Thursday, September 24, 2009

Max Eldon Butler 1946-2009 - Rest in Peace


Monday 9-28-2009 UPDATE: Click here to read story behind picture to left. SOLANA SEZ:


"Instead of sticking to past glories, Mr Solana rightly suggested that the EU - and the US - should be ready to share the leadership of the world with others. Holding regular meetings of the Group of 20 (G-20), which includes both old and new global players, is clearly a good first step in the right direction. But other global governance fora, including the United Nations Security Council, also need to be reformed.

The EU needs not only to talk to Russia, China and India, but also to listen to these and other rising powers. EU policymakers may have to stop giving lessons to other nations and accept lessons based on others' experiences.

If the Lisbon treaty is ratified, the EU's global reputation will be largely influenced by the personality, interests - and wisdom - of the future and first-ever EU foreign minister. But let's not get too hung up on personalities. Without strong and credible policies, even the most charismatic EU foreign minister will not be able to impress.


To all (September 23, 2009): I just received sad words that one of my two remaining younger brothers, Max Eldon Butler, died of a sudden heart attack in Fort Wayne, Indiana, this evening. Pray for him, his wife, children, grandchildren and his remaining siblings. I am the oldest of 7. Now only 4 of us remain.

PRAY FOR ALL OF US!

Constance

Comments:
I'm sorry to hear about your loss. *Hugs*
 
Peace to you and your family. Phillipians 4:7 "And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus."
 
I am already praying for him and also that God grant your whole family the extraordinary grace to draw ever closer to him & the Church and be comforted by his Divine Real Presence during these next few weeks and encourage all of you on your own path to holiness and our ultimate goal....heaven and an eternal place of repose on his Most Sacred Heart.

Mother of Perpetual Help...pray for Max, for all of his family and pray for us. Amen.
 
We are very sorry to hear of this sadness in your family. Please accept our condolences.
 
May the Holy Spirit, our Comforter bring you peace. And may the Lord also draw the family close to Him.

Terri
 
Very sorry to hear about your loss Constance.
May the Lord give you peace and strength
at this sad and difficult time.
 
Constance - please accept my condolences for your loss. My prayer is that God will grant you His Peace, courage for the family to get through this difficut time, and hope for the future with knowledge that God holds it in His hand.
 
Constance
We sympathize with your loss and
will most assuredly support your
entire family with prayer.

Walt & LaWanda
 
My prayers are with your family. I will remember Max during the Divine Liturgy this Sunday.
 
Dear Constance,

I am truly sorry for your loss.
Please accept my heartfelt condolences and be assured that my prayers are with you and your family during this sad time.
 
Dear Constance,
I'll be praying for your brother's wife, children and grandchildren.
I'm also praying for you and your other siblings and families that you may know His comfort and unfailing love at this time.

By His Grace,
-SV
 
Dear Constance,
We are deeply saddened upon hearing of your loss. - Rudi

..."From the end of the earth will I cry unto thee, when my heart is overwhelmed: lead me to the rock that is higher than I." Psalm 61
 
Constance, I continue to pray for you and your family.--Terri

I apologize in advance if my posting is in anyway insensitive, but feel the information is very important.

I just received an email alerting me to this event:

www.islamoncapitolhill.com

Please alert your churches to be praying.
 
Constance:

I am so very sorry for your loss.

May God comfort you in your sorrow; may time heal your broken heart; and may happier memories of your brother console you.

Prayers & hugs . . .

--Rita
 
Constance, I share the sorrow you must feel in having a family member taken away from the family circle. I hope the loss will bring all of you even closer together. I'll say a prayer that it does.

Dorothy
 
May the Lord God Almighty draw near and comfort you and your family Constance.

DouginMI
 
Constance-
Praying for you and your family. May the Lord comfort you and your family.
 
Praying for you & your family Constance. May the good Lord give you all His strength and peace.
 
Dear Constance and family
May the Lord give you peace, that you can feel His loving arms around you.
To your family and the children also. We have the blessed hope in our Lord to see them again. Come lord Jesus fill us with your strength so we can ever lean on you even more than yesterday. Keep you all in prayers.
 
So very sorry for your great loss - I know how hard it is to lose a brother - I'll be praying for his family and for him as well - May our Lord Jesus Christ hold you all close to His heart...
with Love
Melinda
 
This just in vis a vis SOLANA, OBAMA, and ISRAEL - PALESTINE

"Mideast negotiators lauds Obama's initiative
(AP) – 6 hours ago
UNITED NATIONS — The Quartet of Mideast peacemakers says President Barack Obama's meetings with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas represents an important step toward the resumption of peace talks.
The Quartet — comprising the U.S., U.N., European Union and Russia — said it shared the sense of urgency expressed by Obama regarding the comprehensive resolution of the Arab-Israeli conflict.
EU foreign policy chief Javier Solana said some progress had even been made on the thorny issue of Israel's during a series of talks on the sidelines of the U.N. General Assembly.
On Tuesday, Obama summoned Netanyahu and Abbas to a joint meeting at the U.N. Obama told the two leaders that too much time had already been wasted and that it's time to resume negotiations.
Copyright © 2009 The Associated Press. All rights reserved."

http://tinyurl.com/yet8uwe
 
Constance,
Please check your email under the subject "condolences"
 
Alert: This is of great concern.

Belgium Suspends Democracy and Civil Rights Over Swine Flu Pandemic
Posted by sakerfa on September 24, 2009

The Belgian parliament yesterday voted to give the government emergency dictatorial powers under the pretext of dealing with a pandemic emergency.
Belgium is the first country in Europe to formally suspend democracy and civic rights and to switch over to military rule under the authority of a “a special crisis committee” that answers ultimately to WHO and the UN.
WHO declared a pandemic emergency level 6 in June over the “swine flu” pandemic, allowing governments to activate “emergency measures” that suspend the operation of normal government and justice.
Earlier this summer, the Belgian Health Minister Laurette Onkelinx passed a decree allowing the police to be detailed to participate in “medical emergencies” on the mass vaccination and quarantine of the population.

http://dprogram.net/2009/09/24/belgium-suspends-democracy-and-civil-rights-over-swine-flu-pandemic/
 
Constance,


I will keep your family in my prayers. May God console you at this time. My heartfelt condolences to you.


Savvy
 
I pray for Max and for all of your family who mourns him, Constance. May he be very happy in the Presence of God.

Mariel
 
My name is Gina and I am Max's daughter. Thank you all for your prayers, that is a comfort. I love you aunt Connie!!
 
Praying for God's peace and love to surround you and your family.
 
Constance,

Very difficult times, I know. May Christ be with you through this to give all assurance and comfort.

My wife pointed this out to me this evening. Has anyone heard of the Jesus Seminar or Westar Institute? New age to the core and incredibly deceptive.

http://westarinstitute.org/
 
Constance, I am sad to hear of your loss. I have offered prayers for the repose of Max's soul, and for God's aid to all of you in your family.

Lee
 
Constance,

Sorry to hear of your loss. My the Lord be with you and your family at this difficult time and be your peace.

HK
 
I have a video here that will hopefully be an encouragement for you:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSN-JJIjLMY
 
Constance, you have our condolences and sympathies! May God rest his soul.

Eternal rest grant unto him oh Lord, and let Perpetual Light shine upon him. May his soul and all the souls of the faithful departed rest in peace. Amen
 
Constance, you have our condolences and sympathies! May God rest his soul.

Eternal rest grant unto him oh Lord, and let Perpetual Light shine upon him. May his soul and all the souls of the faithful departed rest in peace. Amen
 
Internet signal from my Sprint broadband has been somewhat slower than I am normally used to -- on some sort of "substitute service" here in Northeast Indiana. Max's funeral is this morning. We will all gather together as the large Butler clan this afternoon. I plan to return to Michigan tomorrow.

I saw Patty and Bob Hunter Friday night and after church with my family on Sunday. I had the joy of helping to lead Patty out of the New Age Movement in fall of 1987. She and Bob Hunter later met and married. Bob was with
CRI of Canada. They lived in California where he worked with CRI for a number of years and then relocated with CRI to North Carolina. They came to Indiana for his ministry studies and coincidentally, it happened to be in my home town of Ft. Wayne. It was good to see them again after all these years. Shirley West set up speaking engagements for me in Fort Wayne in the 1980s. Shirley, Bob, and Patty had lunch with me yesterday. We had lots of talking and catching up to do. This weekend has been happiness mixed with tears. Thanks for everybody's understanding, prayers, and support.

Constance
 
Thanks to REFORMED for the Westar Institute link.

Interestingly (and disturbingly) enough, the Westar Institute is now located at WILLAMETTE UNIVERSITY in Salem, Oregon.

That is the alma mater of DOUG COE and where MARK HATFIELD taught when he was supposedly led to Christ by DOUG COE, his student.

Now, it was PAUL TEMPLE, who gave the financial benefits to MARK HATFIELD that led to his Senate ethics investigation and scandal in 1982.

Also, interesting, is that MARK HATFIELD's aide called BILL KEITH, one of the owners and the then president of Huntington House and threatened litigation if my book mentioned MARK HATFIELD. Senator Keith rightly told them that they could not be a public figure and NOT BE a public figure.

And the beat (religious corruption) apparently seems to go on and on . . .

Constnace
 
Constance and Reformed,

Not suprisingly Karen Armstrong shows up on their list of Fellows.
 
Attention Mariel,

Please see the very important post for you on the previous thread.
 
Funeral was this morning, family gathering this afternoon, I head back to Michigan tomorrow.

In the meantime, I just discovered BREAKING NEWS while on my brother-in-law's internet connection. Refresh your browser to read.

Constance
 
Dear Constance, I would like to repeat my sister's sentiments - you and your families "have our condolences and sympathies! May God rest his soul.

Eternal rest grant unto him oh Lord, and let Perpetual Light shine upon him. May his soul and all the souls of the faithful departed rest in peace. Amen"

Mary (Cain) Fifer and family who so much appreciate what of the New Age dangers we learned from your books and tapes of your conferences.
 
Sorry to hear about your loss, Constance. Keeping you and your family in prayer.
 
Constance,

You're family is still in my prayers.

I came across a 1961 article on the World Council of Churches and the New Age in Time Magazine.

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,873495,00.html

Savvy
 
Dear Mary Cain,

Thanks ever so much and for the reminder -- I promised to duplicate and send you the video where I spoke and was introduced by your father at St. Mary's Kansas.

Sincerely,

CONSTANCE
 
Leave to Oregon (my home state)and all their liberal leanings to be a breeding ground for new age groups. i.e. Mark Hatfield, Richard Foster of Renovare and his affiliations with George Fox University. After checking out their seminary classes, I would discourage anyone to send their kids there believing they will be "grounded" spiritually.
 
Constance, I pray you receive a large sense of God's peace and joy.
 
From a friend Ray Gano today -
community organizers pray to Obama

http://www.breitbart.tv/shock-discovery-community-organizers-pray-to-president-elect-obama

DouginMI
 
This on MSNBC today:

British girl dies after cervical cancer vaccine--Health officials halted local vaccination program; investigating death

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33070294/ns/health-kids_and_parenting/
 
To all, especially DOUG IN MICHIGAN . . . I guess this is my form of "tweeting" or "twittering." I am on my way back home. I'm sitting in the Spring Arbor Cafe, half-way home on my return journey. I plan to do my internet radio program tonight. This is a free wi-fi spot with an excellent connection and I took the opportunity to download the "pray to Obama" video. YES, it appears that was the case . . . "Deliver us Obama" and "Hear our cries, Obama"

CHILLING. I hope the president will promptly disclaim and renounce this idolatry. I would not wish upon my worst enemy the eternal post-life fate of one accepting the idolatry or knowingly offering it.

Constance
 
To my dear niece GINA:

You are greatly beloved and an asset to our family. Your poem in honor of your father and my brother which you read at the funeral was beautiful and encapsulated the feelings of all in our family.

Love,
Aunt Connie
 
To Savvy:

Can you post the Time link again on the World Council of Churches and the New Age, perhaps using the tinyurl format. The entire link did not come through and I was unable to find it.

Here is the link to tinyurl where you can paste the copied link and reduce it:

www.tinyurl.com

Thanks!

Constance
 
From the caption under the video Doug in Michigan directed us to view:


The Gamaliel National Clergy Caucus held "a New Orleans style funeral procession as they deliver a casket symbolizing the death of old ways of providing health care and pray for a new day for health care in America."

Constance
 
Dear Constance,
I read your site a lot. This is the first time I've written. I just feel so sorry to hear about you loosing a brother. I prayed for you and your family. This is so painful no words to describe the pain.

Keep up the great work you are doing.
 
Constance,

I've been out of town, so please accept my belated condolences for the passing of your brother. May God give you and your family peace in the days ahead.

Leana
 
Dear Constance,

Speaking of the Gamaliel Foundation, here is the latest gem.....

GAMALIEL FOUNDATION PRAYERS TO OBAMA

A controversy is brewing surrounding a Gamaliel Foundation video posted on Breitbart TV, which purportedly shows the group praying to Obama.

The Gamaliel Foundation is the group that helped sponsor Obama’s initial work in Chicago.

In the video, the group chants “Nobody out, everybody in,” a reference to health care reform, and delivers a casket symbolizing the death of the current health care system. They then seemingly begin chanting prayers to the president.

There is debate as to what the group is actually chanting. In the first part of the video, they seem to be saying, “Hear our cry, Obama” and “Deliver us, Obama,” however, the later chants seems to use “Oh God” and not “Obama.”

This is not the first time this disturbing trend of praising Obama in worship-like manner has come up. School children in NJ are reportedly being taught songs that praise Obama in class.

Watch the video below and judge for yourself:
........

http://renovomedia.com/politics
/gamaliel-foundation-prayers
-to-obama-video/
 
Hi Constance,

Here's the Time magazine link.

http://tiny.cc/JUizs

Savvy
 
New Muslim UN President says "Homosexuality Unacceptable"

http://www.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2009/sep/09092802.html
 
To Anonymous 9:02

If that is true, I like him better already!

Constance
 
MANY THANKS for the TIME MAGAZINE story link on "The Age of Syncretism." After reading it, dated 20 years before I knew of the existence of the New Age Movement, I am outraged. The serious church watchers had to have known this existed and yet they tried to silence me and other warners. Sir Kenneth Grubb, Norman Grubb's brother organized the WCC. Norman Grubb organized InterVarsity Christian Fellowship, "Union Life," WEC and was closely involved with Faith at Work and "Abram" Vereide, the founder of the International Christian Leadership. Indeed the truth of the apostasy was probably a thousand times worse than I had guessed back in 1981 and they undoubtedly thought I knew a thousand timesi more than I then knew.

That they put me to my very expensive proofs to even demonstrate the existence of the New Age Movement and its handmaiden, religious apostasy, outrages me to no end.

If only a court could award them sanctions -- BUT, there is a court, God's court that surely will!

Constance
 
Sudden radical changes in government will be ushered in not by people saying "I want a New Age, Globalist, anti-Christian, totalitarian government" but simply by the fact that economic hardship is becoming the norm for millions and millions of ordinary, hardworking people.

This was the catalyst the ushered in fascism, and it will also be our demise. The unemployed/under-employed/soon-to-be-unemployed is the elephant in the room.

http://charleshughsmith.blogspot.com/2009/09/unemployment-gathering-storm.html
 
vis a vis the VACCINES, just found this tid-bit from Verichip/Digital Angel regarding their latest expectations. CHILLING -- some things are worse than flu!

"Shares of VeriChip Corp (CHIP.O) tripled after the company said it had been granted an exclusive license to two patents, which will help it to develop implantable virus detection systems in humans.

The patents, held by VeriChip partner Receptors LLC, relate to biosensors that can detect the H1N1 and other viruses, and biological threats such as methicillin-resistant Staphylococcus aureus, VeriChip said in a statement.

The technology will combine with VeriChip’s implantable radio frequency identification devices to develop virus triage detection systems.

The triage system will provide multiple levels of identification — the first will identify the agent as virus or non-virus, the second level will classify the virus and alert the user to the presence of pandemic threat viruses and the third level will identify the precise pathogen, VeriChip said in a white paper published May 7, 2009.

Shares of VeriChip were up 186 percent at $3.28 Monday late afternoon trade on Nasdaq. They had touched a year high of $3.43 earlier in the session.

http://www.reuters.com/article/hotStocksNews/idUSTRE58K4BZ20090921
 
Constance,

You're welcome. Over at Israel Forum the New Age blog is being hijacked by people, including mistakenly once by me , I went off topic, who obviously do not want us to learn about the movement. This is a tough battle.

Savvy
 
Just hung up from long talk with Lee Penn. Read AND WEEP:

"http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/encyclicals/documents/hf_ben-xvi_enc_20090629_caritas-in-veritate_en.html#_edn67"

http://tinyurl.com/ycb9jcx

Would appreciate Suzanne's perspective on this. I AM DISTURBED. I am going to read and COMMENT here and probably over at NewswithViews.

From my current perspective: READ IT AND VOMIT. IT IS BLATANT! The Lord knows I have not been a Ratzinger/Benedict XVI basher, but I can see, at least from my current perspective any defense to this.

Constance
 
OK - so a really quick breeze through that link Constance makes me think it is a supportive bolster to liberation theology (?) probaly over simplfying but - am I close?

DouginMI
 
http://tinyurl.com/http-www-vatican-va-holy-fat
 
Doug,

Sorry to say it, but it looks like the whole kit and kaboodle of just about everything we have been looking at, with plans for forced global governance and redistribution blessed by the Vatican.

Constance
 
Constance,

I think I have given you my take on this encyclical before when it was criticized by Cliff Kincaid


The key statement in the encyclical is:

The Church does not have technical solutions to offer[10] and does not claim “to interfere in any way in the politics of States.”

In fact, here is what I posted previously with regard to Kincaid's article on this encyclical and I haven't changed my stand since then.

Quite frankly, IMHO, I think that Cliff Kinkaid's article indicates that he has misunderstood the Papal encyclical.

Modern Popes have learned their lessons of the past about meddling in politics and are more or less officially indifferent to the kind of political system that is in play - just so long as said political system is not guilty of human rights violations.

For example, take the statement from Kincaid's article:
____________
"Some in the media are calling it just a statement about “economic justice.” But Pope Benedict XVI’s “Charity in Truth” statement, also known as an encyclical, is a radical document that puts the Roman Catholic Church firmly on the side of an emerging world government."
________________________

If an "emerging world government" ever "emerges," the Pope is certainly not going to have any control over said "emergence" - any more than the popes of previous centuries were able to control the overthrow of the monarchies and the establishment of republics in their stead.

No. If an "emerging world government" comes into play, then the Pope is going to have to learn to deal with it as he would any other earthly government - encouraging whatever good, truth and justice it claims to represent and condemning any evils and injustices it perpetrates.

Perhaps the best thing is to read the Encyclical itself where it says(emphasis mine):
____________________________

9. Love in truth — caritas in veritate — is a great challenge for the Church in a world that is becoming progressively and pervasively globalized. The risk for our time is that the de facto interdependence of people and nations is not matched by ethical interaction of consciences and minds that would give rise to truly human development. Only in charity, illumined by the light of reason and faith, is it possible to pursue development goals that possess a more humane and humanizing value. The sharing of goods and resources, from which authentic development proceeds, is not guaranteed by merely technical progress and relationships of utility, but by the potential of love that overcomes evil with good (cf. Rom 12:21), opening up the path towards reciprocity of consciences and liberties.

The Church does not have technical solutions to offer[10] and does not claim “to interfere in any way in the politics of States.”[11] She does, however, have a mission of truth to accomplish, in every time and circumstance, for a society that is attuned to man, to his dignity, to his vocation.

Without truth, it is easy to fall into an empiricist and sceptical view of life, incapable of rising to the level of praxis because of a lack of interest in grasping the values — sometimes even the meanings — with which to judge and direct it. Fidelity to man requires fidelity to the truth, which alone is the guarantee of freedom (cf. Jn 8:32) and of the possibility of integral human development. For this reason the Church searches for truth, proclaims it tirelessly and recognizes it wherever it is manifested. This mission of truth is something that the Church can never renounce. Her social doctrine is a particular dimension of this proclamation: it is a service to the truth which sets us free. Open to the truth, from whichever branch of knowledge it comes, the Church's social doctrine receives it, assembles into a unity the fragments in which it is often found, and mediates it within the constantly changing life-patterns of the society of peoples and nations [12].


http://tinyurl.com/nhvska
 
cont....

In fact, the place where the Encyclical mentions an entity with "teeth" it is referring to the UN which, as we all know, has no "teeth."

And does anyone actually believe that the UN is in no need of reform?

The United Nations was by its very definition supposed to embody the idea of the "family of nations."

Instead, for some, it has come to embody the "oil for food" scandal!
__________________________

"67.In the face of the unrelenting growth of global interdependence, there is a strongly felt need, even in the midst of a global recession, for a reform of the United Nations Organization, and likewise of economic institutions and international finance, so that the concept of the family of nations can acquire real teeth."

http://tinyurl.com/nhvska
________________________________

LOL We can only hope that the reform of the UN will begin with the replacement of renegade suspended priest and proponent of Liberation Theology, Miguel D'Escoto. Notice Kincaid doesn't say "ex-priest," in his article but "Communist Catholic priest." In his News With Views article Kincaid writes:
_________________________

"The Pope’s shocking endorsement of a “World Political Authority,” which has prophetic implications for some Christians who fear that a global dictatorship will take power in the “last days” of man’s reign on earth, comes shortly after the United Nations Conference on the World Financial and Economic Crisis issued a call for global taxes and more powerful global institutions. U.N. General Assembly President, Miguel D’Escoto, a Communist Catholic Priest, gave a speech at the event calling on the nations of the world to revere “Mother Earth” but concluded with words from the Pope blessing the conference participants.

http://www.newswithviews.com/Kincaid/cliff329.htm
_____________________________


Not too many news articles mention the fact that Miguel D'Escoto IS A SUSPENDED PRIEST!!! The following is an article from the Catholic News Agency.
____________________________

SUSPENDED NICARAGUAN PRIEST ELECTED PRESIDENT OF U.N. ASSEMBLY

June 6, 2008/ 12:53 pm (CNA).- Suspended priest and former Sandinista leader Miguel D’Escoto Brockmann has been elected to lead the next U.N. General Assembly, beginning in September of this year.
D’Escoto has been a Maryknoll priest since 1961, and in 1975 he became involved with the Sandinista movement in Nicaragua, eventually becoming the country’s minister of foreign relations, a post he held until 1990.
He was suspended by the Vatican in the 1980s together with two other priests involved in the Sandinista revolution, Ernesto and Fernando Cardenal. During a visit to Central America, Pope John Paul II publicly reprimanded him for his political activities.
D’Escoto, who was born in Los Angeles, California, is a close advisor to the current president of Nicaragua, Daniel Ortega, and is a member of the World Council of Churches.

In 1999, then Archbishop of Managua, Cardinal Miguel Obando Bravo, criticized those priests who became involved with the Sandinistas and abandoned their priestly ministry for politics. He said the priests never denounced the injustices that took place at that time.
D'Escoto will succeed Macedonia's Srgjan Kerim in September as president of the U.N. General Assembly and will hold the position for a year.


http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/new.php?n=12862


cont....
 
Constance,

I am starting to have my doubts about Lee Penn, in some of his writings he bought up the Great Monarch theories, something shared by Catholics in the far-right occult movements, he somehow attributed them to Benedict's brand of conservatism. I don't know if his Sufi editor has some say in this. He also hit World Youth Days, claiming people from parishes did not attend them, but independent movements , this is completely false.

Savvy
 
Constance,

If you're confused I would recommend getting a copy of Catholic Evangelist, Mark Mallet's "Final Confrontation", where he talks about the Gnostic New World Order and the system that will persecute Christians.


Savvy
 
cont......

Here, Miguel D'Escoto is referred to in some very unflattering terms......
________________________

Miguel d’Escoto Brockmann Accuses Israel of Gaza -’GENOCIDE’

by sheikyermami on January 14, 2009

Winds of Jihad featured this shady character on a few previous occasions. Like here.

Brockman, this utterly corrupt Jew-hating cretin, is firmly in the Arab pocket and is one of the main-supporters of the OIC’s bill to make criticism of Islam a crime...........

.......D’Escoto, a former Roman Catholic priest and Nicaragua foreign minister, is known for his outspoken criticism of Israel and last year likened Israel’s treatment of the Palestinians to the racist apartheid system previously used in South Africa.
Gabriela Shalev, Israel’s ambassador to the UN, called d’Escoto an “Israel hater” for having hugged Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, the Iranian president and a vocal critic of Israel.
D’Escoto also said the UN had to bear some responsibility for the long-standing conflict in the Middle East as it had allowed the creation of the state of Israel in 1948, leaving the Palestinians stateless.
“You have to attack problems at their root cause and the Palestinian people have been subjected to subhuman treatment for decades and this [the Israeli offensive] is going to make matters worse.”........

http://sheikyermami.com/2009/01/14/miguel-descoto-brockmann-accuses-israel-of-gaza-genocide/
________________________________

A key word in the passage from the Encyclical I just quoted is "de facto" which means that "the interdependence of people" is something that has already occurred (i.e. a fact of history) as a result of "a world that is becoming progressively and pervasively globalized."

Apart from that, papal opinions about politics qua politics are just that - opinions.... and they do NOT - I repeat DO NOT -involve the Pope's infallibility. Papal infallibility applies strictly to official teaching in matters of faith and morals.


Again, this is what I posted on the July 8, 2009 thread.

To my knowledge nothing has changed since then.

While it is true that in the past the Catholic Church has been headed by a few corrupt "Black Popes," I would have to say that at present, unless some very convincing evidence turns up to compel me to believe otherwise, I am going to have a very hard time believing that Pope
Benedict XVI would "bless" anything that smacks of forced global governance,redistribution or ay other form of totalitarianism.

This is not to say, however, that there aren't plenty of other apostates who are currently peddling these very things in the name of "Roman Catholicism."

May God deliver us from them!
 
Susanna:

Lee Penn, a Catholic writer, whose work I do respect is extremely concerned about the papal statement, particularly the portions dealing with covenants with the environment and calling for setting up global authorities. I spent extensive time on the phone with him discussing it tonight. His concerns are real and valid. There are portions of this that could be construed as facilitating earth worship -- the forbidden line none of us must cross. (Rev. 14)

Constance
 
Savvy,

I deeply respect your work, Susanna's work and have no reason so far to disrespect Lee Penn's work. I think all of us are searching, even groping, for the truth on these issues. I know Fr. Fessio was concerned about Cardinal LaVey's appointment to Pope Benedict XVI's old job as Cardinal Ratzinger to the office of head of the CDF (Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith). Lee does have a little more tolerance for some of his Sufi friends than do I . . .

Thanks for your comments!

Constance
 
Tony Blair to head EU?

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/2663036/Tony-Blair-to-head-the-EU-within-weeks.html

or

http://tinyurl.com/y9em8td
 
Constance,

As a Catholic I have always been taught that I have a duty to practice good stewardship with regard to the way in which I use the goods of this earth - which primarily belong to God.

I have never been taught to worship the earth.

I wholeheartedly agree with you that earth worship is a forbidden line that none of us must ever cross.

I have already stated that as a Catholic, I am not required to march in lockstep with every word uttered by the Pope.

I am allowed to respectfully disagree with him when it comes to things like economic policy issues but not on issues such as abortion and euthanasia.

Here is a good article about the encyclical that hits the nail.

cont.....
 
cont...

CARITAS IN VERITATE: NOT THE LEFT'S ENCYCLICAL

Posted by Samuel Gregg
on Wednesday, July 8, 2009

It was, I suppose, inevitable. The moment Benedict XVI’s social encyclical appeared, the Washington Post, the Los Angeles Times, USA Today, and the usual suspects predictably portrayed Caritas in Veritate as a “left-wing” text. It reflects their habit of presenting the Catholic Church as “conservative” on moral questions and “liberal” on economics. That’s their script, and until the day that the Internet juggernaut deals its final death-blow to the mainstream media, they will stick to it.

Unfortunately, there has also been much misleading commentary on Caritas in Veritate from many Catholic commentators anxious to portray the encyclical in secular political terms.

This is hardly a new problem. In his diary of the Second Vatican Council, the great French Catholic theologian Henry de Lubac S.J., repeatedly expressed his frustration with the apparent inability of Catholic writers covering the Council to speak about any of Vatican II’s workings in anything but secular political language.

That said, it is difficult to describe comments about Caritas in Vertitate as revealing Benedict as being “to the left of the Democrat Party on economic issues” or “sounding like a union organizer” as anything but unsophisticated, and, frankly, rather provincial. Contrary to the expectations of many living in America’s Boston-Washington-New York self-referential hothouse, popes don’t compose encyclicals with an eye to the particulars of American domestic politics or the next election cycle.
..

cont...
 
cont....

...Anyone who has actually read Joseph Ratzinger’s many works would understand the pope has never thought that the Catholic faith neatly translates into left or right politics. To be sure, plenty of Catholics (particularly American Catholics) wish that it did. But it doesn’t and it never will, because the Catholic faith purports to contain the entire Truth about God and man. Hence it can never be compressed into earthly political categories.

This basic truth, however, has never weighed heavily with the post-Vatican II Catholic left (most of which is hovering on or over the edge of 60). For them, like the secular Left, everything is political. Hence we can expect plenty of “proof-texting” of Caritas in Veritate. Proof-texting is the art of taking statements from a text to establish the validity of particular claims, even though the text itself, when read as a whole, does not support such contentions.

Catholic leftists have, for example, emphasized the pope’s references to what he considers to be the need to bolster social security systems in the wake of globalization (CV 25). They neglect to mention, however, that Benedict has a somewhat different vision of social welfare - one that is more decentralized, less bureaucratic, and more civil society-orientated (CV 60) than the creaking state incubators of soft despotism slowly turning Western Europe into a global economic irrelevancy.

Sometimes, however, proof-texting is not enough. Hence we find Catholic leftists more-or-less ignoring Benedict’s insistence (echoing John Paul II) that life issues – specifically abortion, euthanasia, and the eugenic planning of births - are at the core of justice questions and that to ignore these specific issues is to acquiesce in enormous damage to human culture.


cont...
 
cont...

...They are also deeply unhappy with Caritas et Veritate’s repeated referencing of Paul VI’s 1968 encyclical Humane Vitae, which reaffirmed orthodox Christianity’s vision of sexual morality, because many of them have invested enormous energy over the past 41 years trying to nuance away or outright deny Catholicism’s defined teachings in these areas.

Of course Caritas in Veritate expresses plenty of prudential judgments with which Catholics on the right and left may legitimately take issue. It cannot be said enough: Catholics are free to disagree among themselves and even with the pope about those matters the Church considers prudential - which includes the overwhelming majority of economic policy-issues, but not subjects such as abortion and euthanasia — as Benedict himself affirmed in a 2004 letter to the then-archbishop of Washington D.C.

The question we should ask, however, is what the Catholic left thinks it is trying to achieve by attempting to shove a theologically-dense text into a politicized left-wing straight jacket.

It would be easy to dismiss them as the secular left’s “useful idiots”, but the root of the problem is theological. Since the 1960s, much of the Catholic left has bought into the centuries-old heresy that perfect justice can and must be realized in this world. They have also largely reduced Christianity’s content to the politically-correct justice-questions. One need only glance at many Catholic religious orders’ mission statements to gauge the accuracy of this claim.

Justice is a perennial Christian concern. But Caritas in Veritate’s very title reminds us that love and truth are even more central to the Catholic faith. “[T]he God of the Bible”, Benedict writes, “is both Agápe and Lógos: Charity and Truth, Love and Word” (CV 3). Without love and truth, the pursuit of justice degenerates into dangerous utopian agendas that trample love and truth. Ultimate justice, Benedict states elsewhere, only comes when we meet our Maker - hence, Caritas et Veritate’s repeated condemnation of utopian schemes (CV 14, 53).

Utopia, as St Thomas More knew when he gave his book this famous title, mean “no-place.” And that is where justice disassociated from truth and charity leads us: the no-place of relativism, despair, and tyranny.


http://tinyurl.com/m9oxkm
 
Susanna and Savvy:

What is particularly bothering me after my own reading of the actual encyclical (admittedly, I have to read it longer and in more depth), is the obvious

1. Call for a global management authority WITH TEETH
2. References to COVENANT WITH ENVIRONMENT and/or WITH THE EARTH.

Also, his earthly "heavenly city" message, appears to me to sharply diverge from Augustine's two cities one.

Constance
 
Constance,

The encyclical is merely offering suggestions without endorsing any specific form of government. To claim otherwise is to make the encyclical say what it clearly doesn't say - however much critics may try to claim the situation is otherwise.

As for the "earthly/heavenly city" issue, the article I just posted addresses that. Ultimate justice is not to be found here on earth, but in the next world.

But just for the sake of discussion here, let's put the issue another way.

The enclycical says:

67.In the face of the unrelenting growth of global interdependence, there is a strongly felt need, even in the midst of a global recession, for a reform of the United Nations Organization, and likewise of economic institutions and international finance, so that the concept of the family of nations can acquire real teeth."

If the "growth of global interdependence" is "unrelenting,"
this means that no one has so far been able to stop it, right?

In the face of this "unrelenting growth of global interdependence," what would you propose as a "governing authority" - if any - if you were consulted?

I personally think the UN is an irreformable, corrupt entity that ought to be scrapped. Whether or not it should be replaced with some other global governing entity or, as in the past, by nations that retain their national sovereignty and answering to no higher earthly authority is something I haven't decided yet.

I am personally not comfortable with the idea of a global power that would trump the national sovereignty of my own or other countries. But that is just my humble opinion. Others who deal with the UN directly may know things that I don't.

As for the "COVENANT WITH THE ENVIRONMENT", I am almost wondering if someone else had a hand in some of the wording of that encyclical besides Pope Benedict XVI. I would like a clarification of that terminology myself.

I can only say that as a Catholic, Christian, I have always been taught that when it comes down to survival, man must prevail over any environmental considerations.

For example, there are fields in California that have been allowed by environmentalist extremists to dry up for the sake of preserving a tiny little two-inch minnow. This a prime example of environmentalism run amok. A tiny little minnow is being given priority over human need??? Please!

FYI, Sean Hannity is keeping a close watch on the situation.

TWO INCH MONNOWS DEMOLISH CALIFORNIA FARMERS

http://blog.friendseat.com/
endangered-two-inch-minnows-
cause-trouble-for-ca-farmers/
 
P.S.

Apaprently, Constance, I am not the only Catholic who suspects that some Vatican Committee pasted this document together.

The following is from a blog hosted by a Catholic Religious Education Director named Philip Campbell from Lansing Michigan:

It is not my job or my place to pass judgment on the Holy Father's words. I do not stand to say whether this is a good or bad encyclical - I can only offer my reflections, with the understanding that they are my own private opinions and that I acknowledge that I am much more ignorant and unlearned than the Holy Father, and that therefore I am going to give him the benefit of the doubt wherever I don't understand something or something seems amiss.

Why am I issuing this disclaimer? Because I do have grave apprehension at some of the things contained in this encyclical. I also see many wonderful points as well. I have to warn you that this is a very long post, even though it will be split into two. First, let's look at the positives....


....That's enough. It's as absurd at the "Ten Commandments For Drivers." Ugghh. Well, here's what I want to ask whatever useless Vatican committee pasted this document together:

WHY ARE YOU WASTING TIME ON THIS?

The Church's mission is the promulgation of the Gospel and the salvation of souls, NOT the reform of the tourism industry and the promotion of bankrupt, European statist agendas. Where is tourism in the deposit of faith that you think you have to pontificate about it? While there are thousands of priests out there preaching heresy from the ambo, why are you levelling these weighty platitudes about environmentalism? Most importantly of all, why is this encyclical not even really mention Jesus Christ AT ALL, as if the Church's mission is to build a secular world peace? Sure, I know it talks about basing solidarity on the Gospel, but it just uses this as a segue to get into socialism, tourism and all the rest. As Fr. Divo Barsotti once said about the modern Catholic Magisterium: "In the Catholic world of our time, Jesus Christ is too often simply an excuse to talk about something else."


http://unamsanctamcatholicam.
blogspot.com/2009/07/caritas-
in-veritate-part-i.html
 
I remember vividly - an article from the Detroit Free Press on Pope JPII - stating he would be happy to be the leader of the the joined world religion but not without "teeth".
That statement has stuck with me since I read it back in 1995 I want to say.

DouginMI
 
I can't keep up here and also at other places. If anyone wants to see my latest comments, as I have no blog, check out
http://www.israelforum.com/board/showthread.php?p=309558#post309558 or http://tinyurl.com/yep3mbk

Dorothy
 
TONY Blair is set to be made the first President of Europe in weeks, The Sun can reveal.
He will be nominated by EU leaders in Brussels if, as expected, Ireland backs the hated Lisbon Treaty in tomorrow's referendum.

A senior Government source said: "If we get a 'Yes' vote it will all move very, very quickly. Tony could be named by the end of October."

Link Here-
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/2663036/Tony-Blair-to-head-the-EU-within-weeks.html

Or Here-
http://tinyurl.com/y9em8td

By His Grace,
-SV
 
Looking forward to tonights program
Hope you received book and fax.

FOTM-Walt
 
Dear Walt,

Not only that, I received the BRONX gift card and very much enjoyed using it for lunch today. With the shape office collections have been in lately, it was useful.

THANKS!
Constance
 
Netanhahu said the UN may be becoming irrelevant. On Israeli news, Arutz Sheva, I believe.
 
Dear Dorothy,
The info you shared regarding Adler and the determined New Age influence directed at Judaism is absolutely a very valuable connection.

I found your insight into the hidden agenda promoting nazism within a sect of hinduism for the purpose of anti-Semitic propagation to be discerning and well stated.

I'll take a short moment to clarify that nazism is no way, shape or form connected to true, Biblical Christianity.

A serial killer can gather himself a large following of mindless helpy-helperton killers and they can all kill in the name of their cousin George...doesn't mean that George inspired, directed, or commanded them to kill in his name.

Leviticus 19:31-34-
'Give no regard to mediums and familiar spirits; do not seek after them, to be defiled by them: I [Am] the LORD your God.'
'You shall rise before the gray headed and honor the presence of an old man, and fear your God: I [Am] the LORD.'
'And if a stranger dwells with you in your land, you shall not mistreat him.'
'The stranger who dwells among you shall be to you as one born among you, and you shall love him as yourself; for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I [Am] the LORD your God.'
This is the God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and Joseph. No true Christian would defile and disobey the commandments of the Almighty
G-d.

I am confident that we agree on this point: Nazism is nothing but hatred and pure evil. It should be revealed wherever it is found and stomped out at it's inception.

I've emphasized this point due to a particular comment you made earlier on in the forum-
"This allows a major attack on Jews to take place, making Christians feel safe being on the sidelines while the culture changes and Judaism is attacked as was done during the time of the Nazis."

A true believer who obeys the commandments of G-d will never sit on the sidelines and watch idly as demonic, maniacal dictators destroy innocent people.

I have many friends who have truly put their lives on the line to serve the Lord in the mission field. One dear family friend in particular was kidnapped, tortured (including having his finger chopped off on video -the video sent to the sponsoring mission and his family),and starved for nearly a year. He was released shortly before my father died and was insistent upon presiding over my father's funeral. As we talked together over the details of the memorial service, he continued to break down uncontrollably due to post tramatic stress syndrome. He remained here in America for a one year furlough, then traveled right back to the exact same territory, where he had been kidnapped, the following year to continue serving the Lord because he loves the Lord his G-d with all of his heart, mind, soul, and strength.

I respect the work that you are doing because it sheds light clearly and steadfastly on pure evil that can and will destroy innocent lives.

I encourage your understanding that true, obedient children of
G-d, be they Jew or Gentile, will never stand idly by, lulled into complacency, ignoring the work of the evil one. Indeed, it is a spiritual battle that will continue until the coming of the Lord.

May you be blessed by the Lord.

By His Grace,
-SV
 
SV, What I wrote about happened during the time of the Nazis when there was a big push to break Christianity away from Judaism. I don't see that happening now. Don't forget, if Constance is right the plan is to turn the three against each other. How will they turn Christians and Jews against each other is still for the future.

Dorothy
 
I'm sorry to hear of your brother's passing. I pray you grasp God's presence and peace. Dorothy
 
Dorothy,

Hindutva is pro-Israel. They also kill Christians. All it takes is people like Redcake to support them, and alieniate Christians from Israel and Jews.


Savvy
 
Sorry to hear about your loss, Constance. Praying for you & your family.

~HM
 
Dear Dorothy,
Thanks for clarifying.
New stuff for me to digest, actually, because I've never heard of Hindutva.

By His Grace,
-SV
 
SV,

Hindutva is in some ways like extremist Islam. They run schools that teach kids to glorify Hitler, take up arms, hate Christians, Muslims, China etc. They teach these kids that everything from Valentine's Day, to Communism is a Christian missionary plot. Michael Witzel, a Professor of Hinduism at Harvard University, was behind the campaign to keep Hindutva out off California state books, yeah Hindutva has many American Hindu supporters. Guess, what he was called a Hindu hater.

Savvy
 
Savvy
I think it's more complicated than you are presenting it. It appears in the Hindutva situation the Israelis are supporting it in concert with the US in a battle against Muslim and communist growth in India.

I agree with your information about the BJP and Hindutva. But in looking further into the situation, I've come across many stories like this:

http://www.countercurrents.org/sikand291108.htm

"Whether all this is indeed true needs to be properly investigated. But the fact remains that it appears to be entirely in the interest of the Israeli establishment and powerful forces in America to create instability in India, fan Hindu-Muslim strife, even to the point of driving India and Pakistan to war with each other, and thereby drag India further into the deadly embrace of Zionists and American imperialists.

"In other words, irrespective of who is behind the deadly attacks on Mumbai, it appears to suit the political interests and agendas of multiple and equally pernicious political forces—Islamist and Hindu radicals, fired by a hate-driven Manichaean vision of the world, but also global imperialist powers that seem to be using the attacks as a means to push India even deeper into their suicidal axis."

It may be a decision to fight the bigger devil.

Dorothy
 
Dorothy,

I understand the whole the enemy of my enemy is my friend senario, but do American Christians truly want to support a movement that kills it's own people. What kind of a message is this sending to persecuted Christians? American Christians would rather support the Zionist cause, than do something about Christian persecution.

It's true that some Jews might see Hindutva as the anti-dote to Islamist, Communist agendas, or even Christian missionary , but I think it's counter-productive to embrace everyone including Hitler to serve your cause.

I understand that Jews are concerned about Christians converting them, but using a Hitler movement to combat missionaries is counter-productive.

At the end of the day, Christians will have to distance themselves from all anti-Christian forces , Islamist, Communist, Hindutva etc.

Jews will have to decide what's best for them.

Savvy
 
In the past there have been repeated attempts at Hindutva activists trying to win Jews over, with anti-Christian, anti-Muslim, anti-Communist speech on IF. I exposed several of them and they ran away. Shravan is something else. I am just afraid that Israel supporting Hindutva could put a dent in Jewish-Christian relations.


Savvy
 
Savvy, there is nothing Israelis and Jews elsewhere can do about what the government is doing in Israel. I've been looking to get an idea of the extent of the cooperation between Israelis and the Hindutva movement, and other than one meetings of unnameds I've not found anything. Charges fly in India like confetti during a parade.

Let's get this straight. Israelis are not anti-Christian either in Israel or the United States. For you to suggest otherwise as you did in your last post is over the top. Messianics are another matter because of their manipulation of Judaism.

Since you are in Canada, I would suggest you contact the Canadian government and ask them to do more to expose the actions of Hindutva before you worry yourself over what Israel is doing. Here's a start if you are not familiar with it.
http://www.petitiononline.com/222002/petition.html

Dorothy
 
Dorothy,

Check out Barrallu's post on Israel and the BJP on IF. He thinks they're right because prosletyzation is evil.


Savvy
 
Savvy, I've following every post over there, including the links.

Dorothy
 
To all who have sent Condolences... Thank you, I am Maxs youngest son Todd, He was a great person and a great father to me and my siblings.
 
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