect the Scriptures. I will do that respectfully, but I will not tippy toe like I'm walking on eggshells at the expense of truth. Civility yes, holding back valuable evidence in a court of law, absolutely not.

Blessings to you in Yeshua,
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I wasn't "snuffed out". I just don't want to waste my time listening to comments like the one you just made, and I do consider it a waste of time, because then I am forced to exercise Biblical forgiveness which we are told to do 70X7, by Yeshua. I forgive you Rose, for your persistently cutting comments...but I don't think it proves anything, and it doesn't uphold a testimony of Messiah for the few on this blog that don't know HIm.

It's easy to do that. In my days before knowing Yeshua, I was the master.. I had some very good training in sarcasm. As a follower of Yeshua, I try to follow His example. Since I'm not God, I do fall short..I admit.

I'll repeat to you that I will reserve my right to speak on this blog respectfully about any subject that I believe is relevant. You can exercise your right to not read my "lengthy" comments if they annoy you too much.

Blessings to you in Messiah Yeshua,

We are free to disagree on religion, on politics, but let's keep the discussion within civil bounds and not stray into personal rudeness. I remind all that Jesus said whoever said unto his brother "Raca," meaning "you fool" was in danger of hellfire.

Re-read the Apostle Paul's warnings on charity (no, not giving all to the poor -- but a charitable, forgiving spirit) and the book of James about an out of control tongue.

I am going to be speaking to a Messianic Jewish congregation within this month.

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Constance, if you want to let others hijack your comments section, there is nothing I can do to stop it.

If you wanted to let someone track mud into your office on a daily basis, it would be your right to let it happen, but others might just say that you've let your office become a pigsty.

If a poster got a bug up his nose and ranted on a daily basis that drinking milk was a sign of promotion of the New Age movement and that the animal rights movement was the only way to go, it would be your right to let it continue. However, others just might believe you are letting it go on because that is what you believe and you are just letting the poster carry your water.

Let me remind you why there is such a thing as censorship. It is because once an idea enters someone's mind, it cannot be dislodged. If it is a bad idea, it festers there until strong efforts are made to dislodge it. During the time it is lodged there, it picks away saying Maybe It's True..... Maybe Catholic beliefs are nasty and untrue and people who believe them are fools who cause trouble in the world. What should we do to stop the troublemakers. Substitute Jewish for Catholic in the above sentence for the same effect.

Those who study the Holocaust learn what those who lived through the start of it didn't realize. IDEAS HAVE CONSEQUENCES. You might be thinking what harm can the ideas of a Joyce and others do. After all, they say they don't hate. Well, the ideas are picked up by others who are, let us say, less intellectual in their approach to changing the world. These individuals can and will destroy lives based on the ideas of others.

As things go along, it will be out of your hands whether you are seen as one who values endless freedom of speech or whether you will be known by the company you keep on the blog.

Over the long period of time I have known you I've completely respected your integrity and strength of character. I've promoted your writings in numerous places and to numerous individuals. Never once has anything caused me to doubt your judgment.

What you research and write yourself can be trusted implicitly. I know you have no hidden agenda and just want to see the truth out, not to bring glory to yourself but to help others learn of the deceit and manipulations of others who would rob all of us of our freedoms. I wish you would apply the same high standards to the comments section.

"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand."

Ephesians 6:12-13
As a long time quiet observer of this blog, I have to ask this question of all of you:

Why has this "J" person (or "Joyce") been allowed to hijack this blog?

This person is being allowed to continue to write these lengthy diatribes (ad nauseam) for weeks now, in an attempt to convince others that her belief system is superior to the belief systems of traditional Protestant believers, traditional Catholic believers and traditional Jewish believers.

Has it gone unnoticed that her approach is very similar to the way that New Agers approach traditional believers? They also try to convince "traditionalists" why they need to abandon their traditional beliefs.

Is everyone on this blog that easily intimidated or manipulated by this neighborhood "blog bully"?

One of the signs of a genuinely religious person is that you can just feel the love coming from that person. Sorry, "J" but many of us just "don't feel the love" coming from your writings.

Maybe it's about time that someone stood up and announced that "the emperor isn't wearing any clothes."
Happy to hear that Constance. Where are you speaking? I have sent your blog to some of my Messianic friends, as well as some of my Evangelical and other friends( Greek Orthodox, Catholic, Jews etc).

I know one lady who survived Auschwitz, but prior to following Yeshua, she was heavily into New Age. She is a dear sweet lady, who has forgiven the Nazis for all the horrors that they did to her and her family. It's amazing to see God's grace in her life..

It breaks my heart that most of my Jewish friends from my childhood are following New Age now..They are either running yoga places or follow New Age mysticism. Most of them were cultural Jews. They would sort of celebrate Hanuakah, Passover, Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur, and it end there.

I have challenged them with things from Torah and just remembering who they are as "Israel" to try to make them reflect a bit, but I don't even know if they really know the Torah. A lot of people just forget their true identity, sad....

I'll be interested to hear how your time there goes, if you feel like sharing.

Shabbat shalom,
Anon 5:12
I loved her postings.
Thank you Constance for giving her space to define, by scripture, her view on the foundations which make research into the New Age Movement reasonable. Hyperbole is sometimes a lie.
Talk about lessons on "how to manipulate others":

Have any of you observed how "Joyce" will post something; then she will follow that up with an "anonymous post" which sounds amazingly like she's posing as herself as her own biggest "fan"?

Dear anon. 6:21

How in the world would you know that?
You wouldn't, period.
In fact Joyce has posted what's in
her heart and what's in the Bible so if
you disagree just say so and say why
but there's no need to fire off wild
shots hoping you might hit something.
You're a liar.

The level of maturity needs to come up a notch here.

To anonymous, whoever you are that thinks I need to do that, you must be awfully bored. I'm not. My life is full and blessed, and my joy comes from knowing Yeshua, not from some external praise I get from the same token, I am not affected by the insults I get from others, because my identity is secure in Him.

As it says in the book of Romans, it is not longer me who lives but Messiah who lives in me. In a nutshell, I am dead and Yeshua lives in me. Sometimes the flesh kicks in if I am not abiding in Him. Hard concepts to understand if you are not living in that place of "face to face delight". My only comment is that it is truly a place of joy and peace..

The only person I want to glorify is Yeshua HaMashich. Just happens that there are others on the blog that love Him too..sorry if that bothers you. God asked Israel to be a light to the nations, and I am part of Israel, so I try to spread the light of Messiah wherever I go, not only on the blog here.

May Yeshua bless you beyond measure so you whoever you are will understand how ,
Shabbat shalom, whoever you are,
the "real" Joyce
thanks Paul, we must have posted simultaneously.
I posted twice by accident trying to correct a mistake..
I wonder what Mr Solana is doing
about Myanmar. I wonder how he'll
spin it and what will be done at his
command. I wonder why the answer
so far is a big NOTHING.

I have a question for you.
Rose, here's some more info
about me for your dossier.

Maybe Joyce and Rose should consider that perhaps the Catholic Church is one big synagogue:

1) Eat the Paschal lamb with bitter herbs = THE EUCHARIST

2) Drink the passover wine = THE CUP

3) The Jewish Mother = Catholics "Blessed Mother" which they HONOR, NOT worship (after all, don't most Protestants believe they are going to receive a crown and that Enoch, Moses, and Moses at least were in heaven -- WHY NOT THE LADY WHO BORE AND RAISED JESUS AS A LITTLE CHILD?

4) Circumcision = INFANT BAPTISM

5) BLESSED ARE YOU LORD GOD . . . similar opening for both Catholic and Jewish rites . . .

Just a few things for everybody to chew on . . . by somebody whose been both places and thinks they get it!

I'm intrigued by the cashless society because I think it is useful in the scenario found in Revelation. Did your colleague discuss any conclusions they might have reached? My husband is involved in putting one of the pieces into place for a more cashless society. I know of several people who barter services and goods off the books. Is that included in the perview of your colleague's work?


Joyce (7:15 AM) states:
"it is no longer me who lives but Messiah who lives in me . . . I am dead and Yeshua lives in me."

Yes, and that's someting else that New Agers teach: "I am God."

Just keep on talking, Joyce and you will keep revealing more and more about who you really are.

Your silence in regard to a post that Constance and Rich have quite correctly described as "demonic," and that references three contributors here (inclusive of Constance) is quite deafening.

I realize it's a lot easier to just turn away. After all, it's directed at three specific people, not you personally.

If your silence in the face of this kind of disgusting behavior is any indication of how you value this forum, then it is going to degenerate into something you don't recognize more quickly than you can say "boo," and you will deserve whatever you get.

After all, why bother to take a stand on anything that doesn't concern "you" directly?
Dorothy, er, anon. 11:29
That's the same thing you said to me
a while back. Then you continued saying
it in response to whatever I said.
It means nothing and accomplishes
If Joyce's quote from the Bible
sounds to you like someone saying
"I am God", then now I understand
how paranoid you are. No wonder.
No wonder you've run amok with
accusations of so many who
don't deserve it.

I'm glad you don't have a Taser.
You don't, do you ?

Here is my e-mail also. My adversaries already have it, why not my friends? -Rudi
Brother Paul @12:00,

I have a question about your faith journey.

Do you consider your posts here as examples of the Holy Spirit moving in your life?

Are they examples of the fruits of the spirit (Galatians 5:22-23)?

I'm just wondering.
How sad and disheartening all of the infighting and bickering has become.
Please - do not attempt to say "I am standing up for the faith" - or "the good fight" because most of what I have read on this sight for a short while now has "I" and "ME" written all over them.
May the Lord Jesus Christ give us all the wisdom to deal kindly wioth each other - as brothers and sisters should.
Make no mistake about it - when the Lord returns - or we meet Him on our own - each and everyone of us will have somethings being straightened out.
If your perception is this is not a true statement, you are mistaken.

Dear Anonymous 7:15. I hate to break it to you but I quoted from the book of Galatians. Rav Paul wrote that:

Gal. 2:20 “I have been crucified with Christ; and it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself up for me.

I made a mistake before saying it was in Romans. I was thinking of this verse, which is thematically similar:

Rom. 6:8 ¶ Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him,

The idea of dying to ourself and living for Him, is a central theme of the faith. The Holy Spirit ( Ruach HaKodesh) lives in us. Our mortal bodies become the temple of the Holy Spirit. So therefore when we crucify our flesh i.e. don't let our flesh control us, we are then walking in the fruits of the Holy Spirit which are peace, joy, patience, long-suffering, etc.

Unlike the New Age concept of "becoming gods" we are very clear on the fact that God is God and we're not, but we do have intimate dwelling with Him. We are in "face to face" relation with our Creator. We are clean vessels because Yeshua's blood has cleansed us, therefore permitting God's Spirit to reside in us.

Shalom in Yeshua,
Hi Constance - I find the revision of death certificates to hide taser deaths abominable - TFS.

I too found this party plan method of selling tasers to women in Denver equally disgusting;

It must be a week for this kinda news as it also came to my attention this week that yet more shops/stores in the UK no longer accept the good ole fashioned cheque/check!

The link below's to an old story but the impact is beginning to hit home;

To Paul (12:00 PM):

I hate to be the one to tell you this, but I am not "Dorothy."

Tell me, do you lay awake nights staring at the ceiling thinking thoughts such as, "The paranoids are out to get me"?

If so, maybe it's time to ask your doctor to give you a prescription for that.

I really do hope you feel better soon.

From "Anonymous" (11:29 AM)
Hey Rose (commenting on your last two posts on the previous thread, currently set at counter 131).

My dad used to say "Never engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed person." After reading this thread (starting with the Sockpuppet post) I now understand why.
To Joyce (12:22 PM)

Whew - thank you so much for "straightening" (?) this out for all of us.

We were beginning to think you were posting "New Age speak" such as "I am God; you are God; the God within," etc.

You were beginning to sound like a "spy" or a "plant" among us with your daily persistent, aggressive postings.

And none of us wants to believe that could ever happen here, do we?
"Faith journey"
I like that. It give you away before you start.
My "faith tradition journey"
would have been even better.
Your head is full of "Pop Psych 101".

Anon. 1:51

Spoken like a true "spy" or
"plant": divisive, and primitive.

"You will deserve whatever you get"?
Is that a threat ?
I sign all my posts. What are you
afraid of ?

Anyway !
If J.Solana can't subdue a military
regime in Myanmar, or doesn't care
to, what good is he ?
I'd say this is going to be his finest
Or, another missed opportunity.

Paul, with nothing to hide.
1:52 to the Anonymous poster. Yes, happy to do that any time. Do you want any other verses about what it means to be "in Messiah". We are also seated with Him in the heavenlies, and everything is under His feet, so in Him we have victory over the powers of darkness, but only in Him. That's why it's so important to be "in Messiah Yeshua". I can do all things through Him who strengthens me...that's another quote from the Bible.

I could go on and on about all the wonderful promises for those who are called to His purposes. The best part is that one day we will have resurrected bodies, like He did, so death has no sting for those of us who know Messiah Yeshua. One day at the sound of the last trumpet ( Yom T'ruah..Feast of Trumpets), the dead in Messiah will rise and all that are still alive will meet Him in the air....It doesn't stop.

Satan, roams around like a lion seeking to see who he can devour and destroy. Yeshua defeated the forces of darkness...that includes those of the New Age Movement. They are already defeated by His finished work on the tree.

Because He defeated the powers of darkness and made an open and public display of them we know that our victory, in HIM ( emphasis) is certain.

God has not given us a spirit of fear, but of power,love and sound mind.

His Word is a lamp to my feet and a light to my eyes.

The fear of God is the beginning of Wisdom...proverbs...etc, etc.

and, on and on and on....So even if we suffer for the sake of His name, we can rejoice, because He counts us worthy to participate in His sufferings. Paul suffered. He was in prison, he was beaten, but He never, ever stopped proclaiming Yeshua crucified...the hope of glory.

I just lost two dear old friends this week. I will miss them, but am so glad that they are in the presence of God because they placed their hope, not in their own righteousness ( which the Bible says is like filthy rags) but in the righteousness of Yeshua.

When we are covered with His righteousness, our Father sees us as His beloved children....our old worldly identity as sinners is dead, now we are seen through the righteousness of Yeshua...What an amazing blessing.. Just want to give you who are interested, hope which will remind you how to stand against the New Age Movement.

We don't weep as the world weeps. We weep for our momentary loss, knowing that the hope of eternity is so very much greater.

I don't like the NAM, but the Bible says that in the last days many deceivers will come and in 2 Peter it says that we are to grow in the truth & knowledge of Him. This knowledge will not be useless. It's not just head knowledge, it's heart knowledge that will protect us all in the days ahead and make us fruitufl, no matter what happens!!

Our Father has always had a plan to restore the Garden. He knew, that we, in our own power, could not defeat the evil one. That is why, Yeshua, the Word who became flesh, the Living Torah came and lived a blameless life, which enables us not to proclaim victory of sin and death!!!

There is no Temple, no animal sacrifices, but God did not leave us without a means to draw close ( korban) to Him. He left us His precious Son, the High Priest who cleansed our sin in the heavenly realm once and for all. All we have to do is appropriate what He has done for us and then we have the right to be called sons and daughters of the Most High God. The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, who is faithful to ALL of His promises. We really can rejoice in that!

Death has a way of making one reflect on such things, so please bear with my little reflection....

Resting this Shabbat in the finished work of Yeshua,
Shabbat Shalom, Joyce

which enables us not to proclaim victory of sin and death!!!

Little correction here. "which enables us to proclaim victory over sin and death".

Sometimes, I'm a little dyslexic or my mind goes faster than my fingers....
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Thanks Paul, Shabbat shalom to you too!!
AMEN Joyce!!

Can someone please tell me why Joyce is attacked so much? All her posts is full of Biblical truth. Keep up the good work Sister. Stand strong in our Lord!
You answered your own question.
Her comments are full of Biblical
truth. They hated Jesus then and they
hate him now. He is the Word made flesh.
He is the AUTHOR and finisher of
the faith.

This doesn't appear to me to be
infighting but rather good vs. evil.

All right I'm done for today. I
obviously had the day off.

-In Jesus son of Joseph AND
Jesus son of King David

Wickus (3:54 PM) stated, "Can someone please tell me why Joyce is attacked so much? All her posts is full of Biblical truth."

Yes, well the Anti-Christ is also going to be an "expert" on the Bible. So, do not be deceived by anyone and everyone simply because that person quotes scripture. It takes a lot more than words. It's also about a person's actions, behavior and attitude toward others that are much more revealing than the words that come out of a person's mouth.
Yes, Paul (4:23 PM) - this is all about "good vs. evil." It's just that now, unlike during the Wild West era, the good guys are often wearing "black" hats and the bad guys are often wearing "white" hats.

"The Great Deception" is out in full force.

Satan has got to be loving every minute of reading this blog.

Congratulations to all of you provocateurs!

If you read this thread (currently at 52 comments) and yesterday's, you will see that your admonitions are being ignored. The Jew-baiting and Catholic-baiting continue here unabated--all in the name of Jesus Christ.

As the owner of this forum, it is your right to set standards, but if you don't take measures to see that those standards are followed, your website will descend into a distant cousin of It's already well on its way to becoming just that.

Many people who participate here, and others who lurk, would very much like to see that happen.

Rose, I had computer issues that prevented me from getting to it sooner and I had air time -- I am going to read the spots carefully and will make some decisions then. Thanks for the heads up and I pray everybody will maintain civility on this blogspot! I'm a lawyer, not a policeman!

I am begging EVERYBODY on this blogspot to LIGHTEN UP! If for no other reason, for the sake of my sanity! The good Lord gave us a sense of humor as a safety valve. Let's all exercise it!

Yes, Javier Solana, Maurice Strong, Barbara Marx Hubbard, Marilyn Ferguson, David Spangler, etc. must be rolling on the floor laughing now -- they could not have created better chaos for Constance than the participants on this free for all blogspot have already done!

Just a suggestion, but what about establishing a new rule:

That comments have to be brief and related only to the subject of the particular "thread" that you have set up for discussion?
Except, what would happen to many of Dorothy's off topic links to other news? Do you really want to do without those? That would eliminate Dawn's post at the top of this thread.
Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said on Thursday that the state of Israel is a "stinking corpse" that is destined to disappear, the French news agency AFP reported.

"Those who think they can revive the stinking corpse of the usurping and fake Israeli regime by throwing a birthday party are seriously mistaken," the official IRNA news agency quoted Ahmadinejad as having said.

"Today the reason for the Zionist regime's existence is questioned, and this regime is on its way to annihilation."

Ahmadinejad further stated that Israel "has reached the end like a dead rat after being slapped by the Lebanese" - referring to the Second Lebanon War in the summer of 2006.

This said, just as Lebanon is on the brink of civil war - no surprise, Iran blames Israel and Olmert is in trouble (destablizing Israel)

Spare us a repeat of last summer.
New Rule:

Comments must be limited to topic of board or breaking news and/or give links to comments.

For the record: All of my life so far, I have survived avoiding pettiness and crowds, wherever possible. This board has gotten very, very petty.

I think we all need to lighten up and to use the vernacular, "get a life."

Joyce, I fear you may be mixing a little Manifest Son of God Theology in with your messianic Judaism. I would study that carefully -- I had material about that in my second book, A PLANNED DECEPTION. They teach that Eve fell from a spiritual state to which we can reattain by use of such techniques as visualization and guided imagery (or by singing the same song over and over and over until we float into a trance) and the bottom line is that we come out accepting the MSOG newest "revelation": that we are gods ourselves.

The Catholics may not be perfect but the orthodox Catholics certainly do have it straight who God is -- they know the difference between God and us-- the MSOG - Sonship Movement has certainly blurred the line between man and God by claiming we have already moved into the heavenlies.

Interestingly, I have a MSOG pamphlet bragging about these developments by Bill Britton. I first learned about the MSOG movement in a pamphlet by a New Ager: Ernest Ramsey of the Unity Founders' Church of Kanasa City, MO. He was inspired to write it after Benjamin Creme spoke in his church. His pamphlet spoke of the MSOG mystery school techniques and that they had changed the New Age concepts to Judeo/Christian terminology substituting the "Age of Aquarius" with "Feast of Tabernacles" and "Year of Jubilee."

You might want to explore this.

Suggested topics and reasons for them are also welcome.

I HATE CENSORSHIP -- always have, always will.


Let's not become what we ourselves despise -- we can rebut and we can answer -- as a lawyer I'm trained to do just that . . . I don't want a milquetoast, ladies' tea society here either -- pretty soon the ladies get bored and lapse into Theosophy -- witness HPB, AAB, etc.

Ohhh well, Aaarrrrrgh!!!

For the appropos Javier Solana Myanmar question by Paul:

There is a new age slogan of crisis = opportunity"

My guess is that this is a dandy opportunity to further global governance of which Dr. Solana is one of the key global players, if not THE key global player.

Some food for thought in this quote from New Ager Brian McLaren, the sentiment he expresses might
have been expressed in some posts here recently.

"Likewise, Brian McLaren has been forging new orthodoxies for a New Spirituality in his aptly-named Emergent church movement. In order for Christians to "emerge" (p. 299) -- what McLaren refers to as a "deep shift in context" (p. 43) -- they must give up their belief system that is mentally ill. They must abandon their "threats of hell" which "seem a little defensive, deranged, out of touch, manic, or embarrassed" in order to have a more "vibrant form of the Christian faith that is holistic, integral, and balanced." (p. 34) McLaren portrays the "typical Christian believer" as "tense, judgmental, imbalanced, reactionary, negative, and hypocritical." (p. 33) Definitely not the picture of mental health!"

When those of us here that quote the Scriptures to counter New Age false spirituality, and take heat for standing on the Scriptures alone as true, we do so in light of knowing the New Agers like McLaren are the source of the attitudes we get in response to our stand for truth.

We can take the heat, the label on out asbestos underwear says, " Made at Calvary"...

Meant "our" not "out"...appologoies for the typo...

Dear Counselor, Constance...
You will have to tolerate this one lengthy post as I defend myself against the accusation that you made.

I strongly object to your very distorted interpretation of my comments. I will quote you and then directly underneath I will quote the book of Ephesians, so you can understand the exact book I am writing from. You should be familiar with the verse.

I can lighten up a lot and have quite a great sense of humor, but not when I see remarks like this. I confess, it really gets me really makes me furious. I have gotten numerous comments from people on your blog who have been very happy to see my defense of the Scriptures. Interesting that that bothers you. I was giving you benefit of the doubt, but I'm afraid you haven't given me the same.

Constance you may be a lawyer, you may be knowledgeable about the New Age Movement, but your interpretation of my quote from Ephesians is blatantly false...and more than I find it shocking that you would make a remark and thereby undermine the Word of God. It's not responsible of you.

I was talking about our New Identity in Messiah Yeshua, or Jesus, or however you like to express that and if you didn't understand that then it would be good to read what the first couple of Chapters of Ephesians says..that's Paul, Rav Shaul who wrote that book, so if you don't like it, argue with him not me...I was only quoting him.

"Joyce, I fear you may be mixing a little Manifest Son of God Theology in with your messianic Judaism. I would study that carefully -- I had material about that in my second book, A PLANNED DECEPTION. They teach that Eve fell from a spiritual state to which we can reattain by use of such techniques as visualization and guided imagery (or by singing the same song over and over and over until we float into a trance) and the bottom line is that we come out accepting the MSOG newest "revelation": that we are gods ourselves."

even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. Ephesians 2:5-7

I NEVER talked about guided imagery or trances. I did read your book, but if you will forgive me, I would rather devote more time to studying the Bible which is God's truth. The Bible says that we are "seated in the heavenlies" in Yeshua, meaning that He has already defeated the works of darkness. It has absolutely NOTHING to do with guided imagery. It is a spiritual reality of our NEW CREATION identity in Him which we must appropriate i.e. take hold of in faith so as to walk in the truth that we are not defeated by the attacks fo the enemy. i.e. IN MESSIAH YESHUA, we have victory over sin and death, because HE became our substitutionary sacrifice. HE became the Second Adam who stood against Satan by living a blameless life and is now elevated at the right hand of God. IN HIM, we appropriate this victory of the CROSS over the powers of sin and death. This is the whole point of the Gospel. That's what makes it good news.. did I miss something?

I am afraid Constance, you are participating on the wrong side, on this one. Please go study the passage and come back to me if you like...

Excuse my strong language, but I stand up for Scripture and really take exception to someone accusing me of otherwise....that is called being an "accuser of the brethren". It looks like this blog is dedicated to driving away Bible believers.... very, very sad. All the study of New Age won't do a thing for someone if they don't know Yeshua and His Word well, and especially in our day! I would appreciate you leaving this comment so others will be clear on where I stand in case they had any doubts.

Praying for you,
One more comment about being "seated in the heavenlies" . IT is positional truth. We have a new identity and a position, which means that IN MESSIAH YESHUA, we are already victorious over the works of the devil because of what HE did on the tree, thus our position of victory is with Him, already seated in the heavens...We are not literally there, obviously, nor do we use "guided imagery". There are spiritual realities that Yeshua's death accomplished for us, one of these is victory over Satan if we abide ( key) in Him. Now for those who still believe in Purgatory, like I used to you can reflect on this...It's not NEW AGE, it's the Bible 101.

Death and sin have been defeated and we can "rest in HIm" i.e. the true meaning of Shabbat, His rest.

God made the world in 6 days on the seventh He rested, because from the foundations of the world He chose us to be holy and blameless in His sight. It was accomplished already at the foundations of the earth because God is sovereign and knew what His redemption plan for us would be. Yeshua was there at the beginning.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being. In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it. John 1:1-5

This is a direct reference back to Bereshit/ Genesis:

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Gen 1:1. The reason God rested on the seventh day is because everything He needed to do was already done in advance, and thus the Shabbat. We can rest because HE rested. HE completed His work. That's our confidence in Yeshua. What did Yeshua say when HE was crucified, "IT IS FINISHED" There was nothing to add to His perfect work. He defeated Satan. All that was left, was to believe and walk in believing faith in obedience. ( our sanctification).

Yeshua was there in the beginning, but He came incarnate to redeem us, because of the Fall in the Garden.. God wants to restore us to that place of His delight..In the New Jerusalem He will, but in the meantime, we appropriate the promises of our "identity in Messiah and positional realities in the spiritual battle against Satan, who is defeated when Yeshua made an open and public display of the works of darkness at the cross... Satan still has a little time of activity on planet earth, but very soon he will be finished completely and all who follow him.

Just want to be very clear..
Thank you for your patience with my lengthy post, but that was important.
Since 1982 you've been saying the New Age movement is growing in this country, the US, and that that the New Age movement is antisemitic and anti-Catholic. Unlike you, I think that is true.

You wrote that the New Age movement is a resurgence of Nazism. Unlike you, I believe that is true.

The Nazi movement was a haven for those who professed Christianity while being anti-Catholic and antisemitic.

For the moment there is one Catholic and one Jew posting here amongst a sea of rock throwers. Both of us have taken a stand against the New Age movement which you profess to expose.

1937 is much too late to say that you are against censorship. Either you are against the New Age movement or you are just out to explain it. Are you going to wait until after the war when Christians will be offed before you are really against the New Age movement?

Do you really expect that Rose and I will somehow keep providing the illusion that there is freedom of speech when no one else is speaking out where antisemitism and anti-Catholicism is concerned? Even you don't want to take a firm stand, except for some generalities.

For the moment forget Europe and the ideas coming out of the EU and take a look at what is happening on this blog.

Just checking in -- need to get home for sleep - left office at 4 a.m. yesterday and here at 1 a.m. tonight (Saturday morning) - pray for me!

For the record, I do recognize bad spirits of self-righteousness when I see them -- humility is a wonderful jewel before God -- I'm seeing a lot of pride from people who have not read my books nor know what my life work has been about. I believe everybody is entitled to one kind warning and after that, I'm not going to beat people over the head with repetition. Joyce, you are beating people over the head and the spirit does not appear to be all that kind nor humble to me. I could be wrong and I sincerely hope I am. I love a lively dialogue as much as anybody.

Joyce, you are a prolific writer -- you can have your own blogspot for free. I would even be happy to link to it, but the extremely long diatribes need to stop.

I know my Bible -- almost cold -- and I for one find offensive your repeated suggestions that maybe I don't because I'm not out there floating in the heavenlies with you yet -- unfortunately, our earthly work has yet to be completed as to the personal chores God gave us and the second coming has not occurred YET --hopefully soon, but God's got the big picture, I've got the little one and I'm in no position to second guess Him -- neither, frankly are you.


As you were writing your persistent and incorrect remarks about anti-Semitism, I was sitting with a dear Jewish friend, who is not by the way a believer in Yeshua, but a dear, dear friend nonetheless. If you were refer to me, I guess you forgot I'm Jewish too, like you. I had a big part of my family killed in the Shoah. I am not anti-semitic, but maybe you ought to ask yourself are you anti-Bible believer or anti-Messianic Jew. Maybe you don't like the idea that I believe in Yeshua as Messiah. That my dear Dorothy is not anti-Semitism. If you are referring to someone else please ignore my remarks.

I'm not anti-Catholic people either. I spend time with Catholic friends too. They know what I believe and I know what they believe and that's no big deal. Stop confusing belief system with liking people. I can separate those two things. I hope you will learn to do that too.
Shabbat shalom,
Dorothy, I still believe the New Age Movement is a resurgence of Nazism. I also believe that it is so pervasive that people have to be warned -- kindly and gently in some cases, perhaps shock treatment in others. The New Age Movement is a big picture -- but the global governance end of it is now so powerful and these petty diversions on my own blogspot are keeping me from properly focusing on necessary research and writing. I don't have foundation backing nor am I wealthy, as both of us well know -- but for now, I AM VERY FRUSTRATED and VERY TIRED.

I have tried to fight the good fight on this one -- but I also cannot ignore the plain Biblical prophecies, even though Joyce seems to think I don't know them -- that I am not presently "seated in the heavenlies" -- Forgive me, all!



I respectfully disagree with you on this one.
The insight Joyce has been sharing here, and the teachings of the MSOG have nothing in common except for using the Hebrew name for Jesus. Joyce is Jewish and has studied the scripture from a Jewish understanding of the text. There are many Jewish believers who share the same understanding of the scriptures. There are many solid Gentile Christian pastors and students who have studied the scriptures with Jews who are former Rabbis, who have come know Jesus as their expected Messiah. What Joyce has been sharing would not seem at all strange to them.
This battle is the Lord's. He's got us ALL covered.

"He maketh me to lie down in green pastures: he leadeth me beside the still waters. He restoreth my soul: he leadeth me in the paths of righteousness for his name's sake." Psalm 23
I would suggest you go reread all of my comments and first find out how the attack on my comments started in the first place several weeks agoo. You may not have understand that. As for my humility or lack thereof, I will leave that to God to judge, thank you. You cannot judge another's heart, so please don't judge mine..I don't think that I attacked your character and would appreciate the same respect.

You accused me of New Age thinking, which is not only ludicrous but very, very offensive. You may have dedicated your life to studying the New Age, but right now you have consistently put down someone on your blog that quotes from the Bible. I suppose if I quoted from Barbara Marx Hubbard, no one would complain. If you don't recognize the spiritual battle on your blog for truth, others do. The battle comes as soon as the Bible is quoted, because it is offensive to some here. I'm so glad the Scriptures offended me or I wouldn't be "in Messiah" today.

By the way, most of Hebraic thought has to do with
word pictures. It's not "visualization" it's hebraic thinking which is very concrete in some ways i.e. thus Yeshua is "the bread of life" . Is He made with flour and water and yeast....Heavens no. This is how most of Scripture teaches us Biblical concepts. We don't picture Him as a loaf of bread. We understand that HE meant, He is life as wheat grows is harvested and then mixed with water, baked , it is then eaten and is our sustenance... This is not New Age thinking either. It's a Hebraic way of teaching. God is teaching us about the heavenly and early realm. He has bridged the two through Yeshua. You remember Jacob's ladder with the angles ascending and descending. Angels can be New Age too, but in that story, they are not. God is always trying to connect us to Him. He wants to dwell with us.. That is the whole point of Yeshua's doing what HE did!!!

I didn't use the expression seated in the heavenly realms. Paul did, a Hebrew of Hebrews a Pharisee of Pharisees. He might have just been talking in a Jewish way. In fact most Jews see the Newer Covenant as a great commentary on Torah. They understand this language. I know rabbis who do see this...if they're honest enough to admit it.

If I lift up my name, then that's one thing, but all I have done here is lift of the name of Yeshua and His Word, and for that now I am being demonized...The only reason I wrote my name in the fist place is because someone asked me too. So obviously, my name is not important in this issue, what is is the Word of God.

I don't want my own blog. I commented on your blog after reading it for a little while for the first time a few weeks ago and the Dorothy, Rose, RL team pulled out there guns and started shooting. I meant and did NO HARM to them whatsoever, or at least didn't have any intention of doing harm and apologized for any unintended harm. Neither of them has apologized to

I have given you the benefit of the doubt, but your last comment, and the one before are totally off base and maybe when you get some rest, you'll be able to look back and see what I am talking about. I've been tired and sometimes misread things, so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say maybe you misread my comments and took them out of context. It happens.

I understand a Jewish non-believer in Yeshua attacking me for using Scripture. I understand even a Catholic, but this is what I would call"friendly fire". Please refrain from accusing me of New Age, because I have helped people come out of New Age thinking. I don't just write about it, I practice it, so if your comments irked me there's a good reason. Not going to go into it any further on the blog....but I do confess I'm disappointed.. No one said we are "floating in the heavenlies" At least I didn't !We are seated according to Paul, not me. Sorry for quoting Scriptures here, but that's where I am today, seated in the heavenlies with Yeshua...

I will pray for you because I do think that in some ways there is a spiritual battle going on on your blog, and I hope you can recognize it as such.

Blessings to you in Yeshua,

As I said in HDR:

1. Jews are New Age targets.
2. Catholics are New Age targets.
3. Evangelical and fundamentalist Christians are New Age targets.

The point I was making was that the New Agers wanted all of these to fight with each other so they could be the phoenix to arise from the ashes. I never wrote that the target was JUST Catholics and Jews.

watch what is happening here. It's not a matter of whose knowledge is superior because this is not a battle between theologians. Joyce and her followers are not posting where her views can be academically reviewed.

What is happening is what Nietzsche described as a battle of wills. The Nazis liked this idea. It was that whoever had the most powerful will was the Darwinist who had the right to take over those with weaker wills.

Sorry Joyce. As far as I am concerned, this is a Rumpelstilskin moment. Some may know what I'm talking about.


I write this to you in this public forum because I cannot find your email address anywhere at the blog.

1. You are being used and manipulated by a few folks who post here. Dorothy and I have both tried to intervene to keep the blog focused, and to keep it from being completely taken over by Joyce (and the folks who express their support for what she writes--Paul obviously, and Rudi apparently (Et tu, Rudi?).

Dorothy has done this because she has had your back for over twenty years. I've done it because I admire your work and the way you go about getting your work out--and what I am able to discern about your character from listening to you speak and reading your words. As a Christian I am proud to call you one as well.

Unfortunately there have been consequences for both Dorothy and myself in standing up. I advised you before to take a quick look at the post from "Paul" on the previous thread directed at me and Dorothy. This is one of a pattern of posts from this particular individual -- you will notice a number of posts from him on this thread where the vitriol continues in one form or another. Let's just say, Paul is "not a happy person."

2. If you were my friend I would probably, given what has unfolded here and the fatigue you have expressed, shut down the comments on this forum since you don't have time to monitor it. This would give you an opportunity to focus on your book and to steel yourself against the battle that has been raging on your very own website that is dragging you down, and causing visible to distress to people who care about you and respect your work.

As we both learned in Con Law I, "freedom of speech is not absolute". I would argue that "censorship" is not the operative word here -- no one can silence anyone, or haul them off to prison for speaking their views. Rather, it's called editing and exercising discretion. I do it all the time when I teach a volunteer class so second graders -- I have to intervene and tell some of the kids what is acceptable if they start engaging in swearing, rudeness, meanness, interruption, etc. to me as the teacher, or to their classmates. If they fail to follow instructions,there are consequences. They are repeatedly told not just about the academic topic I am teaching, but also about the importance of manners. Because it's a Catholic school, I am allowed to frame manners as a religious imperative--I hope what I am doing rubs off in the kids at some point when they are older.

Joyce and Paul are grown adults who have either never learned about manners, or who have chosen to reject what they were once taught and what is, more importantly, written by the natural law on their own hearts (as it is for all of us). Dealing with them in a firm but calm way is censorship in the true sense of the word, but merely an exercise of control and discretion--and a statement to everyone about what you consider to be acceptable adult behvior, and the limits of what you will tolerate here.

Apologies for the lengthy post Constance,

Well it looks like Dorothy and
Rose have nearly succeeded in
driving Joyce out of here with
their incessant mealy-mouthed,
whiney, defense of indefensable
false doctrine, pedophile priests,
and idolotry, by using the time-
tested methods of misquotes,
misrepresentation, false accusation,
and underhanded outright lies.
All this while accusing Bible
believers of all the very things of
which they themselves are guilty.
This technique, if it can be called
a technique, is what's known as
Primitive Behavior. Like when a
little boy punches his younger
brother and then goes screaming
to mom saying "He hit me !"
Dorothy and Rose, you are the
bigots. No one has attacked you
but you claim, with a list that I'm
proud to be on, that these people
have been mean to you, which
they've taken great pains to explain
that they do not have animosity in
their heart towards you or any other
Catholics,only strong disagreement
with Roman Catholic DOCTRINE.
Could Joyce have spelled it out any
more? Every other paragraph of her
posts is a reminder that she does
NOT hate you or any Roman Catholic.
Dorothy, you are not a victim of
hate in this blog. Why do you keep
implying that you are?
Rose your point #4 of your 1:43 post
is disgusting. How does one "take out
of context" the rampant priest pedo-
philia ? How does one take out of
context the destroyed lives of children
and the ruined families and the sick
behavior that has resulted from this
culture within the RC clergy. Was it
just a few bad eggs ? No. Hundreds,
perhaps thousands of criminals of
the worst sort found a comfy home
in the very heart of the RC church.
It went on and on and on and the
reponse from the Pontiff is
transparent and completly lacking
to this day.
Wrong doctrine always leads to
wrong behavior.


Above is the copy of the post from Paul from the previous thread that I was talking about. This is merely one in a long pattern.

I take it for granted that it needs no further commentary from me.

This comment has been removed by the author.
This comment has been removed by the author.

Most forums have some kind of "user guidelines." Although there is some boilerplate language, the terms of the guidelines vary from site to site--they range from very liberal to very specific.

As acknowledged above I realize you don't have time to monitor this forum -- however, I have attached a link to an example of a "Forum user agreement" which may get you thinking in a more relevant way about how others have framed the issues.

What's happening here is not unique to this website (as Dorothy has pointed out)--rather it is a foreseeable consequence of living in this fallen world.

Comment deleted
This post has been removed by the author.
5:33 AM

Comment deleted
This post has been removed by the author.
5:37 AM


As per examples above, why not just delete the comments of any person who you decide is exhibiting rude, inappropriate, or unacceptable behavior toward others - period?

Constance, YOU be the "decider." After all, this is your blog and, therefore, should be guided by your rules. Anyone who can't abide by your rules runs the risk of getting his or her comments deleted. Period - end of discussion.
Good morning all you beautiful
Protestants, Jews, Catholics,
and if there be any Moslems,
Buddhists and Hindus, hello!
Who loves ya ?
God does, that's who.

Please be notified: Sometimes
the debate in here gets a little
testy. But in truth everyone so
far with a few "surfing by"
exceptions, is mature and eager
to hear your views. Not that I'm
the spokesman or anything
because I'm certainly not.

Mrs Cumby is an awfully nice
person to let so much venting
go on and on, on her dime, so
be cool as they say. And I'll
try to be cool too.

Shamanism - Part II

Spiritual associations…

“Shamans are often organized into full-time ritual or spiritual associations, like priests. The shaman is a person who is an expert in keeping together the multiple codes through which this complex belief system appears, and has a comprehensive view on it in their mind with certainty of knowledge. The shaman uses (and the audience understands) multiple codes. Shamans express meanings in many ways: verbally, musically, artistically, and in dance. Meanings may be manifested in objects, such as amulets. The shaman knows the culture of their community well, and acts accordingly. Thus, their audience knows the used symbols and meanings — that's why shamanism can be efficient: people in the audience trust it.” [Source: Wikipedia]

From my own research and experience it is clear to me that in the larger organized shaministic cultures, as we see in ancient Egypt, modern India, Tibet, or much closer to home, in the Hopi…(or on Oprah)…. Specialized knowledge or abilities is often broken up into segments. Each shaman, clan or priestly association retains specific authority for certain knowledge, rituals, or ceremonies. Such organization allows many individuals to attain a level of authority and maintain a sphere of influence within the greater culture where each can operate semi-independently of the others while maintaining the overall cohesiveness of shamanistic structure.

Secret or “special” knowledge…

The Shaman (wizard/priest) is recognized as one who has attained special understanding or ability beyond what is capable of the average person. The Indian guru Sai Baba was well known for making dust appear out of thin air. A new age friend of mine wore a vial of the Baba’s dust around her neck. Sure, while making dust isn’t all that impressive, other shamans apparently do develop skills, which include things like the ability to interpret signs, foretell the future, or heal the sick. When these kinds of things are manifested it is always done with help from the supernatural realm through ceremony or ritual. However, belief, or “faith” in the shaman’s abilities are critical for success. Rarely does a true skeptic witness a so-called “miracle”.

Training and rebellion….

Shamanistic cultures demand strict adherence of specific protocols for those aspiring to attain the “priesthood”. This is absolutely necessary in order to maintain the “trust factor”. This is not to say there are not schisms and disruptions in the overall order. Quite often a shaman will be rejected by his own culture and seek a place in another. The Chippewa shaman Sun Bear is a good example of this. Sun Bear was held in contempt by traditional elders within his own tribe as well as by leaders of the American Indian Movement for “selling” native traditions. This did not stop him from making a good living while mentoring thousands of dedicated followers in white America and Europe.

The Shaman as mediator…

The shaman is viewed as the mediator between man and the spiritual realm. The shaman is able to direct or deflect spiritual forces. He/she’s ability to communicate between the natural and supernatural worlds is viewed as a hard earned talent or a special gift which the individual is born with. In either case the up and coming shaman is almost always mentored by other shamans. A newly emerging shaman does not have to reinvent the wheel whenever he/she decides to go into business. The shaman’s wheels have been well greased since Adam and Eve were kicked out of Eden.
Paul, do you really believe that people here are foolish enough to trust what you write? If so, they shouldn't be allowed outside without a keeper. You make the local gypsy psychic readers look honest.

Old Man,

Unlike your first post about Shamanism (on the previous thread), I am glad to see that this one didn't descend into anti-Catholic bigtory. If you can keep it up, that would be a positive example to set for some of the people here. I hope you can meet this challenge.

I'm the individual who asked you to post about this topic, because I specifically was interested in hearing about your personal experiences living amongst these people as someone who had already converted to Christianity, and I thought others too might share this interest. Now that you've lain the groundwork, I hope the next post will focus on this.


Actually it's not called "gathering information." It's called showing an interest in other people by noticing that they are unique individuals with lives of their own and are equally precious in the eyes of God. In order to do this though, you have to be able to take the focus off yourself for a few moments and focus on other people.

My memory isn't always great in this area especially in the "virtual world" -- I am far better at it, and work harder at it, in person.

Here are some things about the people on this blog that you may not have bothered to notice:

Constance has a young grandchild, and at home she has a husband who suffered a horriffic accident which left him disabled with both legs removed below the knees around the time she started writing her first book. The change that occurred in her life as a result of this sudden disability forced her into a whole new world of learning and responbilites in addition to the discoveries she was making about the New Age. She also has dogs.

Dorothy -- I know a lot less about Dorothy because I missed the radio shows where she and Constance talked about their 25+ year collaboration, but I do know she has a son who is a musician and that she is a religious Jew. I also suspect she is a native South Sider because I recognize her accent -- it is the same accent I heard growing up. I also know that she was at this work herself before she even crossed paths with Constance. Like me, she has spent a lot of time over the years in various capacities as a community volunteer/activist.

Rudi is the mother of grown daughters and lives in Washington State.

Leana, also in Washington, is a home-schooling mom of 3 (or 4?) little boys.

Deannie has a strong academic background and, as is evident in her writing, some serious intellectual chops. I believe her specialty is the social and political history of the Balkan region (perhaps she did an M.A. in this area, I cannot remember exactly). I think she also has a young family.

Olmanoftheski -- I think he is a father as well -- he has a wealth of knowledge about Native American cultures, and is a former New Ager.

Bjorn -- he is employed in academia, and his wife is a doctor. They presently live in Hungary. At some point in his adult life he had a profound religious conversion experience.

Setterman, Dawn, RL, and others I have forgotten to mention that I have little or no details about, (although I think Dawn also has small children). I look forward forward to learning more about them over time as people with real lives, not just as anonymous disembodied words on a board that I evaluate according to whether or not they agree with all my theological views.


Earlier on this thread (8:15) you wrote:

I have a question for you.
Rose, here's some more info
about me for your dossier.

This is the second time you have accused me of "gathering information" on you. I have cut and pasted, above, my response to this accusation the first time you made it. My original response, (which I still stand by), makes some valuable points which your subsequent post (8:15) clearly demonstrates you have failed to take on board.

The fact that you have persisted in resurrecting the original accusation in wake of my response reveals more aspects of your character. I am highlighting this today for the sake of everyone here, especially your fellow Evangelical Christians--who you continue to embarrass more and more each day by association by your appalling and deeply unchristian behavior.

I think I've found a good analogy
to this blog.
Mrs Cumby is Job and we're Job's
Each friend has a different take
on what's going on and each friend
takes more than one opportunity
to express his views. The friends all
have interesting and often deep
things to say about God, mankind,
and the world. Their comments
sometimes run on and on. It's
difficult to see "through" many of
them. Some of them sound quite
reverent and some sound wise but
there are two things that they all
have in common.
One: they're making Job even more
miserable than he was before, and
Two: God eventually speaks up and
informs them that they're all wrong,
including Job, who to his credit
never denounces God or blasphemes.
Then, ( this is the interesting part )
God sets them all, Job included,
straight. It turns out it's about Him,
not Job or his "friends" or his wife,
or his lost children or his lost riches.
It's not about Satan either.
It's all about God, and He tells Job
that he will heal him and restore him
and give him more that he ever had
before, WHEN he prays for his friends.
Job does, and you know the rest if
you've ever read the Bible.

It's only an analogy and Constance
was never as rich as Job but the
similarities are striking, I think.

My apologies to anyone who doesn't
regard the Bible as Gods Word.
The book of Job is DEEP. It is
thought to be the oldest book in
the Bible. Jesus quotes from it
more than once.

Anyone could create any rule to cover nay thought that would need to be enforced by u;ti,ately - thte thought police.
When in our lives - we should exemplify the the workingd of the Lord God Jesus Christ.
Bringing even every thoughts into captivity - understanding that we are commanded to:
29And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:

30And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
30And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.

31And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

Until we each understand that discussion and all that goes with it - even heated needs to be "salted" - each and everyone of us can be incorrect.
It is a heart problem that even in those who contain the Spirit of the Living Lord - can fall to.
Until we are translated - we are subject to the fall and its curse.
No one except the Lord God Jesus Christ is sinless -
It is easy to see a beam in your family member's eye - but difficult to spot our in a mirror.
Especially those who post anonymously - which I will never do -

CONNIE! You Guys!

Connie was great (as usual) on John's show.


You are a MEMBER
Name: kayfox42
Password: sanders

It's okay with John if you don't abuse sharing.

grow up people
Having only read part way down it seems the focus is inward rather than outward, still.

The question for me is how can I help inform you and how can you be my watchman on the wall so we can make better decisions knowing the future is less than rosy?

I need your help to be fully informed.

Heard on radio by a knowledgeable guy (DON'T KNOW IF IT'S TRUE!) that the US Embassy in Iraq is to be the NWO headquarters and plans are to take over the entire Middle East. (Babylon is in Iraq as you know.)

Iran will be bombed (did not say nuked) and 50 of the 72 million people will be killed. (Israel will support this apparently.)

The mistake with Iraq was too many people were left alive and now they are causing problems.

Saudi Arabia will be attack after Iran as the 9-11 terrorist were from there, it was a long term set up.

If Iran knows a strike is coming it seems in their best interest to strike FIRST, Biblical prophesy.

We have a huge joint new underground base with nuke missiles in Israel.

Putin is really put out at US for playing in his backyard.

There is a fungus or something like that, which will eat/encapsulate the DU and make the Iraq area safe. I also read/heard that scalier can do the same thing, don't know, but I think there is some truth that DU can be neutralized, why spend zillions if you know land can't be made safe?

Also, Dubai's near and the elite are there in droves. Brand new huge cities are being built in the general area.

Cheney bought a home in Dubai and Halliburton has moved their headquarters there.

The real estate, casino, TV guy who combs his hair over and a new wife every few years also has a big spread in Dubai as do rock and roll stars, etc.

If you want to be seen and are anybody you go to Dubai. It has 2 or 3 ***** star polo clubs to attract the elite. It is the rich mans playground and brothel.

Dubai is TAX FREE to business, well duh!

My husband lost both legs ABOVE THE KNEES, a far more horrific accident than below the knees -- we have lived with that since 1979 and if anybody thinks it has been a picnic, it has not.

Paul, I must confess I enjoyed your 11:01 post.


That was a typing error (mental error, meaning wrong choice of word) on my part when I wrote the post -- I should have corrected it. If I failed to convey the enormity of what your family has endured, or seemed to downplay its significance in my description, then I failed.

If you want to email to discuss this matter in more detail, and to allow me to clarify my views on this, please do so.

Paul, do you really believe that people here are foolish enough to trust what you write? If so, they shouldn't be allowed outside without a keeper. You make the local gypsy psychic readers look honest.


And this contributes to civility? Hello, pot it's me kettle.
Unlike your first post about Shamanism (on the previous thread), I am glad to see that this one didn't descend into anti-Catholic bigtory. If you can keep it up, that would be a positive example to set for some of the people here. I hope you can meet this challenge.

Bating. Enough said.

Bush owns between 100,000 (this is confirmed) to 2 Million acres in Paraguay. Gas & water.

Rev. Moon bought his property first which ajoins Bush's. Water & ?

Connie made a connection via food between them on John's show.

For all of those who would like to know how "the Plan" might be unfolding, here is a very interesting link compliments of the Club of Budapest and friends..

The brochure for the conference is
(last on on list at this link) is really scary. WARNING: This brochure requires reading while a combination purple/lotus/new age symbol is covering the readable text.

Page 7 explains the purpose of the summit.
It is non-political and purely religious. More Tanakh Scriptures than I've ever
Seen in any New Age documentation. Scriptures about the Temple Mount and the Temple. Pg 11 says, "Our interest is not in building a new temple or in destroying the existing Mosques which we too regard as sacred, but to secure the legitimate rights of access of the Temple Mount for the Jewish people." Page 13 is very significant. "To some up, the unique goal of the Summit .to lay a foundation for a joint and close cooperation by establishing a PARLIAMENT of WORLD RELIGION, an INTER-RELIGIOUS council or court vested with legitimate power to matters relating to religious claims from any particular tradition." (ON THE TEMPLE MOUNT) Got the link with Summit announcement from WorldShift Network site

That's how I see the whole NWR coming together. It's like there are overlapping organizations all doing different versions of the same thing. Talk about Mystery Babylon. Did you see what the Muslims are doing and look at all the Christians and Jews who participated:

This year is the Year of the Dialogue in Europe....guess what their dialoging about....

My philosophy is that it's all well and good that we be watchmen and alert people to the dangers of this stuff, but if we don't arm them with the weapons of warfare, what have we really done for them. I am trying to do my little part to equip believers as Abba opens doors to, but it's not even
a small dent in what needs to be done.

By the way, take a look at Bjorn Farmers blog, which talks about the EU plans for Israel...very interesting in light of this..I think.

One more little tidbit about about Lazlo, besides the Club of Budapest, he is part of this lovely community in the North of Italy, under the mountains:

Quite a resume.

Enjoy my friends....

My heart sank when I read about your husband.

There are no words to describe what is in my heart for both of you.

May God bless all that you touch.


That's really interesting. Look at the first entry on "The 70th Week" blog (Constance has a link). Olmert appears ready to give up control of the Temple Mount with the thought that it would be open to all religions. It appears the US under the Bush Admin. is eager to push the Israelis in this direction. If is not concluded before President Bush leaves next January, I wonder what a potential President Obama might push. Given his choice of foreign policy advisors, I don't think it would be good. Thanks for the links.


When taxes are balloned to keep up with our non inflation and debt, bartering could be like owning a sawed off shotgun and Ruby Ridge.

Thanks Deannie, I'll take a look.
kck: What's "DU"? Will
When you referenced the amount of deaths attributed to tasers you referenced a wikipedia article that said "This article may require cleanup to meet Wikipedia's quality standards," which makes me pretty skeptical about your claim. According to, the taser civilian model is designed to be one of the top non-lethal, self-defense tool. Injury is not caused by the taser; rather, it is caused by the fall once someone is stunned, or it is caused by self affliction. You can find more information about the Taser for civilians here:
http://www.rense. com/general81/ googon.htm

Google sets up in Israel!

I heard that Ted Turner predicted in 80 years we will all be barbarians (I think that is the correct wording). After reading your recent posts, I am thinking people are beginning to realize this across the the way, it is very nice to find your website online. I appreciate your ministry, and am glad to be able to say thank-you for your faithfulness in it.
kck: Once again, what do you mean by "DU" (in one of your earlier posts)?
Does anyone still think this is the "land of the free?"
WILL THE STATUE OF ABOMINATION BE THE 13 SCHULLSPLACED ON JEWISH SIOL,FOR THEY ARE GODS CHURCH AND TEMPLE,OR WILL IT BE THE FLAG OF THE SCHULLS AoC flag at that ,are these schulls the gate way for the anti christ ?????????????parpcofriends says: If the new age christain are prepare the way for the beast ,and the dragon is to be defeated and kicked out of heaven.Could these 12 plus 1 scull be a type of gate way that is to allow the antichrist ,which is the beast out of the bootom less pit.And is it possiabile for Judas to be to be the antichrist .For the bible says the beast was,and was not ,and shall be again.Judas was,and then he was not(when he went to his own special place)and willbe when he ascends out of the bottom less pitt,and slays the two wittness of Jesus that walk the earth during the tribulation period.That would then make the rapture then take place soon ,for i think the 2 wittnesses walk the earth for 4 years then they are killed ,but rise after 3 days ,after they have lain in the streets dismembered ,could this aso be the time that dragon satin sends a flood of his armies after the church ,who are the decendants of abraham,who will take refuge in the tenple of old king Solomon,in the mountains who will flee through the parted mountains ,that were parted by the earth quake,they will survive there for 3 and a half years by God feeding them.And could these 13 sculls be a gate way that will releaes the 2000000 horse men ,who will be satans army that will battle in heaven,the are the Anunniki(fallen angels that bread withe the women of earth and made the Nephiliums ,whom the bible talks of as were ledgens come from.These Anunniki are angels that did not depart with satan when he was kicked out and dissrobed of his bells and musical garmand ,they are the ancient Anunniki that felt heaven before satan .Could they have been responibile for the alians which are the greys (human like blond),the riptilians(snake like human ,grey-green scaly skin with yellow snake like eyes)the Hybrides(child like with white -grey skin and huge egge like eyes)and ?decendants of nephiliums bread with alians and could possibily be the luuminarty controling all world goverments that are preparing the way for the dragon.And when the bible refferrs in genisus to other beings and poeple when cain was afraid to go out into the wilderness and again rev:14.3 the four liveing beings are they alians????

7:17 PM
WILL THE STATUE OF ABOMINATION BE THE 13 SCHULLSPLACED ON JEWISH SIOL,FOR THEY ARE GODS CHURCH AND TEMPLE,OR WILL IT BE THE FLAG OF THE SCHULLS AoC flag at that ,are these schulls the gate way for the anti christ ?????????????parpcofriends says: If the new age christain are prepare the way for the beast ,and the dragon is to be defeated and kicked out of heaven.Could these 12 plus 1 scull be a type of gate way that is to allow the antichrist ,which is the beast out of the bootom less pit.And is it possiabile for Judas to be to be the antichrist .For the bible says the beast was,and was not ,and shall be again.Judas was,and then he was not(when he went to his own special place)and willbe when he ascends out of the bottom less pitt,and slays the two wittness of Jesus that walk the earth during the tribulation period.That would then make the rapture then take place soon ,for i think the 2 wittnesses walk the earth for 4 years then they are killed ,but rise after 3 days ,after they have lain in the streets dismembered ,could this aso be the time that dragon satin sends a flood of his armies after the church ,who are the decendants of abraham,who will take refuge in the tenple of old king Solomon,in the mountains who will flee through the parted mountains ,that were parted by the earth quake,they will survive there for 3 and a half years by God feeding them.And could these 13 sculls be a gate way that will releaes the 2000000 horse men ,who will be satans army that will battle in heaven,the are the Anunniki(fallen angels that bread withe the women of earth and made the Nephiliums ,whom the bible talks of as were ledgens come from.These Anunniki are angels that did not depart with satan when he was kicked out and dissrobed of his bells and musical garmand ,they are the ancient Anunniki that felt heaven before satan .Could they have been responibile for the alians which are the greys (human like blond),the riptilians(snake like human ,grey-green scaly skin with yellow snake like eyes)the Hybrides(child like with white -grey skin and huge egge like eyes)and ?decendants of nephiliums bread with alians and could possibily be the luuminarty controling all world goverments that are preparing the way for the dragon.And when the bible refferrs in genisus to other beings and poeple when cain was afraid to go out into the wilderness and again rev:14.3 the four liveing beings are they alians????

7:17 PM
parpcofriends say :If the world is to be a cashless,barbaric,tasered society.Could it then be that due to one world one currency and already we got credit cards that scane products of barcode selling system we already have.No need for cash in hand just credit and the mark of the beast then beeing a micro chip which is scanned,and if the poeple are going to kill the poeple who dont want to believe in one world new religion ,and thought ,then the poeple of the world will have become barbaric.There are already chips that are inserted into children to located them if they are lost,what else is in the microchip ,can it be used to scan for a value of credit that indivdual has ??
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