News and views of Constance Cumbey concerning "Radical Middle", New Age Movement, Communitarianism, "planetary humanism," "global governance," European Union, Javier Solana, Jeremy Rifkin, "New Age Politics," law in the USA, combined with life in general -- sometimes humorous, sometimes not!
Occupiers Urinate on Cross, Throw Bible - Occupy Wall Street - Fox ... nation.foxnews.com/occupy.../occupiers-urinate-cross-throw-bible 5 days ago – Members of the Occupy Wall Street movement urinated on a cross, desecrated a church and threw Bibles at police officers in separate incidents ... 'Occupiers' Throw Bibles, Allegedly Urinate on Cross | FOX News ... radio.foxnews.com/.../occupiers-urinate-on-cross-throw-bibles.html 5 days ago – Members of the Occupy Wall Street movement urinated on a cross, desecrated a church and threw Bibles at police officers in separate incidents ... Occupiers Urinate on Cross, Throw Bible - Political Forum www.politicalforum.com › General Political Chat › Current Events 100+ posts - 10 authors - 5 days ago Occupiers Urinate on Cross, Throw Bible Members of the Occupy Wall Street movement urinated on a cross, desecrated a church and threw ... DISGUSTING! Obama Endorsed "Occupy" Movement Urinates On A ... maroonedinmarin.blogspot.com/.../disgusting-obama-endorsed-occu... 5 days ago – Obama Endorsed "Occupy" Movement Urinates On A Cross, Throws Bibles At Cops. Just when you thought the Obama/DNC endorsed ... Occupiers' Throw Bibles and Alledgedly Urinate on Cross ... https://newsdeskinternational.wordpress.com/.../occupiers-throw-bibl... 5 days ago – Occupiers' Throw Bibles and Alledgedly Urinate on Cross ... The Occupy Wall Street movement has a history of participants urinating and ... Okay to Urinate on Cross, but Not on Taliban godfatherpolitics.com/.../okay-to-urinate-on-cross-but-not-on-taliban... 2 days ago – But where is the public outrage against members of the Occupy movement who throw Bibles, steal church property and urinate on crosses? Moonbattery » Unholy Occucommies Throw Bibles at Police, Steal ... moonbattery.com/?p=7193 4 days ago – Unholy Occucommies Throw Bibles at Police, Steal Holy Relic, Urinate on Cross ... of the Occupy Wall Street movement — throwing Bibles at the police… ... an occupier urinated on a cross, according to Rabbi Chaim Gruber, ... 'Occupiers' Throw Bibles, Allegedly Urinate on Cross, page 1 www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread801024/pg1 17 posts - 9 authors - 5 days ago Members of the Occupy Wall Street movement urinated on a cross, desecrated a church and threw Bibles at police officers in separate incidents ... Bloodthirsty Liberal » Occupy Movement bloodthirstyliberal.com/?cat=1019 5 days ago – Members of the Occupy Wall Street movement urinated on a cross, desecrated a church and threw Bibles at police officers in separate incidents ... NYC 'Occupy' Protesters Accused of Stealing Church Property ... www.christianpost.com › US 4 days ago – Protesters connected with the New York "Occupy Wall Street" (OWS) ... NYC 'Occupy' Protesters Accused of Stealing Church Property, Urinating on Cross ... Michael Ellick of Judson Church, who is a supporter of the Occupy movement, and Rev. .... Fulfilling the Great Commission One Bible at a Time.
The "churches" in Detroit helping the Occupy Movement are definitely New Age centers also fervently helping the LGBT movement, i.e. in Detroit Central United Methodist Church. The nightly meetings for the Occupy Movement were held there and it was backup housing for the demonstrators.
ALSO, this just in. The OCCUPY movement people just tried to take over the Davos WEF meeting. That will give impetus to the other side of their dialectic: GLOBAL GOVERNANCE!
As if the bankers that Occupy are protesting against aren't themselves globalists?! Economics was the very first thing that went global, because trade is worldwide.
Bankers or Occupiers? Neither of the above, thank you.
The federal government decision last week on insurance coverage for contraceptives in the United States has been widely condemned.
Under the new health care law passed by Congress it was left to the Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) to decide which institutions would be exempted from having to pay for contraceptives under their health plans.
Last Friday the HHS announced that while churches would not have to pay for contraceptives other associations linked to churches, such as schools, hospitals and charitable agencies would not have any exemption.
The only concession offered was to allow employers extra time, until August 2013, to comply with the law: a concession that some observers noted conveniently pushes the obligation beyond the next elections.
“I believe this proposal strikes the appropriate balance between respecting religious freedom and increasing access to important preventive services,” declared the HHS Secretary, Kathleen Sebelius, in a press release announcing the decision.
A position not shared by many others who in the succeeding days expressed their views on the matter.
The occupiers are demanding exactly the SAME global system they think they are protesting against. On one hand they protest the World Economic Forum and World Bank while on the other their demand for "Earth Community" is the product of the same organizations.
Marko, what is documented is that they call for a global community, which is just another KIND of globalism. Also, there is 1% money back of them, most likely the plan is to use them as the excuse for martial law.
Chairman Mao had a concept let the flowers bloom together - so once people were out in the open they could be cut down. Any tendency to converge against the banksters could be used to determine who to send to detention camps later.
This scheme is likely to fail, because the USA is so large, geographically, it can absorb almost any level of violence without a serious threat to the government or society at large. This I figured out a long time ago, and someone in German govt. or police or whatever said the same thing some years later, when asked why they don't allow wierdo cults much or any overt Nazis, what about freedom? the answer, Germany is too small. USA can have the luxury of tolerating its militias and nazis and scientologists, because it is large enough a putsch can't take it down. Germany is too small geographically to be playing from such a strong hand.
While I was initially sympathetic to Arab Spring and Occupy, increasingly it is obvious that the trend of their intent and effects are bad. The Arab Spring merely puts muslim extremists in charge, because the people are attracted by them. Also, the results of overthrow of various secular and not so secular moslem regimes has been bad for Christians regular and nestorian and monophysite heretical alike.
Lindsay Williams, who has an inside track with elitists in the oil segment because of some personal history accidents (or Providence?) says that years ago it was in the works to overthrow all the Arab monarchies and other governments, incl. Iran and Saudi Arabia, my guess is that the reason why is that the military industrial complex and other elements in bed with each other (incl. increasinly apostate charismatic evangelicalism) want a recognizeable moslem enemy for a clash of civilizations.
Also, any hidden anti Christian feeling would be served by these events.
The irony of the Occupy desecrating the Bible and so forth, is that The Bible has a LOT to say against the 1%
The spiritual globalists (ie, New Agers of Occupy) have fallen out with the material globalists (people who run the world financial system). We can agree with each's view of the other while disagreeing with each's view of itself.
I share your scepticism that Occupy is tightly coordinated, rather than a bunch of people having similar views. The main smoking gun that would change my mind is proof that Occupants worldwide are receiving financial subsistence from - when the links are followed upward - a single source. All else is BS as I think you would agree.
"The main smoking gun that would change my mind is proof that Occupants worldwide are receiving financial subsistence from - when the links are followed upward - a single source. All else is BS as I think you would agree."
Actually, you don't need that. if for instance 3 primary sources existed, who were all in agreement with each other, that would be the same thing.
A lot of course is spontaneous, like the Illuminati model of a world without institutions or govt. or religion or anything, just the masses ruled by the manipulators.
One would need to identify who the initial moves for all this and who have the most credibility so tend to be listened to the most are and who THEY are answering to.
One might argue that a single case of such being in a 1% family would be a renegade, but more than that would be suspect.
Now in a setup like this, any element can hijack the whole thing, especially given the fact that the people the masses of today are heavily infected with ideas that are nonsensical, new agey or whatever.
yes, good analysis, that the financial materialist side of the new age and spiritual side of the new age movement are having a falling out.
Perhaps if the spiritual new age side can be made to understand that the materialist side is pulling their strings, and that the spirits leading the spiritual side are the same leading the materialist side, they might drop the both.
I posted the Anonymous 6:27 PM comment. Constance posted my Occupy piece two posts ago. There are links to Occupy demands in there. Their demands include what they are supposedly protesting yet they turn right back around and demand the initiatives which those they claim to oppose have formulated.
I realize the article is long but it is impossible to condense a global revolution into one page. Many will not have the attention span to read it.
There is more than enough evidence in that post to support what I've said.
As I've written, we have the proof of the origins of "Earth Community". We know the origins of World Bank's "Earth Community" traces to the Club of Rome. We know that "Earth Community" being demanded by Occupy is tracable to the same. The proof has more than adequatly been provided.
I hadn't heard that this incident had happened until I came to the blog today, and honestly when I read it- I didn't feel upset or offended.. I felt sad. Sad for those who are in spiritual darkness, who refuse to love the truth. I know God loves those people so very much, and although it may seem pointless, I am going to pray for eyes to be opened to the fact that this movement is not the answer, it is not good, and it has much more going on than meets the eye.
Constance Cumbey said... Yesterday, according to USA TODAY, Oakland, California police arrested 300 Occupy Movement protesters.
OAKLAND (AP) – About 300 people were arrested Saturday during a chaotic day of Occupy protests that saw demonstrators break into City Hall and burn an American flag, as police earlier fired tear gas and bean bags to disperse hundreds of people after some threw rocks and bottles and tore down fencing outside a nearby convention center.
By Michael Macor, AP Oakland police deploy smoke and tear gas to stop protesters with the Occupy Oakland camp as they march through downtown Oakland on Saturday. Enlarge By Michael Macor, AP Oakland police deploy smoke and tear gas to stop protesters with the Occupy Oakland camp as they march through downtown Oakland on Saturday. Dozens of police officers remained on guard outside City Hall around midnight following the most turbulent day of protests since November, when Oakland police forcefully dismantled an Occupy encampment. An exasperated Mayor Jean Quan, who faced heavy criticism for the police action last fall, called on the Occupy movement to "stop using Oakland as its playground." "People in the community and people in the Occupy movement have to stop making excuses for this behavior," Quan said.
Showing the boldness of the Movement as well as its anti-clerical nature, this last week:
One snippet of news from Italy that seems to have been overshadowed by the Italian cruise liner disaster is the recent incursion of the Occupy movement into St Peter’s Square. Some Indignados, as they are known, who are mainly Spanish and French, tried to set up a camp in the piazza, but were ejected by the police, writes Fr Alexander Lucie-Smith in the Catholic Herald.
One of the protestors climbed the Christmas tree (which will be in place until 2nd February, feast of the Presentation), and had to be forcibly removed from it.
The police who removed the protestors were not the Swiss Guard, nor the Vatican gendarmes, but the Italian police. The piazza is Vatican territory, but it is policed, by long standing arrangement, by the Italian forces of law and order. The action of the police was fully supported by the Vatican itself.
As Fr Federico Lombardi is reported to have said: “Considering the actions undertaken and the language used, these Indignados evidently wanted to use the piazza in an improper way, not in keeping with the spirit of the place and it was therefore considered just and opportune to move them out with the co-operation of the police.”
I just finished your piece. It is quite long, but well-researched, and ties a lot of things together. (I wish you had more time to write pieces like that!)
At first I balked at the idea that people could hold to a contradiction like you suggested, but many are ignorant of what is going on in the world, and would probably be shocked and upset at such a revelation.
I wonder if there's a way to sow dissent among the Occupy ranks by getting some of your research into the right hands.... ;^)
I still remain skeptical of the "dialectic argument" to explain everything in the world, especially regarding the idea that the power struggle between East and West is being controlled by powerful elites who benefit from it. Wars and conflicts happen because of the vices of humanity, and perhaps even because God made it that way at Babel. We will never be a united world, until Christ comes and places all enemies under His feet, although the largest attempt for it in human history will be made near the end.
The only way that world government can even be attempted is if enough ties to the past can be severed by erasing the knowledge and understanding of our history as a human race. Many important severances have occurred within my lifetime, I believe.
Here is an interesting analysis by Nyquist on that topic (as you know by now, I read lots of Nyquist, and although I don't agree with everything he says, he is quite astute in his observations of history):
I find it interesting that the Occupy Chicago event being called for this spring is taking place on May Day (May 1st), a traditional "Workers of the World" (read: Communist) day of celebration.
This, in my understanding of the world, links the Occupy movement to the Communist side of things.
But, perhaps the Communists and their fellow travelers are becoming a part of the "Old World Order" and something new and even more dangerous is taking the reigns of rising tyranny. More dangerous because there is a strong spiritual element involved.
This is what Constance has long held - that the Communists can't be a long-term threat because the Bible talks about the world "worshiping" the Beast, and there is no worshiping among atheists. Although, in a sense, they worshiped what Arthur Koestler and five others referred to as "The God That Failed" in a collection of essays by people who left the Communist side.
Ending on a note of pessimism, I recall that Whittaker Chambers left the Communist side for what he felt was the losing side - The West.
I think we are going to enter a period soon where his pessimism will seem to have been well-grounded.
The same reason you balked is probably the same reason I am so infuriated with the leadership behind this “leaderless” Movement. I am not without compassion for many of the Occupiers who have good reason to protest. These same people are being duped and used as pawns.
My observations are that many participants in this Movement are normally hard working people who now find themselves unemployed. They are not just “deadbeats” as some would suggest. While the organizations that helped bring about this economic mess received taxpayer bailouts and reward their executives with huge bonuses, those suffering as a result their actions are finding their homes foreclosed upon because they cannot find jobs.
Repeatedly I’ve told people I don’t disagree with many of the Occupiers complaints, but those professing to speak for the 99 percent really do not speak for the majority of us. I also don’t approve of their class warfare tactics and demonization of those who are successful.
What makes this Movement so dangerous is that its true intent remains hidden.
Jenna, Jonah was in the belly of the whale, ( the depths of despair), when he came to this conclusion, and God made the whale vomit him out and gave Jonah his second chance:
" They that observe lying vanities forsake their own mercy."
Maybe these Occupy people are mostly of a chemically poisoned generation. I listen to various audios on the poisons which infect our environment to an increasing extent, many of which have especial danger to babies in the womb or newborns. Except for those few whose parents DID try to get them clean food, these younger people have been eating and drinking toxic food for more than a generation. Including Growth Hormone milk. Here in my town, people are mostly scientists by profession, and they are not overly given to "organic" (although we have a new organic store which is thriving). But the mothers have demanded milk free of Growth Hormone for many years, in the ordinary supermarkets, and now one can buy many other organic products there. I believe overweight as well as "acting out" can come from bad food and from giving too many immunizations at one time, which is routinely done now. Here in my town the kids at least have an option to have mercury free flu shots. There is little agreement on this, but I believe it is a major factor in "Occupy". They are not only "mad" but they are "physically mad" from eating and drinking bad stuff for a generation or two. This probably won't make a lot of sense to many here, as they'll say, well, the Occupy people are probably Greens, over-emphasizing environment. God did tell us to take care of the earth until He showed up again, so I think we have a mandate to be Green, although not superficially or unreasonably so.
obviously there are some fatuous new age type solutions presented in this, and frankly while we who look at the hidden side of things, like Cumbey and conspiracy theorists and deep politics analysts do, a kind of change in consciousness is going on, making us less controllable, the plain fact is that no such changes as blathered about by Icke and others have any use against reptilian brain dominated corporatocrats.
The solution is, to disempower them. Gut the corporations' status as a legal person. Prosecute some people who are normally untouchable. etc. contemplating your navel, or voting Republican who are bought and paid for by these people, won't do it, and voting New Age sure won't do it, more like promote it, because what the reptilian brain element want is us contemplating our belly buttons and thinking our reality is different than it is because we think it is, while they work on borgifying us.
New Age of the spirituality type in opposition to New Age of the materialist type, in fact is in its service. But some important information is in this movie.
The solution is not to change our consciousness in the sense talked about, but change our consciousness in the sense of - stop seeing those banksters as untouchable and push for prosecution of those that have in fact broken some laws, and yes, that is in the works to some minor extent now.
take note of the part about the revolving door between corporations and govt. like Cheney and Halliburton (who gained from every war the Bush dynasty got us into). That is in the part after the second ad. Now take a closer look at that, in other sources.
take note of the part about the revolving door between corporations and govt. like Cheney and Halliburton (who gained from every war the Bush dynasty got us into). That is in the part after the second ad. Now take a closer look at that, in other sources. alex constantine (ignore his across the board progessive bias look at his data) is a good start. there are many links on my blog at the right in the link list that can be pursued, go to the articles, and pursue with links in articles or using google for still more information.
"Newt Gingrich has just announced he plans to run for President in 2012. And a whole bunch of undiscerning “Conservatives” and “Christians” might just well back him. The entire affair will be to the utter delight of New Age strategists and global planners who well consider Newt Gingrich an indispensable part of their apparatus."
actually, the GOP has been doing more to promote the NWO than the dems.
and yes, any Christian who thinks that lipservice to morals and to rejecting abortion (something Family of Secrets shows was arranged for a Shrub girlfriend, nothing unusual among the respectable eager to keep respectability and all their sovereign individual options without reference to anything beyond themselves), and membership in the Republican Party makes the candidate a good Christian and proper leader, will vote for him.
Speaking of undiscerning Christians Christine, you bomb this blog with links to some of the most new age BS and defend it as good material. I haven't yet decided whether you are undescerning or peppering the blog with links intended to guide people down the wrong path.
I do, as always, appreciate your intelligence and contributions. However, I'm receiving complaints that your sheer volume is scaring others away. Sometimes fewer words have greater impact. Sometimes a picture or a link is worth a thousand words! I don't want to ration anybody's contributions.
AS TO ALL,
There is "collapse comments" feature." If you want to skip somebody's comments, i.e., Anonymous, etc., that can be used without violence to somebody's desire to express oneself.
I think your real problem is you don't like anti Republican
FACT: they are not what they pretend to be. They are materialist new Age to the core Reagan and wife were semi occultists, promoted make believe haze and enchantment in his style and speaking.
FACT: The Bible is as against the 1% as against some of Occupy stuff.
FACT: There is no rapture except to greet The Lord at His return AFTER the tribulation. Rapture doctrine UNHEARD OF BEFORE 1800s and helped by proto New Age organizations
FACT: I have had some extremely odd experiences, and learned that certain things like the sign of the Cross made with faith and precision and intent and Holy Water work against them. Some of the wierdest involved physical effects which prove (a) energy feed vampirism is real when I was the target, and (b) New Age info on the "energy body" is DEAD WRONG (energy system is part of the soul, which term in Hebrew covers both immortal and interface between body and soul and body and spirit as continuum as well as a distinct element in that continuum, and validated by Ecclesiastes 12, but again the New Age info is as wrong on that as it is on "consciousness")
FACT: once you begin looking at the sort of things Cumbey uncovers, if you keep looking you will find stuff invalidating BOTH parties and a lot of American as well as unAmerican values as well.
FACT: all govt. intervention is not harmful, without govt. involvement intrepreneurs would not have gotten anywhere as much done.
FACT: America has been fascination with the occult back to early times. Earlier The Enlightenment was a major attack on Christinaity, ditto masonry occult conspiracy against Christianity before Besant AND CHURCHES HAVE BEEN INFILTRATED WITH MASONRY, INCL. THE BAPTIST CHURCHES. Very few will excommunicate for being masons.
FACT: Pentecostal/Charismatic movement is infected from the start especially because of unbiblical emphasis on "tongues" mishandling Scripture, and "waiting for The Spirit," a mediumistic sort of misapplication of Scripture about a one time only event in the past. God may have used some of these people to get your attention on Jesus, but you need to get away from all this.
GOOGLE KUNDALINI AND CHARISMATIC TOGETHER, Then ask yourself why these people are so whole hog hypnotized by the Republithugs. The Dummycrooks are no better.
FACT: both parties are financed by pretty much the same people. public stance on morals/religion mean nothing as long as the people who own them get their way.
FACT: the first or maybe second political party we had, was the anti masonic party. We need another one only a bit more fine tuned, and aiming at the more complex New Age of both materialist and spiritual forms. All the "third parties" now are jokes or bad in their own right.
when all branches of govt are staffed by people with loyalties that transcend their offices, and they all collaborate, you NO LONGER HAVE CHECKS AND BALANCES.
FACT: The Bible read cover to cover in a short period of time so you don't get a piecemeal effect, 4 months maximum, will show you no one form of government or economic theory that God unreservedly endorses, other than the monarchic rule of His Son when He comes back.
FACT: as shown by Cumbey and Herescope, there is an appalling similarity between the eschatology of the New Age and the eschatology and ecclesiology of the charismatic new apostles, etc. etc. teachers, which should tell you something right there.
St. Paul speaks of being puffed up and made emptier, and entering into visions which you have not seen.
FACT: There is a VERY uncomfortable similarity between the USA and Babylon the Great.
FACT: St. Peter in one of his epistles says we should live in sobriety as well as godliness in expectation of Christ. "sober and godly" doesn't incl. running around in a blissed out state, that you think is the Holy Spirit, but leaves you open to all sorts of influences and ideas without discernment, inhibits you from testing spirits or ideas, and hardly differs from drugs or New Age consciousness warping exercizes effects, and ends up with talking with spirits that are never tested, accepting blindly whatever nonsense is presented in dreams visions or statements from departed relatives about having the resurrection body in heaven, which is a lie because that is a PHYSICAL body we get later when brought to life again by Jesus Christ at His Second Coming, or transformed into that condition if still alive when He comes back, praying by concentrating on the person prayed for instead of on God, not to mention other false prophecies and then making excuses.
It doesn't matter a ministry denounces occultism of obvious sort, if they promote styles of prayer and worship that cause trances states and wild behavior
Sure some of these people may be able to cast out demons, but that is about the power of Jesus Name, not their own holiness, note Jesus' warnings about some such at the Last Judgement in Matthew 25 I think it is "did we not cast our demons and do miracles in Your Name?" they ask and He answers "depart from Me, I have not known you workers of iniquity."
And maybe the reason they have to do so much exorcism, is because they and their followers and the people who come to them from similar contexts are doing something that attracts demons in the first place.
FACT: some of the manifestations such as at IHOP and others, involve symptoms and sequences that parallel the awakening of the so called kundalini energy in tantric hinduism and New Age borrows from it. That cannot be a good sign.
I could hardly believe my eyes when I read the following:
WALL STREET OCCUPIERS URGED TO TARGET CHURCHES
Franky Schaeffer is the son of the late, highly influential evangelical thinker Francis Schaeffer, who helped shape the modern conservative evangelical movement. The son boasts he was himself a co-founder of the Religious Right. But he since has denounced Christianity as “stupid,” writes bitter tell-all books about his parents, and ferociously attacks conservative religionists as the virtual root cause of all American evils. A blogger for The Huffington Post, young Schaeffer is now faulting religious conservatives for facilitating Wall Street greed. He’s imploring the Wall Street Occupiers to “protest the root source of America’s tilt to the far unregulated corporate right.” For Schaeffer, the next logical step is to demonstrate “outside mega churches, Evangelical publishing houses, [and] religious organizations that lead the ‘moral’ crusades against women and gays and all the rest.”....
.....Ecumenically, Schaeffer also tars Roman Catholics as likewise “fundamentalists” who have “delegitimized the US Government and thus undercut its ability to tax, spend and regulate.” So Catholic bishops, like evangelical mega churches, have also tricked their followers into voting against their “own class and self-interest.”...read entire article...
No Christine, my criticism have nothing to do with Republicans. It has everyting to do with the junk you pass off and don't get called on.
I can hardly believe that you get away with passing off David Icke's Reptilian Agenda and then defend it as credible and not get corrected by this community.
This blogging community is sliding down from the standards it once held.
We try to logically assail Christine's arguments, and are met with subtle parries and dodges that never address our concerns and objections, and at the same time flood the comments with even more that needs assailing, so at some point you have to just stop throwing pearls in that direction...
Constance,
My objection to Christine's verbosity is not based upon the volume but the content. It is also based upon the fact that she has her OWN blog, but chooses instead to take over this one.
Occupy protesters attempt to occupy Vancouver cathedral as attacks on Christianity mount
by Thaddeus Baklinski Wed Nov 02, 2011
VANCOUVER, November 2, 2011 (LifeSiteNews.com) - On Sunday morning a break-away faction of the Occupy Vancouver movement tried to occupy the city’s Holy Rosary Cathedral during morning Mass.
Several dozen protesters, calling themselves ‘Occupy the Vatican’, were halted when Archbishop Michael Miller requested a police presence, and were stopped again later in the day by police and members of the Knights of Columbus.
The incident highlights a trend by some in the anti-corporate protest movement to use it as a launching pad for attacks on Christianity and the Catholic Church in particular.
Most infamously, on October 15th, members of the Occupy Rome protest entered a Roman Catholic Church and destroyed a statue of the Virgin Mary.
The effort to occupy the church in Vancouver comes after a call on October 13th by former Evangelical leader Frank Schaeffer for the Occupy movement to begin targeting Evangelical and Roman Catholic churches...read entire article...
"I can hardly believe that you get away with passing off David Icke's Reptilian Agenda and then defend it as credible and not get corrected by this community."
You got a serious literacy and comprehension problem.
The film started off with a repudiation of it, and shifting focus onto our own damn selves, and what scientists call the reptillian brain, a small segment deep in the brain that deals in the kind of behavior and priorities the film discusses.
It goes on to look at such behavior o the part of elites and suggests that they have that segment of the brain in control.
It touches on several matters, and deteriorates into a New Age rant, totally missing the point that no popular change in consciousness or attitude is going to matter, it is only insofar as those in elected and defacto but unelected and unaccountable power change their attitude, OR
we get to work deligitimizing them and yanking the rug out from under them both in terms of law and of view held of them and their values.
BTW, I suspect that Icke is (a) onto something but doesn't realize what it is, that some people MAY be interfaced to or overshadowed by demons, and sensitives misinterpret sudden noticing of this as seeing a shapeshift, and (b) a double agent of sorts, since he advocates the same kind of blissing out New Age stuff that makes you a good cog in the borg machine in the first place.
you need to wade through a lot of muck to pick out gems. disinformation invariably contains a lot of truth, sometimes 90% truth, either with a ringer thrown in to get you off a productive line of research and onto an wrong line, or so packaged that it looks ridiculous and discredits all interest in it.
"A blogger for The Huffington Post, young Schaeffer is now faulting religious conservatives for facilitating Wall Street greed. He’s imploring the Wall Street Occupiers to “protest the root source of America’s tilt to the far unregulated corporate right.” For Schaeffer, the next logical step is to demonstrate “outside mega churches, Evangelical publishing houses, [and] religious organizations that lead the ‘moral’ crusades against women and gays and all the rest.”"
Schaeffer has part of it right, but is dead wrong on buying into the gay agenda and abortion "rights." It is sad that so many with some insight, swallow the progressive package lock stock and barrel, instead of separating the distinct issues.
It is also a bad idea to encourage Occupy protests at churches, because most of them will not make any distinction between The Faith and its corruption and corruptors, and as we have just seen, attack the symbols and text of The Truth, which has been as desecrated by its misuse by the corrupt megachurches and evangelical charismatic right wing greediocrats, as it now was by the OWS.
"We try to logically assail Christine's arguments, and are met with subtle parries and dodges that never address our concerns and objections,"
really? I haven't noticed much logic with a few exceptions. Just assumptions of the package deal thinking sort that is the same way the left thinks, if this then that even though they are unrelated issues. My remarks come from 40 years of reading and some experience and observation of patterns. And 3 Bible readthroughs in 3 or 4 months each.
in deference to Constance and to legit concerns about too much verbiage, I am not posting any more on this thread. too much verbiage can make attention deficit types (I sometimes fit this myself) unable to follow an argument or process information anyway.
BTW - The End Game Global Conspiracy video Christine so fondly promoted is the product of new ager Jim Nichols a follower of the Pleaidian Agenda. Nichol's web site promotes the new agers such as Shirley Maclaine. Do the research Christine. Or have you already and you're objective has been to mislead all along?
"This film doesn't repudiate the new age it bolsters it. You are either thick in the skull or have a lying tongue." well, I have to answer this one.
YOU are thick or weak headed or lying.
I NEVER said it repudiated the New Age. I said it repudiated the shape shifting reptillian story of David Icke, and turned attention on our own internal reptillian qualities as the problem.
In this, it may in fact be supporting original sin, though it doesn't know it.
And that it provides important key information about stuff going on strictly material human stuff in the world.
read more carefully and stop bearing false witness.
Christine, "I NEVER said it repudiated the New Age. I said it repudiated the shape shifting reptillian story of David Icke"
YOU are WRONG about that too. It bolsters David Icke's reptillian theory or haven't you taken time to learn that either. David Icke's Reptilian theory is found throughout the Pleaidian Agenda. Now why would one who supports the Pleaidian Aganda contradict David Icke (which he doesn't). I would suggest you acquint yourself with the Pleaidian doctrines then come back and argue this when you have some knowledge to fall back on.
"BTW, I suspect that Icke is (a) onto something but doesn't realize what it is"
FACT: David Icke professed to be the messiah. Is he onto something there too?
And why would you be passing off new age BS as gospel and then when called on it defend it to high heaven? You are filled with confusion and trying to pass it along to others.
I wish I could quote, in order, Revelations 12, 13, 14 and 15, but it would take up too much space here. So, a brief very synopsis: In Revelations 12 we see a woman clothed with the sun. Most Bible scholars agree that she is the Church of true believers. Then there is Satan ( red dragon ), who, in short, tries to overthrow the true church and the true faith. He is defeated by the angels. In Revelations 13 we see the "beast" , who is the Antichrist and his "religion" who gets his power from the dragon. And we see the "little horn", who is the "False Prophet" , but who could also be called the "False Holy Ghost", all of which shows us a false trinity, which is a devilish but accurate picture of the fact of the Trinity, or what perhaps should be called a Triunity, ( thank you Joyce ). In chapter 14, we see the 144,000 from the tribes of Israel, who preach the everlasting Gospel to the Tribulation world. We see Babylon the Great fall, and in verses 15 and 16 we see the harvest of the earth. Don't forget that Jesus is the Vine and we are the branches. In chapter 15 we see a sea of glass, before the throne of God, which is the collective millions of believers in Jesus through all the centuries of grace, AFTER WHICH in chapter 16, the wrath of God is poured out in full measure on the earth.
So Christine aka Justina, you have no right (or write) to claim that the Rapture of the saints, also known as the "blessed hope", and the great Translation of the saints, which is foreshadowed by Noah, and Enoch, and Methuselah, and Ezekiel, and John the Revelator ("come up here"), is somehow a complete falsehood and say: in capital letters, "FACT", that it is not true ! The only thing that bugs me about you is the way you attempt to speak with authority about every wind of new doctrine which comes blowing down the pike. You have itchy ears. You even have the audacity to contradict a PhD in Physics on a scientific subject ! You're not the only one who's read the entire Bible through, Do it again, and you might pick up some humility.
heheh, I suppose she is not a teen-ager anymore, but I am reminded of a sign my aunt hung in her house when she had a teen-ager- I wish I were a teen-ager, too, so I would know everyhting.
One of the funniest things I ever saw on TV was a confrontation between David Icke and a Jew who was 100% convinced that when Icke said giant reptiles disguised as human politicians were taking over the planet, Icke actually meant Jews but wasn't prepared to say so.
This is the physicist mentioned in one of the posts on this thread, and this time I would like to agree with Christine about the timing of the Rapture. The relevant scriptures refer to the supernatural flight to Jerusalem, for the small number of believers alive on the earth at the end of the Great Tribulation, to join Jesus Christ and his resurrected faithful as they descend to earth at His Second Coming.
I regard the pre-Tribulation Rapture as a false prophecy, of "peace when there is no peace" (to quote Jeremiah). It could only have caught on in a Western church which had forgotten what it is like to suffer for Christ. All scriptures held to refer to a pre-trib timing are highly ambiguous. And why does Jesus make no mention whatsoever of a pre-tribulation rapture in the Olivet discourse, in which he gives the detailed sequence of events leading up to His return?
To Christine @ 9:11 PM: Re: "I am not posting any more on this thread." ___________________________________
Well, since you very condescendingly regard us as 'attention deficit types' and also 'unable to follow an argument or process information'....I'm sure that we fall far short of your very superior (NOT) intellect.
Either way, dear - don't let the blog door hit you on the way out.
Anonymous 2:42 I strongly believe that the correct position is MID Tribulation. The woman in Rev.12 is given a place to hide for 3.5 years. Daniel speaks of 3.5 years in three different ways. He mentions it in days, weeks and years. Mid Tribulation is pre-wrath, as we can see from Rev. 14 when the " harvest of the earth" takes place.
So if as you say the Christian world is divided on the subject; either end-tribulation or pre-tribulation, then the average of the two is perfect. The revealing of the Anti-Christ is exactly at the mid tribulation point. And that's the point at which the Christians are removed, and "taken out of the way".
If you do not take the rapture to be a few seconds before Christ's Second Coming in glory then we differ about that, which should be perfectly possible for believers to do in love; but I also think we might be using some words differently, so let's try to clear up misunderstanding. I believe there will be a recognisable 7-year run-up to Christ's return, with the Great Tribulation comprising the 2nd half of that and lasting 3.5 years. I don't call the whole of that 7 years the Tribulation.
daily praise and worship of our good Lord, givivg thanks, and seeking His perfect will in our lives thru His orchestrared guidance,......thats the ticket! lead us not into temptation and deliver us from evil. draw us close unto you oh Lord, and keep us where you are/ strenghten us and give us wisdom. Fill us with your Holy Spirit Lord n teach us to fully Love one another. Give us REVIVAL, amen. tony/ vt. use us Lord n teach us to serve one another your way.
i got sunshine, in my stomach...like i just rocked my baby to sleep. Wishing for us all, the peace that surpasses all understanding. Praying for this now in Jesus name, amen
Let us shoot for world wide REVIVAL, now, in Christ Jesus, amen. Give it to us Lord, please. Give us unobstructed power from above, and shape it for Your purpose Fully Lord. Give us the real thing Father,...make a powerful move on our lives,...orchestrate Lord, guide us
Anon 4:42 Christians are the salt of the earth. If you take away the salt, the infection, ( sin ) spreads unimpeded, and rot quickly sets in. It's the revealing of the Antichrist, AND the removal of the Christians, along with the Holy Spirit in and among them, which is what's holding all the evil back, that begins the Great Tribulation.
WOW DEB, Ya-Hoo, Praise God,... may your sweet daughter be blessed with great out-pouring, as we speak. May God seal her in His Love and guide her life into wonderful things for the Kingdom. Bless you, thanks for sharing THE GOOD NEWS
....UN panel says retool world economy for sustainability
The world can no longer afford to ignore the environmental cost of economic growth and must redefine the very concept of national wealth, a UN panel of heads of state and environment ministers said Monday.
The panel challenged leaders to recognise that "current global development is unsustainable."
"We need to chart a new, more sustainable course for the future, one that strengthens equality and economic growth while protecting our planet," UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon said in Addis Ababa to mark the release of the panel's report, which outlines more than 50 policy recommendations.
"The world can no longer afford to ignore the environmental cost of economic growth and must redefine the very concept of national wealth, a UN panel of heads of state and environment ministers said Monday."
We all know what that is code for: the Third World wants money for nothing from us and is trying to play the guilt card again. As a result of the West they already have telephones, electricity, railways.
Ask the presidential candidates what they think of the UN...
Paul, I completely agree with you, that we will have to go through at least SOME of the Tribulation, I like to hold to the Pre-Wrath viewpoint because there are no assumptions about when our being caught up in the air will be, except that it will precede God's wrath (we are not appointed to wrath -1 Thes 5:9). However, something that the church isn't clear on is that the "rapture" as we know it, is in fact The Day of the Lord. If you read Revelation 6:12-17, Mark 13:24-27, Isaiah 2:10+19, 1 Thes 5:1-5, and 2 Peter 3:10 they ALL line up about the Day of the Lord.
I know that we as the church have trouble agreeing on when Jesus will come, but one thing is for sure- let us NOT be the foolish virgins who don't have any oil in their lamps!
May God Himself, the God of peace, sanctify you through and through. May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. The one who calls you is faithful, and He will do it. - 1 Thes 5:23,24
"we will have to go through at least SOME of the Tribulation, I like to hold to the Pre-Wrath viewpoint because there are no assumptions about when our being caught up in the air will be, except that it will precede God's wrath (we are not appointed to wrath -1 Thes 5:9)."
There are some differences in terminology clouding this discussion. We can all agree that there is a recognisable 7-year period preceding Jesus' return, in which the second half (3.5 years) will be terrible for the church. To call that 7 years the Tribulation and only its second half the Wrath is misleading, becaue 'tribulation' MEANS (in context) 'wrath'.
As for "not appointed to wrath" - tell that to the countless martyrs who have given their lives for Christ over the cwnturies, many of them in institutionalised persecutions, not just individual executions. Very clearly this verse means shall not end up in hell.
Google it for yourselves:
ReplyDeleteOccupiers Urinate on Cross, Throw Bible - Occupy Wall Street - Fox ...
nation.foxnews.com/occupy.../occupiers-urinate-cross-throw-bible
5 days ago – Members of the Occupy Wall Street movement urinated on a cross, desecrated a church and threw Bibles at police officers in separate incidents ...
'Occupiers' Throw Bibles, Allegedly Urinate on Cross | FOX News ...
radio.foxnews.com/.../occupiers-urinate-on-cross-throw-bibles.html
5 days ago – Members of the Occupy Wall Street movement urinated on a cross, desecrated a church and threw Bibles at police officers in separate incidents ...
Occupiers Urinate on Cross, Throw Bible - Political Forum
www.politicalforum.com › General Political Chat › Current Events
100+ posts - 10 authors - 5 days ago
Occupiers Urinate on Cross, Throw Bible Members of the Occupy Wall Street movement urinated on a cross, desecrated a church and threw ...
DISGUSTING! Obama Endorsed "Occupy" Movement Urinates On A ...
maroonedinmarin.blogspot.com/.../disgusting-obama-endorsed-occu...
5 days ago – Obama Endorsed "Occupy" Movement Urinates On A Cross, Throws Bibles At Cops. Just when you thought the Obama/DNC endorsed ...
Occupiers' Throw Bibles and Alledgedly Urinate on Cross ...
https://newsdeskinternational.wordpress.com/.../occupiers-throw-bibl...
5 days ago – Occupiers' Throw Bibles and Alledgedly Urinate on Cross ... The Occupy Wall Street movement has a history of participants urinating and ...
Okay to Urinate on Cross, but Not on Taliban
godfatherpolitics.com/.../okay-to-urinate-on-cross-but-not-on-taliban...
2 days ago – But where is the public outrage against members of the Occupy movement who throw Bibles, steal church property and urinate on crosses?
Moonbattery » Unholy Occucommies Throw Bibles at Police, Steal ...
moonbattery.com/?p=7193
4 days ago – Unholy Occucommies Throw Bibles at Police, Steal Holy Relic, Urinate on Cross ... of the Occupy Wall Street movement — throwing Bibles at the police… ... an occupier urinated on a cross, according to Rabbi Chaim Gruber, ...
'Occupiers' Throw Bibles, Allegedly Urinate on Cross, page 1
www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread801024/pg1
17 posts - 9 authors - 5 days ago
Members of the Occupy Wall Street movement urinated on a cross, desecrated a church and threw Bibles at police officers in separate incidents ...
Bloodthirsty Liberal » Occupy Movement
bloodthirstyliberal.com/?cat=1019
5 days ago – Members of the Occupy Wall Street movement urinated on a cross, desecrated a church and threw Bibles at police officers in separate incidents ...
NYC 'Occupy' Protesters Accused of Stealing Church Property ...
www.christianpost.com › US
4 days ago – Protesters connected with the New York "Occupy Wall Street" (OWS) ... NYC 'Occupy' Protesters Accused of Stealing Church Property, Urinating on Cross ... Michael Ellick of Judson Church, who is a supporter of the Occupy movement, and Rev. .... Fulfilling the Great Commission One Bible at a Time.
More evidence that this is a global movement.
ReplyDeleteIt’s Official: #OccupyChicago Feeble Pawns of the NATO/G8 Protests
by Rebel Pundit
http://biggovernment.com/rebel
pundit/2012/01/27/its-official
-occupychicago-feeble-pawns-of-
the-natog8-protests/
Maybe we need to take a look at the churches that are helping the Occupy Movement. For example:
ReplyDeleteUNITARIAN UNIVERSLISTS AND OCCUPY MOVEMENT TRACKER - UU GROWTH.COM
http://uugrowth.com/uu-occupy-movement/
Churches Help Occupy Movement Survive Crackdowns, Winter
http://www.huffingtonpost.com
/2011/11/29/churches-help-occupy
-movement_n_1119414.html
The "churches" in Detroit helping the Occupy Movement are definitely New Age centers also fervently helping the LGBT movement, i.e. in Detroit Central United Methodist Church. The nightly meetings for the Occupy Movement were held there and it was backup housing for the demonstrators.
ReplyDeleteALSO, this just in. The OCCUPY movement people just tried to take over the Davos WEF meeting. That will give impetus to the other side of their dialectic: GLOBAL GOVERNANCE!
Constance
As if the bankers that Occupy are protesting against aren't themselves globalists?! Economics was the very first thing that went global, because trade is worldwide.
ReplyDeleteBankers or Occupiers? Neither of the above, thank you.
Contraceptive Coverage Decision Decried
ReplyDeleteReligious Freedom Under Threat in the USA
By Father John Flynn, LC
ROME, JAN. 27, 2011 (Zenit.org)
The federal government decision last week on insurance coverage for contraceptives in the United States has been widely condemned.
Under the new health care law passed by Congress it was left to the Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) to decide which institutions would be exempted from having to pay for contraceptives under their health plans.
Last Friday the HHS announced that while churches would not have to pay for contraceptives other associations linked to churches, such as schools, hospitals and charitable agencies would not have any exemption.
The only concession offered was to allow employers extra time, until August 2013, to comply with the law: a concession that some observers noted conveniently pushes the obligation beyond the next elections.
“I believe this proposal strikes the appropriate balance between respecting religious freedom and increasing access to important preventive services,” declared the HHS Secretary, Kathleen Sebelius, in a press release announcing the decision.
A position not shared by many others who in the succeeding days expressed their views on the matter.
http://www.zenit.org/article-34199?
l=english
Even the Washington Post defends the Catholic Church on this...
ReplyDeletehttp://www.catholicculture.org/news
/headlines/index.cfm?storyid=13110
The occupiers are demanding exactly the SAME global system they think they are protesting against. On one hand they protest the World Economic Forum and World Bank while on the other their demand for "Earth Community" is the product of the same organizations.
ReplyDeleteRegarding anon 6:27's post:
ReplyDeleteCan anyone post some solid documentation to support the statement that the Occupiers are desiring the very same thing they are protesting against?
No theoretical talk of dialectics, etc, please - I'd like to see some real documentation of such a proposed contradiction.
Marko, what is documented is that they call for a global community, which is just another KIND of globalism. Also, there is 1% money back of them, most likely the plan is to use them as the excuse for martial law.
ReplyDeleteChairman Mao had a concept let the flowers bloom together - so once people were out in the open they could be cut down. Any tendency to converge against the banksters could be used to determine who to send to detention camps later.
This scheme is likely to fail, because the USA is so large, geographically, it can absorb almost any level of violence without a serious threat to the government or society at large. This I figured out a long time ago, and someone in German govt. or police or whatever said the same thing some years later, when asked why they don't allow wierdo cults much or any overt Nazis, what about freedom? the answer, Germany is too small. USA can have the luxury of tolerating its militias and nazis and scientologists, because it is large enough a putsch can't take it down. Germany is too small geographically to be playing from such a strong hand.
While I was initially sympathetic to Arab Spring and Occupy, increasingly it is obvious that the trend of their intent and effects are bad. The Arab Spring merely puts muslim extremists in charge, because the people are attracted by them. Also, the results of overthrow of various secular and not so secular moslem regimes has been bad for Christians regular and nestorian and monophysite heretical alike.
Lindsay Williams, who has an inside track with elitists in the oil segment because of some personal history accidents (or Providence?) says that years ago it was in the works to overthrow all the Arab monarchies and other governments, incl. Iran and Saudi Arabia, my guess is that the reason why is that the military industrial complex and other elements in bed with each other (incl. increasinly apostate charismatic evangelicalism) want a recognizeable moslem enemy for a clash of civilizations.
Also, any hidden anti Christian feeling would be served by these events.
The irony of the Occupy desecrating the Bible and so forth, is that The Bible has a LOT to say against the 1%
Marko,
ReplyDeleteThe spiritual globalists (ie, New Agers of Occupy) have fallen out with the material globalists (people who run the world financial system). We can agree with each's view of the other while disagreeing with each's view of itself.
I share your scepticism that Occupy is tightly coordinated, rather than a bunch of people having similar views. The main smoking gun that would change my mind is proof that Occupants worldwide are receiving financial subsistence from - when the links are followed upward - a single source. All else is BS as I think you would agree.
"The main smoking gun that would change my mind is proof that Occupants worldwide are receiving financial subsistence from - when the links are followed upward - a single source. All else is BS as I think you would agree."
ReplyDeleteActually, you don't need that. if for instance 3 primary sources existed, who were all in agreement with each other, that would be the same thing.
A lot of course is spontaneous, like the Illuminati model of a world without institutions or govt. or religion or anything, just the masses ruled by the manipulators.
One would need to identify who the initial moves for all this and who have the most credibility so tend to be listened to the most are and who THEY are answering to.
One might argue that a single case of such being in a 1% family would be a renegade, but more than that would be suspect.
Now in a setup like this, any element can hijack the whole thing, especially given the fact that the people the masses of today are heavily infected with ideas that are nonsensical, new agey or whatever.
yes, good analysis, that the financial materialist side of the new age and spiritual side of the new age movement are having a falling out.
Perhaps if the spiritual new age side can be made to understand that the materialist side is pulling their strings, and that the spirits leading the spiritual side are the same leading the materialist side, they might drop the both.
The materialist side couldn't care less.
Marko,
ReplyDeleteI posted the Anonymous 6:27 PM comment. Constance posted my Occupy piece two posts ago. There are links to Occupy demands in there. Their demands include what they are supposedly protesting yet they turn right back around and demand the initiatives which those they claim to oppose have formulated.
I realize the article is long but it is impossible to condense a global revolution into one page. Many will not have the attention span to read it.
There is more than enough evidence in that post to support what I've said.
It comes down to different visions of a world government, a communist one (Occupy) or a capitalist one (bankers).
ReplyDeleteNeither of the above, please. God separated us at Babel for our own good. What God hath put asunder, let no man join together... or woe betide him.
As for coordination... let us not be too hasty to assume that two people who have the same idea have the same sponsor. Proof is needed.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteAs I've written, we have the proof of the origins of "Earth Community". We know the origins of World Bank's "Earth Community" traces to the Club of Rome. We know that "Earth Community" being demanded by Occupy is tracable to the same. The proof has more than adequatly been provided.
ReplyDeleteI hadn't heard that this incident had happened until I came to the blog today, and honestly when I read it- I didn't feel upset or offended.. I felt sad. Sad for those who are in spiritual darkness, who refuse to love the truth. I know God loves those people so very much, and although it may seem pointless, I am going to pray for eyes to be opened to the fact that this movement is not the answer, it is not good, and it has much more going on than meets the eye.
ReplyDeleteThe occupy movement does have a leader....Satan
ReplyDeletehttp://www.nowtheendbegins.com/blog/?p=1366
ReplyDeleteChrislam Starts To Spread In America
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteConstance Cumbey said...
ReplyDeleteYesterday, according to USA TODAY, Oakland, California police arrested 300 Occupy Movement protesters.
OAKLAND (AP) – About 300 people were arrested Saturday during a chaotic day of Occupy protests that saw demonstrators break into City Hall and burn an American flag, as police earlier fired tear gas and bean bags to disperse hundreds of people after some threw rocks and bottles and tore down fencing outside a nearby convention center.
By Michael Macor, AP
Oakland police deploy smoke and tear gas to stop protesters with the Occupy Oakland camp as they march through downtown Oakland on Saturday.
Enlarge
By Michael Macor, AP
Oakland police deploy smoke and tear gas to stop protesters with the Occupy Oakland camp as they march through downtown Oakland on Saturday.
Dozens of police officers remained on guard outside City Hall around midnight following the most turbulent day of protests since November, when Oakland police forcefully dismantled an Occupy encampment. An exasperated Mayor Jean Quan, who faced heavy criticism for the police action last fall, called on the Occupy movement to "stop using Oakland as its playground."
"People in the community and people in the Occupy movement have to stop making excuses for this behavior," Quan said.
http://tinyurl.com/87c5lad
Constance
2:10 PM
Showing the boldness of the Movement as well as its anti-clerical nature, this last week:
ReplyDeleteOne snippet of news from Italy that seems to have been overshadowed by the Italian cruise liner disaster is the recent incursion of the Occupy movement into St Peter’s Square. Some Indignados, as they are known, who are mainly Spanish and French, tried to set up a camp in the piazza, but were ejected by the police, writes Fr Alexander Lucie-Smith in the Catholic Herald.
One of the protestors climbed the Christmas tree (which will be in place until 2nd February, feast of the Presentation), and had to be forcibly removed from it.
The police who removed the protestors were not the Swiss Guard, nor the Vatican gendarmes, but the Italian police. The piazza is Vatican territory, but it is policed, by long standing arrangement, by the Italian forces of law and order. The action of the police was fully supported by the Vatican itself.
As Fr Federico Lombardi is reported to have said: “Considering the actions undertaken and the language used, these Indignados evidently wanted to use the piazza in an improper way, not in keeping with the spirit of the place and it was therefore considered just and opportune to move them out with the co-operation of the police.”
http://www.cathnews.com/article.aspx?aeid=29662
or
http://tinyurl.com/86qwoeu
Constance
Rich,
ReplyDeleteI just finished your piece. It is quite long, but well-researched, and ties a lot of things together. (I wish you had more time to write pieces like that!)
At first I balked at the idea that people could hold to a contradiction like you suggested, but many are ignorant of what is going on in the world, and would probably be shocked and upset at such a revelation.
I wonder if there's a way to sow dissent among the Occupy ranks by getting some of your research into the right hands.... ;^)
I still remain skeptical of the "dialectic argument" to explain everything in the world, especially regarding the idea that the power struggle between East and West is being controlled by powerful elites who benefit from it. Wars and conflicts happen because of the vices of humanity, and perhaps even because God made it that way at Babel. We will never be a united world, until Christ comes and places all enemies under His feet, although the largest attempt for it in human history will be made near the end.
The only way that world government can even be attempted is if enough ties to the past can be severed by erasing the knowledge and understanding of our history as a human race. Many important severances have occurred within my lifetime, I believe.
Here is an interesting analysis by Nyquist on that topic (as you know by now, I read lots of Nyquist, and although I don't agree with everything he says, he is quite astute in his observations of history):
http://jrnyquist.com/The_Four_Reformers.html
[Sun, Jan 29]
I find it interesting that the Occupy Chicago event being called for this spring is taking place on May Day (May 1st), a traditional "Workers of the World" (read: Communist) day of celebration.
ReplyDeleteThis, in my understanding of the world, links the Occupy movement to the Communist side of things.
But, perhaps the Communists and their fellow travelers are becoming a part of the "Old World Order" and something new and even more dangerous is taking the reigns of rising tyranny. More dangerous because there is a strong spiritual element involved.
This is what Constance has long held - that the Communists can't be a long-term threat because the Bible talks about the world "worshiping" the Beast, and there is no worshiping among atheists. Although, in a sense, they worshiped what Arthur Koestler and five others referred to as "The God That Failed" in a collection of essays by people who left the Communist side.
Ending on a note of pessimism, I recall that Whittaker Chambers left the Communist side for what he felt was the losing side - The West.
I think we are going to enter a period soon where his pessimism will seem to have been well-grounded.
Marco,
ReplyDeleteThe same reason you balked is probably the same reason I am so infuriated with the leadership behind this “leaderless” Movement. I am not without compassion for many of the Occupiers who have good reason to protest. These same people are being duped and used as pawns.
My observations are that many participants in this Movement are normally hard working people who now find themselves unemployed. They are not just “deadbeats” as some would suggest. While the organizations that helped bring about this economic mess received taxpayer bailouts and reward their executives with huge bonuses, those suffering as a result their actions are finding their homes foreclosed upon because they cannot find jobs.
Repeatedly I’ve told people I don’t disagree with many of the Occupiers complaints, but those professing to speak for the 99 percent really do not speak for the majority of us. I also don’t approve of their class warfare tactics and demonization of those who are successful.
What makes this Movement so dangerous is that its true intent remains hidden.
Jenna,
ReplyDeleteJonah was in the belly of the
whale, ( the depths of despair),
when he came to this conclusion,
and God made the whale vomit
him out and gave Jonah his
second chance:
" They that observe lying vanities
forsake their own mercy."
Maybe these Occupy people are mostly of a chemically poisoned generation. I listen to various audios on the poisons which infect our environment to an increasing extent, many of which have especial danger to babies in the womb or newborns. Except for those few whose parents DID try to get them clean food, these younger people have been eating and drinking toxic food for more than a generation. Including Growth Hormone milk. Here in my town, people are mostly scientists by profession, and they are not overly given to "organic" (although we have a new organic store which is thriving). But the mothers have demanded milk free of Growth Hormone for many years, in the ordinary supermarkets, and now one can buy many other organic products there. I believe overweight as well as "acting out" can come from bad food and from giving too many immunizations at one time, which is routinely done now. Here in my town the kids at least have an option to have mercury free flu shots. There is little agreement on this, but I believe it is a major factor in "Occupy". They are not only "mad" but they are "physically mad" from eating and drinking bad stuff for a generation or two. This probably won't make a lot of sense to many here, as they'll say, well, the Occupy people are probably Greens, over-emphasizing environment. God did tell us to take care of the earth until He showed up again, so I think we have a mandate to be Green, although not superficially or unreasonably so.
ReplyDeletewho really runs things. this gets to the point after the second ad.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20gHSO6YxQ0&feature=uploademail
Austerity vs. Europe
ReplyDeleteJavier Solana
http://tinyurl.com/83d4sqq
or
http://www.project-syndicate.org/commentary/solana15/English
Thanks to http://www.pastorbrianroberts.com/ for the link.
* * *
Have a pleasant evening.
Christine Erikson,
ReplyDeleteI just watched the video you posted. You are either an infant Christian or an outright new ager. I strongly suspect your motivation is to confuse.
obviously there are some fatuous new age type solutions presented in this, and frankly while we who look at the hidden side of things, like Cumbey and conspiracy theorists and deep politics analysts do, a kind of change in consciousness is going on, making us less controllable, the plain fact is that no such changes as blathered about by Icke and others have any use against reptilian brain dominated corporatocrats.
ReplyDeleteThe solution is, to disempower them. Gut the corporations' status as a legal person. Prosecute some people who are normally untouchable. etc. contemplating your navel, or voting Republican who are bought and paid for by these people, won't do it, and voting New Age sure won't do it, more like promote it, because what the reptilian brain element want is us contemplating our belly buttons and thinking our reality is different than it is because we think it is, while they work on borgifying us.
New Age of the spirituality type in opposition to New Age of the materialist type, in fact is in its service. But some important information is in this movie.
The solution is not to change our consciousness in the sense talked about, but change our consciousness in the sense of - stop seeing those banksters as untouchable and push for prosecution of those that have in fact broken some laws, and yes, that is in the works to some minor extent now.
take note of the part about the revolving door between corporations and govt. like Cheney and Halliburton (who gained from every war the Bush dynasty got us into). That is in the part after the second ad. Now take a closer look at that, in other sources.
ReplyDeletetake note of the part about the revolving door between corporations and govt. like Cheney and Halliburton (who gained from every war the Bush dynasty got us into). That is in the part after the second ad. Now take a closer look at that, in other sources. alex constantine (ignore his across the board progessive bias look at his data) is a good start. there are many links on my blog at the right in the link list that can be pursued, go to the articles, and pursue with links in articles or using google for still more information.
ReplyDelete"Newt Gingrich has just announced he plans to run for President in 2012. And a whole bunch of undiscerning “Conservatives” and “Christians” might just well back him. The entire affair will be to the utter delight of New Age strategists and global planners who well consider Newt Gingrich an indispensable part of their apparatus."
ReplyDeleteactually, the GOP has been doing more to promote the NWO than the dems.
and yes, any Christian who thinks that lipservice to morals and to rejecting abortion (something Family of Secrets shows was arranged for a Shrub girlfriend, nothing unusual among the respectable eager to keep respectability and all their sovereign individual options without reference to anything beyond themselves), and membership in the Republican Party makes the candidate a good Christian and proper leader, will vote for him.
http://www.alternet.org/story/153913/why_the_super_bowl_is_socialist?akid=8195.253027.OSHU6J&rd=1&t=19
ReplyDeletehttp://tinyurl.com/725sxu4
ReplyDeletewhy the super bowl is actually socialist (this is not a joke)
Speaking of undiscerning Christians Christine, you bomb this blog with links to some of the most new age BS and defend it as good material. I haven't yet decided whether you are undescerning or peppering the blog with links intended to guide people down the wrong path.
ReplyDeleteChristine,
ReplyDeleteI do, as always, appreciate your intelligence and contributions. However, I'm receiving complaints that your sheer volume is scaring others away. Sometimes fewer words have greater impact. Sometimes a picture or a link is worth a thousand words! I don't want to ration anybody's contributions.
AS TO ALL,
There is "collapse comments" feature." If you want to skip somebody's comments, i.e., Anonymous, etc., that can be used without violence to somebody's desire to express oneself.
Constance
I do believe that CHRISTINE was RIGHT ON THE MONEY when she said that most likely the OCCUPY MOVEMENT would be an excuse for MARTIAL LAW.
ReplyDeleteConstance
I think your real problem is you don't like anti Republican
ReplyDeleteFACT: they are not what they pretend to be. They are materialist new Age to the core Reagan and wife were semi occultists, promoted make believe haze and enchantment in his style and speaking.
FACT: The Bible is as against the 1% as against some of Occupy stuff.
FACT: There is no rapture except to greet The Lord at His return AFTER the tribulation. Rapture doctrine UNHEARD OF BEFORE 1800s and helped by proto New Age organizations
FACT: I have had some extremely odd experiences, and learned that certain things like the sign of the Cross made with faith and precision and intent and Holy Water work against them. Some of the wierdest involved physical effects which prove (a) energy feed vampirism is real when I was the target, and (b) New Age info on the "energy body" is DEAD WRONG (energy system is part of the soul, which term in Hebrew covers both immortal and interface between body and soul and body and spirit as continuum as well as a distinct element in that continuum, and validated by Ecclesiastes 12, but again the New Age info is as wrong on that as it is on "consciousness")
FACT: once you begin looking at the sort of things Cumbey uncovers, if you keep looking you will find stuff invalidating BOTH parties and a lot of American as well as unAmerican values as well.
FACT: all govt. intervention is not harmful, without govt. involvement intrepreneurs would not have gotten anywhere as much done.
FACT: America has been fascination with the occult back to early times. Earlier The Enlightenment was a major attack on Christinaity, ditto masonry occult conspiracy against Christianity before Besant
AND CHURCHES HAVE BEEN INFILTRATED WITH MASONRY, INCL. THE BAPTIST CHURCHES. Very few will excommunicate for being masons.
FACT: Pentecostal/Charismatic movement is infected from the start especially because of unbiblical emphasis on "tongues" mishandling Scripture, and "waiting for The Spirit," a mediumistic sort of misapplication of Scripture about a one time only event in the past. God may have used some of these people to get your attention on Jesus, but you need to get away from all this.
GOOGLE KUNDALINI AND CHARISMATIC TOGETHER, Then ask yourself why these people are so whole hog hypnotized by the Republithugs. The Dummycrooks are no better.
FACT: both parties are financed by pretty much the same people. public stance on morals/religion mean nothing as long as the people who own them get their way.
ReplyDeleteFACT: the first or maybe second political party we had, was the anti masonic party. We need another one only a bit more fine tuned, and aiming at the more complex New Age of both materialist and spiritual forms. All the "third parties" now are jokes or bad in their own right.
when all branches of govt are staffed by people with loyalties that transcend their offices, and they all collaborate, you NO LONGER HAVE CHECKS AND BALANCES.
FACT: The Bible read cover to cover in a short period of time so you don't get a piecemeal effect, 4 months maximum, will show you no one form of government or economic theory that God unreservedly endorses, other than the monarchic rule of His Son when He comes back.
FACT: as shown by Cumbey and Herescope, there is an appalling similarity between the eschatology of the New Age and the eschatology and ecclesiology of the charismatic new apostles, etc. etc. teachers, which should tell you something right there.
St. Paul speaks of being puffed up and made emptier, and entering into visions which you have not seen.
FACT: There is a VERY uncomfortable similarity between the USA and Babylon the Great.
FACT: St. Peter in one of his epistles says we should live in sobriety as well as godliness in expectation of Christ. "sober and godly" doesn't incl. running around in a blissed out state, that you think is the Holy Spirit, but leaves you open to all sorts of influences and ideas without discernment, inhibits you from testing spirits or ideas, and hardly differs from drugs or New Age consciousness warping exercizes effects, and ends up with talking with spirits that are never tested, accepting blindly whatever nonsense is presented in dreams visions or statements from departed relatives about having the resurrection body in heaven, which is a lie because that is a PHYSICAL body we get later when brought to life again by Jesus Christ at His Second Coming, or transformed into that condition if still alive when He comes back, praying by concentrating on the person prayed for instead of on God, not to mention other false prophecies and then making excuses.
It doesn't matter a ministry denounces occultism of obvious sort, if they promote styles of prayer and worship that cause trances states and wild behavior
Sure some of these people may be able to cast out demons, but that is about the power of Jesus Name, not their own holiness, note Jesus' warnings about some such at the Last Judgement in Matthew 25 I think it is "did we not cast our demons and do miracles in Your Name?" they ask and He answers "depart from Me, I have not known you workers of iniquity."
And maybe the reason they have to do so much exorcism, is because they and their followers and the people who come to them from similar contexts are doing something that attracts demons in the first place.
FACT: some of the manifestations such as at IHOP and others, involve symptoms and sequences that parallel the awakening of the so called kundalini energy in tantric hinduism and New Age borrows from it. That cannot be a good sign.
Constance, I was addressing some else's comment before yours posted, I took a while composing, its appearance right after yours wasn't aimed at you.
ReplyDeleteOkay, I will cut the verbiage.
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/archives/2012/feb/23/how-save-euro/?
ReplyDeleteJS tweeted news of this book by Soros.
"How to save the euro.George Soros.New York review of books "
For what it's worth...
ReplyDeleteI feel strongly that no ONE person (whether it be a Christine or a Joyce) should ever 'dominate' a blog.
Subliminal End time Message - Brought to You by the Beast System
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8bZkX9H0soU&feature=channel_video_title
http://www.youtube.com/
watch?v=8bZkX9H0
soU&feature=channel_
video_title
Memo to Christine Erickson:
ReplyDeleteLess is More.
Currency Warfare: What Are The Real Targets of the E.U. Oil Embargo Against Iran?
ReplyDeletehttp://tinyurl.com/7bdod8w
Constance & All,
ReplyDeleteI could hardly believe my eyes when I read the following:
WALL STREET OCCUPIERS URGED TO TARGET CHURCHES
Franky Schaeffer is the son of the late, highly influential evangelical thinker Francis Schaeffer, who helped shape the modern conservative evangelical movement. The son boasts he was himself a co-founder of the Religious Right. But he since has denounced Christianity as “stupid,” writes bitter tell-all books about his parents, and ferociously attacks conservative religionists as the virtual root cause of all American evils.
A blogger for The Huffington Post, young Schaeffer is now faulting religious conservatives for facilitating Wall Street greed. He’s imploring the Wall Street Occupiers to “protest the root source of America’s tilt to the far unregulated corporate right.” For Schaeffer, the next logical step is to demonstrate “outside mega churches, Evangelical publishing houses, [and] religious organizations that lead the ‘moral’ crusades against women and gays and all the rest.”....
.....Ecumenically, Schaeffer also tars Roman Catholics as likewise “fundamentalists” who have “delegitimized the US Government and thus undercut its ability to tax, spend and regulate.” So Catholic bishops, like evangelical mega churches, have also tricked their followers into voting against their “own class and self-interest.”...read entire article...
http://frontpagemag.com/2011/10/
17/wall-street-occupiers-urged-to
-target-churches/
_____________________________
"Frankey's" father, Francis Schaeffer also founded the Christian community in Switzerland that came to be known as "L'Abri.
FRANK SCHAEFFER
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Schaeffer
L'ABRI
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%27Abri
No Christine, my criticism have nothing to do with Republicans. It has everyting to do with the junk you pass off and don't get called on.
ReplyDeleteI can hardly believe that you get away with passing off David Icke's Reptilian Agenda and then defend it as credible and not get corrected by this community.
This blogging community is sliding down from the standards it once held.
Anon. 7:34,
ReplyDeleteWe try to logically assail Christine's arguments, and are met with subtle parries and dodges that never address our concerns and objections, and at the same time flood the comments with even more that needs assailing, so at some point you have to just stop throwing pearls in that direction...
Constance,
My objection to Christine's verbosity is not based upon the volume but the content. It is also based upon the fact that she has her OWN blog, but chooses instead to take over this one.
Occupy protesters attempt to occupy Vancouver cathedral as attacks on Christianity mount
ReplyDeleteby Thaddeus Baklinski
Wed Nov 02, 2011
VANCOUVER, November 2, 2011 (LifeSiteNews.com) - On Sunday morning a break-away faction of the Occupy Vancouver movement tried to occupy the city’s Holy Rosary Cathedral during morning Mass.
Several dozen protesters, calling themselves ‘Occupy the Vatican’, were halted when Archbishop Michael Miller requested a police presence, and were stopped again later in the day by police and members of the Knights of Columbus.
The incident highlights a trend by some in the anti-corporate protest movement to use it as a launching pad for attacks on Christianity and the Catholic Church in particular.
Most infamously, on October 15th, members of the Occupy Rome protest entered a Roman Catholic Church and destroyed a statue of the Virgin Mary.
The effort to occupy the church in Vancouver comes after a call on October 13th by former Evangelical leader Frank Schaeffer for the Occupy movement to begin targeting Evangelical and Roman Catholic churches...read entire article...
http://www.lifesite.net/news/
occupy-protesters-turn-against
-christianity
"I can hardly believe that you get away with passing off David Icke's Reptilian Agenda and then defend it as credible and not get corrected by this community."
ReplyDeleteYou got a serious literacy and comprehension problem.
The film started off with a repudiation of it, and shifting focus onto our own damn selves, and what scientists call the reptillian brain, a small segment deep in the brain that deals in the kind of behavior and priorities the film discusses.
It goes on to look at such behavior o the part of elites and suggests that they have that segment of the brain in control.
It touches on several matters, and deteriorates into a New Age rant, totally missing the point that no popular change in consciousness or attitude is going to matter, it is only insofar as those in elected and defacto but unelected and unaccountable power change their attitude, OR
we get to work deligitimizing them and yanking the rug out from under them both in terms of law and of view held of them and their values.
BTW, I suspect that Icke is (a) onto something but doesn't realize what it is, that some people MAY be interfaced to or overshadowed by demons, and sensitives misinterpret sudden noticing of this as seeing a shapeshift, and (b) a double agent of sorts, since he advocates the same kind of blissing out New Age stuff that makes you a good cog in the borg machine in the first place.
you need to wade through a lot of muck to pick out gems. disinformation invariably contains a lot of truth, sometimes 90% truth, either with a ringer thrown in to get you off a productive line of research and onto an wrong line, or so packaged that it looks ridiculous and discredits all interest in it.
do the research.
"A blogger for The Huffington Post, young Schaeffer is now faulting religious conservatives for facilitating Wall Street greed. He’s imploring the Wall Street Occupiers to “protest the root source of America’s tilt to the far unregulated corporate right.” For Schaeffer, the next logical step is to demonstrate “outside mega churches, Evangelical publishing houses, [and] religious organizations that lead the ‘moral’ crusades against women and gays and all the rest.”"
ReplyDeleteSchaeffer has part of it right, but is dead wrong on buying into the gay agenda and abortion "rights." It is sad that so many with some insight, swallow the progressive package lock stock and barrel, instead of separating the distinct issues.
It is also a bad idea to encourage Occupy protests at churches, because most of them will not make any distinction between The Faith and its corruption and corruptors, and as we have just seen, attack the symbols and text of The Truth, which has been as desecrated by its misuse by the corrupt megachurches and evangelical charismatic right wing greediocrats, as it now was by the OWS.
"We try to logically assail Christine's arguments, and are met with subtle parries and dodges that never address our concerns and objections,"
ReplyDeletereally? I haven't noticed much logic with a few exceptions. Just assumptions of the package deal thinking sort that is the same way the left thinks, if this then that even though they are unrelated issues. My remarks come from 40 years of reading and some experience and observation of patterns. And 3 Bible readthroughs in 3 or 4 months each.
in deference to Constance and to legit concerns about too much verbiage, I am not posting any more on this thread.
ReplyDeletetoo much verbiage can make attention deficit types (I sometimes fit this
myself) unable to follow an argument or process information anyway.
Christine,
ReplyDeleteThis is the video you posted.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20gHSO6YxQ0&feature=uploademail
This film doesn't repudiate the new age it bolsters it. You are either thick in the skull or have a lying tongue.
Anon@5:50 p.m.
ReplyDeleteIf Obama and friends want this so bad, then why don't they start their own organization to provide these services.
Why do they have to force organizations started and run by religious groups to pay for contraception and abortion drugs?
Would Obama force a Muslim restaurant to serve pork or alcohol?
BTW - The End Game Global Conspiracy video Christine so fondly promoted is the product of new ager Jim Nichols a follower of the Pleaidian Agenda. Nichol's web site promotes the new agers such as Shirley Maclaine. Do the research Christine. Or have you already and you're objective has been to mislead all along?
ReplyDelete"This film doesn't repudiate the new age it bolsters it. You are either thick in the skull or have a lying tongue."
ReplyDeletewell, I have to answer this one.
YOU are thick or weak headed or lying.
I NEVER said it repudiated the New Age. I said it repudiated the shape shifting reptillian story of David Icke, and turned attention on our own internal reptillian qualities as the problem.
In this, it may in fact be supporting original sin, though it doesn't know it.
And that it provides important key information about stuff going on strictly material human stuff in the world.
read more carefully and stop bearing false witness.
Now I will say no more on this thread.
Christine,
ReplyDelete"I NEVER said it repudiated the New Age. I said it repudiated the shape shifting reptillian story of David Icke"
YOU are WRONG about that too. It bolsters David Icke's reptillian theory or haven't you taken time to learn that either. David Icke's Reptilian theory is found throughout the Pleaidian Agenda. Now why would one who supports the Pleaidian Aganda contradict David Icke (which he doesn't). I would suggest you acquint yourself with the Pleaidian doctrines then come back and argue this when you have some knowledge to fall back on.
"BTW, I suspect that Icke is (a) onto something but doesn't realize what it is"
FACT: David Icke professed to be the messiah. Is he onto something there too?
And why would you be passing off new age BS as gospel and then when called on it defend it to high heaven? You are filled with confusion and trying to pass it along to others.
I see Christine's blog is very active.
ReplyDeleteI wish I could quote, in order,
ReplyDeleteRevelations 12, 13, 14 and 15, but it
would take up too much space here.
So, a brief very synopsis:
In Revelations 12 we see a woman
clothed with the sun. Most Bible
scholars agree that she is the Church
of true believers. Then there is
Satan ( red dragon ), who, in short,
tries to overthrow the true church
and the true faith. He is defeated by
the angels.
In Revelations 13 we see the "beast" ,
who is the Antichrist and his "religion"
who gets his power from the dragon.
And we see the "little horn", who is
the "False Prophet" , but who could
also be called the "False Holy Ghost",
all of which shows us a false trinity,
which is a devilish but accurate picture
of the fact of the Trinity, or what
perhaps should be called a Triunity,
( thank you Joyce ).
In chapter 14, we see the 144,000 from
the tribes of Israel, who preach the
everlasting Gospel to the Tribulation
world. We see Babylon the Great
fall, and in verses 15 and 16 we see
the harvest of the earth. Don't
forget that Jesus is the Vine and we
are the branches.
In chapter 15 we see a sea of glass,
before the throne of God, which is
the collective millions of believers
in Jesus through all the centuries
of grace, AFTER WHICH in chapter
16, the wrath of God is poured out
in full measure on the earth.
So Christine aka Justina, you have
no right (or write) to claim that the
Rapture of the saints, also known as
the "blessed hope", and the great
Translation of the saints, which is
foreshadowed by Noah, and Enoch,
and Methuselah, and Ezekiel, and
John the Revelator ("come up here"),
is somehow a complete falsehood and
say: in capital letters, "FACT", that it
is not true !
The only thing that bugs me about you
is the way you attempt to speak with
authority about every wind of new
doctrine which comes blowing down
the pike. You have itchy ears.
You even have the audacity to contradict
a PhD in Physics on a scientific subject !
You're not the only one who's read
the entire Bible through, Do it again,
and you might pick up some humility.
A little leaven leavens the whole lump.
Amen, Paul.
ReplyDeleteheheh, I suppose she is not a teen-ager anymore, but I am reminded of a sign my aunt hung in her house when she had a teen-ager- I wish I were a teen-ager, too, so I would know everyhting.
One of the funniest things I ever saw on TV was a confrontation between David Icke and a Jew who was 100% convinced that when Icke said giant reptiles disguised as human politicians were taking over the planet, Icke actually meant Jews but wasn't prepared to say so.
ReplyDeleteThis is the physicist mentioned in one of the posts on this thread, and this time I would like to agree with Christine about the timing of the Rapture. The relevant scriptures refer to the supernatural flight to Jerusalem, for the small number of believers alive on the earth at the end of the Great Tribulation, to join Jesus Christ and his resurrected faithful as they descend to earth at His Second Coming.
I regard the pre-Tribulation Rapture as a false prophecy, of "peace when there is no peace" (to quote Jeremiah). It could only have caught on in a Western church which had forgotten what it is like to suffer for Christ. All scriptures held to refer to a pre-trib timing are highly ambiguous. And why does Jesus make no mention whatsoever of a pre-tribulation rapture in the Olivet discourse, in which he gives the detailed sequence of events leading up to His return?
To Christine @ 9:11 PM:
ReplyDeleteRe: "I am not posting any more on this thread."
___________________________________
Well, since you very condescendingly regard us as 'attention deficit types' and also 'unable to follow an argument or process information'....I'm sure that we fall far short of your very superior (NOT) intellect.
Either way, dear - don't let the blog door hit you on the way out.
To Anonymous @ 2:30 PM:
ReplyDeleteI would say that the Christian community is probably evenly divided on the pre-Tribulation Rapture theory vs. the post-Tribulation Rapture theory.
We, who are post-Tribs, are still secretly hoping that the others are right and we are wrong.
Either way, we are keeping the faith, praying and staying prepared.
Anonymous 2:42
ReplyDeleteI strongly believe that the correct
position is MID Tribulation.
The woman in Rev.12 is given a
place to hide for 3.5 years.
Daniel speaks of 3.5 years in
three different ways. He mentions
it in days, weeks and years.
Mid Tribulation is pre-wrath, as
we can see from Rev. 14 when the
" harvest of the earth" takes place.
So if as you say the Christian
world is divided on the subject; either
end-tribulation or pre-tribulation,
then the average of the two is perfect.
The revealing of the Anti-Christ is
exactly at the mid tribulation point.
And that's the point at which the
Christians are removed, and "taken
out of the way".
Occupy Wall Street protesters throw condoms, drown out speakers at Rhode Island pro-life rally
ReplyDeleteby Ben Johnson
Mon Jan 30, 2012
http://www.lifesite.net/news/
occupy-wall-street-protesters
-throw-condoms-drown-out-speakers
-at-rhode-isl
Paul,
ReplyDeleteIf you do not take the rapture to be a few seconds before Christ's Second Coming in glory then we differ about that, which should be perfectly possible for believers to do in love; but I also think we might be using some words differently, so let's try to clear up misunderstanding. I believe there will be a recognisable 7-year run-up to Christ's return, with the Great Tribulation comprising the 2nd half of that and lasting 3.5 years. I don't call the whole of that 7 years the Tribulation.
Pink Stink: Komen Drops Planned Parenthood Support
ReplyDeletehttp://tinyurl.com/7vdow5s
daily praise and worship of our good Lord, givivg thanks, and seeking His perfect will in our lives thru His orchestrared guidance,......thats the ticket! lead us not into temptation and deliver us from evil. draw us close unto you oh Lord, and keep us where you are/ strenghten us and give us wisdom. Fill us with your Holy Spirit Lord n teach us to fully Love one another. Give us REVIVAL, amen. tony/ vt. use us Lord n teach us to serve one another your way.
ReplyDeleteorchestrated guidance[ that is ]
ReplyDeleteAbide in Christ,.....what a thing to believe!
ReplyDeletewe will be CHANGED, in the twinkling of an eye! ....imagine!!
ReplyDeletelike the river, joins the OCEAN, as the germ in the seed grows,.....we'll finally be free to get back HOME
ReplyDeleteSteer me right, sweet Jesus.....be my all in ALL!
ReplyDeleteJah please come to the crossroads,......set all the people Free
ReplyDeleteego sucks,.....take ME away from the power of MY ambition
ReplyDeletei got sunshine, in my stomach...like i just rocked my baby to sleep. Wishing for us all, the peace that surpasses all understanding. Praying for this now in Jesus name, amen
ReplyDeleteLet us shoot for world wide REVIVAL, now, in Christ Jesus, amen. Give it to us Lord, please. Give us unobstructed power from above, and shape it for Your purpose Fully Lord. Give us the real thing Father,...make a powerful move on our lives,...orchestrate Lord, guide us
ReplyDeleteThank you for all you offer us Lord, forgive us for our shortcomings,...thank you for all of the beautiful people
ReplyDeleteAnon 4:42
ReplyDeleteChristians are the salt of the
earth. If you take away the salt,
the infection, ( sin ) spreads
unimpeded, and rot quickly sets
in.
It's the revealing of the Antichrist,
AND the removal of the Christians,
along with the Holy Spirit in and
among them, which is
what's holding all the evil back,
that begins the Great Tribulation.
But oh yes I agree that we can
disagree in love.
Praise God from whom all
blessings flow.
we are but a moments sunlight, fading in the grass.............teach us Lord to LOVE one another, right now. teach us to be fearless
ReplyDeletei agree Paul, i do agree. however, ... ? maybe that coffee threw into lala land some. this is tony in vt. blessings my brother
ReplyDeletethrew me[that is]
ReplyDeletepicture shadrack n them in that fire,...all safe with Jesus!
ReplyDeleteMy 17 year old daughter said the sinners prayer tonight...I am on cloud 9.
ReplyDeleteit blows me away to think that Jesus said, Forgive them Father, for they know not what they do.
ReplyDeleteWOW DEB, Ya-Hoo, Praise God,... may your sweet daughter be blessed with great out-pouring, as we speak. May God seal her in His Love and guide her life into wonderful things for the Kingdom. Bless you, thanks for sharing THE GOOD NEWS
ReplyDeletethe love of GOD is real
ReplyDeletethe love of God Israel
ReplyDeletehttp://news.yahoo.com/un-panel-says-retool-world-economy-sustainability-164515165.html
ReplyDelete....UN panel says retool world economy for sustainability
The world can no longer afford to ignore the environmental cost of economic growth and must redefine the very concept of national wealth, a UN panel of heads of state and environment ministers said Monday.
The panel challenged leaders to recognise that "current global development is unsustainable."
"We need to chart a new, more sustainable course for the future, one that strengthens equality and economic growth while protecting our planet," UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon said in Addis Ababa to mark the release of the panel's report, which outlines more than 50 policy recommendations.
more at article
Deb,
ReplyDeleteIt's a good time to open up to Mark 4
and the parable of the sower.
Just my humble two cents.
God bless and keep your daughter.
"The world can no longer afford to ignore the environmental cost of economic growth and must redefine the very concept of national wealth, a UN panel of heads of state and environment ministers said Monday."
ReplyDeleteWe all know what that is code for: the Third World wants money for nothing from us and is trying to play the guilt card again. As a result of the West they already have telephones, electricity, railways.
Ask the presidential candidates what they think of the UN...
Paul, I completely agree with you, that we will have to go through at least SOME of the Tribulation, I like to hold to the Pre-Wrath viewpoint because there are no assumptions about when our being caught up in the air will be, except that it will precede God's wrath (we are not appointed to wrath -1 Thes 5:9). However, something that the church isn't clear on is that the "rapture" as we know it, is in fact The Day of the Lord. If you read Revelation 6:12-17, Mark 13:24-27, Isaiah 2:10+19, 1 Thes 5:1-5, and 2 Peter 3:10 they ALL line up about the Day of the Lord.
ReplyDeleteI know that we as the church have trouble agreeing on when Jesus will come, but one thing is for sure- let us NOT be the foolish virgins who don't have any oil in their lamps!
May God Himself, the God of peace, sanctify you through and through. May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. The one who calls you is faithful, and He will do it. - 1 Thes 5:23,24
"we will have to go through at least SOME of the Tribulation, I like to hold to the Pre-Wrath viewpoint because there are no assumptions about when our being caught up in the air will be, except that it will precede God's wrath (we are not appointed to wrath -1 Thes 5:9)."
ReplyDeleteThere are some differences in terminology clouding this discussion. We can all agree that there is a recognisable 7-year period preceding Jesus' return, in which the second half (3.5 years) will be terrible for the church. To call that 7 years the Tribulation and only its second half the Wrath is misleading, becaue 'tribulation' MEANS (in context) 'wrath'.
As for "not appointed to wrath" - tell that to the countless martyrs who have given their lives for Christ over the cwnturies, many of them in institutionalised persecutions, not just individual executions. Very clearly this verse means shall not end up in hell.
Yours,
A postie
Secretary General Ban Ki-moon said in Addis Ababa to mark the release of the panel's report, which outlines more than 50 policy recommendations.
ReplyDeleteWorld of Warcraft Gold Billig
World of Warcraft Gold Kaufen