Thursday, September 11, 2014

Federica Mogherini - New European Union "High Representative for the CFSP"

UPDATE:  I'm learning more about Ms. Mogherini and some of it I"ll freely confess that I like.  She was recruited into Prime Minister Renzi's government after she posted a "sharp-tongued" tweet about him.  Rather than being threatened, he made her part of his government.  That Renzi was able to take constructive criticism says something for him.  Next and very big to me were the steps she took to help rescue a Christian -- Mariam Ibrahim -- under persecution -- a death sentence for her Christianity in the Sudan.  As Foreign Ministser of Italy, Ms. Mogherini worked for her release.  I am touched by the picture of her holding Ms. Ibrahim's young son, one of two born while she was held in cruel confinement for her Christianity.

This is from a Yahoo news "slideshow":  http://tinyurl.com/o53e4v9


 The European Union has named a new face to replace Catherine Ashton for the job originally created by and for Javier Solana.  Her name is Federica Mogherin:  High Representative for the Common Foreign and Security Policy.  She is a relatively young woman (41), well schooled in political science and political experience.  Her experience appears to come from the far left wing of politics.  She was formerly a member of Italy's  Italian Communist Youth Federation.  The Wikipedia reference can be accessed by clicking here.  Unlike Catherine Ashton who came inexperienced to the job, Ms. Mogherini has served for the past 7 months as Italy's Foreign Minister.

According to Wikipedia:

A member of the Italian Communist Youth Federation from 1988, in 1996 she joined the Youth Left after the dissolution of the Italian Communist Party and its transformation into a social-democratic party. In 2001 she joined the National Council of the Democrats of the Left (DS), and then in the National Executive Board and the Political Committee. In 2003 she started working at the DS's Foreign Affairs Department, where she was given responsibility for relations with international movements and parties, and later became the coordinator of the Department; finally, she was given responsibility for Foreign Affairs and International Relations in the staff of Piero Fassino, the party chairman. During this time, she took care of matters relating to IraqAfghanistan, and the peace process in Middle East. She maintained relations with the Party of European Socialists, the Socialist International, and their member parties.Moreover, she was in charge of relations with the USDemocratic Party.

Her goal is to end the Ukrainian crisis by re-establishing relations between Russia and the Ukraine, per the Wikipedia source.  According to observer, writer Joaquin Roy, she has both critics and challenges:

For her part, Mogherini will have to face traditional problems and new challenges. The establishment already mistrusts her because of her age. She will find little support from a group of people, most of whom could be her parents.
On the Commission, where she is vice president, she will hardly be comforted by the handful of women Juncker manages to recruit. On the Council she will have the support of only four ladies, led by Angela Merkel, in a boardroom full of boring men in dark suits and dreadful ties, each of them obsessed with managing foreign policy on their own terms and at their own risk.
The worst of the bad omens for the appointment is the suspicion that the EU’s hard core does not believe the position of High Representative to be important, given that the main security and defence competences remain in the national domains.
Mogherini’s second challenge, like that of her predecessor Catherine Ashton of the United Kingdom, is to cope with the enduring imprint of the founder of the position, Javier Solana of Spain.
She looks like an intriguing new figure on the international scene.  This should be interesting to watch.

Stay tuned!

CONSTANCE

Comments: 1 – 200 of 206 Newer› Newest»
Here is a link for more information on Ms. Mogherini:

http://www.esteri.it/mae/en/ministero/ministro/


Constance
 
Here's a London Telegraph story about some of the politics surrounding her rise to power in Italy and the new EU appointment to the world's highest paying political job:

http://tinyurl.com/koeajro

Constance
 
One more comment. I just Youtube searched her and found a video of her EU CFSP acceptance speech. She is fluent in English and handles herself well. I suspect we will hear much more of her.

Constance
 
Cathy Ashton was Treasurer of the UK Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament at the time it was strongly suspected of being in Moscow's pay, although any such payments were kept off-book. So I doubt that the tenor of EU policies will change much. Unfortunately.

 
http://www.herescope.blogspot.com/2014/09/stage-managed-ecumenism.html

in the article is a complaint that the evagelicalism as known once is now dead. How did this happen?

this article attempting to define evangelicalism, presents three definitions, and there are problems in both. The revivalist phase brought in an unbiblical mechanistic formula (Finney) way of doing things, and often involved outbursts and strange behavior such that one historian said more came to see the antics than hear the gospel (Johnathan Edwards' scene, who himself was a wife beater and preached messages that apparently led to despair and suicides). I add this from other sources.

According to the article, the early phase of evangelicalism involved putting The Bible into practice, obeying Jesus and cleaning up their own and society's act. Consistent with preaching by the Prophets and Jesus' own condemnations of hypocrisy and evil and the greatest hypocrisy would be to limit all this to the individual, and not attempt through law and condemnation of bad customs to change some of the society around one. Indeed, enough individuals change and society does change. This is not works righteousness where you earn salvation without Christ, but rather, bear fruit as He says to do - and He warns of punishment, in some cases up to expulsion from The Kingdom at the Last Judgement, if one doesn't bear any fruit at all.

However
THE THIRD DEFINITION is where the trouble we see today begins.

http://www.wheaton.edu/ISAE/Defining-Evangelicalism/Defining-the-Term
"A third sense of the term is as the self-ascribed label for a largely Midwest-based coalition that arose during the Second World War. This group came into being as a reaction against the perceived anti-intellectual, separatist, belligerent nature of the fundamentalist movement in the 1920s and 1930s. Importantly, its core personalities (like Carl F.H. Henry, Harold John Ockenga and Billy Graham), institutions (for instance, Moody Bible Institute , Wheaton College, and Fuller Theological Seminary), and organizations (such as the National Association of Evangelicals and Youth for Christ) have played a pivotal role in giving the wider movement a sense of cohesion that extends beyond these “card-carrying” evangelicals.

Recently, historian Molly Worthen has suggested that another way to understand evangelicals that goes beyond a strict theological, denominational, or sociological definition is to see them as Protestants that have historically been "circling around three questions": 1.) How does one reconcile faith and reason? 2.) how does one become sure of salvation; and, 3.) how do Christians reconcile their personal faith with a society that is increasingly pluralistic and secular?"

All these three questions presuppose an acceptance to some degree of the legitimacy of the things that war against faith, and adjusting to them, or forcing them to some extent to adjust to faith, but not enough to break them.

Let this "evolve" (or rather degenerate) into seeker sensitive, and add weird extreme behavior (with the help of the pentecostal thing, which turned up as an occasional oddity in those days and in Wales) and you have the modern mess.

 
Per her Italian government website bio:

She is a member of the Institute for Foreign Affairs (IAI), the Council for the United States and Italy and a fellow of the German Marshall Fund of the United States.

She is a member of the Council of the European Leadership Network for Multilateral Nuclear Disarmament and Non-Proliferation (ELN) and of the Group of Eminent Persons (GEM) of the Preparatory Commission for the Comprehensive Nuclear-Test-Ban Treaty Organization (CTBTO).


Constance
 
Disturbing pro-Euthanasia developments in usually Catholic Italy:

http://tinyurl.com/nr4dtph

Constance
 
Christine, how is it that your posts seems to carry so little weight? Perhaps it is the lack of facts and gossip used as filler.

And quite off topic again very early on, for this particular thread.
 
Anon 11:41

Why don't you use the collapse feature that Constance has mentioned before? Or, I've got an idea, just don't read her posts!!!

I've said before that sometimes Christina is a little out there and I don't agree with all of her posts, but, some of you just enjoy kicking her.

Some of you disagree with her, as is your right to do so, but some of you WANT her to continue with the very posts you have a problem with, so it seems it has become somewhat of a sport to bash her.

There are many others here who post off topic info and some who post things trying to be cute and funny. I don't like those posts. But guess what? I don't read them!!

Disagreement is ok, but some here are not what I would call nice people or Christian in the way they respond to her.
 
Excuse me, but I don't see how Jonathan Edwards, supposedly a wife-beater according to Christine, has one thing to do with Ms. Mogherini getting appointed to the EU High Representative post.

What clutter she often adds here.

Perhaps Christine should write instead for a gossip column.
 
Constance - Disturbing pro-Euthanasia

I think we will be seeing this progress to the USA very soon as the Alzheimer's epidemic has just started.

Of interesting note is that Aluminum and Floride are discovered as big factors.
We are receiving floride in the drinking water and reports of nano-partials of aluminum in the chemtrail spraying.
http://www.naturalnews.com/044366_fluoride_aluminum_brain_damage.html
 
"On the Commission, where she is vice president, she will hardly be comforted by the handful of women Juncker manages to recruit. On the Council she will have the support of only four ladies, led by Angela Merkel, in a boardroom full of boring men in dark suits and dreadful ties, each of them obsessed with managing foreign policy on their own terms and at their own risk."

well, what direction do these people want to go in? If it is anywhere in a direction compatible with her plans, if these are her plans, she might be able to do it.

"The worst of the bad omens for the appointment is the suspicion that the EU’s hard core does not believe the position of High Representative to be important, given that the main security and defence competences remain in the national domains."

if so, then it won't be status of the office as much as her ability to persuade them to cooperate that matters.

On the other hand, the real problem seems to me, not so much what EU thinks as what Russia and Ukraine thinks.

The entire Ukraine thing was the work of the US/NATO interests, run by the banksters, to get Ukraine into EU so it could be looted like the IMF etc. does.

NATO symbol is a disguised swastika, and the EU itself is the manifestation of the non violent uniting of Europe under German control (in this case only part of the time) plan of the Nazis for post WW 2 survival of their ideal.

One of the founders was himself "ex" Nazi. The history of de nazification in general is a shameful failure, excused by "the old guard know how to do things, etc." and powered by the secret coalitions across the Atlantic pre, during, and post WW 2. The same reason why certain plants were never bombed, because they were part of the property of "American" big business.

The Kiev forces that threw out the man who wouldn't go for the EU semi joining, are clearly old guard nazi collaborator derived.

Ukraine itself is the artificial creation of Gen. Ludendorf and the German General Staff who pulled off essentially a scam. "Ukraine" means frontier and never had a national history. Crimea being Ukrainian is the work of the USSR specifically Kruschev.

Personally I think Ukraine should be partitioned and the eastern half rejoin Russia, it was always Tsarist property, and Kiev itself is part of the original Russian heartland.

EU drew back to some extent from American hostility to Russia, because of its dependence on Russian gas. This might be a driver in eventually either siding with Mogherini's plan, or going for partition, or both.
 
http://scgnews.com/the-geopolitics-of-world-war-iii

"Contrary to popular belief, the conduct of nations on the international stage is almost never driven by moral considerations, but rather by a shadowy cocktail of money and geopolitics. As such, when you see the mouthpieces of the ruling class begin to demonize a foreign country, the first question in your mind should always be "what is actually at stake here?"

For some time now Russia, China, Iran, and Syria have been in the cross hairs. Once you understand why, the events unfolding in the world right now will make much more sense.

The U.S. dollar is a unique currency. In fact its current design and its relationship to geopolitics is unlike any other in history. Though it has been the world reserve currency since 194 this is not what makes it unique. Many currencies have held the reserve status off and on over the centuries, but what makes the dollar unique is the fact that since the early 1970s it has been, with a few notable exceptions, the only currency used to buy and sell oil on the global market."

obviously there are other interests in play or these games wouldn't work too well. but this article is important, although SCG (Storm Clouds Gathering) is not a Christian source or reliably pro Israel. No one who does fit these categories should be taken as 100 % reliable to be taken on faith all the time without checking things, either. After all we are all only human (which means "fallen," nice sounding word eh? get real, it means warped, evil inclined and incompetent sometime the incompetence driven by the prior two elements and prideful and we need to fight its manifestations in ourselves not accept them as okay - as distinct from forgivable and if something isn't bad then what's to forgive? yes fallenness and its personal manifestations are bad - God didn't make us this way).
 
Xtine,
Thanks so much for the juicy gossip !
I don't know who you were quoting ( you deflect that information with a wave of your keyboard ), regarding Jonathan Edwards, but you feel the need to quote it. With friends like you The Gospel doesn't need any more enemies.
It's always a treat to read what worldly sources have to say about Christianity. And then to have it filtered through your worldly lens Xtine, so that it adds up to slanderous gossip. It must be true because someone said it.
Fantastic, and as usual, malicious and an attempt at damaging to the furtherance of the Gospel.
If you like that you should watch the History Channel on TV, where they almost continually
tear down all things Christian in a very matter-of- fact, pseudo-intellectual way.
So Evangelical is now a dirty word, or a "modern mess" as you put it, since you are standing on Eastern Orthodox solid ground, because nothing closer to home was quite right for you.
_Not that you speak Aramaic or know anything at all about life in Syria, or the Peshitta, or the hidden anti trinitarian agenda of George Lamsa.
I repeat: Xtine is a jammer and a disinformation agent on this website. She doesn't do any useful work. She is idle. If it weren't for this website she
wouldn't be doing anything at all.
 
its a modern mess because it is being taken over by liberal theology and values and charistmatic deception and new apostolic reformation, which third wave or latter rain rehash, which Constance first discovered due to a New Ager's positive review of their eschatology, and details in a chapter in A Planned Deception, then known as Manifest Sons of God or MSOG.

all the "advances" in unwholesome ecumenism and new type meditation called contemplative prayer and spiritual formation, and degenerate music and freedom to sin, are from the evangelical camp now, whatever other camp they were in originally.

As for Adam Lamsa, I know nothing of him except he had something to do with an English translation of the Peshitta.

my trek into Eastern Orthodoxy had nothing to do with him, and everything to do with The Bible and early church writings and practical experience in driving out demons and evil spirit and psychic influence and getting myself under control.

I would question your teachers and everything you know and go back to the drawing board if I were you. I weould start here,
http://myocn.net/saint-ignatius/ A DISCIPLE OF ST. JOHN THE APOSTLE and you can find Justin Martyr and St. Irenaeus (A DISCIPLE OF POLYCARP HIMSELF A DISCIPLE OF ST. JOHN THE APOSTLE) online. BOTH MID AD 100s.
 
bear in mind, that the same poisons wreaking avoc in evangelicalism, in anglicanism and RC have started to infect Orthodoxy, but Vladimir Moss' books refute them as not Orthodox. notions that attack the Atonement, hell and so forth, and abuse of the doctrines of love and forgiveness to disempower actual and potential victims of various things sexual and otherwise, and empower victimizers. (These already have messed up our justice system to some extent, no more flogging restitution just restarted in some states 10 or 20 years ago as part of the criminal system not a separate expensive civil procedure, death penalty almost eradicated, low sentences for rape and murder and no laws against adultery and all laws against homosexual acts altered to only prohibit non consensual homosexual acts).

so be on guard in ALL churches Orthodox and otherwise.
 
Paul, you called it about what really happens here nearly ever single time we hear from Christine. A jammer who hinders rather than helps getting the truth out and no friend to the Gospel.
 
"my trek into Eastern Orthodoxy had nothing to do with him, and everything to do with The Bible and early church writings and practical experience in driving out demons and evil spirit and psychic influence and getting myself under control."

No Gospel in that testimony Christine. You have ratted yourself out...again.
 
no Gospel, eh? what do you think "THE BIBLE" in that sentence contains? What do you think the disciple of Apostle John and the disciple of John's personal trainee would be talking about?

in fact, these people were denouncing heresy and deceivers before you were born (to put it mildly).

Eastern Orthodox is the original church with more bells and whistles perhaps than poverty and hiding from persecution would allow in the first century.

If you want to hear Gospel, I got rescued by God from demons in the early 1970s, and had reservations based on evolution and Noah's Ark supposed ridiculousness, but in AD 1977 I found out the arguments against evolution, that even some scientists were rejecting it, and that the carrying capacity of Noah's Ark was 350 boxcar loads, which made the whole thing credible.

I decided that if Jesus is the coming rightful King over all I'd better do what He says. What does He say? get baptized. So I got baptized.

The rest is history, Eastern Orthodoxy is fine tuning.
 
"As for Adam Lamsa, I know nothing of him except he had something to do with an English translation of the Peshitta."

oops that's George Lamsa, sorry, not awake yet that time of morning.


 
The devil reads the bible too Christine! He 'believes' too...but no repentance. No repentance and no obedience to that word means someone does not truly believe it. No changed heart and no changed life wrought by the Spirit of God is still on the broad path that leads to destruction. Honestly, your testimony does not bear witness to these things.

God's word has the power to alter a human life-any human life. Your words show they have no Gospel power. You may be altered in some psychic, humanistic, religious (holy water, etc) way but are you truly ? And don't miss this...that does not mean any church altar--that means the cross of Christ is where you by faith have reckoned yourself dead in your trespasses and sins and made alive in the blood of the Lord of life.

The devil knows what the bible says and it says you must be born again. He loves to use religion (churchy things) to confuse the issue! The devil was obviously not born again. Were you?

Words don't cut it. You are all about words Christine, so get alone, away from the computer, and go do the heart check and see if you are in the faith. Don't let your pride keep you from dealing real with this.

Seriously. Do it.
 
you have no idea what changes have happened in me and in my life. neither are you going to hear about it because you will then use it as some kind of grist for your mill.

as for pride, dumping that sin was how I decided to go ahead and get on SSI admit I couldn't make it without help.

why don't you take a look at yourself for a change.


 
From BROOKINGS......where Javier Solana is a distinguished fellow in the Foreign Policy program:


In a clear reference to Mogherini, Lithuania's President Dalia Grybauskaitė said that the EU must not pick someone who is “pro-Kremlin”—an exaggerated charge, perhaps, but indicative of the sensitivity and concern her candidacy has caused. But above all is the view that others are better qualified to deal with the Russian challenge—not just in terms of years clocked on the foreign policy beat but in the substance of what they say and do about it. Carl Bildt, Sweden’s foreign minister, is a leading example. Polish Minister of Foreign Affairs Radek Sikorski is another. Bulgaria’s Kristalina Georgieva, currently EU commissioner for humanitarian aid, would be a good compromise candidate.

One would think that the views of these member states would be taken extremely seriously by the rest of the EU. Instead, isolating and defeating them is just another “part of the political game.” Needless to say, this is not a game. It is the most serious security threat Europe has faced in over two decades. Two hundred and twelve EU citizens were killed by a Russian missile fired by Russian backed separatists in July. Thousands have died in Ukraine as a result of the war Russia started. And in recent weeks, Russian forces have begun a formal invasion of Ukraine.

It is mind-boggling that in a week when Russia opened a third front in Ukraine, European leaders are even considering appointing anyone other than someone with a proven track record of understanding and meeting Russia’s challenge, let alone a person who has consistently underestimated the risk. It’s as if a climate skeptic from the oil industry was to be appointed as environment minister.
....read more.....

http://www.brookings.edu/blogs/up-front/posts/2014/08/italian-foreign-minister-mogherini-europe-wright

 
Then my question is why don't your words give God glory instead of you and your religion and practices?

This is what prompted my words and you have no idea how I meant them. If you knew what I was referring to in the first place, in this most important spiritual matter, you would not have been offended and welcomed such thoughts.

I do not need to know anything about you, and not mine to know, but as one soul to another, I encouraged you be sure of where your confidence rests. It appears by your words that your EO church and assorted add-ons (church-related and otherwise) are where your dependency is based.

We are to find our soul's only safety and life dependency and rule of life in the faith Christ died and rose again to give us. Looking to and leaning upon the Lord when we say we are followers of Jesus. Jesus said follow Me-not follow My followers or follow My church. That seems to be the lack or you would readily admit this. So the ball is in your court to know this for your own personal edification. My questions and understanding of the words you yourself wrote only highlight the need you present.
 
To anyone I ask this:
As to Ms. Mogherini EU appointment, is it possible she is being set up for a fall?

 
Christine,

Don't waste your time arguing on this issue. This is the usual either/or Protestant game, where two things are constantly pitted against each other.

Susanna, has more sense and stays out of this.



 
here's what I think. The fact that Brookings is bitching like this, shows that the elites it represents usually are on the let's-have-WW 3-and-make-lots-of-money bandwagon.

That the other people they quote are bitching like this, shows that Mogherini is exactly what is needed now.

Brookings institute is not ignorant like the average person talking about a war Putin started. It is a liar. They are a think tank with all kinds of information incl. classified to work with.

Putin didn't start anything. US spent over a billion dollars to "bring democracy" to the Ukraine, i.e., destabilize the place. A bunch of Ukrainian semi traditionalists meaning neo nazis who idolze Stepan Bandera illegally overthrew the prez who decided not to follow oligarchs and others into slavery to the EU and the IMF.

Ukraine started looking dangerous for Russia, since its long standing warm water port is Crimea, and they have a naval base there with by treaty the right to up to 25,000 troops in place. This is of course ESSENTIAL TO ACTION IN THE MIDDLE EAST, and Russian and Chinese support of Assad keeps Christians safe there.

Crimea, added without choice to Ukraine by Kruschev, went independent and requested Russia to take them in, which Russia did.

Ukraine meanwhile has been giving trouble to Russian population mostly in the east. Two cities tried to establish themselves as independent.

EU of course at first was upset it didn't get to acquire Ukraine as a semi member, who would add to EU wealth without having full EU voting membership. BUT they realized that they rely a LOT on Russian gas.

Mogherini's appointment sounds to me like EU is carefully ready to bargain with Putin. Whatever their long term goals are, they realize it is not a good idea to push them now, perhaps not in this generation.

Maybe WW 3 won't break out in eastern europe.

The definition of "europe" as anything east of Austria and Poland is culturally and historically idiotic anyway. Greece would get a pass on that for historical influence, but the rest of them are not a good fit. Slavic countries in general are in their own category as you move east. The definition of europe as almost the same as eurasia, and that as the entire european AND north asian continent, sounds like laying the psycho-political groundwork for european empire in Asia at some point.

Also consistent with Nazi goals in the past.
 
anon. 6:07 how do I not give God the glory? and if you'd bother to look into EO services and prayers online, they are all about that. Far more so than the typical protestant church service, and RC is kinda midrange, having deviated from and developed from EO.

ALL the main categories have the "civil religion" angle where religion takes a back seat to regular life.

God led me to a stronger situation and better teaching and information than I had before, the good stuff I had before was similar to what I find in EO but I didn't know this, and it existed because both derive from The Bible, or in some cases from wisdom John Wesley got from studying the church Fathers of the first 500 years or so.

anon 6:42, yeah she could be being set up for a fall. OR she might be set up as window dressing to make Putin trust EU more, and back off his defensive stance. OR she might represent a sane element, but might fall because of the not so sane element.
 
It is interesting to note that Federica Mogherini's father Flavio Mogherini was a successful cinema set designer who worked with renowned film directors that included Pier Paolo Pasolini.

Pasolini, who was violently murdered on November 2, 1975, was more than just a famous film director - just as his films were more than just films insofar as they were said to have had a deep political significance - influenced as they were by Italian Communist Antonio Gramsci whose cultural infiltration and transformation strategy known as "cultural hegemony" is still being implemented today ( i.e. "political correctness")

Pasolini himself was also an Italian political figure and was a member of the Italian Communist Party.

...Pasolini referred to himself as a 'Catholic Marxist' and often used shocking juxtapositions of imagery to expose the vapidity of values in modern society. His friend, the writer Alberto Moravia, considered him "the major Italian poet" of the second half of the 20th centrury....

......Pasolini joined the Communist Party as a young man - in his works he often explored ideological problems, but his relationship with Communism was questioning - like later the attitude towards him by his party members. The mutual schism led to his expelling from the party for alleged homosexuality. However, Pasolini regarded himself as a Communist to the end of his life......

......In LE CENERI DI GRAMSCI (1957) Pasolini returned to ideological debate. He took as his starting point the theories Antonio Gramsci (1891-1937), a political leader and the cofounder of the Italian Communist Party, who spent in fascist prisons the last ten years of his life. Pasolini accepted the rational arguments of Gramsci, but was tormented by his attraction and revulsion for the world he observed.....


http://www.pierpaolopasolini.com/bio.htm
_________________________________

Pasolini’s use of dialect owed much to the influence of Antonio Gramsci, the Sardinia-born Marxist who wrote his major works from Mussolini’s prison cell. Pasolini took from Gramsci the need for a national popular art that would engage a critical working class. This was to be part of a wider political struggle to project an alternative proletarian culture in opposition to ruling-class hegemony and occupied the breadth of Pasolini’s early work, through his poetry and subsequently through his writings and films. His celebrated 1957 poem, The Ashes of Gramsci, reflected his debt to Gramsci’s thought; notably the way “forbidden voices” can inform social change.........

https://www.opendemocracy.net/arts-Film/pasolini_2982.jsp
_________________________________

In 1967, in Venice, Pasolini met and interviewed the American anti-Semite, expatriot poet Ezra Pound who supported the Third Reich during World War II, was later tried for treason against the United States and convicted. They discussed the Italian movement neoavanguardia, arts in general and Pasolini read some verses from the Italian version of Pound's Pisan Cantos.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ezra_Pound
_________________________________

NEOAVANGUARDIA

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoavanguardia
_________________________________

By the way, Miguel Serrano, who, along with Savitri Devi, was a co- founder of "esoteric Hitlerism/ Nazism", was an admirer of Ezra Pound.

Ezra Pound & the Angel
Miguel Serrano

http://www.counter-currents.com/2011/10/ezra-pound-and-the-angel/
__________________________________

See also:

http://www.counter-currents.com/tag/on-pound/
______________________________

Interesting "convergences," are they not???
 


6:07 P.M.

"I encouraged you be sure of where your confidence rests. It appears by your words that your EO church and assorted add-ons (church related and otherwise) are where your dependency is based". Hey 6:07 P.M.,,,,, that applies to ALL religious Zombies here, whether or not your in some apostate protestant church ,EO, or the catholic cult.

Seems there are idols here at this blog, 'high and lifted up', and then there are the lower caste, that are just fodder! Good for abuse.
 
People can take or leave whatever they wish. My hope is that they do not dismiss the Holy Spirit when the truth is put in front of them no matter who or what denomination it comes from but that part is entirely up to them of course.

People answer to God so I take no offense at persons whether they agree or not. Many love to shoot the messenger for messages that they can't handle for whatever reason. So what!

....the beat goes on...
 
Christine in response to 6:07, you figure it out since no one can suggest anything to you.

And try not to be a modern mess yourself.
 
"As to Ms. Mogherini EU appointment, is it possible she is being set up for a fall?"

They asked that about Cathy Ashton too, but it proved not to be the case. More likely is that Mogherini and Ashton were potentially disposable frontmen for the real power players behind.

 
Anonymous 5:57 A.M.

From what I have read, Mogherini's EU appointment had more to do with appeasing certain groups with an agenda than it did with her actual qualifications for the job.

With the passage of time and the rush of events, the stakes have become much higher. Yet the EU continues to select its leaders as if its postmodern continental paradise were not under siege from the south, because of the disintegration of the Arab world, and to the east, thanks to Russian aggression. Just like last time, the selection of the new high representative, Federica Mogherini, was undignified, full of haggling, and more focused on her gender, party affiliation, and nationality than on her actual qualifications for the job. And those are few: Mogherini emerged from obscurity just a few months ago to become Italy’s foreign minister.

Critics look at Mogherini’s lack of experience and assume that the EU’s underperformance in foreign policy will continue. This is a real possibility, and with crises brewing to Europe’s east and south, this is a particularly bad moment for the EU to descend into a bout of internal squabbling. But Mogherini can transcend the process that selected her and be the foreign policy representative the EU needs if she learns a few lessons from the recent past.

Back in 2009, pundits were filled with hope about the new EU foreign policy chief. The post was new and newly empowered to set up a diplomatic corps, the European External Action Service (EEAS). Against this backdrop, the choice of Ashton, an unknown British politician with no foreign policy experience, came as a cold shower. Her appointment reinforced the perception that the EU leaders’ stated resolve to raise the union’s foreign policy profile was rhetorical rather than real
..............

http://www.brookings.edu/research/opinions/2014/09/04-high-representative-expectations-eu-shapiro-alcaro
_________________________

See also:

http://www.project-syndicate.org/commentary/paola-subacchi-pillories-italy-s-prime-minister-for-insisting-on-his-choice-for-eu-foreign-policy-chief
____________________________

Her acceptance speech on becoming the EU’s high representative for foreign affairs and security policy revealed little. Of course, she didn’t want to offend anyone, particularly not the Nordics, Balts, and Poles, who are skeptical about her attitude toward Putin. They remember that Mogherini’s first foreign visit during Italy’s last turn at the EU’s rotating presidency was to Russia.

Mogherini’s new job is a minefield. She will have to manage the diplomatic corps of the European External Action Service, an institution that still lacks a clear strategy for how it will fit in with the diplomatic services of the EU’s member states.

At the same time, Mogherini will serve as vice president of the European Commission, where she will have to cope with much infighting and egos. And she will have to deal with the big member states. Just as Tusk, a conservative, is beholden to Merkel and Cameron, the left-leaning Mogherini is beholden to French President François Hollande and other left-wing leaders
.............

http://carnegieeurope.eu/strategiceurope/?fa=56502

 
"Mogherini’s first foreign visit during Italy’s last turn at the EU’s rotating presidency was to Russia."

hmmmm. maybe an effort to appease Putin (or set him up with a false sense of security for the next game they play on him in Ukraine or to continue the present one?) was a big part of this.

as for a WW 3 scenario, POTUS is planning to bomb ISIS (good) without getting permission from Syria first (bad) so probably Assad having some sense is not going to shoot American planes and effectively help ISIS, but POTUS wants to arm the moderates (who are a mythical beast) and this means arming ISIS so Russia who is already supplying arms and maybe some advisors to people fighting ISIS (I think this is only in Syria but maybe Iraq) will get dragged into this mix more so, and things will erupt. Iran will of course be on the side of anyone opposing ISIS, so they will get into it. China will also, because they get a lot of oil from Iran, and already backed Russia in the Mediterranean to stop an American incursion in Syria (which if done would have triggered a regional war which would have involved the foregoing players and easily gone beyond regional). Pakistan will support China not USA due to high handed treatment, that resulted in China saying that an attack on Pakistan will be viewed as an attack on China (I don't recall seeing much about American incursions without Pakistan permission and accidentally killing Pakistani troops and such like since then).

Long ignored by people who make projections about WW 3 and who will fight who, is that BRICS refers to
BRAZIL, Russia, INDIA, China, I forget the S maybe that is just a plurality indicator, and other nations have joined since then. So we can assume Brazil and India will not be on the USA side in the case of WW 3.


 
China has already quite a quiet presence in Africa, and the Boko Haram thing (which has started its own caliphate or something like that) is probably going to cause China to be in play against it, since they are already allergic to islamic jihadism since they have had to deal with this at home.

Russian military equipment is likely present someway somehow, since an old Antonov figures in the movie Lord of War, a semi humorous account of an actual international gun runner who I think was finally caught. (the bit at the end about Col. South, obviously Ollie North, and the way things actually run as opposed to how they are supposed to run is worth taking note of, though eventually this guy did get taken down.)

The USSR collapse resulted in the greatest fire sale in history as one writer put it, and a lot went to Africa for its various wars.

Now, Rev. 13 describes the beast as being like a leopard (something present in Africa, but could also relate to Chinese origin infrastructure to the empire this represents), feet of a bear and feet are the weapons of a predator like this, note earlier ref. to Russian arms, and the mouth of a lion, perhaps it will be English speaking, or it may spew the alleged Anglo American values, or it may overtly support the actual Anglo American values.

Daniel 7 shows four beasts arising from the sea, probably the Mediterranean. Since the others apparently come from the other cardinal directions, this last one probably comes from the south, from Africa.

And from it will arise the antichrist, though his ethnicity, real or alleged religion, and personal point of origin (birth place) and political point of origin (some imperial office held over some geography) could be the same as all or most of the conflicting interpretations over the centuries claim, since this empire will conquer the other three.

So it looks like the groundwork for this fourth beast is being built in Africa now.

We are usually told Daniel 7 is rehash of the statue dream of Nebuchadnezzar, and only about ancient empires. But the former segues into the Second Coming and Last Judgement, while the latter ends with the establishment of the Kingdom of Heaven, Christ's first coming.
 
"POTUS wants to arm the moderates (who are a mythical beast) and this means arming ISIS so Russia who is already supplying arms and maybe some advisors to people fighting ISIS (I think this is only in Syria but maybe Iraq) will get dragged into this mix more so, and things will erupt."

Maybe. Maybe not. Every time a new conflict breaks out in the Middle East a certain mindset says "This Is IT!" One day such people will be right. So far they have been wrong every time. Unless you have divine revelation, you can't know.

It is now abundantly clear from the recent histories of Egypt, Syria, Iraq, Libya that the only choice in the countries of the region is between a strong dictator who will in practice be a nominal Muslim, or an Islamic fundamentalist regime. If the West has any remaining sense then it will back the former option. Saddam Hussein was a terror to the people of Iraq, but a terror to the West he was not.

"China has already quite a quiet presence in Africa, and the Boko Haram thing (which has started its own caliphate or something like that) is probably going to cause China to be in play against it"

China is certainly going to defend its financial interests in Africa, which are extensive - when it realised the risks of holding US debt some years ago it started to buy up Africa instead.

Boko Haram is now linked with IS, al-Qaeda and other lovelies.

"The USSR collapse resulted in the greatest fire sale in history as one writer put it"

Among other things, Ukraine found itself in possession of nuclear weapons from the Soviet arsenal. Russia didn't want an independent Ukraine to have them but was not then in a position to do anything about it. The USA didn't want Ukraine to have them either, so it guaranteed Ukrainian security on condition that Ukraine gave them up. Now the USA is reneging on that pledge. Ukraine is not a member of NATO, so NATO is not shafting Ukraine by not engaging; and arguably the USA should not guarantee Ukraine's security in view of its location and history; but this US failure to honor its word does mean that the word of the POTUS will be taken less seriously worldwide.

What is that history? Russia takes its name from Kievan Rus, an early mediaeval political entity in that region - Kiev being the capital of Ukraine. This really is Putin's doorstep, and perhaps it should be.

 
IS is run by a guy, Ibrahim Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, who fell out with Zawahiri, the man who took over al-Qaeda after Osama bin Laden was taken out. (Zawahiri was implicated in the assassination of President Sadat of Egypt in 1981 by, through front organisations, the Muslim Brotherhood which was founded in Egypt.) Al-Baghdadi reckoned that Zawahiri was too moderate.
 
Anonymous 5:45 A.M.

RE: It is now abundantly clear from the recent histories of Egypt, Syria, Iraq, Libya that the only choice in the countries of the region is between a strong dictator who will in practice be a nominal Muslim, or an Islamic fundamentalist regime. If the West has any remaining sense then it will back the former option. Saddam Hussein was a terror to the people of Iraq, but a terror to the West he was not.

You are absolutely right. But as the saying goes, "it takes two to Tango," and if there is currently no viable alliance between Washington and Damascus, it is largely due to a failure to mend relations on the part of Damascus, not Washington.

At The Jewish Policy Center, researcher Michael Sharnoff writes:

Learning the lessons of history, dating back to 1955, Syria has consistently demonstrated that it is not a friend of the United States.

Throughout the Cold War, Syria chose to ally with the Soviet Union. From the rise of Khrushchev through the Brezhnev years, Syria played a role in the Soviet strategy to undermine U.S. interests in the region. Even during the Gorbachev years, leading to the collapse of the Soviet Union in 1991, Syria failed to grasp a golden opportunity to broaden ties with Washington. During the heyday of Washington-brokered peace deals of the 1990s, Syria failed yet again to mend relations. Today, Syria's dangerous policies continue to demonstrate that it is a duplicitous regime.


http://www.jewishpolicycenter.org/833/the-syria-soviet-alliance

 
P.S.

It is also noteworthy that the Soviet excuse for invading Poland from the east on September 17, 1939(a little more than two weeks after Hitler invaded Poland from the West on September 1, 1939 violation of the Riga Peace Treaty and the Soviet-Polish non-Aggression Pact) was very similar to the excuse currently being given for Russia's invasion of Ukraine in violation of the Budapest Memorandum:

By 17 September, the Polish defence was already broken and the only hope was to retreat and reorganize along the Romanian Bridgehead. However, these plans were rendered obsolete nearly overnight, when the over 800,000-strong Soviet Red Army entered and created the Belarussian and Ukrainian fronts after invading the eastern regions of Poland in violation of the Riga Peace Treaty, the Soviet-Polish Non-Aggression Pact, and other international treaties, both bilateral and multilateral.[Note 6] Soviet diplomacy claimed that they were "protecting the Ukrainian and Belarusian minorities of eastern Poland since the Polish government had abandoned the country and the Polish state ceased to exist".......



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasion_of_Poland

 
Last week the brother, Mohammed, of IS's leader, Ibrahim Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, came out as a Christian. He is currently resident in the USA. This didn't make the mainstream media - kinda embarrassing when you hear such news first via al-Jazeera:

http://worldnewsdailyreport.com/brother-of-top-isis-leader-repents-converts-to-christianity/

 
Susanna, don't you realize none of that matters? NONE OF THAT POST MATTERS BECAUSE....Assad is the protector of Christians along with other religious minorities in Syria, he belonging to an islamic heresy himself, alawism.

and BECAUSE.....Wherever the Arab Spring wins, persecution of Christians either begins where it wasn't before, or ramps up far worse than it was.

USA and Euro elites are often closet satanists of one stripe or another. This situation about Christian persecution resulting from American actions CANNOT BE AN ACCIDENT. where there is a repeated pattern, there is intent. It can't be called unintended consequences beyond the first maybe at most second event.

and of course there is no viable relationship with Damascus because USA intelligence forces were always backing and creating the color revolutions and Arab Springs incl. the effort to eliminate Assad, which become overtly admittedly American govt. effort?



Just like supposed CIA incompetence was nothing of the sort. They were created by and run by and for Wall Street types, and their real purpose was always to serve the military industrial complex interests, to give an opportunity for adventure to those so minded among them, and to rake in the big dough, which means the alleged purposes of CIA could never be pursued in any effective way, because that would end the Cold War and end the military contractors' income. And end the CIA's reason for existence.
 
To Dan Bryan:

Welcome aboard!

Constance
 
To Christine:

I think we should give the new HR on board for the EU a chance. If she can tone down the tension between the EU,Ukraine and Russia at a time of such deep tensions in the world, more power to her. If she has an agenda, it will come out and we can react then.

Constance
 
To Christine:

I agree with the analysis you cited vis a vis the money situation -- what might be driving the anger toward Russia is the BRICS situation -- Brazil, Russia, India, China, and South Africa and their efforts to start a new international bank which could be perceived as endangering our currency. Able observers here have pointed this out in the past and I have been carefully watching as a result of their 'heads up' on this issue.

Constance
 
To Anonymous re Christian Conversion of brother of top ISIS leader:

Would that they would all go and do likewise!

Constance
 
I am liking some of the things I am reading about Ms. Mogherini. For one thing, she worked for the release of Sudanese woman Mariam Ibrahim, a Christian who was sentenced to death by a Sudanese court for marrying a Christian and refusing to adhere to her Father's Islamic faith even though she said she had been a Christian all her life and could not change. I'm going to put the picture up of Ms. Moghherini proudly holding the small son of the woman she worked to save from a Sudanese death sentence.

http://tinyurl.com/oc5s22y

Constance
 
I wonder about the possibility that the conversion to Christianity by Mohammed al-Baghdadi might just be a ruse and a way of fooling anyone and everyone who may want to believe it.
What if this very man were elevated to a position of power and then began to speak peace peace when there is no peace ?

 
...Not that anyone in ISIS would ever tell a lie.
 
Christine, your post of 7:14 where you said the following:

Putin didn't start anything. US spent over a billion dollars to "bring democracy" to the Ukraine, i.e., destabilize the place. A bunch of Ukrainian semi traditionalists meaning neo nazis who idolze Stepan Bandera illegally overthrew the prez who decided not to follow oligarchs and others into slavery to the EU and the IMF.

Ukraine started looking dangerous for Russia, since its long standing warm water port is Crimea, and they have a naval base there with by treaty the right to up to 25,000 troops in place. This is of course ESSENTIAL TO ACTION IN THE MIDDLE EAST, and Russian and Chinese support of Assad keeps Christians safe there.


...these are interesting thoughts, but I don't think they bear up under scrutiny (esp. the part about Putin not starting anything.)

Let me reiterate something I post here from time to time:

The "collapse" of the Soviet Union can be shown to have been a staged event, as part of a long-term strategic goal to put the West to sleep, and allow the enemy in Moscow to regroup and come back to finish us off another day. (That's an oversimplified view, but will do for now.)

If such a strategy was (and still is) in place, it has been largely successful. Just looking at the way things are shaping up seems to verify this idea.

Susanna has posted some recent entries showing various convergences among geopolitical entities. This is an important thing to look at in any geopolitical analysis. There is a great deal of historical and present cooperation and strategic partnering between the "Brown" of Nazism, the "Green" of Islam, and the "Red" of Communism/Marxism. They are all cut from the same cloth, and have the destruction of Christian, Western civilization as their goal. Sadly, the achieving of that goal is coming along quite successfully.

In case anyone is interested, Cliff Kincaid of Accuracy In Media and Survival USA will be having Jeff Nyquist on his Roku TV show tonight. I PROMISE YOU, it will an interesting and enlightening show for anyone wanting to know the root causes of much of the unrest going on in Ukraine and other areas of concern. It certainly is not something that the US started or was involved in, in my opinion.

Please listen to Cliff and Jeff tonight, so you can be better informed to arrive at your own conclusions.

Here's a link to the show if you don't have Roku TV:

http://www.kenneytv.com/Roku.html

If you do, search for "America's Survival TV" show with Cliff Kincaid and Jerry Kenney.

Cliff usually posts a link to the show a few days later on either youtube or on his website, which is here:

http://americasurvival.org/

Putin and Russia are the bad guys, NOT the USA! Spend some time on Cliff's site, and you'll come to the same conclusion.
 
As an addendum to my above comments, please also check out a series of articles written by Jeff Nyquist on his homepage. The series is called "Empire of Lies" and is in four parts. You'll need to scroll down a ways, and the older articles are further down.

http://jrnyquist.com/

 
Pope Francis Rejects Extra Security During Trip to Muslim-Majority Albania Despite Isis Assassination Threats

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/pope-francis-rejects-extra-security-during-trip-muslim-majority-albania-despite-isis-assassination-1465839


__________________________________


Vatican responds to Islamic State threat

The Vatican has played down renewed reports of a death threat against Pope Francis by Islamic State (IS) militants.

On the eve of the pope’s one-day trip to Albania next Sunday, the Iraqi ambassador to the Holy See, Habeeb Al Sadr, on Saturday told the online version of Rome daily Il Messaggero: “Our intelligence and our analysts suggest this [attack on the pope] could happen.

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/vatican-responds-to-islamic-state-threat-1.1928690?mode=print&ot=example.AjaxPageLayout.ot


__________________________________



Isil want to assassinate the Pope, says Iraq's ambassador to Vatican

Habeeb Al Sadr warns that Isil's "band of criminals" could have Pope Francis in its sights, ahead of the pontiff's visits to Albania and Turkey

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/the-pope/11098905/Isil-want-to-assassinate-the-Pope-says-Iraqs-ambassador-to-Vatican.html


 
Dear Marko,

Re: Susanna has posted some recent entries showing various convergences among geopolitical entities. This is an important thing to look at in any geopolitical analysis. There is a great deal of historical and present cooperation and strategic partnering between the "Brown" of Nazism, the "Green" of Islam, and the "Red" of Communism/Marxism. They are all cut from the same cloth, and have the destruction of Christian, Western civilization as their goal. Sadly, the achieving of that goal is coming along quite successfully.

If you haven't done so already, you may also want to take a look at the Norman Dodd interview conducted by Edward Griffin. It is riveting! Here we not only see the origin of Common Core which Charlotte Thomson Iserbyt has dubbed "communist core" but we also learn about how tax exempt foundations are engaged in other "un-Amercan activities" - with "un-American" being defined by Mr. Dodd as "effecting change in this country through unconstitutional means." Moreover, the purpose of this change ( as described to Mr. Dodd by government officials ) was to effect the peaceful merger of the United States with the former Soviert Union ( now Russia). This so-called "convergence" between capitalism and communism ( a.k.a. "Third Way" ) was a theory embraced by none other than Franklin D. Roosevelt.

Benito Mussolini described his new movement as a "Third Way" between capitalism and communism.

The Reese Committee - NORMAN DODD (full interview by Edward Griffin)

Published on Sep 10, 2012

"The Reese Committee learned that the 'Rockefeller Foundation' and the 'Carnegie Endowment for International Peace' were, with tax exempt dollars, funding leftist propaganda operations aimed to changing America through the brain, not the battle field."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gz-ouH2MRfQ
_______________________________


cont...
 
cont.

United States House Select Committee to Investigate Tax-Exempt Foundations and Comparable Organizations

The Select Committee to Investigate Tax-Exempt Foundations and Comparable Organizations was an investigative committee of the United States House of Representatives between 1952 and 1954. The committee was originally created by House Resolution 561 during the 82nd Congress. The committee investigated the use of funds by tax-exempt organizations (non-profit organizations) to see if they were being used to support communism. The committee was alternatively known as the Cox Committee and the Reece Committee after its two chairmen, Edward E. Cox and B. Carroll Reece.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_House_Select_Committee_to_Investigate_Tax-Exempt_Foundations_and_Comparable_Organizations
_______________________________

See also:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/3768227/Dodd-Report-to-the-Reece-Committee-on-Foundations-1954
______________________________

In my opinion, one of the most interesting questions asked about the super-rich promoters of socialism - whose goal, according to Vladimir Lenin, is communism - has to do with why the super-rich who head gigantic tax exempt foundations such as the Ford Foundation, Rockefeller Foundation, Carnegie Foundation, etc., and are rich beyond the wildest dreams of human avarice would even think about supporting communism???

According to Norman Dodd, the heads of these foundations see Communism as the means of developing a monopoly of which they will be the ultimate beneficiaries. ( i.e. when the means of production become concentrated in hands of an elite few who will then be able to control it....namely, themselves). Remember, socialism is not about "sharing the wealth." It is about consolidating and controlling the wealth.......and doling it out only to those who show themselves willing to "toe the party line."

It is the logical and perfect sociopolitical tool of a powermongering megalomaniacal elite which disguises its agenda as "social justice."
 
Paul,

My understanding of the brother in the USA, per the news accounts I have read, is that he is a long time USA resident/citizen and is an engineer educated in the USA. His brother has him under a "Fatwa" / Death sentence. He is in the witness protection program of the USA as a result. At least, that's what I read.

Constance
 
George Lamsa was, as I recall, a person with close association to several occult groups including the Unity School of Christianity where he was a frequent speaker, ARE (Association of Research and Enlightenment), and others. That, I would say, most likely made him a dedicated New Ager and I would distrust the spin that would give him on a Bible translation given choice of words and meanings.

Constance
 
Everybody should refresh their browser as I have added to the original post story about Federica Mogherini, the EU High Representative for CFSP designee pending office at the close of Catherine Ashton's EU term in November.

Constance
 
I note that the Italian government, Prime Minister Remzi, Foreign Minister Federica Mogherini, and Pope Francis seem to be the ones who gave real help in the form of her flight from the Sudan after they worked to secure her release. I suspect the USA government was in on it, too, but the enthusiastic help for this poor lady, Mariam Ibrahim appeared to come from the Italians, God bless them!

Constance
 
An interesting Der Spiegel article on Ms. Mogherini.

http://tinyurl.com/lsauesn
 
Another excellent DER SPIEGEL article and video about the Mariam Ibrahim release and the Italian government officials greeting her including Prime Minister Renzi and his wife together with Federica Mogherini:

http://tinyurl.com/nl7dd9k
 
From Ms. Mogherini's website for Italian Foreign Ministry dated August 8th:

Iraq: Mogherini cites need to protect Christians and Yazidi and support Kurds halting Isis

Rome 08 August 2014
Minister for Foreign Affairs Federica Mogherini considers fundamental and urgent the mobilisation of the entire international community in the protection of Christian and Yazidi minorities in northern Iraq. "We must protect Iraqi civilians and, in particular, the Christians and Yazidi being persecuted by ISIS", she said, "and support the Kurdish Peshmerga militias in halting the advance of ISIS. For this reason, we agree with American President Barack Obama’s decision to intervene.

The international community must stand at the side of the Iraqi government and move to bring aid to the populations", Mogherini CONTINUED. "Italy is already active in this. Deputy Minister Lapo Pistelli has just come back from Iraq and the Cooperation has earmarked one million euro, through WHO, WFP and UNICEF, for emergency assistance for the displaced, and to re-establish proper living conditions in areas inhabited by Christian minorities in the Nineveh Plain area under Peshmerga control".

The foreign minister will have a telephone meeting this evening with Kurdish President Massoud Barzani.


Constance
 
Sorry, here's the tiny url link to the Boston Globe article I just referenced:


http://tinyurl.com/qhh48ku

Constance
 
More from that same Boston Globe article about Matteo Renzi:


Nobody would confuse Renzi with José Luis Rodríguez Zapatero, the former leftist Spanish premier who waged war with the Church on virtually every front, and whose name became shorthand in Catholic circles for secular hostility to the faith.

At a personal level, Renzi spurns pretense, often going around tieless and insisting on using the colloquial “tu” in conversation rather than the formal “Lei”. He called on politicians to embrace simpler lifestyles, among other things, selling off a fleet of luxury cars used to transport heads of state. Politically, he opposes the stern fiscal austerity measures associated with Germany’s Merkel government, arguing that the state has a responsibility to help workers and the poor. He also called for liberalized IMMIGRATION LAWS, saying earlier this month that Europe must not “close in fences and lose sight of the fundamental value of openness in the world.”

Any of that sound familiar?

On Tuesday, veteran political commentator Ernesto Galli della Loggia asserted that Renzi has the “Catholicism of a Boy Scout,” is rooted more in sentiment than any grand intellectual theory, focused on CONCRETEchallenges, “efficient and compassionate,” “open to the ideas of others,” and “kind and simple.”

“Today, in the epoch of Francis,” Galli della Loggia wrote, “this may be the only kind of Catholicism capable of being translated into politics” and getting anything done.

Unsurprisingly, Renzi is an unabashed Francis fan. He’s told Famiglia Cristianamagazine that “he believes a great deal” in the pope’s reforms, and admires him “for putting at the center of everything the relationship of a pastor with his people.”

 
Marko,
"They are all cut from the same cloth, and have the destruction of Christian, Western civilization as their goal."

in case you hadn't noticed, Putin is backing the Russian Orthodox Church and pushing Christian civilization agendas, while the west throws Christian civilization in the garbage.

As for US having nothing to do with what got started, you are wrong, the evidence incl. a taped phone conversation by Nugent or whatever her name is with someone, even discussing who would be the best US puppet to put in charge.

The problem began years ago, when NATO took in east euro countries contrary to its promise not to expand, at the end of the Cold War. NATO has been slowly encroaching on Russia for many years, and something should have been done earlier against this.

Motive? aside from empire there is the issue of NATO needing to justify its continued existence. Career issues.

you need to read sources other than what makes you feel pumped up and strong to fight something or other. Been there, done that, repented of it.

yell all you want about the NWO but until you realize USA-NATO-EU and to a lesser extent Britain ARE the NWO you will tilt at windmills. Do research going back 150 years and on secret societies whose members run things now (incl. fraternities like Skull and Bones) Anthony Sutton is a good starting point.

Staged event? I've heard that theory. It has only the word of a defector with a lot to gain (reliable support financially from telling what his handlers wound want to hear) and let's suppose it was really a plan, that plan went into overdrive and became a power in itself, it stopped being a play and became a reality.

As for Cliff Kincaid, I think he is an idiot stuck in the 1960s. I have no time for anyone with the kind of semi dark mechanistic self certainty I see in his photo. Sorry Constance, I know you like him. But I outgrew his kind back in the late 1980s and had some doubts about them a few years prior.

As for George Lamsa, I never read his Bible translation and never knew anything about him except that he made a translation. It would be nice if someone with better credentials would make a translation from the Peshitta it sounds interesting in itself.

Mogherini's statements show she knows the situation better than most in the USA do.
 
"As for Cliff Kincaid... I have no time for anyone with the kind of semi dark mechanistic self certainty I see in his photo... I outgrew his kind back in the late 1980s"

So that's settled then. Do you not realise that comments like this say far more about you than about Cliff Kincaid?

 
got curious about Lamsa, here is wikipedia
"In 1989 the Christian Evangelical apologetics research ministry Christian Research Institute asserted in a published review that several of Lamsa's theological positions and interpretations were not supported by the Bible. The review concludes by saying:

"On the surface, Lamsa appears to be a revealer of biblical truth and culture and a friend of evangelical Christianity. Closer study, however, has revealed that Lamsa promotes metaphysical, not evangelical teachings which have led him to inaccurate interpretations and translations of portions of the Bible. As an ambassador of Nestorian, not biblical culture, Lamsa became a cultic figure in his own right." [11]

William M. Branham, evangelist and personal friend to Lamsa [12] has said:

"To our gratification we find the words in both amazingly the same so that there is no difference actually in content or doctrine. We may even conclude that God has allowed these newly discovered manuscripts and recent publications of already known scripts to come before us to prove the authenticity of what we already had. And we find that though translators may fight each other, scripts do not." "

How Branham can say that is amazing unless the Peshitta or its translation is even worse than assumed here, because Branham was anti Trinitarian, while Nestorianism, which Lamsa represents, is Trinitarian but supposes the Second Person of The Holy Trinity overshadowed or walked with or merged with the man Jesus, or in some other way that a severe distinction between natures (divine and human) means a distinction of persons in Jesus Christ Himself.

http://www.peshitta.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=2697

more dirt, scroll down http://www.bible.ca/trinity/trinity-translations.htm

still more dirt, incl. ref. Lamsa claimed to remember "his Armenian people" being massacred, but if he claimed them as his then either he came from a VERY mixed marriage (monophysite with nestorian, opposite poles) or is lying about this or about being Assyrian (nestorian).

http://www.equip.org/articles/george-m-lamsa/#christian-books-5
 
anon 4:29

"Do you not realise that comments like this say far more about you than about Cliff Kincaid?"

yeah, it says that I have grown allergic to indicators of trouble and have learned from experience.
 
It says also that you think you can judge by looking at somebody's picture. Believe that if it gives you any comfort.

What impression do you think you give, in your YouTube clips?

 
Christine,

I disagree with just about every point you made in your response to what I wrote about regarding Putin, Russia, Cliff Kincaid, etc. I don't have the time right now to rebut them all, nor do I think it would do any good even if I did.

If you think Putin is a great defender of Christianity then I've got some good Christian muck land to sell you. Has all the right nutrients to develop a fertile mind perfect for sowing seeds of deception into.
 
This comment has been removed by the author.
 
my youtube clips need to be redone. stumbling, bumbling, mumbling, try to focus on content rather than delivery. I really should type up and read it instead of try to explain things as I go along.

Translating a primarily visual and associative networked kind of thinking into words is difficult, and my enunciation is a bit bad.
 
My personal jury is still out on Putin. Cliff Kincaid dislikes him intensely, but I'm still watching. I personally thought the Olympics this year were an exercise in decency that the USA tried to spoil by injecting blatant homosexuality into them.

I also have to agree with Putin's statement that he may or may not have said with pure motives that "by the USA putting same sex marriage on the same level as marriage with children, has opened its doors to Satanic influences."

Indeed we have. Now even a broken clock is right twice a day. Maybe these were the only times Putin was right, I don't know, but my jury is still out on the man.

Constance
 
I didn't know anything about Federica Mogherini before I read about her here.

Therefore, I had no "a priori" biases about her one way or another.

Like Renzi, who is a little younger than she is, Mogherini has also been marinated in "Third Way" communism for most of her life, so as far as I am concerned, her being a communist in and of itself does not necessarily make her an evil person.

After doing a little research on Federica Mogherini, I must say that the jury in my "court" is out on her as it would be for anyone who appears to be acting for the sake of political expediency. This is on account of her unfortunate trip to Russia during which she made it look as if Italy were overstepping its bounds as President of the EU vis a vis its stated backing for the construction of the Russia-sponsored South Stream gas pipeline project which would bypass Ukraine and pump gas directly to Europe. .....starting with Italy.

Some leaders reproached Mogherini for having said, after talks in the Kremlin on 9 July, that Italy was ready to support for the energy dialogue between Russia and the European Union in order to promote the implementation of the South Stream gas pipeline project.

The construction of the Russia-sponsored South Stream gas pipeline, intended to pump Russian natural gas directly to Europe and bypass countries such as Ukraine, ran into a number of hurdles as the European Commission attempted to block the project’s implementation over Russia’s stance on Ukraine.


http://www.euractiv.com/sections/global-europe/profile-federica-mogherini-next-eu-foreign-affairs-chief-308102
________________________________

Italy ready to mediate energy dialogue between Russia, EU — FM
Economy
July 08, 14:53

http://en.itar-tass.com/economy/739508
___________________________

Italian EU presidency backs South Stream

10.07.14

http://euobserver.com/economic/124930
__________________________

As for any efforts Federica Mogherini may have made on behalf of Mariam Ibrahim, they are laudable indeed.

In fact, one can only hope that Ms. Mogherini will be no less effective in putting a stop to the persecution of Uniate Christians and Jews in Ukraine by the once Stalin - approved Moscow Patriarchate which is trying to make Uniate Christians and Jews the scapegoats for the current crisis in Ukraine. Unfortunately, the "Third Way" communism of the Moscow Patriarchate seems to be morphing into the "Moscow as Third Rome" agenda.

For the record, on July 8, 2004, the “3rd Rome” theory of the Patriarch of Moscow was formally denounced by Greek Orthodox Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew.
 
Constance and others who agree with Putin's statements:

Evil people can say good things. When you study the man - his history, his associations, his actions in the past - you find someone whose words cannot be taken at face value. Everything he says is to further some agenda, or at the least to keep the reins of power in his own hands as much as possible.

I agree with his assessment of the decadence of Western civilization. But I believe what he would replace it with is much darker. He is a devil disguised as an angel of light.
 
Putin is ex-KGB, is a brilliant strategist, but this whole global chess match looks a bit staged, doesn't it?

One time Obama is saying "I'll have more flexibility when I get re-elected", next he is starting a new Cold War with Russia. One thing is for sure. All of this will eventually lead to the dollar demise, which will usher in global currency. Russia just signed a weapons contract with Egypt. There are deals going on outside of the dollar left and right.

There have been reported Russian troops on US soil. Our government is destroying its sovereignty and welcoming in the UN global warming carbon tax, illegal immigrants from who knows where.

Europe is doing likewise. Yesterday and today NY times and CNN had articles about all the illegals coming on boats through Sicily. Many die sadly , but a lot of them make it to land and are absorbed into the great EU.

Last but not least there is ISIS, a creation of the
West, who has been busy stirring up religious war. Is this General Pike's plan in play?

What do you think Constance?
 
Marko,

From National Review Online by Editor-at-large, Jonah Goldberg:

May 28, 2014 12:00 AM

Vladimir Putin’s War on the Truth
The Russian president revives the Stalinist trope of dubbing political opponents “fascists.”

By Jonah Goldberg

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/378875/vladimir-putins-war-truth-jonah-goldberg
__________________________

Jonah Goldberg is the author of the book LIBERAL FASCISM: THE SECRET HISTORY OF THE AMERICAN LEFT FROM MUSSOLINI TO THE POLITICS OF MEANING.

At first sight, Mr. Goldberg's title seems to be oxymoronic - until one carefully considers his argument thatfascist movements were and are left-wing.

 
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/378875/vladimir-putins-war-truth-jonah-goldberg

SOME nazi goons in the overthrow? SOME suchlike in the govt. in Kiev? how much do you need before it is obvious? The Ukrainian culture tends to glorify Stepan Bandera and his Nazi scene.

When a similar picture would emerge regarding an antiwar group in the 1960s it would be immediately branded as communist by the same kind of thinkers as write this rag, and with good reason.

"To be sure, we have our homegrown nuts, but the Soviets fertilized and cultivated the crop at every opportunity. Immediately after the assassination of John F. Kennedy, the Soviets went into overdrive nurturing “independent” writers such as former German Communist Joachim Joesten. His Oswald: Assassin or Fall Guy? was the first book on the murder, appearing before the Warren Commission issued its findings. Joesten “discovered” that Kennedy was killed by the CIA, of course.

When the Mitrokhin archives — the files of a defector KGB librarian — were opened in the 1990s, we learned that Joesten was funded by the KGB. "

when you want to make trouble for an enemy, you dig up dirt on him. IF THAT DIRT IS REAL IT IS EVEN BETTER FOR YOUR CAUSE.

To read this you would think nothing ever was researched and printed against the lone nut theory except by commies.

Guess what. All the evidence AGAINST OSWALD AS KILLER is in the voluminous collection of testimony in the Warren Commission books, several volumes, and their conclusion DOES NOT FIT THEIR FACTS.

The EU itself was founded (with the help of others) by a Nazi and is the same thing that the Nazis in their last days planned to do by economics once their military plan to unite europe under Germany failed.

Various attacks on Putin as having gone after "capitalists" or "entrepreneurs" ignores that these men were more like mafia than normal American businessmen, and peace only came when Putin struck a deal, they stay out of politics, don't try to influence, and he would back off the war on them, which hopefully had by then taken out the worst of them.

"He’s a dictatorial, charismatic leader who bends church, business, labor, and media to the needs of a centralized state under a thoroughly nationalist banner. "

So did Reagan.

We should have done what Kennedy said must be done, in a speech that contained enough to piss off everyone and ensure his death, most likely arranged by a couple of guys on the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the only ones with the ability to run Oswald through the many strange twists of his military life. yes, he was set up.

Kennedy said that we should stop backing dictators just because they were anti communist, and side with the legitimate desires of the people for freedom, before commies could get in there and exploit this.

To get Ho Chi Minh to help against the Japanese, he was promised that we would back him against the French later.

This promise was broken, and the Viet Nam war was one of the results, because he turned to the commies to get help against the French (who were using brutal German soldiers incl. ex SS on the run in their French Foreign Legion in French Indochina as it was called then).

and if you don't think America is corporatist now, take another look at the role big business plays in getting people elected, and google "the revolving door."
 
Susanna,

In my travels, speaking for HLI, in the 1980s and sometimes 1990s, I met the Catholic Bishop of Moscow. He was a wonderful man who obviously showed strains of past persecutions. He was interested in talking with me about Dr. Kevorkian. I'm interested in the information you present about an alleged "Third Rome" envisioned by the Orthodox Church. Is there pressure against Russian Roman Catholics by Orthodox interests. I would like to know much more having met a few of the Russian Catholic players over the years. I once had a Russian Catholic priest visiting from there as a guest on my Detroit WMUZ radio program, LAW TALK. It was sometime between 1992 and 2006, the years I was involved in that programming.

Constance
 
Hi Constance,

Your question was directed at Susanne, but if I may, I would suggest one place to start looking is with a man named Konstantin Preobrazhenskiy (or Preobrazhensky). Here's the intro from a wikipedia article on him:

Konstantin Georgiyevich Preobrazhenskiy (Russian: Константин Георгиевич Преображенский; born in 1953 in Moscow) is a former KGB officer, an intelligence expert and the author of several books and numerous articles about Russian secret police organizations.

He is known for his publications about KGB operations in Japan, recruitment of Russian emigrants by Russian Foreign Intelligence Service, and infiltration of Russian Orthodox Church by the KGB/Federal Security Service (FSB)
.

He has written extensively about the infiltration of the Russian Orthodox Church, which Putin uses as a way to "authenticate" his statements of moral authority over the decadent West. It's all a show. The extent of the lie he lives is open to debate I suppose, but I think it is safe to say he is not who he portrays himself to be.

Once KGB, always KGB, with the exception of bona fide defectors.
 
one analyst put it this way more or less, while the KGB was infiltrating the Orthodox Church, the Orthodox Church via persuasive influence and actual conversion, was infiltrating the KGB.

bear in mind, that the test of validity of anything is not whether it conforms to USA interests, or style.

and the Russian people have always preferred a strong leader. Better this guy Putin than either a sap who will let them be overrun militarily or looted (as their oil and gas were being looted before Putin took over) on the one hand, or a flat out Hitler with racial agendas and covert eventually to go overt neo pagan agendas.
 
"Putin is "a dictatorial, charismatic leader who bends church, business, labor, and media to the needs of a centralized state under a thoroughly nationalist banner." So did Reagan."

Except that if a churchleader, a business leader, a union leader or a media mogul didn't do what Reagan wanted, he didn't end up framed in jail. This comparison is deeply disingenuous and is the sort of thing that might itself have been made by somebody in Putin's pay.

 
"business leader, union leader, or a media mogul" in Russia you are talking about a very different animal than here. Do more research on the Russian Mafia and their tentacles. I don't think it was a matter of framing at all.

When the USSR fell and Heritage Foundation was in there as advisor, the transition to an uncontrolled undirected economy was immediate, and without intermediate phases and anything went. The worst elements gained a lot of control, and they didn't bother to frame anyone. They just beat them up or killed them.

Meanwhile, people who used to wait all day to get a little meat, now could get none, while meat was dumped by the road, because it wasn't profitable to get it to the people who wanted it.
 
This comment has been removed by the author.
 
What on earth are you talking about? YOU are the one who quoted "church, business, labor, and media". You talk here like a paid Putin spy. Come to think of it, you have been pretty free in accusing others of bad motive here.
 
yeah I quoted it to remark that this game of defacto centralization is played everywhere incl. in USA

Then it is pointed out to me, that under Putin business labor and media (not church) who disagree can end up framed or dead, unlike under Reagan.

Now at this point we have a totally different issue, not that such categories get drawn into support to create a centralized (because semi unanimous in the power base) effect,

but rather what happened to some in such categories of power under Putin.

At this point, I recall all that was coming out of Russia in those days, and details you either are ignorant of, or forgot or are dishonestly leaving out and hoping everyone else doesn't know or forgot.

The situation in Russia was totally different. Putin walked a fine line with people who would kill him if they could.


As for paid Putin spy, do you want to see America destroyed? just keep pushing for war. Because America will face a coalition that can't be beat. As I have said before start learning Russian and Chinese. In case you all are too dense to understand what I mean, you will need to speak the language of the new ruling class and occupation authority and once brought into citizenship status in the empire, to understand voter materials in elections. That's if you are alive.

Of course if you represent elites with underground bunkers and above ground extensive compounds working with plants that can stand such, and you think it would be fun to restore godly govt. meaning monarchy (DEMOCRACY AND CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLICS WERE ORIGINALLY CLASSED AS LEFTIST ALSO FROM THAT PERSPECTIVE) and feudalism, and you think these people will take you in after you help take down the USA, and others too damaged to occupy or elites think they can cut deals or run them, go right ahead. you may be in for a surprise. Such people use and throw away useful idiots as much as commies and hitlerites and so forth do.
 
"In case you all are too dense to understand what I mean..."

We know exactly what you mean. We just don't share the image of yourself that you have, and phrases like that are in large part why. You are in danger of becoming just a figure of fun at this blog.

 
So Christine,
If you never read the Lamsa translation, then what Bible do you use in your EO services ?

 
New King James Version for the NT and I think a mix of two translations of the Septuagint for the OT, almost all quotes from the latter in liturgical use are from the same OT books you use but Wisdom of Sirach and/or Wisdom of Solomon not the same as Proverbs sometimes shows up.

These books were not added by RC but the common inheritance of it and EO from early times, and the first KJV included these, but Luther kicked them out and tried to kick out James and Revelation.

That's for the lectionary but the liturgy itself draws mostly on Psalms and NT extracts to make its statements.

Here is an entire Holy Liturgy (slight variations in different times, such as "save us O Son of God Who is risen from the dead" is the usual form, but on The Exaltation of The Cross it is "save us O Son of God Who was crucified for us" I give this example because I attended this year's celebration of the finding of the Cross and remember this).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYg5D6gpe98

the tones it is sung in vary somewhat also. There are no musical instruments, the bulk of the service is always the same, but the readings from Scripture differ of course,

the sermon is usually not very long and is supposed to be in the first half of the service, where I go it is after Communion.
 
Lamsa has nothing to do with Orthodoxy anyway. Aside from his heretical teachings, any Orthodox (because Trinitarian as opposed to Arianism, which is represented today by JWs and William Branham and others) tradition he came from, if he wasn't just a liar exploiting interest in the exotic, is either nestorian or monophysite, and they descend as churches from the time the undivided church, before RC schism, now called Eastern Orthodox, rejected these heresies. Supposedly they have softened their heretical stances in past centuries. the issue is Christology. monophysitism calls itself miaphysitism now, and to its credit rejected the extreme monophysitism of Eutyches, which was also rejected by the relics of St. Euphemia.

In nestorianism person and nature are confused, so that two persons appear to be how they view Jesus Christ, in monophysitism the same, so that the divine and human natures are merged into a kind of hybrid nature though they recite "without confusion" etc. regarding the two natures, but it is hard to tell what they believe as one person put it. One story to the Chambesy conference, another for internal consumption apparently.

Christological heresies that don't deny either His humanity or His divinity hinge on confusion between person and nature.
 
the Peshitta is from Syriac, the NT used by the Orthodox churches is either Greek, the Byzantine text type, or translated into whatever vernacular.
 
Dear Constance,

Re: In my travels, speaking for HLI, in the 1980s and sometimes 1990s, I met the Catholic Bishop of Moscow. He was a wonderful man who obviously showed strains of past persecutions. He was interested in talking with me about Dr. Kevorkian. I'm interested in the information you present about an alleged "Third Rome" envisioned by the Orthodox Church. Is there pressure against Russian Roman Catholics by Orthodox interests. I would like to know much more having met a few of the Russian Catholic players over the years. I once had a Russian Catholic priest visiting from there as a guest on my Detroit WMUZ radio program, LAW TALK. It was sometime between 1992 and 2006, the years I was involved in that programming.

There is certainly pressure against Russian Roman Catholics - few as they are in Russia - by Russian Orthodox interests!

....The Roman Catholic Church in Russia is part of the worldwide Roman Catholic Church, under the spiritual leadership of the Pope in Rome.....

.....Due to the long-held views of the Russian Orthodox Church, Catholicism is not recognized by the state as a legitimately Russian religion, and Catholics have often been seen as outsiders, even if they are ethnically Russian.

The Soviet Union, which persecuted all religions, also saw Catholicism as a non-Russian allegiance.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Catholicism_in_Russia

_______________________________

See also:

Russian Catholics Greet New Pope With Open Arms

By Jonathan Earle

Mar. 15 2013

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/russian-catholics-greet-new-pope-with-open-arms/476956.html
_______________________________

The following article goes back to 2002.......only about 12 years ago.

RELIGIOUS PERSECUTION IN RUSSIA?

State agencies said to be conducting anti-Catholic campaign

Published: 04/23/2002

.......Although Putin on several occasions has described Russia as a “secular state,” the Russian government continues to work closely with religious leaders of the Russian Orthodoxy. Observers note that since the time of Czar Peter the Great (d.1725), Russian Orthodoxy has remained nearly a department of state, having little autonomy from the central government........

http://www.wnd.com/2002/04/13639/
________________________________

***********************


cont....
 
cont.
 

cont...

As for the "Third Rome" envisioned by the Moscow Patriarchate, this is not a new idea. Moscow has been called "the Third Rome" since the 1400's.

THIRD ROME

The story of "Third Rome" ("the second Constantinople") started in 14th century Bulgaria, under the reign of Tsar Ivan Alexander. He aimed to raise the prestige of his land and capital, introducing the name Tsarevgrad Tǎrnov for it (in comparison to the Slavic name of Constantinople - Tsarigrad), which was later supported by the words of Patriarch Callistus I of Constantinople that "Tǎrnovo is the capital of the Bulgarians and second both in words and deeds after Constantinople".........

.....Russian claims

See also: The Tale of the Princes of Vladimir

After the fall of Tǎrnovo to the Ottoman Turks in 1393, a number of Bulgarian clergymen sought shelter in the Russian lands and transferred the idea of the Third Rome there, which eventually resurfaced in Tver, during the reign of Boris of Tver, when the monk Foma (Thomas) of Tver had written The Eulogy of the Pious Grand Prince Boris Alexandrovich in 1453.

Within decades after the capture of Constantinople by Mehmed II of the Ottoman Empire on 29 May 1453, some Eastern Orthodox people were nominating Moscow as the "Third Rome", or the "New Rome". Stirrings of this sentiment began during the reign of Ivan III of Russia who had married Sophia Paleologue. Sophia was a niece of Constantine XI, the last Byzantine emperor. By the rules and laws of inheritance followed by most European monarchies of the time, Ivan could claim that he and his offspring were heirs of the fallen Empire, but the Roman traditions of the empire had never recognized automatic inheritance of the Imperial office. A stronger claim was based on religion. The Orthodox faith was central to Byzantine notions of their identity and what distinguished them from "barbarians". Vladimir the Great had converted Kievan Rus' to Orthodoxy in 989, in return for which he became the first barbarian to ever get an Imperial princess as a wife.

The idea of Muscovy as heir to Rome crystallized with a panegyric letter composed by the Russian monk Philotheus (Filofey) of Pskov in 1510 to their son Grand Duke Vasili III, which proclaimed, "Two Romes have fallen. The third stands. And there will be no fourth. No one shall replace your Christian Tsardom!" Contrary to the common misconception, Filofey explicitly identifies Third Rome with Muscovy (the country) rather than with Moscow (the city), although the term "Muscovy" was considered synonymous with the Russian lands at the time. Somewhat notably, Moscow is placed on seven hills, as were Rome and Constantinople......

......21st century

Several political analysts and journalists have argued that Vladimir Putin aspires to make the Russian Federation into the Third Rome.

As Nikita Khruschev's granddaughter Nina L. Khrushcheva explained with both historical and contemporary references:

Moscow has been known as the "Third Rome" since the 1400s. When Byzantium collapsed, old Moscovia assumed its responsibility... Now Moscow can re-assume this role. Under Putin, the Soviets' secular society began to rethink its place in a world in which conservative religious beliefs take precedence over civic norms. This helps explain why two members of the feminist punk group Pussy Riot were sentenced in 2011 to almost two years imprisonment for performing their anti-Putin prank "prayer" in Moscow's main Cathedral of Christ the Savior.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Rome
_______________________________
 
cont...

It speaks volumes that when Francis Cardinal Bergoglio was installed as Pope Francis, for the first time in history, the Greek Orthodox Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew of Constantinople attended Pope Francis' installation Mass in Rome......while the Russian Orthodox Patriarch Kirill did not.

It also speaks volumes that it was Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew and not the Russian Orthodox Patriarch Kirill who met with Pope Francis and knelt side by side with him in Jerusalem to pray and to acknowledge the "ecumenism of blood" which was occurring due to the persecutions and murders of Orthodox, Roman Catholic and all other Christians in the Middle East.

03/15/2013
TURKEY - VATICAN
For the first time since the Great Schism, ecumenical patriarch to attend pope's inaugural Mass

The metropolitans of Argentina and Italy will accompany Bartholomew. Moscow Patriarchate hopes in closer cooperation with Rome but excludes for now a meeting between Pope Francis and Patriarch Kirill.

.......Relations between Catholics and Orthodox have been improving since the Second Vatican Council through mutual visits, acts of friendship and theological dialogue.

Under Benedict XVI, the dialogue picked up in earnest after a lull. In trying to promote it, the pope suggested ways to express the primacy of Peter's successor that could be acceptable to the Orthodox, finding his inspiration from the undivided Church of the first millennium.

Catholic ecumenism has met however with great resistance from the Russian Orthodox Church and the Moscow Patriarchate, seat of the 'Third Rome'...........


http://www.asianews.it/news-en/For-the-first-time-since-the-Great-Schism,-ecumenical-patriarch-to-attend-pope's-inaugural-Mass-27408.html
______________________________

ALL THE BATTLES OF KIRILL

6/5/2014

The Patriarch of Moscow and all the Russians tightens the invitation from Pope Francis, the “rivalry” with Bartholomew and the crisis in Ukraine

Marco Tosatti
Rome

The Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople, Bartholomew, primus inter pares ( "first among equals" ) among the Orthodox, was one of the protagonists of the Pope's trip to the Holy Land and will be at his side on Sunday in the prayer for peace in the Holy Land. These are events that revive his role, and consequently weaken the claims of the Moscow Patriarchate for a leadership position in Orthodoxy, to the detriment of Constantinople. It is not excluded that Pope Bergoglio’s desire to meet with Kirill was not reaffirmed to temper their apparent favor of Rome towards Bartholomew; but it is evident that in the quiet, and even so, battle between the Second and Third Rome, the Second Constantinople is scoring points. .....

http://vaticaninsider.lastampa.it/en/world-news/detail/articolo/ortodossi-ortodoxos-orthodox-34562/

cont...
 
cont...

The following article nails it with regard to the "Third Rome" mentality of the Moscow Patriarchate. It describes Moscow's overreaching ambition to preside over all of orthodoxy.

THE ILLUSION OF THE THIRD ROME

Cyril’s imperial policy is leading the Russian Orthodox Church to isolation

23 August, 2011 ▪ Oleksandr Kramar

Patriarch Cyril (Kirill) of Moscow again was in Ukraine on July 26-28. Nearly all mass media that reported his visit emphasized the word “again.” The reason is because the patriarch’s visits have become so frequent that he appears to be using any suitable opportunity to travel to Ukraine. This is already his third trip in 2011. Moreover, on July 26 he met in Kyiv with Ilia II, Catholicos-Patriarch of Georgia, who has a strained relationship with the Georgian government and supports Cyril’s initiatives in the region. The current visit and the meeting of the two patriarchs appear to be not so much a bid to reinforce Moscow’s positions in “canonical territories” as a desperate attempt to save the “Russian World” with its “original Orthodoxy” from becoming marginalized and insignificant.

Cyril’s overreaching ambition to establish Russian hegemony in the Orthodox world appears to be making the Russian Orthodox Church (ROC) increasingly isolated. On the one hand, this is corroborated by the more active efforts of the Constantinople patriarchate to consolidate the Orthodox churches in Europe and the Mediterranean and its ostentatious disregard for Cyril’s aspirations to play a special role in the process. On the other hand, the failure of Cyril’s “Ukrainian blitzkrieg” is becoming increasingly obvious. Not only did it fail to draw all Ukrainian Orthodox churches that are not part of the Moscow patriarchate closer together but also stirred discontent over Moscow’s brutal interference among the autonomous-minded members of the UOC (MP).......
..read entire article.....

http://ukrainianweek.com/Politics/29218
________________________________

cont....
 
cont...

In letters to Patriarch Alexis II, Cyril of Smolensk, and Russian political officials, Bartholomew declared:

The gathering together of Orthodox faithful into one flock under the leadership of a single powerful leader, who would be carrying out the agenda of a particular government, will unavoidably lead the Church into becoming nothing more than an organ of that government, and not the means by which mankind achieves salvation... The involvement of government into the decision-making process of the Church smacks of unacceptable caesaropapism. During the Communist era there occurred an intolerable politicization of the Russian Church... We hoped that things would be different after the fall of that monstrous system. However, to our dismay, we see that the current Russian government continues to unhesitatingly interfere, and, indeed, to even ‘make policy’ concerning matters that are strictly ecclesiastical... Those who speak of a Third Rome are totally unsuited to hold leadership positions in the Orthodox Church, because they will play a role in transforming her from a Christ-worshipping faith to a feudalistic organization based upon the exercise of raw power... The foolish theory pertaining to a Third Rome is hubristic [i.e., overweening arrogance] and blasphemous. New Rome [Constantinople] may be the first among equal Patriarchates, but she has never sought to dominate and exercise power over the other Orthodox Churches. We recognize her primacy in the stewardship of our unity, and she has performed this function humbly and absent any exercise of power."

http://credo.stormloader.com/Ecumenic/struggle.htm
________________________________

CAESAROPAPISM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caesaropapism
_____________________________

It was Our Lord Himself who said "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's and to God the things that are God's." Matthew 22:15-22

Roman Catholic Popes of the past have often had to learn this lesson the hard way. Perhaps Patriarch Bartholomew is more willing to "watch and learn" than is his Orthodox confrere in Moscow.
 
Sunday, 12 December 2010 10:15
WikiLeaks Evidence: Russia Sponsoring Islamic Terror
Written by Christian Gomez

....Meanwhile, as if the news of Russia's armament of Iran is not alarming enough, another cable made reference to the resurgence of the once pro-Soviet Tudeh Party within the government of Iran. In the cable it is stated that an unnamed Iraninan "former non-Marxist revolutionary activist" has avowed that Iran's "Tudeh (communist) party is reorganizing support among factory and government workers, and intellectuals."

These "many former Tudeh sympathizers," the activist claimed, "hold positions in the bureaucracy and elsewhere."

It should be noted that the Tudeh was the party to which Iranian Prime Minister Mohammad Mosaddegh belonged before he was overthrown by the CIA in the 1953 d'etat, which the CIA warned would lead to blowback — and such was the case in 1979 with the Islamic revolution and the taking of American hostages.

The reemergence of the communist Tudeh Party and the increased Russian arms sales to state sponsors of terrorism — Iran, Venezuela, and possibly Eritrea — along with expressed solidarity of Italian communists with Russia, reads almost like a page from the Cold War.

This would all seem to vindicate the claims made by Sergei Tretyakov, ("Comrade J") one of the highest-ranking members of the Russian FSB (successor to Soviet KGB) to defect the United States, who stated that Russia currently views the United States as a "target."


http://www.thenewamerican.com/world-news/europe/item/8637-wikileaks-evidence-russia-sponsoring-islamic-terror
 
"Although Putin on several occasions has described Russia as a “secular state,” the Russian government continues to work closely with religious leaders of the Russian Orthodoxy. Observers note that since the time of Czar Peter the Great (d.1725), Russian Orthodoxy has remained nearly a department of state, having little autonomy from the central government........

http://www.wnd.com/2002/04/13639/"

Observers missed something. The Russian Patriarchate was dissolved by Czar Peter the Great and made into not nearly but actually a department of state. Atheist Soviet Russia attempted to suppress all religion, until Stalin for whatever reason decided to reinstate the Patriarchate, giving an appearance of not oppressing Christianity. (However attending openly could endanger or prevent your career.)

So the Moscow Patriarchate is no longer a department of state, Stalin made it independent (which is why he had to infiltrate with KGB instead of rule it openly).

The kind of cooperation between church and state now evident in Russia, used to be normative in the USA with tax money going to church schools, as distinct from to any church itself (the latter would have been establishing a religion, but this move was only denied by the Cosntitution to the fed level, at least one state retained an established religion, a protestant denomination of course, for many decades I forget which one).

It was only after RC became a major presence that Protestants pushed for a sharper disengagement between religion and state, to ace out RC. This of course backfired in the present super secularism, which equates church (and organization) with religion (a belief system) and aims to cut the latter out of the state, which is alien to USA culture of older times and practice. Just notice the prayers opening Congress, taking oath on the Bible etc.

Now, RC and uniatism (itself a sell out to RC by Orthodox who managed to keep almost all their features but accepted Rome as head) have actively and violently (hence uniate existence) oppressed Orthodoxy, and naturally you are going with that history to want to make sure this doesn't happen again.

pre emptive measures make sense.

Moscow Patriarchate had the Balamand Agreement (now fallen into disuse and no one pays attention to it) with Rome, allowing limited intercommunion, which was a scandal among some Orthodox jurisdictions and one of the reasons for some schisms.

Iran in the great chessboard is a counterbalance to sunnism, since it is shia, and any effort to put islam on the warpath again (its original and normative condition till military setbacks and the breakup of the Ottoman empire, and events in India, forced this to stop) would be sunni.

People here on this board whine and cry over the rise of New Age heresy and its influence in the secular world (NWO), but IF YOU WANT TO PREVENT OR STOP THIS, YOU WOULD NEED THE KIND OF SYMPHONY BETWEEN A DENOMINATION THAT WAS A BASTION OF CONSERVATIVE CHRISTIANITY AND THE STATE THAT IS GOING ON IN RUSSIA.

They also have a better knowledge of because closer to Islam for centuries, than we do, and are more prepared to take appropriate action.

In any case, why is this our business?

NATO promised to not encroach Russia at the end of the Cold War and has done nothing but that since.
 
Marko:

RE: He (Konstantin Georgiyevich Preobrazhenskiy) has written extensively about the infiltration of the Russian Orthodox Church, which Putin uses as a way to "authenticate" his statements of moral authority over the decadent West. It's all a show.

I tend to agree. Another interesting thing to note is the way Putin inserted himself into the Vatopedi Land scandal in Greece - siding in with Greek Orthodox monk Abbott Ephraim whose alleged swindle reportedly brought down a Greek government.
Reportedly, Abbot Ephraim and Putin go back a long way.

Interestingly,(and this is not mentioned in all the stories about the scandal), there are two Abbot Ephraims involved in this story, and the younger one who was involved in the Vatopedi scandal, is believed by some to have once been the disciple of the elder Abbot Ephraim whose Greek Orthodox monasteries have been popping up like mushrooms all over the place in North America - even though the Greek Orthodox Church in America reportedly doesn't have the kind of money that would allow for the construction of all these monasteries.

Of course, if the two Abbot Ephraims have been colluding with one another and if their sympathies tend to lie with the Muscovite "Third Rome," this raises many questions about the role the Ephraim - controlled monasteries may be playing in helping Russia to make further cultural encroachments into the United States and her ally Canada - Gramscian - style.

Here is the story of the scandal and the monasteries as told by
Greek Orthodox Christians for Truth and Reform:

http://gotruthreform.org/money-part-one-continued

http://gotruthreform.org/links-to-information-websites
___________________________

As for the Ephraimite Monasteries themselves, they were at one time to be found at the Rick Ross cult "Hall of Fame." I saw the articles myself. However, the links are no longer viable. The Ephraimites were a tad disturbed that they were included in Mr. Ross's cult data base and attempted to marginalize his work by focusing on his Jewish background.




 
Third Rome concept goes like this. Rome was the first city of the empire, so became first city of the Church, Peter had nothing to do with it. (that was a conceit that came centuries later as far as status of the city was concerned.) Ecumenical Council Constantinople I bumped Constantinople up from third place to second, because it was second city of the empire. Alexandria protested, Rome backed Alexandria, but eventually backed down.
(Constantinople I canon 3.)

The Ecumenical Council of Chalcedon opposed Rome's support of Alexandria, on this basis: "Following in all things the decisions of the holy Fathers, and acknowledging the canon, which has been just read, of the One Hundred and Fifty Bishops beloved-of-God (who assembled in the imperial city of Constantinople, which is New Rome, in the time of the Emperor Theodosius of happy memory), we also do enact and decree the same things concerning the privileges of the most holy Church of Constantinople, which is New Rome.

FOR THE FATHERS RIGHTLY GRANTED PRIVILEGES TO THE THRONE OF OLD ROME, BECAUSE IT WAS THE ROYAL CITY.

And the One Hundred and Fifty most religious Bishops, ACTUATED BY THE SAME CONSIDERATION, GAVE EQUAL PRIVILEGES (ἴσα πρεσβεῖα) to the most holy throne of New Rome, justly judging that the city which is honoured with the Sovereignty and the Senate, and enjoys equal privileges with the old imperial Rome, should in ecclesiastical matters also be magnified as she is, and rank next after her; so that, in the Pontic, the Asian, and the Thracian dioceses, the metropolitans only and such bishops also of the Dioceses aforesaid as are among the barbarians, should be ordained by the aforesaid most holy throne of the most holy Church of Constantinople; every metropolitan of the aforesaid dioceses, together with the bishops of his province, ordaining his own provincial bishops, as has been declared by the divine canons; but that, as has been above said, the metropolitans of the aforesaid Dioceses should be ordained by the archbishop of Constantinople, after the proper elections have been held according to custom and have been reported to him."
http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf214.xi.xviii.xxviii.html

When Rome fell to heresy (filioque) and schism, leaving the true church while pretending to be the only true church when in fact only a broken branch of it, Constantinople became head at the table. (Originally there were five Patriarchates, but now there are at least 15 some called Metropolitans.)

When Constantinople fell to the Ottoman Turks, it was no longer politically as well as religiously viable. Hence the "Third Rome" thing.

Now, note the entirety of that canon 28. It gives Constantinople ecclesiastical authority over the barbarians in some specific lands, and this is the basis for an ongoing squabble among the jurisdictions now.

USA has several Jurisdictions represented and a move to unite all, so there be one American patriarchate. Personally I think this is a bad idea. smells more of ambition than anything else, using canons issued for another time and place as the excuse, and focussing more on form than content.

Constantinople (aka Istanbul) claims authority in all lands that did not have a patriarch in those days, or receive one from its granting autocephaly later. That means in theory, Constantinople has authority here in the barbarian (non Greek speaking) land of the USA.

Russia however was here first, in Alaska and the Pacific NW, and the Antiochian jurisdiction (Syria, but now run out of Damascus not Antioch) neck and neck. The Orthodox Church in America being once the metropolia went to the Moscow Patriarch to receive autocephaly, instead of remaining as part of ROCOR (Russian Orthodox Church Outside of Russia) raising the question of whether an autocephalous church can grant autocephaly or whether this can only come from Constantinople.
 
Christine,

RE:So the Moscow Patriarchate is no longer a department of state, Stalin made it independent (which is why he had to infiltrate with KGB instead of rule it openly).

After Nazi Germany's attack on the Soviet Union in 1941, Joseph Stalin revived the Russian Orthodox Church (which he had formerly suppressed) for the sake of political expediency to intensify patriotic support for the war effort. At the time, he needed the kind of moral support that he believed only the Orthodox Church could supply.

As for the Russian Orthodox Church Outside Russia:

RUSSIAN ORTHODOX CHURCH OUTSIDE RUSSIA (ROCOR)

The Russian Orthodox Church Outside Russia (Russian: Ру́сская Правосла́вная Це́рковь Заграни́цей, Russkaya Pravoslavnaya Tserkov' Zagranitsey), also called the Russian Orthodox Church Abroad, ROCA, or ROCOR, is a semi-autonomous part of the Russian Orthodox Church.

ROCOR was formed as a jurisdiction of Eastern Orthodoxy as a response against the policy of Bolsheviks with respect to religion in the Soviet Union soon after the Russian Revolution of 1917, and separated from the Russian Church of the Moscow Patriarchate in 1927 after an imprisoned metropolitan Sergius (Stragorodsky) pledged the Church's qualified loyalty to the Bolshevik state. The Russian Orthodox Church Outside Russia officially signed the Act of Canonical Communion with the Moscow Patriarchate on May 17, 2007, restoring the canonical link between the churches. Critics of the reunification argue that the issue of KGB infiltration of the Moscow Patriarchate church hierarchy has not been addressed by the Russian Orthodox Church.........

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Orthodox_Church_Outside_Russia
_____________________________

PATRIARCH SERGIUS OF MOSCOW
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriarch_Sergius_of_Moscow
 
yes, ROCOR was made pursuant to a tomos from the precedor of Sergius, to deal with the situation.
 
The Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew of Constantinople was not too happy about the Russians butting into the Abbot Ephraim case and publicly denounced their interferance.


Εcumenical Patriarchate Denounces Russian Interference in the Ephraim Case

- Jan 11, 2012 -

http://eu.greekreporter.com/2012/01/11/%CE%B5cumenical-patriarchate-denounces-russian-interference-in-the-ephraim-case/

__________________________

01/10/2012
RUSSIA - GREECE
Abbot of Mount Athos arrested. War of influence between Moscow and the Ecumenical Patriarchate
by Nina Achmatova

http://www.asianews.it/news-en/Abbot-of-Mount-Athos-arrested.-War-of-influence-between-Moscow-and-the-Ecumenical-Patriarchate-23649.html
_________________________

01/17/2012

High tension between Moscow and Constantinople

http://vaticaninsider.lastampa.it/en/documents/detail/articolo/chiesa-ortodossa-orthodox-church-iglesia-ortodoxa-11740/
___________________________
 
So Christine,
Who publishes the English version that you read in church ?
I had thought, incorrectly?, that the only English version of the Peshitta was Lamsa's.
But since the general consensus here is that he was/is a heretic, I thought I should point out that I have read the whole Lamsa translation, and, ( in spite of his anti-trinitarian beliefs ) no sound doctrine is challenged by him. He only points out a few very interesting KJV translation problems and shows what they should say: such as:
The verse that quotes our Lord as saying "It's easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter into heaven" should say; "Its easier for a rope to pass through the eye of a needle,etc." , because the Aramaic word for "rope" (gamel) is synonymous as the word for "camel" (gamel).
_To which I said thanks for the clarification. And there were a couple other examples of such mistranslations.
The only place I could detect an agenda on his part was where he translated the words of Jesus on the cross just as he was about to die; "Eloi, Eloi, Lama Sabachthani". Lamsa says that he was saying; "For this I was spared" which I don't understand.
My point is that just like Helen G. White and her
very important take on the seven annual Feasts of the Lord, she seemed to go 'round the bend and off into megalomania in her latter years.
I think Lamsa's translation is a very clear and well spoken English translation. It is an easier read than the KJV.
But hey the guy did have an agenda, and I'm not defending him for that. I'm just not condemning him as far as his translation goes, and it's obvious that the people in that part of the world at that time had figures of speech that King James's translators would not have known about, necessarily.
 
I apologize if I failed to write clearly.

THE PESHITTA IS NOT USED BY ANY EASTERN ORTHODOX CHURCH.

THAT MEANS THEREFORE THAT NO ENGLISH TRANSLATION OF THE NT FOR ORTHODOX USE IS FROM THE PESHITTA.

THE PESHITTA IS USED ONLY BY THE SYRIAN ORTHODOX WHO ARE NESTORIANS, not the same as Antiochian Orthodox which runs out of Damascus instead of Antioch since a few hundred years ago, not the same as some RC eastern rite or latin rite jurisdiction located in Syria.

"Oriental Orthodox" is the term used for "non chalcedonian churches" meaning nestorian and monophysite or miaphysite. They can be called "Orthodox" because the term started in contrast to the Arian heresy which denied the full divinity of Jesus Christ, and those heretics who did similar about The Holy Spirit, either denying His full divinity or denying His personhood, and this predates the nestorian and monophysite heresies.

Both these are Trinitarian, but by confusing nature with person, are confused regarding the way in which Christ's divine and human natures are joined, the nestorian divide them too much, the monophysite or miaphysite deny any serious distinction more like a merger, though Copts have been known to claim they believe the natures are joined without confusion or mingling, but what they said to the Chambesy conference, and what goes for internal publication is apparently not the same thing.

the Peshitta was of course originally in fully Orthodox hands, but because of geography it is strictly nestorian sourced now, maybe some Syrian monophysites use it also, I don't pay too much attention to those people.

The English translations of NT used by Orthodox have in the past incl. RSV I think, but now standardized with The Orthodox Study Bible as the New King James Version, being based on the Byzantine Text which is also the basis for the Patriarchal Text Greek in use in Greece and maybe Constantinople.

Thomas Nelson permitted use of the NKJV, and also publishes the Orthodox Study Bible. Also just about all other versions incl. KJV.

Some complaints have been made against NKJV, but chapter and verse were invented by a Roman Catholic scholar many centuries ago, and got taken up by everyone. Orthodox Study Bible presents the NT in paragraphs, not verses, the verse numbers being in the paragraphs, but keeps also the chapters.

It is only when you isolate verses out of paragraph context, that a problem is made by whether "Lord" is present or not, since the context incl. statements about Jesus as Lord in the same paragraph or nearby ones, and the overall context is about Jesus being Lord, so anything read in the NT is read with that presupposition.
 
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Just going on air 10 am Eastern Time to do my radio program. Please join me live and call in to 888-747-1968. Lots to talk about today!

Constance
 
My apologies in advance for being off-topic (again), but I feel it is imperative to correct the idea that Putin is somehow some great "Christian" leader, and that if Russia starts a war in Europe or elsewhere, it is somehow NATO and the West's fault for our "encroachment". What a ludicrous idea. Such thinking is completely in line with the propaganda put out from Moscow via RT (Russia Today) and other KGB/FSB outlets. It is also completely false.

Please check out the following two articles (and the embedded videos in the second link). Don't skip through any of it, but read/listen to the entire presentations. There is much there to digest, and to be concerned about. Europe is in danger of being invaded by Russia, or perhaps a combination of Russia, Iran, and possibly even China, marching through via the old Silk Road.

http://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.org/2014/09/18/return-of-the-evil-empire/

http://noisyroom.net/blog/2014/09/20/the-bear-and-the-dragon-encircle-the-eagle/

It's always been my feeling that the Next Big Thing on the prophetic schedule is World War. From the ashes of that, the New Age rises like a Phoenix. A different possibility is that there is a linkage between Marxism/Communism/Utopianism and the New Age philosophy, and the destruction of the West (at the hands of the Eastern empires of Russia, China and Iran, all of whose Marxist roots are DEMONIC) is a needed precursor to the rise of the Antichrist and his system. Yes, Islamism has much in common with Marxism.

Again, my apologies, especially to Constance.

--+-----

Interesting side note regarding Moscow as the Third Rome: Moscow, as well as Rome, was built on seven hills. There is a prophetic significance to that.
 
Addendum to above:

When listening to Cliff Kincaid / Trevor Loudon embedded in the Noisy Room article, it's part of a "Play All" YouTube embedded stream. There's no need to listen to all of the shows - just the one that starts playing, called "Obama's Fake War Against Islam Benefits Russia". (2 of 80) It's 50-some minutes long.

 
Marko, the history is simple. NATO promised no encroachment, no adding of east european countries to itself.

NATO did not keep its word.

Last heard from in terms of expansion, NATO was knocking on Russia's front door.

Now, of course, NATO denies this, while effectively admitting it on the same page.
" there have never been political or legally binding commitments of the West not to extend NATO beyond the borders of a reunified Germany..."

note the deceptive phrase legally binding commitments. However, "Thus, the debate about the enlargement of NATO evolved solely in the context of German reunification. In these negotiations Bonn and Washington managed to allay Soviet reservations about a reunited Germany remaining in NATO. This was achieved by generous financial aid, and by the “2+4 Treaty” ruling out the stationing of foreign NATO forces on the territory of the former East Germany. However, it was also achieved through countless personal conversations in which Gorbachev and other Soviet leaders were assured that the West would not take advantage of the Soviet Union’s weakness and willingness to withdraw militarily from Central and Eastern Europe.

"It is these conversations that may have left some Soviet politicians with the impression that NATO enlargement, which started with the admission of the Czech Republic, Hungary and Poland in 1999, had been a breach of these Western commitments."

Now, these conversations and reassurances were made by the very same people who ran NATO and EU anyway, and were perhaps INTENDING TO DECEIVE in that they never put it into writing in the NATO rules themselves.

But this understanding, this gentlemen's agreement, is admitted to by NATO as having occurred.

http://www.nato.int/docu/review/2014/Russia-Ukraine-Nato-crisis/Nato-enlargement-Russia/EN/index.htm


 
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Now as for seven hills, here is a list of cities that are built on seven hills. (anti RC crew here take note, Vatican is NOT on ANY of the Roman seven hills and is outside both the ancient and modern roman city limits.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_claimed_to_be_built_on_seven_hills

you will note that THE UNITED STATES HAS TWENTY OF THESE CITIES, many of them involved in the NWO satanic elites etc. scene.

according to http://basementgeographer.com/cities-built-on-seven-hills/

Constantinople, one of these cities (modern Istanbul) in fact was originally just the small town Byzantium built on ONE hill but expanded, "The historic seven hills of Constantinople were basically synonymous with the city core, bounded on the north by the Golden Horn, on the east and south by the Sea of Marmara, and on the west by the city wall. Ancient Byzantium was founded on the first hill at Seraglio Point. Modern Istanbul has long since expanded beyond these bounds. The parallels between Rome and old Constantinople, of course, were many due to their shared heritage as seats of the Roman Empire, and their statuses as seats of the two main branches of pre-Reformation Christianity. It may come as little surprise that when Moscow became the main centre of the Orthodox Church (a ‘third Rome’) after the fall of Constantinople in 1453, the myth that it, too, was built upon seven hills arose in an effort to further the analogy between the two cities."

however http://books.google.com/books?id=M-Fz-xAHVSoC&q=seven+hills#v=snippet&q=seven%20hills&f=false

questions the accuracy of this, that this myth arose in an effort to draw a comparison to Constantinople and Rome, and of course this would mean that whatever the number of hills it was on eventually it didn't start like that, and if it has expanded since may be more.

JERUSALEM ALSO IS BUILT ON SEVEN HILLS,
which puts it in the running for end times Babylon also. However, Revelation says it is spiritually called Sodom not Babylon. A good case has been made that America is Babylon the Great. Here is one example.

http://endtimesforecaster.blogspot.com/2010/03/america-is-end-times-babylon.html

possibly consistent with my thesis at http://seventhchapterofdaniel.blogspot.com Ibadan, Nigeria and Kampala, Uganda are built on seven hills, but Ibadan is upstream of the ocean, and would only need to expand greatly to fit the scenario of its destruction being visible from the sea.

My take on America as Babylon is, maybe. If not, there is also the thesis that Mystery Babylon is a moving stronghold, and that it sets up shop in different places throughout history, each place is eventually destroyed by God, and that currently it is the USA, but that doesn't mean that the USA is end times Babylon, it might be brought down by the wrath of God and Mystery Babylon shift to Ibadan, Nigeria or a whole new city on seven hills be built on some coastal deep water port quality place.
 
addendum on the NATO enlargement post, note the NATO page reference to

"the “2+4 Treaty” ruling out the stationing of foreign NATO forces on the territory of the former East Germany."

which IS a legally binding treaty that implies everything eastward as well. Sounds like an implication with intent to deceive. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_on_the_Final_Settlement_with_Respect_to_Germany#The_Treaty

LOOKS LIKE NATO FORCES ARE ILLEGAL IN GERMANY. hmmmm.
 
Dear Marko and Constance,

Re:Interesting side note regarding Moscow as the Third Rome: Moscow, as well as Rome, was built on seven hills. There is a prophetic significance to that.

I agree. Just for the record, some of the Church Fathers - including Saint Jerome - believed that Rome was the "restraining power" mentioned by St. Paul ( 2 Thessalonians 2:6-7)which would function as biblical katechon in terms of stalling the coming of the Antichrist.

Constance, with regard to your comment;

"Putin's statement that he may or may not have said with pure motives that "by the USA putting same sex marriage on the same level as marriage with children, has opened its doors to Satanic influences......"

I agree with Putin's statement as well regardless of the purity of his motives.

But Putin's motives notwithstanding, there is an important issue that needs to be taken into account which may have some bearing on Russia's strong discouragement of homosexuality; namely, Russia's abysmally low birth rate.

Lawmakers in Russia have come right out and accused gays of decreasing Russia's already low birth rates ...and were considering banning citizens of countries that allow same-sex marriage from adopting Russian children. Moreover, in February, 2014, Russia enacted an anti-gay adoption ban.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/02/13/world/europe/russia-same-sex-marriage-adoption-ban/
________________________

Many here are going to find this a little hard to believe but Russia's birthrate was so low in one Russian region (Ulyanovsk) that in 2007, young married couples were being given Fridays off from work so that they could stay home and make babies.

Russians offered day off, prizes to procreate
8-14-2007


http://www.nbcnews.com/id/20268426/ns/world_news-europe/t/russians-offered-day-prizes-procreate/#.VB-A5MHD-70
_____________________________

Putin is also looking to solve the low population crisis by encouraging immigration.

However, it is instructive that the immigrants Putin is looking to "encourage" are not the kind of immigrants who are likely to contribute to "multiculturalism" in xenophobic Russia.

This is because Putin wants to aggressively stimulate immigration by,

luring Russian-speakers from former Soviet countries and the Russian diaspora to return home. He writes that an influx of 300,000 annually could drive major population increase. But, he admits, that past programs to get ethnic Russians to resettle in Russia "have worked inefficiently… we need to revisit this issue and develop a more ambitious set of measures to support people who want to return to their historic homeland"....

....While Russia might be able to attract huge numbers of immigrants from neighboring China and Central Asia, Putin makes clear that he is talking about Russian-speakers who are willing to "embrace our culture and our values"......


http://www.csmonitor.com/World/2012/0214/Putin-vows-to-halt-Russia-s-population-plunge-with-babies-immigrants
_______________________________

Drunken Nation: Russia’s Depopulation Bomb

http://www.worldaffairsjournal.org/article/drunken-nation-russia%E2%80%99s-depopulation-bomb
_______________________________

Looking at recent events from this perspective, the thought occurs to me that part of the motivation behind Putin's annexation of Crimea and his invasion of Ukraine might have to do with Russian demographics.
 
P.S.

I doubt Putin will have much luck persuading ethnic Russian Roman Catholics to "come home" and "make babies." LOL
 
Roman Catholicism was viewed in Russia in Tsarist times as part of a western cultural incursion and un Russian anyway.
 
" Susanna said...
Dear Marko and Constance,

Re:Interesting side note regarding Moscow as the Third Rome: Moscow, as well as Rome, was built on seven hills. There is a prophetic significance to that.

I agree. Just for the record, some of the Church Fathers - including Saint Jerome - believed that Rome was the "restraining power" mentioned by St. Paul ( 2 Thessalonians 2:6-7)which would function as biblical katechon in terms of stalling the coming of the Antichrist."

Susanna, you don't understand what Marko meant. Probably because you never read Revelation except for the excerpt about the woman clothed with the sun.

ANY PROPHETIC SIGNIFICANCE ABOUT ROME BEING ON SEVEN HILLS,

is about it being the beast with seven heads, which are seven hills, and also seven kings,

on which rides the harlot Mystery Babylon the Great.

While I disagree that it is Rome, this prophetic significance Marko is referencing has nothing to do with who restrains the antichrist, but with either who is or is involved with the antichrist.
 
Christine, 1:45 P.M., & 12:02A.M.

Re:Roman Catholicism was viewed in Russia in Tsarist times as part of a western cultural incursion and un Russian anyway.

Excuse me, but I think that if you had carefully read my comment at 1:37 P.M. you would have known that I had already addressed that issue:

There is certainly pressure against Russian Roman Catholics - few as they are in Russia - by Russian Orthodox interests!

....The Roman Catholic Church in Russia is part of the worldwide Roman Catholic Church, under the spiritual leadership of the Pope in Rome.....

.....Due to the long-held views of the Russian Orthodox Church, Catholicism is not recognized by the state as a legitimately Russian religion, and Catholics have often been seen as outsiders, even if they are ethnically Russian.

The Soviet Union, which persecuted all religions, also saw Catholicism as a non-Russian allegiance....


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Catholicism_in_Russia
_____________________________
 
Christine,

Why not show the same concern about Russia breaking treaties as you do about NATO breaking treaties?

 
What treaties have they broken since the "reset"?

And whatever went on in many past decades, what is going on now is motivated by western greed and ambition, and is playing with everyone's lives.
 
Meanwhile, chemical and biological weapons have been illegal by treaties for decades, yet the USA has never ceased making them, and distributing them to friends. The chemical weapons Saddam Hussein used came from us.

 
Christine,

RE:Meanwhile, chemical and biological weapons have been illegal by treaties for decades, yet the USA has never ceased making them, and distributing them to friends. The chemical weapons Saddam Hussein used came from us.


"Operation Sarindar" (meaning "emergency exit") was an operating procedure designed by Soviet military intelligence to get rid of all traces of chemical weapons delivered or produced under Soviet guidance in Third World countries "if the Western imperialists ever got near them", writes Pacepa. Pacepa, Ion. Ex-spy fingers Russians on WMD, The Washington Times, October 2, 2003.


EX SPY FINGERS RUSSIANS ON WMD

By - The Washington Times - Wednesday, August 20, 2003

On March 20, Russian President
Vladimir Putin denounced the U.S.-led “aggression” against Iraq as “unwarranted” and “unjustifiable.” Three days later, Pravda said that an anonymous Russian “military expert” was predicting that the United States would fabricate finding Iraqi weapons of mass destruction. Russian Foreign Minister Igor Ivanov immediately started plying the idea abroad, and it has taken hold around the world ever since.

As a former Romanian spy chief who used to take orders from the Soviet KGB, it is perfectly obvious to me that Russia is behind the evanescence of Saddam Hussein’s weapons of mass destruction. After all, Russia helped Saddam get his hands on them in the first place. The Soviet Union and all its bloc states always had a standard operating procedure for deep sixing weapons of mass destruction — in Romanian it was codenamed “Sarindar, meaning “emergency exit.”

I implemented it in Libya. It was for ridding Third World despots of all trace of their chemical weapons if the Western imperialists ever got near them. We wanted to make sure they would never be traced back to us, and we also wanted to frustrate the West by not giving them anything they could make propaganda with.....

...The Soviet bloc not only sold Saddam its WMDs, but it showed them how to make them “disappear.” Russia is still at it. Primakov was in Baghdad from December until a couple of days before the war, along with a team of Russian military experts led by two of Russia’s topnotch “retired”generals,Vladislav Achalov, a former deputy defense minister, and Igor Maltsev, a former air defense chief of staff. They were all there receiving honorary medals from the Iraqi defense minister. They clearly were not there to give Saddam military advice for the upcomingwar—Saddam’sKatyusha launchers were of World War II vintage, and his T-72 tanks, BMP-1 fighting vehicles and MiG fighter planes were all obviously useless against America. “I did not fly to Baghdad to drink coffee,” was what Gen. Achalov told the media afterward. They were there orchestrating Iraq’s “Sarindar” plan.
..
..read more....

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2003/aug/20/20030820-081256-6822r/
________________________________

Is Russia Aiding Syria to Hide Its WMD?

According to Kamal al-Labwani, a prominent Syrian opposition figure, Assad has already begun moving his WMD onto Russian ships.

By Ryan Mauro
Wed, September 18, 2013

http://www.clarionproject.org/analysis/russia-aiding-syria-hide-its-wmd
 
okay, I know Russia has chemical weapons, BUT THE POINT, WHERE IS OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS AND INNOCENCE?

as for Assad those weapons are being removed for destruction, remember the deal that got brokered? Almost all of them have been destroyed. If you would follow a wider range of news and commentary than you apparently do (I do not mean RT) you would know this.

If Russia had not put its foot down with China's help, and stopped America from bombing Syria over those weapons, this would have exploded into a regional war that would probably have gone nuclear.
 
Christine 8:57 A.M.

Re:What treaties have they broken since the "reset"?

For one thing, Russia is currently in violation of the
Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances.
which was signed in Budapest, Hungary on 5 December 1994, providing security assurances by its signatories relating to Ukraine's accession to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons. The Memorandum was originally signed by three nuclear powers, the Russian Federation ( Boris Yeltsin), the United States of America President Bill Clinton), and the United Kingdom ( Prime Minister Tony Blair). China and France gave somewhat weaker individual assurances in separate documents.

The memorandum included security assurances against threats or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of Ukraine as well as those of Belarus and Kazakhstan. In return, Ukraine gave up the world's third largest nuclear weapons stockpile between 1994 and 1996.

Following the 2014 Crimean crisis, the U.S. and all the other signatories stated that Russian encroachments into Ukraine and Crimea is in breach of its obligations to Ukraine under the Budapest Memorandum, and in clear violation of Ukrainian sovereignty and territorial integrity.

*******************************

Earlier this year, it was first reported by the New York Times that Russia was suspected of being in violation of the 1987 Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty

U.S. Says Russia Tested Cruise Missile, Violating Treaty

By MICHAEL R. GORDONJULY 28, 2014

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/29/world/europe/us-says-russia-tested-cruise-missile-in-violation-of-treaty.html?_r=0
_________________________________


In 1986, Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev confided to aides that the West’s nuclear missiles were “a gun at our temple.” The following year, Gorbachev and President Ronald Reagan signed an agreement eliminating the whole class of nuclear weapons in Europe. The Intermediate Range Nuclear Forces Treaty was good for Europe, and remains so today, long after the Cold War has ended.

So it was unsettling when the Obama administration recently published a compliance report saying that Russia had violated the treaty. At issue is a provision that prohibits the possession, production or flight-testing of ground-launched cruise missiles with a range of 500 kilometers (311 miles) to 5,500 kilometers (3,417 miles) or launchers for such missiles. The United States has not published details of the claimed violation, which makes it hard to evaluate, but it reportedly involves tests of a ground-launched cruise missile...
read more....

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/russia-should-reveal-more-about-a-possible-missile-treaty-violation/2014/09/07/67dbbb6c-1d96-11e4-ab7b-696c295ddfd1_story.html
_______________________________



29 July 2014

b>Russia 'violated 1987 nuclear missile treaty', says US


Russia has violated a key arms control treaty by testing a nuclear cruise missile, the US government says.

Russia tested a ground-launched cruise missile, breaking the Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty signed in 1987 during the Cold War, the US said.

A senior US official did not provide further details on the alleged breach, but described it as "very serious"...
read more...

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-28538387
___________________________

Moscow may walk out of nuclear treaty after US accusations of breach

Alec Luhn in Moscow and Julian Borger

The Guardian, Tuesday 29 July 2014

Russia said to be on point of leaving 1987 treaty, after Obama administration said it violated the accord with tests of R-500

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/29/moscow-russia-violated-cold-war-nuclear-treaty-iskander-r500-missile-test-us
____________________________

Nota bene... that all these reports are from the left-leaning mainstream media!!!
 
Well, Russia offered us a more effective anti Iranian missile base location but we insisted on putting these in eastern Europe, stirring up suspicion.

If you suspected someone was planning to do something to you, wouldn't you be inclined to sideline agreements about testing weapons just in case?

As for Ukraine, Russia has the Kosovo separatism being backed by USA legal precedent on its side for anything it does in Ukraine in support of separatists. We kinda stepped in the hole we dug, didn't we?


 
Christine,

RE:If Russia had not put its foot down with China's help, and stopped America from bombing Syria over those weapons, this would have exploded into a regional war that would probably have gone nuclear.

Really? The way I learned it, Russia is the country that provided Iran with the kind of missile technology which has enabled them to field an entire arsenal of long-range missiles equipped with chemical, biological, and possibly nuclear warheads at some point in the near future......all with the help of Russian dupe Strobe Talbot who was once dubbed "Russia's man in Washington."

Former Clinton Official Named as Russian Dupe

AIM Report — March 4, 2008

http://www.aim.org/aim-report/former-clinton-official-named-as-russian-dupe/
_____________________________

STROBE TALBOT: RUSSIA'S MAN IN WASHINGTON

http://www.aim.org/aim-report/former-clinton-official-named-as-russian-dupe/
______________________________

Strobe Talbot is still with the Brookings Institute. His confreres include Obama's current security advisor Susan Rice. She is the person who appeared on five different Sunday morning news programs after the attack on Benghazi to peddle the administration's false narrative about an offensive video that led to the attack of our embassy there and the murder of our Ambassador and other military personnel who died while trying to defend our ambassador and the embassy.

Re:as for Assad those weapons are being removed for destruction, remember the deal that got brokered? Almost all of them have been destroyed. If you would follow a wider range of news and commentary than you apparently do (I do not mean RT) you would know this.

Maybe if YOU followed the news sources I follow, you would know BETTER. ( I do not mean RT either ).

Western Intelligence Suspects Assad Has a Secret Chemical Stockpile

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/05/01/western-intelligence-suspects-assad-has-a-secret-chemical-stockpile.html

 
"The chemical weapons Saddam Hussein used came from us."

And yet, purportedly, it was Soviet military advisors (probably along with Spetsnaz troops) who moved them out of Iraq on the eve of our first invasion and into Syria.

To further substantiate what Susanna has posted, here's a *very* interesting (but long-ish) article from Front Page Magazine that was posted at freerepublic back in 2007. Interestingly, I looked over at Front Page Magazine's archives, and there's rewritten, shortened version that has been substituted for the one grabbed from FPM when it was originally published. Lots of interesting things were dropped from the archived version at FPM. That kind of stuff is standard operating procedure lately at FPM - look at the fracus they had with Diana West. Personally, I think FPM has been compromised.

Anyway, the link:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1926630/posts

That should put to rest once and for all the "Bush Lied, Soldiers Died" mantra.



 
Susanna,

firstly, try to forget the "american interests" programming, slam on the brakes and THINK.

Assad is the only protector of Christians left in the Middle East.

ALL THE ARAB SPRING EVENTS, CIA ORCHESTRATED, RESULTED IN CHRISTIANS BEING PERSECUTED, EITHER WHERE THEY HAD NOT BEEN PERSECUTED BEFORE OR RAMPING UP WHATEVER WENT ON SOMETIMES.

As a Christian WHY WOULD YOU SUPPORT ANY EFFORTS AGAINST ASSAD? or do you just not know about this?

Assad belongs to a muslim heresy, and protects various religious minorities in his country from the sunni element. Naturally this incl. shia, and naturally therefore Iran supports Assad.

secondly it doesn't matter who gave nukes to who (and Israel has a lot of nukes) what matters is that they are there, and even if they were not used, Assad has the support of Iran and Iran is Shia which is hated by Sunnis and vice versa. Destabilization would mean a regional war, and Israel would probably get into it sooner or later.

America is not Christian in culture or in the values and concerns of the military industrial complex which essentially runs it.
 
From the above-linked article in my post:

More than any other person, Shaw uncovered the mystery of the disappearance of Saddam’s missing stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons....

As a result of some long-time personal relationships, he was able to develop a working relationship with the head of the British Secret Intelligence Service (MI6) and senior members of the Ukrainian intelligence service. The Ukrainians, part of the Coalition in Iraq, gained access to the records of the Russian Spetznatz units that had secretly been ordered to Iraq at the end of 2002. This elite unit of the Russian Special Forces includes a force specially trained to remove all evidence of Russian arms transfers from client states.

At the February 2006 Intelligence Summit, Shaw spoke publicly for the first time. He told how three western spy services discovered that Russian soldiers had been dispatched from Trans-Caspian bases, switched from combat uniforms into civilian clothes, and transited to Iraq. They were not bringing any new weapons into Iraq. The Spetznatz were smuggling Saddam's stash of heavy explosives and unconventional weapons out. Shaw has collected all the details of the plan, the identity of the units and their commanders, and the dates of their entry and exit of Iraq.

The conventional wisdom is that the USA and Great Britain supplied Saddam with his chemical weapons equipment during the Iran-Iraq war. The cynical joke goes: "The USA has proof of Saddam's WMD: they have the sales receipts." In fact, both the Reagan and Thatcher administrations worked strenuously to forbid the export of even precursor chemicals, as confirmed by the archives of the State Department's Office for Export Controls Cooperation. It was the former Soviet Union that supplied Saddam with 99% of his chemical and biological weapons.

 
I think you are the one who needs to THINK, Christine.

If I am not supporting any one Muslim dictator over another it is because the subject I have been discussing here is not about which Muslim dictators are most beneficial to Christians.

It is about what Russia and Putin have been up to.

The reason why Russia is relevant to the topic of this thread is because of Federica Mogherini's unfortunate trip to Russia after which - in lockstep with her Italian communist masters - she came out in support of a "new and improved" South Stream gas pipeline that would bypass Ukraine and enter Europe through Italy.

On account of this sleazy little deal with Russia, Italy was accused (rightly) of overstepping the boundaries of its EU presidency - which is particularly disgraceful given Ukraine's ongoing efforts to become part of the EU.

Nothing like throwing a potential fellow EU member under the bus - especially after Ukraine gave up her nukes in exchange for guarantees of her security and sovereignty (Budapest
Memorandum).

If you were following the news I follow, you would know that just a few days ago, Ukraine approved a historic EU deal.


Ukraine approves historic EU deal, breaking ties with Moscow

September 16, 2014

The Association Agreement is approved by Ukraine's parliament, paving the way for European Union membership and distancing the country from Russia

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/ukraine/11100419/Ukraine-approves-historic-EU-deal-breaking-ties-with-Moscow.html
____________________________

Ukraine is also looking to join NATO. Before the Russian encroachments into Ukraine, public opinion in favor of NATO membership was low, but public opinion in Ukraine is beginning to change since then.

Yanukovych fled Ukraine amid the Euromaidan uprising in February 2014. As a result of this revolution, the interim Yatsenyuk Government came to power in Ukraine. The Yatsenyuk Government initially stated it did not have the intention of making Ukraine a member of NATO.

NATO officials vowed support for Ukraine and worked to downplay tensions between the bloc and Russia, which refused to recognize the impeachment of Yanukovych or the Yatsenyuk Government. In late February 2014, Anders Fogh Rasmussen, Secretary General of NATO, reaffirmed that NATO membership is still an option for Ukraine.

On 29 August 2014, following reports that the Russian military was operating within Ukraine, Ukrainian Prime Minister Arseny Yatseniuk announced that he would ask the Ukrainian parliament to put Ukraine on a path towards NATO membership. The government has also signaled that it hopes for major non-NATO ally status with the United States, NATO's largest military power and contributor. As part of these efforts, and to rule out future Ukrainian membership in the Eurasian Economic Union and other Russian-led supranational entities, Yatseniuk also submitted a draft law to repeal Ukraine's non-bloc status previously instituted by Yanukovych
...........

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukraine%E2%80%93NATO_relations
_______________________________

Needless to say, this is really putting Russia's nose out of joint because as the late Russian defector Sergei Tretyakov ( "Comrade J" ) pointed out, since the "fall" of communism in the former Soviet Union, the weakening and/or destruction of NATO is still high on Russia's "to do" list.

 
"The Spetznatz were smuggling Saddam's stash of heavy explosives and unconventional weapons out. Shaw has collected all the details of the plan, the identity of the units and their commanders, and the dates of their entry and exit of Iraq."

assuming this is true, once again, American actions are short sighted and trip up on the sin of pride.

yes, theology has relevance....always.

US gives unconventional weapons to Saddam Hussein. (in violation of international agreements since WW I.)

US decides to lure Saddam Hussein into a war, pursuant to some long range goal. Various lies told about atrocities in Kuwait to steam up American public.

Son of Nazi SS commander runs the invasion. Mass slaughter of Iraqi troops trying to surrender. Air strikes go on indefinitely. hundreds of thousands of Iraqis die not just then but because of disease and lack of food because of damaged infrastructure.

Russia gets the American unconventional weapons.

wonderful.

 
Susanna, you are not thinking with priorities properly hierarched.

It doesn't matter what Putin or anyone else is up to. Only one thing matters. Jesus Christ's interests.

All else has to be subordinated to that.

And Ukraine joining NATO will be a disaster. Russian support of eastern half Ukrainian separatism could result in WW 3 real easy, unless NATO countries decide they want no more part of US games, and that may happen.

a. the NSA spying ticked them off,
b. Germany can't get its gold back. i am not a fan of Glenn Beck, but this video explains it real simply.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iM4s3LYZQHM

google the subject of German gold repatriation to get in depth study on this.

while you're at it, google the subject of counterfeiting gold bars, not private sales but stuff that has ended up in Chinese govt. stashes they found were fake, tungsten bars coated in gold to have the right look and weight, but scratch them and its another story.

These stories are the tip of an iceberg.
 
Marko,

Your WMD information squares perfectly with mine.

Ion Mihai Pacepa is the Romanian defector from the former eastern bloc who reportedly revealed "Operation Sarindar" ("emergency exit")to our intelligence services.

Ion Mihai Pacepa is the highest-ranking Soviet bloc intelligence officer to defect to the West. He served as chief of the Romanian foreign intelligence agency. He says Romania had a plan to sanitize its Soviet WMD called Operation Sarindar, or Emergency Exit. Pacepa actually carried out this plan for Muammar Qaddhafi in Libya. The only evidence left behind of the Soviet involvement was technical documents stored on microfiche and buried. Once recovered, these documents would show how to quickly rebuild the weapons arsenal.....read more....

http://www.victoryinstitute.net/blogs/utb/2007/08/12/operation-sarindar/
_____________________________

ION MIHAI PACEPA

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ion_Mihai_Pacepa
______________________________

Another thing that comes to mind......recall that the whole Joe Wilson/Valerie Plame fiasco had to do with whether or not Iraq was buying yellowcake from Nigeria.

Then President George W. Bush had reportedly received information from the British Intelligence Services ( which later turned out to be forgeries) indicating that Iraq was buying yellowcake (uranium) from Nigeria.

This affair might be interesting to consider in the context of "Operation Sarindar."

When the US and UK first began considering military action against Iraq, Bush faced the same resistance Clinton had encountered in 1998 from France and Russia.


July 20, 2005

About that 500 tons of yellow cake...

By Rick Moran

http://www.americanthinker.com/2005/07/about_that_500_tons_of_yellow.html
______________________________
 
America's sins are great, and we are just beginning to pay for them. But apparently you have drunk too deeply from the anti-American propaganda information streams, Christine, to see the greater sins, past and present, and the possible future evilness, of any other nation. To you, the cause of everything evil in the world is the United States. You must have been raised on Howard Zinn's version of history.

I quoted an article that said (and I have no reason to doubt it) that Russia supplied 99% of the WMDs to Iraq. You come right back and say WE supplied them. You will not admit error. When it is obvious that you are wrong, you distract or deflect onto something else.

It is rather aggravating, to say the least. But... not everyone is teachable. I must learn not to let those people become a source of frustration.

I learned a lot that I didn't know from the article I linked, and it helped piece things together a little more for me in regards to recent history. I hope others here were able to get something out of it.

--+-----

Is the following a good "nutshell" view of the modern world? It came to me while watching the video about Norman Dodd in one of Susanna's earlier posts (please go back and watch it if you haven't - 12:01 PM).

For what it's worth, this is how I see the Utopian, collectivist, Marxist, New Age, demonic goal for the world:

Achieve world "peace" via forced collectivism, by influencing and changing political and religious thought, especially in the West. Convergence is preferred, by "educating out" the old ways of thinking, but will be accompanied by war if convergence isn't effective.

Main obstacle: Judeo-Christian belief system as embodied most fully in the establishment of the United States upon these principles. If the United States ceases to be, the bad actors mentioned earlier (Utopians, etc) will be able to run amok, and try to create their heaven on earth. Tower of Babel amplified 100x. A new Dark Age.

Until.... Jesus Christ returns and puts an end to the darkness, praise God!

 
Pretty much said it for me too Marko. Thanks.
 
Well said, Marko!
 
Marko, and Co., you need to stop relying on partisan sources, a congressional investigation turned up facts that show Rumsfeld had a lot to do with Saddam Hussein's chemical weapons.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-153210/Rumsfeld-helped-Iraq-chemical-weapons.html

this was likely the context for it, and Saddam was unhappy with a southern border arrangement from the Shah's time and took advantage of the situation after the Shah's fall to even the score, resulting in the Iran Iraq war.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_support_for_Iraq_during_the_Iran%E2%80%93Iraq_war

As for Judaeo-Christian values, the only clear cut thing is the effort to prevent all power being in one man's hands, because all men are evil. (The fall and inherited sin nature, remember?)

I am sure Russia added to the stash Saddam Hussein had, but the bulk of it was American.

The sins of America are not only abortion and tolerating homosexuals and things like that. There is also greed, pride, ambition, violence, and we have a track record for selling arms to both sides of disputes. When slavery was legal, it was run more by the pagan Roman system than by the Hebraic system. No one, for instance, was to go free after seven years of servitude even if they were Christians themselves.

A lot of foreign aid has been a means to gain power and extract wealth from countries. I recommend Confessions of an Economic Hit Man for starters.

Even the containment policy instead of rollback regarding the USSR back when it could have been done, was driven by concerns of how handy they were to have around.

Read The Best Enemy Money Can Buy by Anthony Sutton.

As for Howard Zinn, I don't recall seeing his name but once, it is familiar, but I don't recall it on anything I've read, perhaps he was quoted or referred to.

I used to think like you guys back in the early 1980s. Part of the motive was wanting something to hate something to kill and something hopefully to kill me eventually, being aggressively inclined but having a death wish and depression.
A little quick research showed me, that there were no people hiring mercenaries who were worth working for, only few hired women anyway. Part of it was some John Birch Society literature, which included some materials like None Dare Call It Conspiracy and The Naked Capitalist that cued me that things weren't entirely what even the JBS thought they were.

(JBS was a scam anyway http://www.watch.pair.com/belmont.html and I recall some criticism that Robert Welch might be a commie himself because he kept his people from doing much constructive or effective aside from letter writing campaigns, which are not worthless, but there was a tendency to get derailed like redirect conservative energy.)

Over the years, I learned better. Dave Emory helped and so did some other people who told the truth about what was going on in the field.

of course none of these people are "pure," some are a lot less impure than others.

A good start would be to outlaw all political parties, including the Republithugs and Dummycrooks, and go back to what the founding fathers had, a no party system.

and nationalize the federal reserve, deinstitute it and return the country to the Constitution's law that Congress mints money and defines it. And tax the Stock Market transactions. and reinstitute flogging and restitution as part of the criminal system, be more trigger happy with the death penalty and lower the prison population this way.

 
" be more trigger happy with the death penalty and lower the prison population this way."

should have written, be more trigger happy with the death penalty and by the combination of these measures, lower the prison population.

That's what I meant, not execute every other prisoner on speculation.
 
http://shoebat.com/2014/09/22/isis-spokesman-supporters-kill-europeans-americans-canadians-way-possible/

just reading this now. The big justification, from muslim jurisprudence, is the ten million at least estimated dead muslims because of American and allied actions.

see what bombing the hell out of people and destroying infrastructure gets you? hatred.

When the airstrikes began in Iraq, I remember I was living in a hotel and watching TV news. And I was all for it, until this dragged on past two weeks. This is not acceptable.

I don't support ISIS in any way, because of their caliphate goals, their persecution of Christians, and their glorification of rape and coerced prostitution and coerced marriages, but massacre is never good public relations.

In Viet Nam, every time there was a massacre by air, or on the ground like My Lai which was not an isolated incident, or rape, more people joined the Viet Cong or supported them, those who were not even personally affected just heard about it.
 
Dear Marko,

I finally had time to listen to the Cliff Kinkaid audio presentation you posted entitled RETURN OF THE EVIL EMPIRE.

I think it is very well worth listening to! I will probably listen to it a couple more times along with the Norman Dodd video.

I am reposting the link to the Cliff Kincaid presentation here so that anyone interested in listening to the program won't have to go and hunt for it;.

http://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.org/2014/09/18/return-of-the-evil-empire/
_______________________________

Here is a link to the Norman Dodd Report:

www.garynorth.com/DoddReport.pdf
_____________________________

Russian professor and political scientist Igor Panarin is a supporter of Russia as a "superstate," and it was his view that Stalin after 1934"started a process of recreation of the Rus doctrine "Moscow – a Third Rome" in new historical conditions."

So Putin is not the first to envision "Moscow - a Third Rome" in the 20th/21st centuries.

On 3 July 1941 when Stalin addressed the Soviet people as "Brothers and sisters", this doctrine became the dominating geopolitical idea of the USSR-Rus and replaced the Lenin-Trotsky's idea of world revolution that was an external (imported) geopolitical project. <The Pan-Eurasian nationalism of Trubetzkoy, joint with the "Moscow – a Third Rome" idea realised in the conditions of the Soviet order yielded a result – the USSR won a victory in the global skirmish with Fascism. And the Trotskyist ideas won at the end of the 20th century in the USA and brightly manifested themselves in the ideology of the liberal globalism of a part of the contemporary American political elite (globalists)...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Igor_Panarin
_______________________

cont....
 
cont...

Among Panarin's other ideas thst went tandem with the "Moscow the Third Rome" idea was that of the "Eurasian Union."

Eurasian Union: proposed in January 2006 as Eurasian Rus – an interstate formation modelled after the European Union on the territory of the post-Soviet area headed by a Prince (after Machiavelli) that would restore and strengthen the economic integration, with gradual incorporation of a series of Balkan and other countries. He proposed Vladimir Putin as the first Prince of the formation, which he renamed in 2009 to Eurasian Union and proposed St Petersburg as its capital by 2012, when in his view only 3 planetary centres of force would exist – the European Union (EU-1), the Eurasian Union (EU-2), and the Chinese Commonwealth. In April 2009 he proposed a second, Southern capital – Alma-Ata and in May 2009 – two more capitals: Kiev in 2014 and Belgrade in 2020......

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Igor_Panarin
______________________________

See also:

EURASIAN ECONOMIC UNION

Ukraine submitted an application to participate in the Eurasian Economic Union as an observer in August 2013.[54] Its membership was seen by some analysts as the key to the success of the union as Ukraine has the second largest economy of any of the 15 former republics of the Soviet Union. Russian pressure for Ukraine to join the Eurasian Economic Union instead of the European Union was a key factor in the Euromaidan protests that ended Viktor Yanukovych's rule as president of Ukraine and led to the Crimean Crisis. With high tensions between Russia and Ukraine in the wake of the crisis, the future inclusion of Ukraine seems unlikely.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eurasian_Economic_Union
______________________________

The Eurasian Economic Union will come into effect in January, 2015

http://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2014/05/29/a-new-level-of-integration-russia-belarus-kazakhstan-sign-eurasian-economic-union.html
_______________________________


During Cliff Kincaid's presentation he mentioned historian Paul Kengor.

I personally own just about all of Mr. Kengor's books in addition to the Mitrokhin Archives, the Venona Secrets by the late Herbert Romerstein, Diana West's book AMERICAN BETRAYAL and other books by KGB and Russian defectors.....just to name a few.

I even have the classic WHAT WE MUST KNOW ABOUT COMMUNISM by Harry and Bonnaro Overstreet
(1958.)

The following is from,
Chapter Eleven - TACTICS AND STRATAGEMS: THE UNITED FRONT:

http://www.writing.upenn.edu/~afilreis/50s/overstreet-what-we-must-know.html
 
how out of date can you get? and notice that the goal of Panarin (never mind whether Putin wants this or most Russians do) envisioned a regional semi empire, not a world empire, EU, Eurasia, and China, as distinct and independent entities.

Yes, third rome mystique was a driver with Stalin, or at least one he exploited.

There are two versions of the "holy Russia" theory.

a. that it is or was until communism came out of nowhere and killed everyone and converted and corrupted the rest, 99% full of holy and pure simple people.

This is easily refuted by the complaints of priests of the 1800s and accounts of travellers, and of saints and suchlike who repented of sins and told about them and painted a rather unholy picture of typical Russian village life.

b. that Russia is in some mystical way inherently "holy" whatever that means, as distinct from the typical behavior of typical Russians, and distinct even from whatever belief system might prevail!

the main proponent of this notion in the 1800s was a crude cigar chomping drunken slob who had two de facto wives (or a wife and mistress) in tow. Obviously his meaning of holy is not what Christians, Orthodox or otherwise, think of the word as meaning.

Panarin, given his date setting, sounds like yet another wild dreamer. Do we really have to take him seriously?

More to the point, we should look at the fact, that the Clinton nuclear doctrine, to absorb the first strike, has been replaced with making the first strike.

If you had a nuclear armed rival who took this tack, would you keep to treaties about testing, or start getting ready to deal with what might happen?
 
Christine,
Your comment at 8:38 is so irresponsible that I'm not sure where to begin.
That 50 million number is the number of Americans that the Imam is giving permission and encouragement to Muslims everywhere to kill. It is
basically a number that he pulled out of his turban which supposedly reflects the number of people killed by Americans in the last hundred years, or since aviation began.
Of course even that number is ridiculous, but just so you know, The CASUALTIES OF WAR caused by American led coalition in Desert storm,
both in the air and on land, probably didn't quite total 50,000.
Christine, I read the article you linked to in Shoebat. Why would you be so quick to jump onboard the Islam propaganda wagon, and sympathize with it ?
Do you see what gossip and wild exaggeration gets you ?
Fifty million Christine ?
You believe the Imam but you disbelieve in anything American.
Then of course you follow up that with some completely untrue statements about Vietnam.

Here's a little factoid: We didn't start either World War. We were dragged into both of them.
And we didn't start wars with Korea or Vietnam.
We went to save the world from Communism and we did just that to some degree. We certainly put a cramp in their style.
And we aren't the ones torturing, raping , beheading and burning people alive, seemingly just for sport. That would be the militant Muslims of ISIS, The muslim brotherhood, Hamas, and a whole host of other barbaric bloodthirsty demon possessed morons, in the name of an idol, but in fact just for the sake of bloodlust.

Oh, the things I want to say to you right now...




 
By the way Christine, that's FORTY FIVE comments by you on this thread alone, most of them lengthy.

 
Paul, our own figures alone had over 100,000 Iraqi children alone dead as a result of destruction of Iraqi infrastructure in the time frame in which
Scy of State Allbright was asked if this was asked if this was acceptable to accomplish the goals there and she said "Yes."

Sure the figure 50 million is probably exaggerated, but refers to all actions in the Middle East and elsewhere that affected muslims.

Personally I think ISIS and their families old enough to have been indoctrinated (which is old enough to hold a gun and use it which is maybe 10 years old) should probably be exterminated, to wipe this ideology out, but that's another thing.

If you read the article Theodore Shoebat posted I think I left a link to
it, you will see that the entire ISIS thing is based in koran and shariah specific things.

But if you go around killing indiscriminately THIS IS THE KIND OF PR YOU GET AND THIS IS THE KIND OF REACTION YOU GET.

As for American propaganda, it is as unreliable as anyone else's. Everyone on all sides lies, and everyone on all sides has hidden agendas.

If Daniel 7 first beast is America-Britain, and most likely NATO as the American arm, then we are in for a take down sooner or later. Maybe not in our lifetimes maybe next year. But that the critter after its wings are stripped (all air and space power lost) is lifted up on its feet like a man and a human heart instead of a monstrous and self deceiving and arrogant heart given to it. Repentance, it looks like.


The point is, our hands have not been all that clean. Even our foreign aid has been a shakedown setup of the recipients, the world bank as predator.

While Shearer of antipasministries.com has some problematic angles, his details of the depravity of the American evangelical union with big business and big government, and the general evil is accurate per what I already know.

And, as he points out, our sin is worse than that of comparable nations, because our sins are committed allegedly in Christ's Name.
 
Once again, thanks Paul for setting it straight. Christine is so often off base with the Bible and with science and an ungrateful American (to the point of bitter? God knows)to be so off base with history as well. Is it perfect? A long way from it. This nation needs to repent of great sins...and will answer for them...but are we as a nation, what Christine says we are? Are we responsible for the crimes of those nations that have hated everyone (even their own) long long before there was even an America?

Christine you are a very troubled soul. There is a pattern in your know-it-all posts that is evidence of how little regard you have for others. You should spend time before the Lord and let Him innumerate your sins and let that humble you and give you some correct perspective. (and give this blog a break)
 
Christine said:

"How out of date can you get?"

How very New Age of you, Christine, to suggest that we abandon the old ways of thinking, and replace them with.. .exactly what, I don't know.

You are an apologist (intentionally or unintentionally, only God knows) for our enemies, both spiritual and geopolitical. In war, motives are important. We (America) don't kill people with malice, wanting from the outset to destroy life and property. We only do so because some other person or nation decides that they want to do just that, so in Christian love for their potential future victims, we put a stop to it. Putting a stop to violence perpetrated by evil entities sometimes (usually) involves using violence. But the motive is out of love, at least theoretically. To morally equate the killing that happens at the hands of the Islamists, or the Communists, or other evil and nasty people, with the killing that happens by the hands of those trying to stop it, is muddled and incorrect thinking.

You also said "As for American propaganda, it is as unreliable as anyone else's."

More proof of muddled and baseless thinking, or thinking that is based on an incorrect understanding of the world. You really should, in a fit of 80s nostalgia, form a picket line at the nearest college campus, and start up that well-known chorus "Hey Hey, Ho Ho, Western Civ has got to go!"

Although.... on most campuses today you'd probably just get weird stares, because for the most part, the cries of students 30 years ago were mostly answered, and there are no longer any teachers or professors passing along the core values of the Christian West. We are far into the darkness that resulted from that.

 
Christine,
"
Paul, our own figures alone had over 100,000 Iraqi children alone dead as a result of destruction of Iraqi infrastructure in the time frame in which
Scy of State Allbright was asked if this was asked if this was acceptable to accomplish the goals there and she said "Yes."

Sure the figure 50 million is probably exaggerated, but refers to all actions in the Middle East and elsewhere that affected muslims."

Our own figures alone?
What are talking about?

The Air Force figures it to be around 40,000.
Why are you lying?

Do you consider FIFTY MILLION, as opposed to fifty thousand to be an "exaggeration" ? OMG!

Christine, pack up your bags and move to Damascus or Mosul or someplace like that with your exaggerations, but remember, there won't be any food stamps there or rent relief checks or
disability payments coming your way there.
There won't be a safety net for you, Aspargers' notwithstanding.

Put your crack pipe down and push yourself away from the computer and give us all a break.

 
Last week I mentioned a show to be broadcats online and on Roku TV, with Cliff Kincaid and Jeff Nyquist.

For those who tuned in, the show was not seen because of technical difficulties. (Cliff's Comcast went bonkers.) For the more paranoid out there, I find it interesting that out of all the weekly shows they've done since they started (over a year), that was the only one that got cancelled for technical reasons. Hmmmm. Maybe there's a message they have that someone didn't like?

Anyway, it's been rescheduled again for tonight:

http://www.kenneytv.com/Roku.html

Or if you have Roku, search for America's Survival TV with Cliff Kincaid and Jerry Kenney.

9PM Eastern, tonight (Wednesday).

Show title: "Putin’s Plans for the World and Obama’s Plan to Spread Russian Influence in the Middle East"

 
paul, Air Force estimates eh? are you talking military casualties only?

put YOUR crack pipe down. Here is the video where (okay I was wrong on the figure, it wasn't 100,000 it was FIVE HUNDRED THOUSAND IRAQI CHILDREN UNDER FIVE YEARS OLD DEAD BECAUSE OF INFRASTRUCTURE DESTRUCTION)

Allbright is appraised of this, does not deny it, and says yes it was worth it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omnskeu-puE
 
Christine,
The 23 second video that you base your conjecture on sounds to me like it was cut off, probably at the point where Ms Albright realized the absurdity of the number. It was based on Leslie Stall's need to make a grandiose statement in her 60 minutes segment. "More than Hiroshima" she said with a straight face.
I based my estimate on what Wikipedia says:
Here is a collection of many different estimates:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War#United_Nations

There are many sources which vary wildly, but this 34,000 is from the UN which is consistently anti-American.
The estimates that run up to 100,000 are for the eight years from 2006 to 2014.

May your computer go down permanently.

 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdmix60ajmA this video shows Allbright saying later that she was wrong in saying it was worth it, but did not challenge the figure.

https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=11772087&postID=7755802812935780373&page=1&token=1411574197779

Bill Richardson, plenty of time to challenge the figure, does not challenge the figure.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOrrOu8uV8o

respectable source and links to UN information supporting this figure.

http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/stories/iraq/sanctions.html

UN sources anti american, eh? the UN was generally an American tool. you may think that "america" your god is distinct from the elitist satanist new age/nwo globalist closet nazi eugenics mystically inclined types that run america, and have increasingly over the past 100 years, but guess again.

All sides lie in wars, and before and after. But some lies are checkable.

your problem is, you want to have someone either an individual or a nation to look up to and trust implicitly and without question, and defend to the death, giving you a sense of validity.

Think these exact same feelings are absent from those opposed to you in other countries? think again.

much of what you may think are spiritual stirrings in you when you hear the national anthem (one of the worst pieces of music and verbiage, should have been America The Beautiful) or whatever are in fact fleshly, and such group loyalty is documented in animals.

national borders and independent legal and political systems are important to hamper human evil, not because "national sovereignty" and "nationalism" is a good thing in itself, but because it is a useful tool against evil, and gives people places to run when things get dicey.
 
"The estimates that run up to 100,000 are for the eight years from 2006 to 2014. " so what? its the result of destruction of infrastructure as well as sanctions.
 
Christine,
Yes and the point was, you quoted 50 MILLION at
8:36 above, as if it were a fact.

 
_That should say 8:38
 
Dear Paul.

RE: Christine,
Your comment at 8:38 is so irresponsible that I'm not sure where to begin......

.....Here's a little factoid: We didn't start either World War. We were dragged into both of them.
And we didn't start wars with Korea or Vietnam.
We went to save the world from Communism and we did just that to some degree. We certainly put a cramp in their style.



Thank you Paul. That meant more to me than you can even imagine!


 
Marko,

Re: How very New Age of you, Christine, to suggest that we abandon the old ways of thinking, and replace them with.. .exactly what, I don't know.

Bravo! Your comment is spot on!
 
Dear Paul and Marko,


At 12:54P.M. Christine said:

you may think that "america" your god is distinct from the elitist satanist new age/nwo globalist closet nazi eugenics mystically inclined types that run america, and have increasingly over the past 100 years, but guess again.

I beg to differ with that un-American screed.

The way I learned it growing up, the proper love of one's country -patriotism - is not only part and parcel of the virtue of piety which is also a Gift of the Holy Spirit, but is also implied by the 4th Commandment "Honor thy father and thy mother" - especially since it is self evident that the family is prior to the state. In fact, the very word "patriot" comes from the Latin word "pater" which means "father."

A country or nation is actually a "family writ large."

And wasn't it St. Paul who said
in 1 Timothy 5:8

"But if anyone does not provide for his own, and especially for those of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever???"









 
firstly, the figure is TEN million not FIFTY million, that the imam claims, at a life for a life, ten mil would even it out.

The claim is based on muslim life everywhere not just Desert Storm.

(Susanna what should we try instead of your untried and untrue partisan sources? Try history books.)

Paul and Susanna, if you think Desert Storm was our first incursion into muslim lands, you truly are ignorant, incredibly ignorant.

This figure would be a combination of all killed directly by bombs and guns and indirectly by actions of people we put in power, in all muslim lands or locations we got involved in ever.

Iran - democratically elected Mossadegh toppled and Shah put in charge.

Iraq - two different war actions when one would have been enough if keeping Saddam in power wasn't useful to ensure a second incursion, more money for the military contractors who make bombs and bullets and planes that don't always work that well. Not to mention whatever shit we were up to besides that.

Sudan and similar locations.

Afghanistan.

Pakistan.

Indonesia - a muslim country we got involved with in the anticommunist thing, involving a massacre of people planning to massacre non commies, good, but the massacre under (was it Suharto?) went into the million count, even if exaggerated not good, because the legitimate targets couldn't have been that many.

Philippines - Moro tribesmen that the .45 got its reputation established against, because it would take down enraged and drugged up holy warrior that a smaller caliber wouldn't stop before he was in machetteing range of you, are muslim.

All struggles in Egypt.

Libya.

And they are probably counting "palestinian" dead because we support Israel.

When you add it all up, 10 million is credible. A lot were legitimate fortunes of war, but a lot were not.

PAUL NATION AS FAMILY WRIT LARGE - well, families are supposed to support their poor so THERE IS THE BIBLICAL BASIS FOR THE WELFARE STATE.

However, regarding turning against a govt. going bad, something you applaud people doing who do so in support of the USA, note this

"honor your father and mother THAT THY DAYS MAY BE LONG UPON THE LAND WHICH THE LORD THY GOD GIVETH THEE." which land they would not keep if they were not godly, so obviously it is godly parents loyal to God who are to be honored, having no gods but YHWH is the first commandment, which outranks all other considerations.

Ezekiel chapter 20 lambasts them for following the sins and evils of their fathers.

Zechariah 1:4 "Be not as your fathers...."

Daniel 9:16b "because for our sins, and for the iniquities of our fathers, Jerusalem and thy people are become a reproach to all that are about us."
Daniel doesn't hesitate to acknowledge the evils of his fathers.

Now, if you give a damn about this country, you will pray for God's wrath to be softened and for the repentance of many. perhaps the destruction won't come in our lifetimes, but it will come, it has to. But how extensive is another matter, and I am not the only prophecy studier who draws a connection between Daniel 7's first beast and America linked with Britain.

Not to mention the America-is-Babylon interpretation which has a lot to it.

Note that Jeremiah was denounced for warning it was not wise to rebel against Nebuchadnezzar, and frankly in modern terms, Daniel was a collaborator. To those who look only to their family, their tribe, their blood their "greater self," a rabid egotism that is disguised as selfless because hidden behind the image to your mind of others who you value as a part of yourself, those who think only of their nation as their first priority and do not think about God or do so only in terms of sexual sin issues, but greed ambition empired vain glory etc. these dire sins escape their attention.
 
Yeah and I bet you walk the talk too Christine ;).
Muslim crimes have gone on for centuries. A threat to all the known world anytime they found themselves enabled. Early America had it's share of muslim bad behavior to deal with on the high seas when we were not engaging them, and had certainly not gone into their territory, so you need to read some history ole girl. So what's new?

Bad religion makes for bad culture and the poor innocents born into that suffer by hands their own people so much more than anything we have done there so you way overstate the case--again.

The need to overstate your point is how you operate because your point is weak. (and that's not new either).
 
Putin has rejected the eastern Ukraine's request to be admitted to Russia.

heh, more fool you.

http://www.blacklistednews.com/Russia%E2%80%99s_Leader_Putin_Rejects_Ukrainian_Separatists%E2%80%99_Aim_to_Become_Part_of_Russia/38055/0/38/38/Y/M.html
 
"The need to overstate your point is how you operate because your point is weak."

doesn't even cross my mind. I "overstate" because I have to educate you people.
 
and I don't support Islam AT ALL but the way the west has operated only plays into their hands in terms of public relations.

 
I "overstate" because I have to educate you people.

Not only weak but manipulative.

Not only weak but anti-social.

Not only weak but overzealous.

Well, consider me and no doubt others, the unwilling, and your form of education unwanted. But the severely dogmatic in you won't respect that and so you force yourself and your "education" upon us.

Actually it's not really christian or even civil in your form of communication, rather it's your form of jihad on this blog.
 
Paul,

I agree with Susanna about your statement:

"We went to save the world from Communism and we did just that to some degree. We certainly put a cramp in their style."

I wish that we had now half the drive and determination to finish the job, or even recognized that the job was left undone - the same drive I saw in my grandmother's eyes when she would talk to me in hushed tones about the evils of Communism. The ability to spot evil as that generation could has been programmed out of us by those same Communists, and by those with the same deadly Utopian ideas. We have been told that in order for everyone to survive, the stronger (the West) must disarm and make themselves equal to the weaker (the non-West).

From a Jeff Nyquist 2010 article:

More than twenty years ago, working on a book that was later titled Origins of the Fourth World War, I inserted a quote from the Treaty for the Prohibition of Nuclear Weapons in Latin America, which states: "That nuclear weapons, whose terrible effects are suffered, indiscriminately and inexorably, by military forces and civilian population alike, constitute, through the persistence of the radioactivity they release, an attack on the integrity of the human species and ultimately may even render the whole earth uninhabitable." The treaty further states: "That general and complete disarmament under effective international control is a vital matter which all the peoples of the world equally demand."

About the above, I predicted, "It is, in essence, the language of the final treaty; of the treaty that is coming...." There is an inevitability to certain ideas, for better or worse, and this can be discerned far in advance. Today the "final treaty" will be signed on April 8th, marking the first step in President Barack Obama's march toward a world free of nuclear weapons. Currently the U.S. deploys 2,100 strategic warheads while Russia deploys 2,600 warheads...

There is an eloquent summation of all this in James Burnham's book, Suicide of the West, where he wrote: "It is a mark of the ascendancy of liberal ideology ... in the advanced Western nations, most particularly the United States and Great Britain, that for the first time in history disarmament proposals and pacifist-tending ideas are being pressed not by the nations with inferior arms in order to weaken the stronger, but by the stronger in order to weaken themselves: to sacrifice their relative advantage, and thereby to lessen their ability to defend their interests and ideals." As Burnham correctly noted, "what is ending in our age is not empire but merely the empires of the West."

To further make his point, Burnham quoted Louis Veuillot, who wrote: "When I am the weaker, I ask you for my freedom, because that is your principle; but when I am the stronger, I take away your freedom, because that is my principle." Here is what Burnham calls "the dialectic of liberalism." It is also the dialectic of the arms control process between Russia and the United States. The treaty that President Obama is going to sign will not disarm Moscow in the same way it disarms the United States...

Nothing can stop the disarmament process over time. It will advance, and will signify the weakening of the West as it signifies the strengthening of Russia and China. The final, predictable, and tragic result of all this was foreseen by James Burnham more than four decades ago. With all that happened during and after World War II, it seems that nothing has been learned about the essential nature of free society and the essential nature of societies that are decidedly not free.

http://tinyurl.com/pheu2gz


The assigning of moral equivalence between Western nations and aggressor nations like Russia and China is the resigning of ourselves to a "final solution" executed upon us by those who do not think as we do, and therefore are NOT our moral equivalents.
 
I guess that what I don't understand is Aspargers
Syndrome.
It's said that they have no feelings. That they can't be corrected because they have no sense of being wrong when they are wrong.
A friend of mine employed an Aspargers person in his store for years, only to recently find out that he was stealing money out of the drawer every day for all those years, and when he was confronted with it, he didn't register any remorse or acknowledge any wrongdoing. My friend just let him go.
In fact he got a job with another person in retail and after a few weeks he was found to be stealing, every day, again.
They are also known to have an inflated sense of self worth and feelings of grandiosity.
The main reason my friend hired him was that he was knowledgable regarding the particular merchandise that my friend sells, (music gear) and also because he knew that he had a problem and, being a Christian himself wanted to help him out and show him some respect and dignity.

 
Dear Paul,

According to one Social Security claims rep of 32 years, it is uncommon for an adult to be approved for SSI benefits just for Asperger's Syndrome.

Most people with Asperger's Syndrome do work...and few people who only have Asperger's Syndrome get SSI.

Moreover, if a person doesn't have a specific clinical diagnosis of Asperger's Syndrome, than for all intents and purposes for SSI the person doesn't have it - unless, of course a physician is either mistaken, clueless....or willing to be part of the "crazy money" scam like the one we have here in Massachusetts and elsewhere.

The last paragraph in the following article is educative:

THE NEW WELFARE SWINDLE

.....In 1988, there were 4.46 million SSI recipients. Today, there are 8 million. It is impossible to know how many of these are fakers gaming the system, but SSI recipients know no color or geographic boundary. Federal data shows that roughly half are white, half black. Nor does the phenomenon apply to all of the poor. The aforementioned veteran social worker visits several severely mentally handicapped persons who work menial jobs rather than accept government largess. They take pride in going to work every day and in setting a good example for their children. My neighbors would think them crazy....read more...

http://spectator.org/articles/36566/new-welfare-swindle
_____________________________

I suspect that the reasons why the "Asperger's" person your friend was good and compassionate enough to hire was fired ( i.e. stealing )probably had a lot less to do with Asperger's Syndrome than it did with a serious moral character flaw that his enablers have helped him to "evolve" and "fine tune" by using Asperger's as an excuse for his wrongdoing.

But who knows? I could be wrong, and, as always, am willing to stand corrected if I am wrong - albeit not by Christine, thank you very much!!!

In any case, as far as the work ethic is concerned, there are several people with special needs like learning disabilities and Downs Syndrome working at the American-owned grocery store where I shop.

They are given whatever jobs that they are able to do and they do an excellent job!

They also go out of their way to be polite and helpful and I make it a point to thank them as I leave - not only personally and verbally, but also by ringing the bell that has been installed at the exit by the managers to be rung "FOR GOOD SERVICE." I usually take my elderly neighbor (88 years old) shopping with me, so that bell gets a good workout because they are particularly nice to her.

We also have discovered that sometimes the owners are there and they like to hear that bell ringing.
 
I don't feel that there is a proven wrong motive from Christine--God knows that part--but it is her method I take exception to.

I have a nephew who was diagnosed with a mild case of aspbergers and he had a real problem with feeling empathy. He also has some body deformity and felt the sting of people's unfair judgment many times. He became a christian at a young age and was taught right from wrong and though he struggled, and still does to a sometimes more sometimes less degree, he has overcome many many obstacles and is now a productive part of many things in life. On his own and on his own dime. It is the Lord who has been doing that work in him and he credits God for that. Everyone has something to overcome.

But God! (that is wonderful to type) But God wants to do this in people if they will allow Him. We do have a freewill-(first they need to be convicted of sin by God then they can respond in agreement with Him-repent and believe in Jesus-and that will begin that process of inward change-or they can willfully choose to say no to God's prompting. People with or without a disability can certainly have that do-it-all yourself ego and want to take credit also.

God knows that too.
 
The do-it-my-way syndrome is alive and well worldwide.
In individual people, in localities, in nations, and ultimately in a global plan.
The fight is on and there are many many losers playing this game.
And it won't be over until it is OVER!
God will see to that.
~only room for one at the top~
 
"I "overstate" because I have to educate you people."

!!

You don't "have to" at all. That is simply an inner compulsion of yours. Secondly, it doesn't work, as the overwhelming majority of people who choose to reply to you either disagree with you or poke fun at you. Third, "you people" is a huge warning phrase that somebody has an inflated self-image. Just who do you mean by "you people", Christine?

 
"The need to overstate your point is how you operate because your point is weak. doesn't even cross my mind. I "overstate" because I have to educate you people."

It doesn't cross your mind that your point could be weak?

Huh?

When information is merely googled I supposed you don't have to put much thought to it.

Ok Christine, you put a lot of effort in overstatement to "educate" us but not a lot of thought about the points you are making.

Got it.
 
I figured come over here to see what "you people" are doing.


But who knows? I could be wrong, and, as always, am willing to stand corrected if I am wrong - albeit not by Christine, thank you very much!!!

LOL!!

Russia completes dry run of nuclear bombing attack on America

Analysis of the flight indicated the aircraft were conducting practice runs to a pre-determined "launch box"--an optimum point for firing nuclear-armed cruise missiles at U.S. targets, said defense officials familiar with intelligence reports.

The disclosure of the latest Russian nuclear forces training came amid a call by a Russian general the prior week for Moscow to adjust its military doctrine to include a first-strike option against the U.S. and NATO.

"Gen. Yuri Yakubov, a senior Defense Ministry official, was quoted by the state-run Interfax news agency as saying that Russia's 2010 military doctrine should be revised to identify the United States and the NATO alliance as enemies, and clearly outline the conditions for a preemptive nuclear strike against them," the Free Beacon reported.

Among other necessary doctrinal changes, Yakubov said, "it is necessary to hash out the conditions under which Russia could carry out a preemptive strike with the Russian Strategic Rocket Forces," which are the Russian army's nuclear forces.

The recent practice launch runs are just the latest in a string of such missions that involve aggressive Russian bomber flights near U.S. airspace. The Free Beacon said a number of analysts believe that the flights amount to nuclear saber-rattling by Moscow over escalating tensions surrounding Ukraine.



 
Hi Craig,

Re" Russia completes dry run of nuclear bombing attack on America

http://www.naturalnews.com/046886_russia_nuclear_bomb_obama.html
__________________

Good find, Craig!

This is a perfect example of why Russia is said to be in violation of the 1987 Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty. Earlier on this thread, I posted the following:


In 1986, Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev confided to aides that the West’s nuclear missiles were “a gun at our temple.” The following year, Gorbachev and President Ronald Reagan signed an agreement eliminating the whole class of nuclear weapons in Europe. The Intermediate Range Nuclear Forces Treaty was good for Europe, and remains so today, long after the Cold War has ended.

So it was unsettling when the Obama administration recently published a compliance report saying that Russia had violated the treaty. At issue is a provision that prohibits the possession, production or flight-testing of ground-launched cruise missiles with a range of 500 kilometers (311 miles) to 5,500 kilometers (3,417 miles) or launchers for such missiles. The United States has not published details of the claimed violation, which makes it hard to evaluate, but it reportedly involves tests of a ground-launched cruise missile
...read more....

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/russia-should-reveal-more-about-a-possible-missile-treaty-violation/2014/09/07/67dbbb6c-1d96-11e4-ab7b-696c295ddfd1_story.html
__________________________

INTERMEDIATE RANGE NUCLEAR FORCES TREATY

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intermediate-Range_Nuclear_Forces_Treaty
_________________________
 
P.S.

The late Russian defector Sergei Tretyakov - a.k.a. "Comrade J" - said that he saw his book entitled COMRADE J as a kind of "wake up call" for Americans.

"Americans are a little bit naive when they say, '[The] Cold War is over, and right now, we can relax.' [That's] not the case for intelligence [work]," he tells Robert Siegel.

Just as in the Soviet era, Russia's main targets remain the United States, NATO and China.


http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=18476273
____________________________

As one reviewer of Tretyakov's book, Miguel A. Faria Jr., M.D wrote:

"Tretyakov was no ordinary spy of the Communist era. He was the first KGB/SVR officer, who was actively spying for the new Russia after the collapse of the Soviet Union, to defect to the USA. According to a senior FBI agent involved in the case, Sergei Tretyakov "has been by far the most important Russian Spy that our side has had in decades...I can tell you this man saved American lives."

Although Tretyakov died on June 13, 2010, his death was not announced until July 9, 2010. Many suspected foul play.


 
http://www.project-syndicate.org/commentary/javier-solana-urges-the-world-s-traditional-and-emer



I wonder if he would like to head that up......
 
It doesn't sound great that Russia is doing practice runs for nuking America... but isn't that routine? Doesn't America do practice runs to nuke Russia and China? And if not, should it?
 
We should not suppose that, just because medics have coined the term Aspergers for a specific set of manifestations, it understands its origin as it does with viruses and bacteria. Personally I reckon its origin lies in deeply unhappy experiences of maltreatment very early on in life, perhaps too early to be remembered. That does not excuse boorish behavior but it goes some way to explaining it.
 

Re: Doesn't America do practice runs to nuke Russia and China? And if not, should it?

Actually, Russia has been whining about our use of drones and target missiles in missile defense tests even though neither weapon is covered by the Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty - especially the drones insofar as they are not “launched” from a ground-launched cruise missile launcher as defined by the treaty, but “takes off” and returns like a manned aircraft. Such aircraft are not limited by the INF treaty. It is thus a stretch on the part of the Russians to equate the two categories, an equation that cannot be justified by the letter of the treaty.

From United States Naval Institute News:

Russian Nuclear Treaty Violation: The Basics

http://news.usni.org/2014/07/31/russian-nuclear-treaty-violation-basics
________________________

I agree with the commenter following the preceding article who suggested that we re-establish missile defense in Poland. Now THAT'S my idea of a "reset button!!!"

Russia Stonewalls U.S. on Charges of Nuclear Missile Treaty Breach

Moscow turns tables, accuses U.S. of INF treaty violations

http://freebeacon.com/national-security/russia-stonewalls-u-s-on-charges-of-nuclear-missile-treaty-breach/
________________________

While neither the USA nor Russia is the sole repository of virtuous behavior, the "cloven hoof" is tending more these days to be peeping out from beneath the skirts of "Mother Russia."
 
P.S.

The usage of the term "mother" in reference to a nation or culture symbolizes the "spirit of collectivity".

Something to keep in mind when considering the New Age Movement.

Speaking of which.....has anyone heard about "Vissarion," the "Jesus of Siberia?"

VISSARION
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vissarion
________________________

The Vissarion Christ: Inside Russia's End-Times Cults
By Anna Nemtsova
Filed: 12/17/12 at 12:00

http://www.newsweek.com/vissarion-christ-inside-russias-end-times-cults-63607
__________________________

Jesus of Siberia: The Russian ex-traffic policeman who claims he is the son of God

By Niall Firth
Updated: 05:22 EST, 31 August 2009
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1209858/Jesus-Siberia-Ex-traffic-policeman-says-son-God-leads-thousands-followers-Russia.html
______________________________

JESUS OF SIBERIA

http://www.sbs.com.au/dateline/story/transcript/id/601707/n/Jesus-of-Siberia


 
Bill Maher, an avowed non-Christian, explains to Charlie Rose how the religion of Islam is intrinsically violent, and thus very different from Christianity (among other differences noted):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpdGK3F4pC0&index=2&list=UUbINn3x-intLp88Zrf8acpg
 
This is now the 2nd time my comment has been deleted, and I think I know why Google is doing so. Do a search of "YouTube" + "ISIS" and you'll find the article I tried to post, and the likely reason it disappeared.
 
It's not exactly easy to find ISIS's website address either.
 
INTERESTING - August 28th article by Brookings Institution's Thomas Wright says "Mogherini is the wrong choice for Europe." I note that JAVIER SOLANA is employed (one of his MANY lucrative jobs) by the Brookings Institution. This MIGHT signal that Solana does not approve of Ms. Mogherini. Hmmm -- I wonder if he would have worked as hard for the release of Mariam Ibrahim from the clutches of her death sentencing Sudanese?

Constance
 
Craig, I didn't delete any comments. Let me look at the spam box to see if there are any clues there.

Got to get to bed. MicroEffect radio program in the morning, 10 a.m. Eastern time (7 a.m. Pacific time).

Constance
 
Here is a release from Mogherini's department on August 8th, when many of us were just waking up to ISIS -- she got the picture:

Iraq: Mogherini cites need to protect Christians and Yazidi and support Kurds halting Isis
Rome 08 August 2014
Minister for Foreign Affairs Federica Mogherini considers fundamental and urgent the mobilisation of the entire international community in the protection of Christian and Yazidi minorities in northern Iraq. "We must protect Iraqi civilians and, in particular, the Christians and Yazidi being persecuted by ISIS", she said, "and support the Kurdish Peshmerga militias in halting the advance of ISIS. For this reason, we agree with American President Barack Obama’s decision to intervene.

The international community must stand at the side of the Iraqi government and move to bring aid to the populations", Mogherini continued. "Italy is already active in this. Deputy Minister Lapo Pistelli has just come back from Iraq and the Cooperation has earmarked one million euro, through WHO, WFP and UNICEF, for emergency assistance for the displaced, and to re-establish proper living conditions in areas inhabited by Christian minorities in the Nineveh Plain area under Peshmerga control".

The foreign minister will have a telephone meeting this evening with Kurdish President Massoud Barzani.

 
US Senator Ted Cruz had recent very kind words about Federica Mogherini and the Italian government's role in securing Meriam Ibrahim's release:

http://tinyurl.com/lo423oc

To his credit, Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX), among other members of Congress, made her plight a top priority. Religious liberty is a human right, he argued, not one that is conditional or can be taken away. He therefore released this statement on Thursday, rejoicing she had been “brought out of the darkness.” He also praised government and religious leaders from around the world. Without them, Ms. Ibrahim's liberation would have been impossible:

“We rejoice today that our sister, Meriam Ibrahim, has been brought out of the darkness of persecution and into the light of liberty where she can worship freely and fully,” Sen. Cruz said.
“Great thanks are due to the government of Italy, which, not taking no for an answer, exerted the strongest diplomatic pressure to resolve Ms. Ibrahim’s case. Prime Minister Matteo Renzi publicly raised Ms. Ibrahim’s plight in recent weeks, and Foreign Minister Federica Mogherini has taken a personal interest in the case.

“Pope Francis has been a tireless advocate for Ms. Ibrahim through prayer, and their combined and sustained efforts have brought Ms. Ibrahim and her family to safety.

“Truly the Lord works in mysterious ways. Ms. Ibrahim’s long trial seemed at times hopeless, as a powerless woman was victimized by a brutal government that would torture and kill its own citizens for their faith. But its beautiful conclusion today when Pope Francis laid his hands on her in blessing reminds us of the boundless power of pure faith to lift up and preserve the weak and oppressed.

“It is also a call to action for all Christians around the globe to redouble our efforts to draw attention to the plight of the many Christians still suffering cruel and unjust imprisonment, including Pastor Saeed Abedini in Iran and Kenneth Bae in North Korea.

 
Constance,

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you had deleted any of my comments.
 
Sorry to see the "Anonymous" -- I posted the piece about Senator Ted Cruz praising the Italian government and giving them credit for "not taking no for an answer" and for Ms. Mogherini's strong role in taking a personal interest in the case -- she is the Foreign Minister for Italy and the European Union's now selected successor to Catherine Ashton as High Representative for the Common Foreign and Security Policy.

It is more than interesting to me that the Brookings Institution which employs Javier Solana has taken such a critical stance against her.

Constance
 
Dear Constance,

RE:It is more than interesting to me that the Brookings Institution which employs Javier Solana has taken such a critical stance against her.

I have been digging into this more deeply with a view to acquiring greater clarity of understanding of the situation.

The following article from the Brookings Institute which employs Javier Solana makes it abundantly clear why they are taking such a critical stand against Federica Mogherini.

Mogherini is the Wrong Choice for Europe
August 28, 2014

http://www.brookings.edu/blogs/up-front/posts/2014/08/italian-foreign-minister-mogherini-europe-wright
___________________________

I find the Brookings critical attitude more than interesting as well given the fact that Strobe Talbott who is president of Brookings was once dubbed "Russia's man in Washington."

I am finding it utterly fascinating that at one time EU membership for Russia was being considered. And look who was among the most vocal supporters.

Among the most vocal supporters of Russian membership of the EU has been former Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russia%E2%80%93European_Union_relations#EU_membership
________________________

Silvio Berlusconi: Russia should join EU
by at 16/10/2008 20:07
BRUSSELS (AFP)

BRUSSELS (AFP) - Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi said Wednesday that he is in favour of Russia becoming a member of the European Union, a "vision" he has held for several years.

"I consider Russia to be a Western country and my plan is for the Russian Federation to be able to become a member of the European Union in the coming years," Berlusconi told reporters in Brussels.

"Me, I want to go further. I have had this vision for years," Berlusconi said as he arrived in Brussels for an EU summit.

The Italian prime minister has had a friendly relationship with Russian Prime Minister Putin for several years and invited the former president of Russia, along with his family, to stay at his private residence on the island of Sardinia....read more...


http://themoscownews.com/news/20081016/55351176.html
_____________________________

cont..
 
cont..

Apparently Mr. Berlusconi was claiming to be Russia's BFF ( Best Friend Forever) while at the same time claiming to be America's BFF.

Preparing President Obama for a meeting with Mr. Berlusconi in June 2009, Elizabeth Dibble, the deputy chief of mission at the United States Embassy in Rome, warned that some in the American government regarded the Italian leader as “feckless, vain and ineffective as a modern European leader.” Dealing with him, she said, “requires a careful balance of close consideration”.......

.......“Our relationship with Berlusconi is complex,” Ms. Dibble wrote. “He is vocally pro-American and has helped address our interest on many levels in a manner and to a degree that the previous government was unwilling or unable to do.” Yet, the diplomat noted, there are other areas where Mr. Berlusconi “seems determined to be best friends with Russia, sometimes in direct opposition to American, and even European Union, policy.”

It was noted that Mr. Berlusconi had criticized the American missile defense project, eastward expansion of NATO and support for Kosovo’s independence as “provocations of Russia.” Virtually alone among European leaders, he defended Russia’s military push into Georgia during the August 2008 war and has backed joint energy projects between Gazprom in Russia and the Italian energy company ENI, at a time when the European Union is pushing for less dependence on Russian gas.

Mr. Berlusconi’s ties with Russia and Vladimir V. Putin, its former president and current prime minister, are clearly a subject of American concern. Mrs. Clinton’s office sent off questions to the American Embassies in Rome and Moscow, asking for anything that might cast light on the relationship. “What personal investments, if any, do they have that might drive their foreign and economic policies?” the cable asked...
read more...

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/03/world/europe/03italy.html?_r=0
______________________________

Alas....(at least for Berlusconi and other supporters of his "vision"), Putin said "Nyet" to EU membership for Russia.

Russia not planning to join EU

October 17, 2008 - 18:56 AMT

PanARMENIAN.Net - Russia is a self-sufficient country and has no intention to join the European Union, Vladimir Chizhov, RF permanent representative to the EU, said when commenting on Italian PM Silvio Berlusconi's statement.

"We have every reason to develop independently, but not as a part of a union," Chizhov said
............

http://www.panarmenian.net/eng/world/news/27275/
___________________________

It is very curious to learn, however, that Russia, which claimed to have every reason to develop "independently" but not as part of a union, has recently signed the treaty with Belarus and Kazakhstan which has established the Eurasian Economic Union which will go into effect on January 1, 2015.

I think that we can safely conclude that whatever "pro-Russia" leanings Federica Mogherini might have are simply reflective of the long-standing policies of the Italian politicians whom she serves and shouldn't really be held against her personally.....unless she demonstrates that she doesn't deserve to be given the benefit of the doubt.

At least that is my analysis of the situation.
 
P.S.

......the alleged “softness” toward Russia, even if we want to admit it exists and is not a polemical invention, could not be attributed to her but to the Italian government. She certainly did not go to Moscow as a personal initiative....

http://www.cidob.org/en/publicaciones/opinion/europa/el_reto_de_mogherini

 
Be headings begin in America:

www.tedmontgomery.com/remarks.html
 
Christine,

The West has made political mistakes, but this does not explain Islam's own laws on apostasy or beheading Christians, coming to Oklahoma or your next door neighbour.

Anybody who has the Holy Spirit would not go around randomly be-heading people.

We all sin, but this is a clear case of demonic possession.

These people need an exorcist, not air-strikes.

We do not wrestle against flesh and blood.





 
I've posted a new article -- in the meantime, so far my jury is favorable to Ms. Mogherini. Her taking a personal interest and following through on the plight of Meriam Ibrahim as the Bible would say "covers a multitude of sins" It will be interesting to see if there are further attempts to block her from taking the EU foreign policy job. If Brookings Institution has made snide comments about her, it might be that Javier Solana didn't bless her appointment either.

Constance

 
anon 9:22 "We do not wrestle against flesh and blood."
what a classic example of out of context Scripture quoting. The larger context in this case, which includes favorable references to govt. role as suppresser of evil in another Epistle.

exorcism would only remove the spirits empowering ISIS to be effective and more vicious, but the taste for this existed already and the ideology is already there.

exorcism would weaken the evil not eradicate it.

and when you got a herd of monsters, possessed or not, headed your way, you need bombs and guns. Exorcize 'em as they get closer, sure, weaken them. But their OWN evil remains and must be dealt with, lethally. A few here and there convert, but Jesus warned that most people seek the wide gate not the narrow gate.


 
If Solana didn't bless her appointment, then he's not the all powerful being some here think.

Give it up with Solana. He's a has been.
 
yes Solana is a has been, but anon 2:25 is forgetting several things.

a. all the interest in him derives from believing prophecy experts who for decades had a euro american focus, which is not biblical. prophecy centers on Israel and the Middle East, so the antichrist won't arise from Europe, unless he is a european ruler of some segment of the last empire that will crush what is left of britain-america, russia and china and out of that empire will come the antichrist see Daniel chapter 7.

even if that interpretation is wrong, he still has to be essentially middle eastern, and even if the Roman empire is revived, NONE of it has to be in Europe, because it was all over the map, literally, europe, the Middle east to the edge of Persia and in northern Africa incl. Egypt.

2. the european focus incl. solana IS NOT WORTHLESS IN ITSELF, because even if prophecy doesn't play out in our lifetimes, though it might, these things in europe are affecting us now.

3. solana IS IMPORTANT because of his occult and New Age connections, and while he may be a has been WHO HAS HE BEEN MENTORING WHO IS NOT A HAS BEEN> who has the same connections AND has power to affect europe and our daily lives? this is important.
 
No I haven't missed anything at all Christina. It's just that some people have been trying to shoehorn Solana into something he is not for years and it really gets old after awhile.
 
Matteo Renzi, Italy's charismatic young prime minister (Federica Mogherini was appointed by him as Italy's foreign minister) appears to be somewhat of a mixed bag -- but not of the anticlerical, anti-Christian stripe of too many present Europeans. He looks like a decent young man probably influenced by the same New Age "Third Way" propaganda he had to have grown up with. I'm saddened by his position on same-sex unions. From a recent story in the Boston Globe:

He’s a regular Mass-goer, he was active in a Catholic branch of the Scouts, one of his closest advisors coauthored a 2007 BOOK with an Opus Dei priest defending the Church from the “Da Vinci Code”, and Renzi counts bishops and priests among his friends. His wife, Agnese, has a brother who is a priest and several relatives in the Neocatechumenal Way, a Catholic movement born in Spain, and she taught catechism in their Florence parish while her husband was mayor.

Yet Renzi is also a man of the left, who has occasionally taken positions that haven’t gone down well in church circles.

He’s in favor of civil unions for same-sex couples, which is one potential looming conflict with a pope who last Sunday ominously warned that “the devil wants to destroy” the family. Renzi’s government is also backing a bill to speed up DIVORCE that has been criticized by the Italian bishops.
 
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