Monday, October 17, 2005

I don't often agree with Sojourners, but this time, I think I might


I just opened one of those form email solicitations. This one was from Sojourners. Frequently I have found myself at odds with just about everything coming from that organization and its magazine. Both are too often anti-Israel, pro-New Age, pro-Matthew Fox, pro-Rosemary Ruether, and New World Order of the leftist variety. The New Agers have no trouble counting them among their networks, although their former head vigorously denied it in a letter to me in 1983, demanding that I keep the contents private. Obviously, he lacked legal education. He had no expectation of privacy in a letter sent to another unless he was sending it to me in a privileged capacity, i.e., me as his lawyer. That letter will be among the items turned over to the Bentley Historical Library of the University of Michigan for archiving.

However, today I found myself nodding my head in agreement to one of their initiatives. Assuming the facts as they stated them were correct, and given my history with Sojourners, that can be a BIG ASSUMPTION, a moral wrong is being waged against the poor of this country. As the bankruptcy laws tighten, the poor, including but not limited to medically indigent, are left with distressingly few options. A few scriptures come to mind, including but not limited to Matthew 25 and admonitions to turn not to the left hand, nor to the right, but strictly in the paths of the Lord. Today, Sojourners said it as I would say it and here republish verbatim the emailed solicitation:

»Call Congress today, and click here to tell your friends and spread the word!Just weeks after Hurricane Katrina exposed the crisis of poverty in America, Congress will debate as early as Wednesday how much money should be cut from the budgets of health care, nutrition assistance, and other vital services for poor and working families. That's right, they will cut funds - and the question is by how much. Perhaps equally astonishing, they will decide how much - up to $70 billion - they will cut taxes for the richest people in America. In Washington, this may be business as usual, but as people of faith, we believe that budgets are moral documents, and so far this budget is morally bankrupt.
We have a short amount of time to make a big difference, and we need your voice now!
1) Call Congress now. Tell them to get their priorities straight!
(800) 426-8073 (Toll-free courtesy of American Friends Service Committee)
Speak up for those who cannot speak. - Proverbs 31:8
Ask to speak to one of the senators from your state. When the senator's phone is answered, say politely: "My name is _____, and I live in [your town/city]. As a person of faith, I would like Senator [name] to oppose budget cuts to Medicaid, Food Stamps, and other vital services, and to oppose more tax cuts for the very rich. Needs of poor families should be a moral priority at this time, not tax cuts for the wealthy.”
After you're done, please call your other senator, followed by your representative.*
2) Tell 10 friends now!
The success of this call-in day will depend on how many people call their senators and members of Congress. Congress does listen to what their constituents think, so after you call, please tell your friends, family, pastor - anyone who shares your concern for restoring just budget priorities - about this call-in day!**
»Click here to tell your friends about today's call-in day
Many in Congress claim that Hurricane Katrina has driven congressional spending and budgets out of control, and that sweeping cuts to vital social services are justified because of these increases. This claim couldn't be further from the truth.
Fiction : Government spending is dangerously high.
Fact: Even with new Katrina funds, federal spending as a percentage of the economy is below the 30-year average. Arguments like these are driven by an ideological determination to shrink government, not reality.
Fiction : Deficits are spinning out of control because of reckless spending and new Katrina relief.
Fact : The root of the problem of skyrocketing deficits is new tax cuts for the very wealthy, not new spending. For the past three years, tax revenues as a percentage of the economy are at a 30-year low. Nevertheless, many in Congress will stop at nothing to enact new tax breaks for the wealthiest Americans. Between now and 2010, the cost of the Bush tax cuts (if extended) will total $1.7 trillion. Katrina relief - even when you amount interest costs, is projected at $240 billion - less than 15% of what the tax cuts will cost. And yet there is momentum behind a plan this year to add an additional $70 billion in new tax cuts - mostly for the very wealthy. Simply put, this plan is out of touch with our values.

I do believe I'm inclined to make those calls to my Senators and Congressman. You might want to consider doing likewise. Just pray for wisdom to avoid all their Sojourners New Age stuff and left wing New Age Movement networking and solutions. They are there!
The Twenty-third Psalm
Welfare Version

Society is my shepherd: I shall not work.
It alloweth me to lie down on a feather bed;
It leadeth me beside the still factories.
It destroyeth my ambition.
It leadeth me in the paths of a goldbrick for politics' sake.
Yea, though I walk through the valley of inflation and deficit spending,
I will fear no evil,
For the welfare agencies are with me.
Their generosity and their staff they comfort me.
They prepareth the requisitions that filleth my table.
By mortgaging the earnings of my grandchildren
My head is filled with mirth
That my cup runneth over without effort.
Surely, the taxpayers shall care for me
All the days of my life,
And I shall dwell in the house of a parasite forever.
Nice version and for those the shoe fits, let them wear it; HOWEVER, here in Michigan far too much employment has been "outsourced" to countries where there is very cheap labor. Our economy is in depression -- not recession. Louisiana with its Katrina victims; Florida with last year's hurricane victims and FEMA demanding repayment. Welcome to the New World Order -- one where people wish they were dead! Blaming the victim? That's New Age "bad karma" theories, certainly not the will of our Lord who said, "feed the hungry, clothe the naked, visit those in prison . . ."
"feed the hungry, clothe the naked, visit those in prison . . ."

The question is whether that is a personal mandate, or Jesus suggesting how the government should operate.

Personally, I think that it was a personal mandate. Don't you?
I will say right up front that I don't buy those fact vs fiction statements. Sounds like more of the same old Democrat Party talking points which are dishonest and misleading, but I suspect Sojourners has an agenda that is different from some politicians. I read somewhere how the Democrat party has in the last 15-20 years changed from supporters of the working class into one supporting many different negative groups. Instead of building Dams and Steel mills they now prefer to protect the environment by not building these productive items. We should all have decided what to think about Bush's tax cuts by now, but it is up for renewal soon and we should let our elected officials know what we think. I accept his reasons for tax cuts and believe the progress we have made since is much better than where we were going prior to the stimulating cuts. Tax cuts for the rich is a misleading statement. I can tell you the first time I was exposed to this stupid statement was around the year 1960 when as a newly married couple we were struggling to get by on my $1.56 per hour job. The political campaign was all about tax cuts that year and local politicians told us it was unfair to cut tax because the guy who earned more would get more tax cut. I can tell you that a couple dollars more each week would have made the trips to buy groceries much easier in 1960. The tax cutters lost and soon we had a new "temporary" state sales tax on food that is still with us today. We had no tax on food previously. Why would anyone want to pay more tax than we already do. I am now retired with 401k money that I wish to use some to help one of my children buy a home but to do so will mean unreasonable tax to pay. Don't tell me about a tax cut being wrong. We need more tax cuts!!
The real question here may be what is Sojourners agenda.
We do need to help those needy folk. But use appropiate restraint.
That Sojourners has an agenda -- a New Age one -- my experience tells me is absolutely true. That the Democrats have by giving into special interest groups abandoned their real constituency of working class people is obvious. That the rich have got richer and the poor poorer in the last five years is also obvious. Maybe the 3rd seal of Revelation -- the Rider on the Black horse -- inflation and suffering for some, luxuries for others "touch not the oil and the wine."
This comment deals with two areas. The first is the growing knowledge of how difficult it is for middle-aged white collar workers to find employment these days. This writer has a new book called Bait and Switch which details the plight of the white collar worker who has become unemployed. I think this is the kind of difficulty Constance is finding to an extreme in Detroit.

The excerpt shows how New Age has continued to invade the business world, and where there is New Age, logic has gone out the window.

This excerpt is taken from two interviews with the author of the book.

BARBARA EHRENREICH: Blue collar world? Agree or disagree: It is easier to work when you are a little bit high. That's a hard question, actually. And then -- but in the white-collar world, they want – they say they want to really understand your unique personality so they can slot you into the right job. I said I have already told you I want to be a PR person. No matter, you get these tests. The tests are all completely discredited, scientifically worthless. The first test I took revealed --

AMY GOODMAN: What's it called, these tests?

BARBARA EHRENREICH: It was the Enneagram test, based on Sufism and ancient Celtic lore, among other things.


BARBARA EHRENREICH: Seriously, yeah. And major, major corporations rely on this. Anyway, it turned out that my one big flaw was that I was not good at writing and should avoid occupations involving that. So, that was that.
The tax cuts were nothing and the government in reality is nowhere near being over budget. The liberal whiners who see nothing but gloom and doom are hard at work deceiving people about the war and the economy.

The best way for the government to bring money in to help pay for the war and the hurricanes etc., is to let people keep more of their own money to spend as they see fit (See link below). At first glance it seems contradictory doesn't it? But if you take an honest look at it, you'll see that it makes perfect sense, provided you have some common sense to begin with.

You have to ask yourself this question: How has the (supposed) deficit gone down even with the war going on? Government Tax Receipts Hit New July Record

ANSWER: Because people have had more of their own money to spend on things they need, which ARE TAXED! That is where most of the money comes from and how the economy can expand.

Raising taxes STIFLES spending just as raising interest rates STIFLES borrowing.

If you raise taxes, people won't have that money to spend on products they would otherwise be paying taxes on.

Think about it. Everything you buy is TAXED and the government gets a cut. Every item bought and sold, imported and exported has a TAX on it, everyday 24 hours a day, 365 days a year.

We also pay income TAXES on top of that with each paycheck! The Non-workers and those under an ever increasing percentage pay no income taxes.

Then we pay a another huge TAX once a year on a percentage of our hard earned money that was already TAXED before! Amazing isn't it?

So, OUR government TAXES every single product, every single pay check and then TAXES the income earned that they didn't TAX before. Then they TAX any interest earned too!

If people are not buying things because they have to save that much more money to pay their INCOME TAXES by April 15th, they aren't going to be buying as much, which means less money will be going into the government coffers.

Unemployment before the hurricane was 4.9% which is extremely low and lower than when Clinton was in office. FACT! The Clinton economy was a false bubble created by corporate corruption built on the backs of working investors.

(D)on't fool yourself. The rich democrats know this stuff too, and they use it against unwitting people by pulling at their emotions to distract from seeing what they are really doing in order to steal more of the people's (not the governments) money.

When you go buy a car, do you let the salesman use emotional tactics on you to get the price UP?

Placing emotions ahead of common sense, is exactly what democrat salesmen (I feel your pain) rely on.

The reality is that the wealthy pay almost all of the federal income tax, and there is clear and compelling evidence that our tax system -- especially its misguided redistributive elements -- imposes a heavy cost in terms of growth that is ultimately paid by the non-wealthy in the form of lower productivity and, hence, lower wages and incomes.

According to a new report from the GAO, we pay a very heavy price for the heavy taxation of saving, investment, corporations and estates that [liberals] strongly favor.

It found that the efficiency cost of the tax system -- the output that is lost over and above the tax itself -- is between 2 percent and 5 percent of the gross domestic product. In short, we lose between $240 billion and $600 billion every year, just because of the way we raise taxes."

The U.S. economy is somewhere around 12.8 *** TRILLION *** dollars.

So how much was Bush's tax cut? A drop in the proverbial ocean! A cup of coffee to Starbucks....
Just a side note, I really don't like the comments when they appear across the full page.

Having worked for a help agency I know there are both people who really need help and people who work the system. In addition I do believe much money goes into providing jobs and administration and support for the helpers. Given human nature, the system is not going to straighten itself out. Between what the government offers and what private agencies offer there is huge amount of help being given to people who do not have jobs or do not have enough money to pay for special help needs.

White collar people who are losing their jobs do not know how to work the system. Read the book.

This UPS story appeared in August of this year:
Comerica Bank: Detroit economy healthier

DETROIT, Aug. 29 (UPI) -- Michigan's largest bank says Detroit area business activity fell slightly in July but was within its historic range.

"The Detroit regional economy looks healthier this summer than it was in
the spring, but a clear uptrend still has not begun," said Dana
Johnson, chief economist at Comerica Bank.

"The local economy will be hard pressed to show consistent gains given the environment of surging energy prices, rising interest rates, and ongoing restructuring in the auto industry."

Copyright 2005 by United Press International. All Rights Reserved.

I'm beginning to think the tax cuts are like a ponzi game. While money comes into one's pockets and the government pockets, it can only continue if no more jobs leave the country, the housing market holds up (people buy things for houses)and the government stops spending on things like museums and strange roads (pork). Detroit is a good example of what happens when things start to go downhill.

I started to worry a while back when an answer to CAFTA and NAFTA was not to worry; Americans are brilliant and will always come up with new ways to make money. We are expecting this from the 56 million who voted Democratic in the last election vs the 58 million who voted for the Republicans? Wasn't Detroit a Democratic city?
Has Comerica Bank in Michigan been viewing the same landscape I have been seeing -- or are they trying to create their own reality? The economy is in serious trouble for the time being here in Michigan and the Delphi bankruptcy has intensified those woes. General Motors has had huge layoffs. The phone company has outsourced most of its operator and technical support work to Asian countries -- I wouldn't take that Comerica statement as gospel. Over the years it has closed many of its own branches.
Whistling in the wind.
Michigan is most liberal state in the nation. Is it any wonder why they are having so many problems?

Illinois is becoming just as bad with democrats controlling state government.

Grey Davis was booted out of California for the same corrupt junk happening in both MI and IL. State taxes going up, companies and jobs leaving while the governor denies it all. Liberal recipe for disaster.
Annoymous, being from Illinois I will agree with you. However, from what I've seen over all of these years, people from all over the country are as stupid as people from Michigan and Illinois. Are people from all of the other states are somewhat aware of what is happening? My answer is NO. They are as trusting as Illinois and Michigan people are. There are no grass roots efforts going on. There are no groups or individuals reporting on their own what the New Age movement is doing in their communities. Christians and Jews are extremely lazy. Christians think in terms of end times so they don't have to do anything more than be aware. Jews are self-assured that things are under control.

How many individuals who read this blog can get off their backsides to do research that will help others? Most sit waiting until someone else provides them with information. Even then they don't acknowledge that they have read anyting that makes them more aware. It is absolutely disgusting to watch the community of US citizens acting like children waiting for a parent to make their world a good place.

I am disgusted with the Willy Lump Lumps of this world, even more so by those who choose not to act in any way even though they have a clue as to what is happening. I can only hope that when End Times come God will give them a good kick in the rump before they reach heaven.
As a person with a debilitating disability, guess I'll speak up to say that a notice was given me that my life saving medicines will be cut off come January 1, 2006. True, there is medicare help with some of the medicines but not without taking from a poverty based income already via higher premiums.

To add to that, there are half of my medicines that will not be covered period. These have to come out of my very small income per month.

It would be a terrible thing to have to gripe about paying more taxes on the home I own, or the car I own or the University I like to send my kids to---

However, as a poverty stricken disabled person, unable to work, I have none of those things. How dare people complain about losing a few dollars yet being allowed to keep all those nice things. Try walking in the shoes (if you can walk, I can't) of people who have a choice between medications that keep us alive and the roof over our heads along with food. Or giving up the roof over our heads, along with the food to be able to pay for the medicines needed to live.

Try that one on for size--then complain about paying a few more taxes--sheesh. My very life is on the line and come January 1, 2006 it may end. What complaint do those with homes, cars, jobs, children, and other luxuries have?

Is your life on the line in less than 90 days? You think it stressful to pay a few more dollars in taxes. Try thinking about how to save your very life in such a short amount of time. Many of us, including myself, might very well die.

Is it not enough that you have your health? Now you complain over money that can save other peoples lives? This, I do not understand.

And should anyone tell me to turn to the Church as we should be able to do according to the Bible--the Church doesn't really care about the poor as a whole. Yes, there are Christians who do but not the majority by a far stretch.

People died today in the United States of America because they did not have health insurance. There are others who are homeless at this very moment you are reading this. Others, like myself, are limited in our options and will either be homeless, dead, hungry or stuck in nursing facilities.

And why? Because the Church did not listen to Jesus Christ, nor the Prophets about taking care of the poor, the widows, the orphaned, the lame, the outcasts, the foreigners et al.

So Trent, while you blaspheme the 23rd Psalm (which is adding to the Word of God--that brings curses by the way), what will you do for your fellow man? Complain over your luxuries some more? Or will you do what God Almighty instructed you to do--help those who need the help--"the least of these."

Stop whining when others of us out here would simply like to live a little longer. No more, no less. Just live.
Anonymous 3:51 AM,

Thank you for speaking the truth in a very direct way. I'm a Christian with a disability and from experience, you are correct. The Christians feel they need do nothing with a few exceptional Christians noted. This is a sad commentary on the Church.

The anonymous 5:43 AM is also from me. Let it be noted on this blog that Christians cannot even take the time to visit me, or call me, let alone invite me to Church. Truly, we are the castaways, even in the Church.

Again, there are a few Christians who do care and obey Jesus Christ's teachings. I will not deny them for what they are trying to do. And surely their reward is coming. Praise God for that. These few Christians deserve His reward.

Thank you for speaking up. May God Bless you and others who know the truth and know God's Word.
"feed the hungry, clothe the naked, visit those in prison . . ."

I take this to mean that we should do this ... not hire a professional to do it for us ... (ie. through taxes.)

Jesus was outraged at the salesmen in the temple who were hired-hands to raise up an offering that God commanded that the people raise up for themselves. The lazy people, rather then raise their own offering, would purchase one at the temple from a hired-offering salesperson.

Of course, the offerings became SECOND best rather then the UNBLEMISHED offering that was commanded, when it was left up to the professionals.

This is my indictment against those that would rather care for the sick through their tax dollars then do it themselves.

That was my point all along.

You stated in part:

"This is my indictment against those that would rather care for the sick through their tax dollars then do it themselves."

Amen to that statement. I'm the anonymous who is disabled on this board. Apologies for my misunderstanding of what you were trying to say in your first post.

May God Bless you as well and pray that Christians 'especially' get that very message you have typed out. Perhaps on your website. It's really sad we have to remind Christians of this sort of thing, isn't it.

Peace to you.
Everyone, before it's all over we all going to be struggling just to make ends meet. To the very wealthy we are nothing but worthless eaters. We are considerd being the little people of society. The good jobs the US had are basically gone and replaced with lower wages. While the rich get richer. What amazes me the very wealthy belong to golf clubs and other organizations. They tell us they can't help give us health care or provide a percentage. However they can join elete golf clubs and pay high memberships just to be a member. The issue is somthing called self. We live in a society that takes care of self. I remember when Michigan had its auto industry rolling people were working then the plant closings of the 80's and layoffs. It's been downhill ever since. I'm 39 years old I've never had a good paying job, but I've always found work at doing something. To the ones who are severly disabled and can't work remember the Lord has the final say so and make sure your heart is right with him. One day the very wealthy will answer. There's a scripture about the rich man and lazuras. The rich man was in torment and lazuras was at Abrahams bossom. Another good scripture is James chapter 5. Even my wages are garbage, but I try to keep in mind the whole picture.
Christian with disability, check with the drug company that supplies your drugs. Some of the companies have a program that allows you to receive the drugs at a much lower cost or free based on what income you have. Find out if there are clinics in your community that offer low or free medical service. If you live near black or Mexican communities, there are probably hospitals or clinics around. Again, these things are for low income people and you will probably have to prove you are low income. Do not be proud. Expect to sit for hours in the waiting room. Talk to the billing people or social worker connected to see where things stand. They may help you apply for very low cost drugs.
Wow, it's a little hot in here, BUT understandably so.

Someone said,

"I can only hope that when End Times come God will give them a good kick in the rump before they reach heaven."

Ummm, last I checked there will be many who are saved that will make it into heaven by the skin of their teeth. I don't think many Christians know this--and this is from the Pre-trib rapture view--but when we are raptured we immediately go to the Judgment Seat of Christ. Not the great white throne judgment that's a ways away and not for present Church believers!

My point is that, when we get there it won't be a judgment of sins as those were taken care of at the cross. But our works SUPPOSEDLY done in Christ's name will be tried and if they are found wanting they will simply be burned up. Based on what stands "trial by fire" so to speak (which means judgment) will be the works that determine the jewels in our crowns (literally), our authoritative roles in the 1000-year millenium and eternity thereafter.

Ultimately, those who have confessed faith will find themselves with a shack, not a mansion, and a simple halo for a crown (i'm being funny, but making an important point). All of this will be because they simly confessed faith, but didn't profess their faith--meaning put it into action. Feed the poor, and help the widow and the fatherless.

Folks I am from a single parent home (my mother) and my brother and I are fatherless. I grew up poor and EVERY person that cursed us or tried to hurt us got their due from God.

Touch God's people in the wrong way, you will pay. Touch them with loving kindness and prayer and find yourself blessed beyond measure.

No I'm not elderly AT ALL, but if you call yourself a Christian and don't help people why claim the faith?! What are you here for?! Find another faith to tarnish.
(for annon)
Annonymous, you can't count on God to punish others in a way you see. It may happen, but it may not. It's your reaction in the face of adversity that matters. Remember Job.

In the meantime, take a little effort to warn others of what is occuring in the world thru the New Age movement. You will never know how your efforts work out, even if you look at it as casting your bread upon the waters.

There are two levels. One is a personal level, that which impacts you and yours. There is a community level in which you participate on an adult level where you work and may never know what impact you have on others around you. That's the hardest one.
For the record: My husband lost both legs above the knee in a 1979 accident. We had been married only 5 years when this happene. The lady who hit him had a whole $20,000 worth of liability insurance -- is my husband at fault because a "Generous Motors" (GM) truck didn't hit him and he could collect millions? What about the government that allowed people to only carry $20,000 worth of insurance. What about all those who benefited from the cheaper rates financially? Who pays? Or should I go "New Age" on everybody and chalk it up to his "bad karma"??!!
For the record: My husband lost both legs above the knee in a 1979 accident. We had been married only 5 years when this happene. The lady who hit him had a whole $20,000 worth of liability insurance -- is my husband at fault because a "Generous Motors" (GM) truck didn't hit him and he could collect millions? What about the government that allowed people to only carry $20,000 worth of insurance. What about all those who benefited from the cheaper rates financially? Who pays? Or should I go "New Age" on everybody and chalk it up to his "bad karma"??!!
No Karma allowed Constance..:)

We know this is all pre-planned. By 'this' I mean de-populization. Beginning with the disabled, to seniors and any others considered "unfit." This will most certainly fulfill those Georgia Guidestones commandments, won't it? All in the name of saving "mother earth." At least this is my understanding of this diobolic plan.

It also fulfills prophecy, does it not? Many will be killed for their faith in Jesus Christ and currently are in other countries. Here in the United States it is beginning with the disabled, the seniors, the poor, and ultimately whoever won't bow down to the system.

Correct me if I'm wrong or have missed something. That was a brief overview to portray my understanding of this new world order system that is currently being implemented right under our noses. What say ye Constance? Am I in correct ballpark with this one?

Hoping to hear from you. And May God Bless you and your Husband!
To anonymous that said this in part:

"Christian with disability, check with the drug company that supplies your drugs. Some of the companies have a program that allows you to receive the drugs at a much lower cost or free based on what income you have"

That is good for many medicines. However, the government has decided to completely omit some drugs that will, under no circumstance be covered in even a little way. They have cut those medicines completely and stated that they will not cover them and they fully expect deaths, seizures and others who end up in the emergency rooms. They so stated that very thing and still passed the law that these particular medicines cannot be covered. It is out of pocket. Two of them I've been on since 1986.

What gets me is they "know" and even "stated" that there will be deaths, seizures, emergency rooms and other major complications without these particular medicines--yet still passed the law.

Nobody in the decision making cared.
Amongst the meds being cut out or down, the ability to acquire canes, walkers, wheelchairs, dentures, eyeglasses along with other things of such nature are also going to be out of pocket.

Also, currently I have inhome attendant services. This has been cut off in some states and it will not surprise me to see it happen across the country. They are claiming this will save money, however it is much less expensive to have inhome attendant services than the money the federal government would put out for nursing facilities. So this is more information for those who may know or who are the recipients of such things.

Another thing--this avian flu is becoming a real scare tactic that will probably bring in martial law or at the very least quarantines. If quarantined, how does one get their meds, food, water, medical treatment and other much needed things. They are claiming the military will probably be doing this and that to me is our undoing.

This flu wouldn't be dangerous had they not revived the 1918 spanish flu from a corpse. But they did so now we have the 1918 flu alive once again and God forbid that one vial should fall. Alas, it just might.

Anytime the government begins their rhetoric about some scare, you can count on it to come to pass. Everyday we are reading about this avian flu being found in yet another country. Can anyone say Martial Law? and death of course.

That's how I see things in this new age thinking. It will cut the population down, no doubt about that.
As if anyone care what Constance thinks. Blogs are a waste of time.

PS You are a crazy nut, who bases her world on poor speculation.

You are also a descendant of Satan.
Constance Cumbey's descent from Satan: *Constance Elizabeth Cumbey neè Butler (b. 1944) is a lawyer, specialising in getting satanists off scott free. She has been President of the Federation of Satanists since 1991. Cumbey seeks to destroy the New Age by encouraging Christians to kill New Agers. **John Merrill Butler (1921 - 2002) was a close friend and drug dealer of Ozzy Osbourne. He is the real father of Jack and Kelly Osbourne. **Margaret Elizabeth Kutsch was involved in evil voodoo deeds ***John Butler (b. 1866) was a eugenics promoter. ***Isadore was involved in eugenics. ***Earl A. Kutsch (b. 1897) was Grand Master of the Order of French Satanists ***Doris was a very bad woman, responsible for many butcherings in Ohio. ****Edmund Silas Butler (1851 - 1923) was voted the most evil man in Ohio in 1883. He also posed as a Baptist priest. ****Mary enjoyed eating gurkins. ****Augustus Kutsch (b. 1865) was a cannabis farmer. In latter life he posed as a Mormon. ****Elizabeth Miller (b. 1863) was a big cannabis smoker. *****John Butler (b. 1815) was A avid Satanist posing as a Baptist priest. He kept 53 slave, many of whom he sires chidren with. *****Elizabeth Leeper (b. 1821) came from a Satanic family from Pennsylvania. She was particularly evil, a very bad woamn. *****Matthias Kutsch came from France as a representative of a Satanic order that posed as a Christian one. He founded the Church of Kutsch, from which evil was spread in the state of Ohio. *****Mary was a cruel woman responsible for acts of pure evil. ******Satan (cira 4000 BC - 1832) he dug his way from the firey pit of hell to the surface of earth in 1807. He took the form of a human, and the name Perry Mason Butler. Perry got a job on a farm in Union County, Ohio as a stable mucker. After several weeks work he butched the family he worked for and took over the opperation of their farm. In 1814 he married Grafin Sophie von Brandenburg. They had one son, Edmund Silas. Perry therw himself under a horse and cart in 1832. He survived but died the following week from a dodgy loaf of bread. ******Grafin Sophie von Brandenburg (1807 - 1901) was sent by he cruel father, Geulph IV to Ohio, where her marriage was arranged to Satan incarnate. After the death of her first husband she returned to Germany to do evil deeds.

I rather suspect our old "friend Squeakbox" and/or Eric Jon Phelps has again been lurking around this board. This smacks of his type of mischief. Absolutely no Satanism in my family of which I am presently aware. The links of whoever posted it are almost as meaningful as Squeakbox attributing any postings from Toronto to me in Detroit area because the atlas as he views it shows them close together! I don't mind the insults on me -- I expected it and can take it -- are you trying to enhance my heavenly real estate holding? "Leap for joy when men say false things about you for My name's sake" as our Lord said, "for great will be your reward in heaven."

But have the decency to leave my grandmother alone! She was the most Godly person I ever knew!
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My godly father, John Merrill Butler was born in Van Wert, Ohio and lived from May 5, 1920 to October 23, 1983? Who is this suspect "John Merrill Butler, who allegedly lived from 1921-2002." Sounds like somebody who came back to vote in past Chicago elections!Don't know if the false reporting is Squeakbox, Phelps or another. But it is EVIL!
Constance, We love you and pray for fairness to be restored to you and your family.

And you have endured 25 yrs of abuse from that EVIL bunch. Wow!
Speaking of Squeakbox, he is probably sulking over at Wikipedia because you are not bringing over new information on Javier Solana that he can claim as his research. In fact I note that "Weathergirl" wrote that it is his page and that he wrote it. Good old Squeakie never corrected her.

Whoever made up that piece on Satanists certainly hasn't known how much slander Constance has had to deal with over the years. It usually came from people whose toes she was stepping on with her carefully researched information. The little smear job above is baby stuff compared to what she has had to confront in the real world.
Well Constance,

Looks as though they never stop with you. They can try to slander you all they want but truth is truth and like you said--your place in the Kingdom of God is absolute (course I paraphrased what you said but same idea). Hang tough and know there are many prayers for you and I too will pray in your behalf. Your research has borne out truth and will eventually show to all that has read your books and also here. God Bless you Constance and don't let them get to you. Just remember the spirit behind their evil (which I know you do--so rejoice as Peter tells us).

To the poster that said this:

"To the ones who are severly disabled and can't work remember the Lord has the final say so and make sure your heart is right with him. One day the very wealthy will answer. There's a scripture about the rich man and lazuras. The rich man was in torment and lazuras was at Abrahams bossom. Another good scripture is James chapter 5. Even my wages are garbage, but I try to keep in mind the whole picture."

Amen to that and thank you! God Bless you also!

Now here is a link on some history of eugenics since someone had mentioned eugenics:

This link gives a good look behind the thinking of some of these pro euthansia fanatics. This man is well known and still teaches this.
Here's the article I meant to put up on the last post:,hentoff,12702,6.html
As to the idea of helping the poor:

Many 'conservative' christians are so self-righteously certain that we are above the iniquity of Sodom because we do not stoop to perversions. But how many are ignorant that Ezekiel's declaration of the the basic sin of Sodom actually hits frighteningly close to home?
"For this is the sin of Sodom: they had plenty to eat, and lived in leisure, and they did not strenghen the hands of the poor."

Jesus said "if you did it not to the least of my brethren, you did it not to me." He also said, "love thy neighbor as thyself."
The poor are our neighbors, and need help because they are in anguish. Some have emotional and neurological afflictions that you want to judge as laziness. Most are struggling with burdens you don't even begin to feel.

Will you sit and polish your philosophies and principles along with our portfolios?

But how would you feel if you had to choose between heating your home or feeding your kids?

Would you not give thanks to God no matter where help were to come from?
Sorry Constance, I was only having a joke. You seem like a good person. I am just a little sceptical, well very sceptical, as one who doesn't believe in the God of the King James bible (which is highly doctored I may add.)

Do you read the King James bible? IF yes, why so? Why not get hold of a translation of the Hebrew originals and the dead sea scrolls?

Yours Truly

a Cumbey sceptic
A serious question here. I have to ask you if you don't believe in the God of the Bible, then what type of god do you believe in? You must believe in a savior of some sort. Please don't use the argument of the Bible has been doctored. If you believe in the hebrew version I assume you believe in the God of creation,and of Abraham? I realize there are a lot of theologies out there, but have you read the Bible through to prove what it is about, and why you don't believe in the God of the Bible? From what I've seen, even athiest still believe in something. Most of the times it does includes themselves in some sort of way. Do not take this as harsh please. But is it possible for one to save oneself? Out of all the pain and misery around the world, it seems to be a never ending circle of destruction. Even with all the education and technology, is life really any better? Is the final outcome any different? you know...death. After all what everyone is trying to defeat is death. From every point of view, from everything except christianity there is not a savior. There is no one who will stand on your behalf. So without a savior, it comes down to saving yourself. But what would you be saving yourself from? Friend in Christ.
Some interesting points there, anon.

I don't believe in any God, or a saviour of any sort. I don't believe in the Hebrew version either. I was just point out that the Bible is meant to be the word of God, but the King James one is more the word of the Catholic Hierarchy c.300 AD - 1650.

I do believe there is more to life than what we know though, i.e. I don't subscribe to the scientific doctrine.

I believe that it is possible to better yourself, or as you say save yourself. In my opinion no one else is going to do it, not Sean HAnnity, not George W., not Jesus H. Christ. I see a lot of Christians just saying "i'm waiting for Jesus to come" then he can sort everything out. I see it as an excuse to do nothing. Not sayiny all Christians are like this.

I believe technology can be posative if used properly, i.e. distrubuting supressed info on t'internet. You say "But what would you be saving yourself from?" byt what would Jesus be saving you from?

Sorry about the Devil liniage, it was something I found in the history of my old wikipedia user page. I just thoug it was pretty funny, an amusing satire.
To Sir Augustus: I thought of you when I heard the John Lenon song IMAGINE.
The way of life as composed by Jesus is the best choice. Nothing by you or Lenon can compare.
Give it a try, you might be surprised.

Here are the words to Johns song just for you.


Imagine there's no heaven,
It's easy if you try,
No hell below us,
Above us only sky,
Imagine all the people
living for today...

Imagine there's no countries,
It isnt hard to do,
Nothing to kill or die for,
No religion too,
Imagine all the people
living life in peace...

Imagine no possesions,
I wonder if you can,
No need for greed or hunger,
A brotherhood of man,
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world...

You may say Im a dreamer,
but Im not the only one,
I hope some day you'll join us,
And the world will live as one.
Well sir augustus, I really hope you do get around to reading the new testament. I do not look at the Bible from a catholic or whatever you want to tie to it. Remember the Bible was not designed to be a religion. It is the only book in exsistance that has the history of the world tied to the final outcomb of the world, and match 100%. I understand if you are a sceptic. Im not saying not to be. It is a way of keeping yourself safe. The only thing I can say to you is to commit to reading it to find out why this would not be the answer your looking for. There are so many things in the Bible that are so relevant today, especially when it comes to weather, earthquakes,wars,disease and so on. Yes I understand there is almost always a scientific reason, but that is not the point. The Bible predicted all these things happening to one generation. Not as preveous generations saw it little by little, here and there. I'm talking all of these disasters everywhere, and on record braking scales. Remember the Bible does not say what will cause all these things,or say exactly when, its just the fact that one generation will live to see all these things happen wold wide repeatedly. This is just a warning shot across the nose to the world. Matthew ch.24, Mark ch.13, luke ch.21, and many more. Its just a start. If the Bible is correct in these things, how many more things do you think could be correct? When it really comes to it, it is physically impossible to predict these things, but it has been. It is amazing! I hope you are up to the challenge. from freind in Christ.

This is hilarious
I think you're right on track and not many people are willing to admit that they share your views. lost pet is an AWESOME place to discuss LOST.
Sorry about my spelling. But honestly I dont care! If I can get my point across about the message of salvation, does spelling matter, even to all the educated geniuses out there? If you can understand the content, I guess thats all that matters. When I speak with my mouth, would you pick up on speeling errors? Get real. So I am a finger poker as well at typing, so am I unqualified? Do you think people argued punctuation with Jesus? I doubt it.... but would you?
I tried to figure out where to post this, but none of the three headings fit, so I just dropped it here.

There was a big todo about Anne Rice leaving Christianity behind and turning to Christianity. Here are two sites that speak about her book.

It seems she takes a lot of liberty with her interpretation of Jesus. It seems to me to be another attempt to separate Jesus from Judaism. Jesus was raised as a Jew, but she turns him into somekind of miracle kid, more fit for science fiction than for Christianity. At the second website, hers, a number of clerics tell her she has written a wonderful book.

Anyway, I think most people aren't going to use their brains regarding this book. They will just buy the image of a warm and fuzzy child Jesus.
I am shocked and saddened by the porn people posting their spam to this site. I am just now discovering AND ELIMINATING it. Many thanks to the "anonymous" who graciously called it to my attention.
Would you consider it a new age belief if people believed they could transform a piece of bread into god?
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