Sunday, April 19, 2009
"Actually, we need an attitude of mind where rethinking and the concept of evolving attitudes becomes part of the discipline with which you approach your religious faith"
There has been reported friction in the past between Tony Blair and Javier Solana. It should be most interesting to watch this one play out. Mr. High Profile vs. Mr. Fly Just Under Everybody's Radar.
Your comment in the previous thread bashing the belief (of no doubt a Catholic poster) who speculated "Carrie ...[might] intercede for her" is shocking. When people are grieving, bashing their faith is considered insensitive, to say the least. Let Carrie RIP. Respect those who want to honor her in a shared expression of the Catholic faith. I for one will honor Carrie now with her frequently expressed prayer of Marion intercession: Our Lady of Fatima, pray for us.
by Steven Ertelt
April 17, 2009
Washington, DC (LifeNews.com) -- Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano has backed down from the security document her department issued for the Obama administration linking pro-life advocates to terrorists. The document has caused a national outcry for saying those who oppose abortion are likely to be part of a group of people who engage in "rightwing extremism."
Napolitano defended the report Thursday, but said that a section claiming hate-motivated groups and movements " may include groups and individuals that are dedicated to a single issue, such as opposition to abortion" should not have been included.
"If there's one part of that report I would rewrite, in the word-smithing, Washington-ese that goes on after the fact, it would be that footnote," Napolitano said Thursday on Fox News.
The report was distributed to police and sheriff's offices nationwide and it has sparked strong opposition from pro-life advocates who take exception to the Obama administration labeling them terrorists.
Meanwhile, the Thomas More Law center, a pro-life legal group, informed LifeNews.com on Thursday that it has filed a federal lawsuit against Napolitano. The lawsuit says the Obama administration's document "violates the civil liberties of combat veterans as well as American citizens by targeting them for disfavored treatment on account of their political beliefs."
The lawsuit was filed in the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Michigan on behalf of pro-life nationally syndicated conservative radio talk show host Michael Savage, pro-life advocate Gregg Cunningham and others.
The Law Center claims that Napolitano’s Department (DHS) has violated the First and Fifth Amendment Constitutional rights of these three plaintiffs by attempting to chill their free speech, expressive association, and equal protection rights.
The lawsuit further claims that the Department of Homeland Security encourages law enforcement officers throughout the nation to target and report citizens to federal officials as suspicious rightwing extremists and potential terrorists because of their political beliefs.
Richard Thompson, president and chief counsel of the Thomas More Center, told LifeNews.com, “The Obama Administration has declared war on American patriots and our Constitution. The Report even admits that the Department has no specific information on any plans of violence by so-called ‘rightwing extremists.’"
"Rather, what they do have is the expression of political opinions by certain individuals and organizations that oppose the Obama administration’s policies, and this expression is protected speech under the First Amendment," he continued.
“Janet Napolitano is lying to the American people when she says the Report is not based on ideology or political beliefs. In fact, her report would have the admiration of any current or past dictator in the way it targets political opponents," Thompson added.
The Law Center is asking the court to permanently enjoin the Obama administration's policy and its application to the plaintiffs’ speech and other activities, and to award the plaintiffs their reasonable attorney’s fees and costs for having to bring the lawsuit.
Deal Hudson, a Catholic writer expressing the views of many pro-life advocates upset by the document, called it the Obama administrations "crackdown on Evangelicals and Catholics who care enough about the protection of human life, as guaranteed in the Declaration of Independence, to organize, educate, protest, and vote on the basis of the moral principle upon which all other moral principles are based."
He wondered whether the pictures of prominent pro-life activists like Father Frank Pavone, Congressman Chris Smith or others would be "hanging on the Post Office wall" along with other criminals and the FBI's most wanted list.
Only God knows what is in the hearts and minds of both Tony Blair and Newt Gingrich with their recent "conversions" to the Catholic faith.
While I hope and pray that their motives are sincere and genuine, I remain somewhat skeptical.
Hmmm, I wonder if should sign off as Joyce or Jaclyn this morning, I think I feel like Jaclyn today ;-)
It is ok to express opinions for and against this belief, but let's be sensitive of the feelings of grievers. I too grieve for the earthly loss of Carrie.
Re: Constance clarification of the Catholic belief that we can ask those who have gone before to pray for us. It is my opinion that the saints, Moses, Elijah and others would be horrified that we would bypass our invition to enter the throne room of grace boldly, making our petitions known, but instead seeking THEIR assistance. Not only is there no Scripture to support this, the Bible clearly forbids it.
I don't think you understood where I am coming from and I'm sorry if you misunderstood my sincere intentions which sadly are often misunderstood.
I have recently lost some dear friends too, and have others who are about to die, so I am not trying to be at all insensitive towards loss. but rather to point them to the hope they have in Yeshua.
When Scriptural truths are presented it is not to hurt people but to encourage them..that they are already seated in the heavenly realm with Yeshua.
and another very comforting verse that Yeshua gave before He was crucified:
John 14:19-20 “After a little while the world will no longer see Me, but you will see Me; because I live, you will live also.“In that day you will know that bI am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you.
I am pointing out spiritual realities that in our moment of loss, sometimes we may not think about or we might not have ever heard. We are in Him and He in us... It doesn't get much closer than that....So again I will say, not to in any way shape or form say anything against Carrie's memory, but the Bible gives us the assurance that through His Spirit God Himself dwells in us, and we in Him.. I think at moments of great loss and sadness if we could see this clearly, as the Bible states it, it should offer us the greatest comfort and hope...
It doesn't mean that we don't miss a person who is dear to us. It just assures us that if we are part of His body, we are already in Him and therefore we can ask anything in His Name and He will hear our prayers..
In some of the most beautiful funerals I have ever attending, the Scriptural verses and concepts that out outlined here were discussed, so it is not something that I thought of as in any way offensive..
My apologies though, if you did not get that out of the comments...
You write all the things that are technically correct - we do have hope in Jesus and the Resurrection, and Scripture tells us we do not grieve as those who have no hope. But unless you have personally suffered the greatest loss and felt it to the core of your being can you understand, that at the time of the most intense pain, pain that becomes physically debilitating, being quoted Scripture isn't going to make much sense of death. Grief makes the best of believers question where God is. We ask- Why God?, Help me God, Is anyone there? Hope itself eludes us for a time and no Scripture clarification helps in the depths of that despair. Grief is a feeling of agony so intense, unless you have been in the darkness of the valley of the shadow yourself because you have felt the full blast of death hit you square on, can you know what it feels like. In the depths of this dark valley, you just want someone to hold you, let you cry, tell you they are sorry - even if they are an athiest, you just want, want, want what you cannot have - you want the Resurrection RIGHT NOW. We who grieve know what it feels like to stand in Gethsemane, be betrayed and abandoned (not to compare our agony with Christ's, but an understanding of it becomes clearer than ever before). Have you ever felt grief to that degree? I have and do. It was an enigma to me why well-meaning believers quoted Scripture as if that should erase my pain. It made me feel shameful I had it at all, if I was a "better Christian" I wouldn't have the pain. (I saw it as pious superiority on their part - friends of Job). Sometimes it is best to BE like Christ to those who suffer, rather than quote His words. I just wish people (even the well meaning) knew what it FEELS like to be on the receiving end of words.
I've lost some of the people closest and dearest to me, so I really do know what grief is like. One thing that I also know is that we all respond differently and might need different things
.. So perhaps I was sharing the thing that helps me in those moments...All I want you to know is that my intentions were not intended for anything but good..if it was hurtful, I am truly sorry.
I certainly didn't mean it to say that "if you were a better Christian you wouldn't feel pain".. The best believers in the world grieve deeply.
The separation of death is not natural...even for believers in Yeshua and in the resurrection so..
Matt. 5:4 “Blessed are those who mourn, for they shall be comforted.
May you be comforted with His peace that surpasses all understanding..
"When He had taken it, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb. Each one held a harp and golden bowls filled with incense, which are the prayers of the saints."
Those who sleep in Christ are still members of His body, as are we. So, we may ask the saints to pray for us in the same way we would ask a fellow Christian here on earth to pray for us.
An example of Mary's intercession, while still living here on earth, happened at the wedding feast of Cana. Even though Jesus felt His time had not yet come to perform his first miracle, He did so only at the request of His mother. She then simply asked of the wedding host, "Do whatever He tells you."
And, isn't that clearly the message for all of us even today? "Do whatever He tells you" -- by obeying all of God's Commandments and loving God with thy whole heart and loving thy neighbor as thyself.
I'm not sure I would call that passage one about intercession...on the part of the saints who have already died...We are all saints in Messiah, so we need to look at the passage to see whose prayers are going up...
If you are in Messiah, you are a saint.. That's what Scripture says. All of Paul's letters start out greeting the saints in Colosse, or Phillipi etc. The word "saint" simply means set apart, and in Yeshua the Messiah, we are all saints ( even though we still sin sometimes). We are set apart because He justified us with His blood, and we have His righteousness now..( in spite of our imperfections which we all have).
Again, I'm not trying to make anyone feel bad here, on the contrary, I'm trying to say what Scripture says about "who we are in Messiah" and based on that reality, what authority we have to go to the throne room.
The reason that this comforts me is because I have no question marks about what was accomplished for me when I gave my life to Yeshua. Not because of who I am, but because of who He is. We receive His righteousness. We are brand new creations. This is the tremendous hope and promise that all of us who believe in His atoning work have.
Because He lives, we will live.. It doesn't take away the pain of loss. It just makes it temporary.
We are commanded to go boldly to His throne of grace:
Heb. 4:16 Therefore let us draw near with confidence to the throne of grace, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need.
Yeshua, taught us to pray to our Father in Heaven directly, so that is the clearest example.
We can intercede for one another here, but when we do we bring our requests to the Father.. This is the biblical model given to us by Yeshua Himself for praying. Praying to our heavenly Father doesn't have to be a word by word repetition of Yeshua's words but that is the model given to us for how to pray.
Mary's request to do what her Son said was not a prayer, but a request from one person to another on behalf on another, so we cannot call this prayer.
Prayer is really important, and the prayers that are most effective are those that are according to HIs Will, and we can know His Will by what He has told us in His Word. Prayer can move mountains, when we address it to the one who made the mountains...who better to ask than the Creator, our Father, our Redeemer, Himself.
If you read about people who had intimate communion with God, like Moses, they saw Him "face to face".. We too, can know Him this way because of Yeshua.
I hope I'm not offending you, but rather sharing from my understanding of what it means to be "in Messiah". I hope that helps clarify. I love sharing this because it has helped me so much in my life to understand these things, so I like to pass them on to others...
There is a time and season for the dissection of differences in doctrine.
Now is a time of grieving and respect for the loss of a faithful friend and servant of the Lord.
Please consider this as you continue to comment regarding these matters.
"He who loves purity of heart and HAS GRACE ON HIS LIPS, the king will be his friend." Proverbs 22:11
I pray for grace to be on your lips at times such as these.
By His Grace,
I agree with Bobbie, Joyce takes great effort and much study to explain her positions, providing a a lot of Scripture. I don't find her spirit to be harsh or offensive.
Father Frank has been in the trenches since he was Terry Schiavo's advocate.
We talk about a lot of things on the blog that will provide no eternal value whatsoever and at times bring a lot of fear into people's hearts. I don't mean to "dissect doctrine" but rather remind all of us, who are in Him about His grace and truth and promises:
Titus 3:4 But when the kindness of God our Savior and His love for mankind appeared,
Titus 3:5 He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,
Titus 3:6 awhom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
Titus 3:7 so that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
This is the hope we have, otherwise our faith is in vain.. I don't know about you, but this hope is what keeps me going in difficult moments of my life and when I look around and see some of the mess in the world. One of the reasons I am very careful to quote from Scripture as much as possible is because Scripture alive...and I need to remind myself what it says..
You will notice, I also mention Sabbath quite often on this blog.. the weekly Sabbath which is a reminder of the Sabbath that awaits all of us:
Heb. 4:2 For indeed we have had good news preached to us, just as they also; but athe word they heard did not profit them, because it was not united by faith in those who heard.
Heb. 4:3 For we who have believed enter that rest, just as He has said,
“aAS I SWORE IN MY WRATH,
THEY SHALL NOT ENTER MY REST,”
although His works were finished bfrom the foundation of the world.
Heb. 4:4 For He has said asomewhere concerning the seventh day: “bAND GOD cRESTED ON THE SEVENTH DAY FROM ALL HIS WORKS”;
Heb. 4:5 and again in this passage, “THEY SHALL NOT ENTER MY REST.”
Heb. 4:6 Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it, and those who formerly had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience,
Heb. 4:7 He again fixes a certain day, “Today,” saying 1through David after so long a time just as has been said before,
“TODAY IF YOU HEAR HIS VOICE,
DO NOT HARDEN YOUR HEARTS.”
If God's Word is spoken or written, it should remind us all about the eternal hope that we have in Him. For those who might read this blog, or don't understand His promises, I hope that they might come to know HIm this way.. I don't know who reads the blog, but I work with the assumption that , as Scripture says:
Is. 55:11 So will My word be which goes forth from My mouth; It will not return to Me empty,
Without accomplishing what I desire,
And without succeeding in the matter for which I sent it.
The Word of God( not my words) is living and active and sharper than any two-edged dsword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and espirit, of both joints and marrow, and fable to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. Heb 4:12
Rom. 10:16-17 However, they did not all heed the 1good news; for Isaiah says, “LORD, WHO HAS BELIEVED OUR REPORT?” So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.
So, I too, share things about NWO, New Age from time to time, but those things will not save any of us. We could be experts, studying the New Age for decades, but that is not brings hope, nor does it bring eternal life, so my greater interest on a blog where people are thinking about these things and particularly when there has been loss and we are all thinking about life and death, is to share the hope that I have within...
I take the words of Peter to heart too, when he says:
1Pet. 3:14-15 But even if you should asuffer for the sake of righteousness, byou 1are blessed. cAND DO NOT FEAR THEIR INTIMIDATION, AND DO NOT BE TROUBLED, but sanctify aChrist as Lord in your hearts, always being ready bto make a defense to everyone who asks you to give an account for the hope that is in you, yet with gentleness and reverence;
What other hope, what other truth, what else do we have of eternal value to comfort people with, if not the living Word of God?
With all the "bad news" we're hit with on a daily basis I welcome each and every life giving word that comes my way. In season and out of season. Thanks Joyce. -Rudi
"Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction. For the time will come..."
2 Timothy 4
Yes, and I'm guilty as anyone else of being a bearer of bad news, but I like to counter some of it with the Word which brings life..
One of the last things he did before leaving office was to sign Britain up to another treacherous treaty.
No one noticed at the time because the papers were full of a story of the missing girl Madelain Mcann.
Her picture appeared on the front page nearly every day for about 6 months.
Upon leaving office, Blair was entertained by the pope as he officially converted to Catholicism. He then became an employee of J.P Morgan and Credit Suisse in the capacity of advisor on global economics. Each paid him somewhere in the region of £.5 million for his services.
Blair also started an interfaith foundation and claimed that the breaking down of religious intolerance was to become his life's work.
If these events do not affirm his globalist credentials, i don't know what does.
The Lisbon treaty when it finally becomes ratified, will mean the end of the U.K's national sovereignty and guess who has been touted as one of the few men with the experience to head up the newly formed European superstate? That's right, Mr Blair himself.
Meanwhile, the the job of managing the mess of financial failure is passed to Gordon Brown.
What a smart exit Blair made.
Of course it was all planned out well ahead.
Praise God that our future is in the hands of our heavenly father.
A question I continually ask myself regarding what rise of the abominations - will I behave like Abraham - or Lot?
Jerusalem Academy continues to be a source of interesting ( not in the good sense) information. On JA, is mentioned an organization called All Nations Cafe.. I will call attention to the link section of All Nations Cafe:
You'll notice there are two sites about Labyrinths and another about Mandala's, which you can look up yourselves if you are interested, but I want to focus particularly on the Mandala link page:
...which brings us to pages on sufism, Kabbalah, Christian mysticism, and Native Indian spirituality..
I'll highlight some of the more interesting links, but I just want to caution you that they are pretty bizarre:
on the link page of this site, there are many other bizarre links..
This conference off of their site ties everyone together: kabbalists, sufis, Christians, Buddhists, Hindus:
I just want to highlight a few interesting links like Eckhart Tolle, which you can easily find, and then this one called Seven Pillars:
Now you will see some very interesting people in the Seven Pillars such as Jim Garrison from Wisdom University:
The leadership also includes Harriett Crosby from Noetic Sciences:
If you want to find out how convoluted it gets, watch this 5 minute film connecting the origins of Sufism to the origins of Hermeticism:
from this group, we link to:
and from Kalliopeia, we link to:
Where we find people from Global Mindshift.
These we've seen on the site, but here's a new one:
You should read the history on global community site, but it leads you to this:
from conexions, we get to the enneagram, another one of those symbols like the labyrinth and the mandala which has found it's way into popular culture and to the church:
If you remember a few months back, I and I believe Carrie, pointed out the Emergent conference with the Catholic priest who used the Enneagram along with Emergent Village, that would be Richard Rohr, if I'm not mistaken.
Here's the Emergent village site:
and here's where it leads to:
and on this site are people like Marianne Williamson:
with Richard Rohr...
On Richard Rohr's site, we find the All-seeing eye in the pyramid, but he is talking about the trinity...how very interesting. He's talking about his "Lenten hermitage" ...and this form of meditation he was doing.. One can only guess what his "Lenten experience was all about."...
And last but not least on his site we find "One" the movie.
So there you have it, in a short hour I started at Jerusalem Academy website not having any idea at all where it would lead me, and by following the links have connected to the sufis, hermeticists, Kabbalists, Hindus, the Catholics, and the Evangelical Emergent Church straight back to the New Age...
Last but not least, I would love for you to take a look at the links from the Richard Rohr site:
We have such people as Jim Wallis of Sojourners, who is doing the big conference to feed the hungry that I talked about a blog or so ago, that includes President Obama and his Faith based initiative and the ONE organization.. the Network of Spiritual Progressives with Rabbi Lerner and the Global Marshall Plan:
There are the Catholics, the Presbyterians, the Lutherans, the anti-nuclear folks, etc, etc,..
Now there are a lot more links that I haven't written about here or even looked at myself, so for those of you who are interested in doing New Age research and how it is working to bring about Global Religion and Global Government I highly recommend that you check some of these out. Check out also Alex Jones movie:
Alex is Alex, but you have to give him credit.. He ties together the financial political aspects of the New Age movement. He mentions people like Soros, but add to the list Jeffrey Sachs and all the other UN groupies.. You can see how neatly things start fitting together. You don't have to search to far..
The merging of the financial markets, the merging of spiritualities through mystical practices all in the name of helping mankind and world peace..I'm thinking also of the TM conference with Ringo and Paul, another example of this sort of thing. The merging of the political systems through all kinds of Global Treaties which you can find on the UN site among others..
Okay, this is a long post with a lot of information..so I want to end it by saying that this is why it is soooooooo important for us to know the truth.. If we just trust our leaders, it is not sufficient and in some cases it is downright dangerous.
We must all become Bereans.. Peter said
2Pet. 1:19 So we have athe prophetic word made more sure, to which you do well to pay attention as to ca lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star arises fin your hearts.
2Pet. 3:17-18 You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, bbe on your guard so that you are not carried away by the error of unprincipled men and fall from your own steadfastness, but grow in the grace and aknowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To Him be the glory, both now and to the day of eternity. Amen.
p.s. if I made any mistakes on the links, I was multi-tasking while I was doing this so...sorry.
I just wanted to follow up. I have no argument with anything you post Scripturally, as I too am a believer. My experience was such that the day after my husband unexpectedly died, the pastor (who prides himself in exegesis) coldly quoted a barrage of Scripture at me with no understanding that I was in shock and in extreme emotional pain. He was correct in everything he said, but lacked the human element of compassion, it was though he wanted immediate results of joy, but hold the tears (it was more about what he felt, than what I felt). Even at the funeral, exegesis, exegesis, exegesis, but the coldness was bone-chilling. He forgot to mention that there was a man we were mourning that day. When Lazarus died, Jesus wept, He showed emotion. I've become acutely aware of how important it is, that no matter how much we know about Scripture, people need to be shown love, not just speak about it. My experience has left me sensitive. I'm sorry if I offended you by my post.
Someday, we will all meet face to face, and we will know even as we are known, it will be joy unspeakable and full of glory!
Home after dark.
Blessings to you all!
Yes, I can understand how hard that must have been for you and I'm so sorry you had that experience that. I never meant my comments to sound unloving at all, so if they were taken that way I do apologize.
I'm also not conducting a funeral, but commenting on a blog, so of course the context is very different, but even so I would never minimize loss.
I also know that even though there is Scriptural truth we are people that God made with a full range of feelings and grief is just hard. There's no other way to put it, especially when we are talking about a spouse or a close member of the family.
It was only two weeks I was at the funeral of a believer that was very, very hard, a loss of a spouse that was premature and a great shock with some other hard surrounding circumstances. All I could do was cry with this dear woman. I can't even begin to describe how hard it was, and she was a believer, and got up herself and quoted from Scripture...but was devastated.
This last year or so, I've probably lost more people I know than all the prior years put together, so I've been dealing with it non-stop. Many of them seemed too young to go home, so I really don't minimize the emotional side of grief at all.
Personally, I believe need to be sensitive to the emotions of the grieving family and at the same time speak truth. God's Word should bring comfort but is never meant to say, that it is easy to lose someone we love, especially a spouse.
Yes, Yeshua wept and then He was glorified through the death of Lazarus. You are absolutely right, and we mourn with those who mourn, so being cold and insensitive has no place in the body.
Having said that, just in defense of the Pastor, some people don't deal with death as well as others and are incapable of offering comfort at these times. I'm not defending him, just explaining that I know people like this and perhaps they shouldn't be conducting funerals..
Hopefully, you had some others around you who know and love you and were able to offer comfort. So sorry to hear about the loss of your husband and I do hope that you have peace in the midst of this sad loss..we do serve a God who comforts us and I have experienced this comfort in many circumstances in my life.
Service Will Be "VOLUNTARY"
I'm thinking of an old Twilight Zone Episode "To Serve Man"
Sharing the Stage with Obama: Kennedy and Bill Clinton
"President Obama will travel to the SEED School of Washington this afternoon to sign a $5.7 billion national service bill that should allow the AmeriCorps program to nearly quadruple in size over the next eight years."
"The bill would increase the size of AmeriCorps to 250,000 by 2017. Currently, the program has 75,000 enrollees."
"Later today, President Obama will sign the Edward M. Kennedy Serve America Act, a bill that will more than triple the number of AmeriCorp volunteers to over 250,000. The act will cost taxpayers roughly a billion dollars a year, over the next five years."
"The bill also establishes Sept. 11 as a National Day of Service and Remembrance. "
Obama Taps Nike Veep to Head National Service Agency
Obama's selection of Maria Eitel comes Tuesday as the president plans to sign a bill to triple the size of AmeriCorps and expand other programs that the corporation administers.
Established in 1993, the Corporation for National and Community Service merged two previously existing agencies, ACTION and the Commission on National and Community Service. The Corporation initially was directed to manage three primary programs. 'Senior Corps', 'AmeriCorps' and 'Learn and Serve America'
Background and Homepage of the
Corporation for National and Community Service
March 31, 2009 the House of Representatives passed an amended version of H.R. 1388 (Generations Invigorating Volunteerism and Education Act) renaming the bill
"The Edward M. Kennedy Serve America Act"
H.R. 1388 directs the Corporation to develop a plan to increase AmeriCorps positions – including NCCC, VISTA, and AmeriCorps State and National positions – to 250,000 by fiscal year 2017, beginning with 88,000 positions in 2010, 115,000 in 2011, 140,000 in 2012, 170,000 in 2013, 200,000 in 2014, 210,000 in 2015, 235,000 in 2016, and 250,000 in 2017, while working towards achieving a goal of having at least 50% of the positions be full-time.
(H.R. 1388, as of 3-31-2009)
April 20, 2009
The stage is being set for the Antichrist to put a stop to animal sacrifices in a rebuilt Jewish temple.
From fulfilled prophecy:
A meeting is scheduled Thursday in Brussels to revive the Union for the Mediterranean (UPM), frozen since the war in Ghaza, according to a European source in Cairo.
I understand this is significant, can someone please explain why?
On a learning curve, Thanks!
Here's the short version:
The significance of the meeting about reviving Lisbon treaty is that EU for the moment is operating without a constitution and with a rotating presidency, every 6 months. For those who believe that EU represents a revived Roman Empire in fulfillment of Daniel 2, the constitution would be significant. The number of nations in EU don't fit, but the WEU ( Western European Union) is 10 nations.
Others believe that the world will be divided into 10 zones in fulfillment of Daniel, like NAFTA, EU, etc.
The iron in the legs is clearly a continuation of sorts of the Roman Empire, whether it is the EU we will have to wait an see. Welcoming Turkey into EU would also be significant, since the original Roman Empire had Constantinople as a capital, so lots of history there. There is also the element of mixing of clay and iron, which has been interpreted in a number of ways. One thing we know for sure, clay and iron don't stick together because the clay is brittle.
This could be the Islamic component, or...
One thing that we have to remember is that European culture ( the Roman Empire culture) has spread throughout the Western World, just as Babylonian, Persian and Greek cultures touched other parts of the world.
I think there are those on this blog and on FP who believe the covenant discussed in Daniel has already been confirmed. I would not be counted among those people that thing that because I'm waiting for a covenant that includes Jerusalem and is specific.
When the antimessiah confirms it, I think we will know.. Some believe this might be Javier Solana, others Prince Charles, or his son, others Obama,etc., etc.
Personally, I'm not sure if the antimessiah has already come on the world stage or not, and I'm not sure I would be willing to speculate on that yet, but I would want to be cautious about things like this...I'm watching and praying and seeing what's going to happen with Jerusalem. When there is a Middle East plan that includes Jerusalem I'll be watching carefully.. until then, I'm suspending judgement and just taking it all in.
Jerusalem will certainly be at the center of God's prophetic plan, which is not to say these other entities are not important like EU, US UN, Russia, Iran, etc.. but watching Jerusalem is like watching God's prophetic clock, because it is ultimately where Yeshua will put His feet.
There are some that don't think 1948 was significant in the prophetic plan. I am not one of them. I think it was the beginning of a fulfillment of Ezekiel 37, the restoration of Israel. Satan is never happy about this, so anything concerning Israel will be filled with trouble and confusion.
Europe has been called Eurabia because of their growing Muslim populations and the economic influence of the Arab world, but US also has a significant Muslim presence and there are lots of other spiritual influences bringing enormous confusion ( definition of the world Babel) so keeping watching and praying..
Satan doesn't care how he deceives people, just as long as they are deceived ....
Previously, an EU Constitution had been put to a vote but France and I believe Holland rejected it. This time the French just pushed it through without putting it to a vote, and the Irish gave their citizens the opportunity to vote on it. . Many other Europeans would probably reject it too, if they were allowed to vote, but some countries just didn't bother to ask...sounds like dictatorship.
The bottom line from EU perspective is that having the EU without a constitution doesn't give adequate power to EU, so this is a necessary step in moving forward and consolidating the power of EU. They would then have a more permanent presidency, which would theoretically permit the prophecies about the antimessiah to be fulfilled, so that would be significant to those watching for an EU president to be the antimessiah.. The next question would be, who is going to be EU pres, Javier Solana or Tony Blair ( some of the names that have been put forward)..
Again, I am not stating necessarily my views, but some of the common views held out there. If someone wants to add to this, please feel free...
There are many kinds of grief, but the sudden death of a child or spouse, especially if violent, is like no other. The post-traumatic shock produces extreme physical reactions needing care of the one stricken. Until you have experienced it (and God forbid you should), there is NO comparing it to other losses. Quoting Scripture to someone in this state is like acid in a wound. If you have been there and had it done to you, as the widow/anonymous poster above knows, only acts of compassion like just being with those who mourn, is what helps. The exegisis of Scripture is NOT appropriate unless it is references Scripture like Lamentations or some Psalms that mirrors the feeling of the grief stricken. Acknowledging pain is the start to healing. For those who have suffered this type of loss and grief, any reminder of of insensitive ministry of those who mourn is opening old wounds. Tread lightly Jaclyn and Joyce. You mean well, but it is clear you are unaware of the depth of feelings here.
One Who Knows
The Union for the Med, is simply the name which the Barcellona Process now goes. A restart means they are trying to begin to enforce the 7 year treaty.
With all my respect to you and heartfelt compassion for your suffering it seems that we are speaking of an entirely different situation. I have said my peace, so I think I will decline any further discussion of this subject, but my sincere sympathy to you for any traumatic and sudden loss you may have had in your life..
I pray that the Lord has consoled you in your loss.
Thank you for your understanding. Only one who knows can understand.
Interesting responses you have given, especially the last one. 1) You automatically assumed two different widows were the same blogger. 2) If you can't get your viewpoint to be centerstage you dismiss the bloggers by saying the subject is closed. Your sign-in is most appropriate - Joyce said, Joyce said, Joyce said. I won't trouble your mind any further with a viewpoint other than your own, but if you should decide to preach at funerals I know a pastor you could be on the same page with.
URL to article: http://www.infowars.com/the-shill-world-order-pushers-of-the-false-left-right-paradigm/
Never have I asked you to hide your light under a bushel.
I simply ask that grace and mercy would be on your lips during the very week of the loss of a dear friend to many here.
I have been shown God's perfect grace, mercy and lovingkindness throughout my life- most abundantly and blessedly during the loss of my own father.
I'm cautioning you because there's no need to instigate another long and drawn out thread pitting Catholicism and Protestantism during a time of grieving.
By His Grace,
"Moscow, April 21, Interfax - The Russian Orthodox Church has asked the World Conference Against Racism, Racial Discrimination, Xenophobia and Related Intolerance (WCAR), which started in Geneva on Monday, to introduce into international law the notion of Christianophobia."
"'It is very important to the Russian Orthodox Church to raise the issue of introducing to the list of threats the notion of Christianophobia in addition to anti-Semitism and Islamophobia,' deputy head of the Moscow Patriarchate Department for External Church Relations Archpriest Georgy Ryabykh told Interfax-Religion."
"UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon mentioned anti-Semitism and Islamophobia in his speech at the opening ceremony of the conference, the priest said, regretting that the UN secretary general did not 'say a single word about Christianophobia.' "
"Today there are a lot of 'examples of violations of Christians' rights, insults of their feelings, public distortion of the Christian teaching to make the notion of Christianophobia enter the international circulation.' "
Link To Article-
By His Grace,
I guess all the various treaties are related in one form or another, it's hard to keep it all sorted out in my head.
Joyce, your comments re: the peace treaty in 1/07 are interesting. I just learned about it a few months ago, so much to absorb.
Here are some of my thoughts. The first rider of the white horse comes forth with a bow (no arrows are mentioned) and a crown was given to him, he came out conquering and to conquer. To me, that describes Solana...he has garnered so much power, completely un-noticed by the world without firing a shot. I used to think the the AC would be someone with a rock star image like Obama, but Solana seems to better fit the scriptural description. And there is no indication in scripture that the world will be aware of the treaty when it's signed.
Now global government, global currency, global religion. The world is turning on Israel. Economist say we are looking at a tsunami of inflation...Rev. 6:6 ...."A quart of wheat for a denarius, and three quarts of barley for a denarius, and do not harm the oil and wine!" That's inflation.
So many factors seem to be in place, I can hardly imagine they are all a big bundle of coincidences.
Not to mention active military on our soil, whispers of martial law and fema camps, it feels like hell is about to break lose.
I wonder how there could be a future treaty, followed by another
7 years, the timeline seems so advanced already.
Just my thoughts ;-)
The results of two polls show overwhelming public support for Miss California, who chose to risk losing the Miss USA crown rather than give a dishonest "politically correct" answer just to please the judges.
Miss California - 80%
Perez Hilton - 20%
Fox's Greta Von Susteren poll:
Miss California - 98%
Perez Hilton - 2%
Any help I can give I am more than willing to. I, personally have been closely monitoring the political aspect of this for a few years plus, and believe I have a pretty firm grasp of what is going down. Through the help of many here I have become educated in the new age movement, so as to understand the under side of it all. The fact we are told this time would come upon all men like a snare, tells me much of the prophecied time will go unnoticed, that is until its too late! You seem to be on the right track with your own personal research, if there are any questions you have, or are looking for particular documents feel free to ask, as I or many others are more than willing to provide answers.
I often here things of a political nature from my uncle who drives trucks for a medical company. His job often takes him to Canada, where he listens to Canada's national public radio. Many of his comments have led to good research of concrete documents.
I had a visit with him this evening and what he shared with me tonight shook me. He told me while listening to NPR of Canada he heard a report which stated Obama had signed legislation allowing Chinese troops into our country in the event of civil unrest, for the purpose of patrols, detention of prisoners, and maintaining the government. I have yet to verify this, however this is not a man who is into telling tall tales, and what he tells me I can usually take for a fact. I trust that he heard this report, however I am unsure if it is propaganda being spun to the Canadians, or if Obama actually did sign this.
Any help I can get here would be appreciated. Even if it is propaganda. On the bright side of this, my uncle was a Obama supporter who is now begining to see the flaws, and is now begining to take the things I tell him more seriously.
You assumed that I assumed, but you assumed wrongly...I don't take anything for granted on this blog...there are lots of anonymous contributors.
I simply meant I am done discussing my views on the subject, feel free to continue. Don't worry, I don't preach, but have shared some thoughts at funerals and they were very well received... We are on a blog here and not at a funeral, and I was never remotely attempting to give a eulogy with my comments a couple of days ago. Had I were, that would be quite a different story.
Scientists warned that the increase in big-eaters means more food production — a major cause of CO2 gas emissions warming the planet.
Overweight people are also more likely to drive, adding to environmental damage
WE ALL should have been expecting this. So the game of blaming the "usless eaters" begins
Let us know if you are able to confirm. I assume Canada's NPR has no transcripts available(?)
I can honestly say, I don't have a firm opinion at this point on who an antimessiah would be. I consider all the ideas out there and then watch.
The anonymous poster said, it could be a "Jew" because it is a "covenant" and the Tanach usually is referring to God's covenants when it uses the expression "berith". The word according to Brown Driver Briggs, can be a pact, an alliance, an agreement.
Also in the case of the Gibeonites, Joshua made a covenant, so I don't agree that it has to be a Jew or it has to be a covenant in the sense of one of God's covenants. The covenant Joshua made was a peace treaty, which may be closer to the kind of covenant that we are looking at.
It might be someone who claims Jewish lineage, like the royal families, but that is not necessarily the case. The covenant may have some connection to the Temple service, because of the verse that says in the middle of the week the animal sacrifice is stopped, which presumes that the sacrifices have recommenced. This would also require a Temple and an agreement about Jerusalem..Right now there is a big mosque sitting up on Temple Mount..
Jerusalem is the most difficult part of the getting any peace treaty accepted, because it is God's footstool, the center of the earth, it is Mt. Moriah, it is the place where the Muslims claim Mohamed was removed from ( like Elijah), it is the place where the sacrifices are done, it is where Yeshua's coming back, it is where the shekhinah glory of God manifest when His presence filled the Temple after Solomon dedicated it. .It is the most important place for Jews, and the whole world seems to want it too, some want to make it an international capital for all religions..so those are a few of the reasons I think the covenant will include Jerusalem..
There is the very real presence of Islamic nations on Temple Mount and surrounding Israel, that would like to wipe her off the map and see the Mediterranean red with the blood of Jews, regardless of all the noise about Saudi peace plan or other peace plans, so all of these factors must be taken into account.
Walid Shoebat thinks the antimessiah is a Muslim and gives his reasoning why:
I am reasonably convinced of one thing, that Jerusalem will be somehow part of the covenant that is confirmed..and yes, it could very well be existing covenants that are solidified. This is a possibility, but so far the status of Jerusalem remains unresolved. The Masons, the UN, the Theosophists have always wanted to see Jerusalem as an international capital, so if somehow there was an agreement that allowed for at least Christians, Muslims and Jews to worship there and Jews to do animal sacrifice, I would be very convinced.
On that note here is something from today's Jerusalem Post about the Pope's visit and the interfaith dialogue, which of course will pave the way for this "international Jerusalem" :
Zech. 12:2 “Behold, I am going to make Jerusalem a cup that causes reeling to all the peoples around; and when the siege is against Jerusalem, it will also be against Judah.
By the way, I think Jerusalem will ultimately be international also, but not the way the Pope means it and Tony Blair and everyone else and their uncle.. I believe when the King of Kings is seated on His throne and the nations are all going up to celebrate Sukkot, it will be an international city in the true sense that God intended. Isn't that just like Satan to try to produce a counterfeit.
Zech. 14:16-19 Then it will come about that any who are left of all the nations that went against Jerusalem will go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to celebrate the Feast of Booths. And it will be that whichever of the families of the earth does not go up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, there will be no rain on them. If the family of Egypt does not go up or enter, then no rain will fall on them; it will be the plague with which the LORD smites the nations who do not go up to celebrate the Feast of Booths. This will be the 1punishment of Egypt, and the punishment of all the nations who do not go up to celebrate the Feast of Booths.
@ JD re: Chinese troops in America-
I've tried to find reports via the internet that back up your uncles claim, but as of yet I can't find anything.
Your comment struck me however, in that last night as I watched the news about the government not allowing banks to repay TARP funds, I had a (conspiracy theory) moment when it all kinda made sense.
Our government doesn't want the banks to repay the TARP funds because it rather have Control over these banks. Perhaps China has denied the USA repaying debt for the same exact purpose? Maybe, just as our government is now telling the banks who can make what, who has to go, who they have to extend credit to and how much, etc... Maybe China is (behind the scenes) controlling our government the same way?
Just a thought
RE: When Israel signed on to the treaty in 01/07, didn't that automatically include Jerusalem?
Also, I understand (according to Scripture) that the Temple seems to be in place at the mid-point of the 70th week. Right now it is heavily controlled and sacrifice is virtually impossible.
However, if we saw the war of Ezekial 38 take place, God supernaturally gives Israel victory. As a result, Israel is driven to worship, and emboldened to sacrifice on the Mount. Couldn't a tent (or make shift structure) conceivably be quickly put in place to suffice as it did in the OT?
Just a thought. Thanks for your input!
The heat is on...
Here is recommendation 666:
and maybe someone can post the treaty that was signed in 01/07, to my knowledge there is nothing about Jerusalem in it and the status of Jerusalem remains a very hot subject in the peace talks.. probably one of the hottest.
It's a matter of opinion of course, but the most controversial subject of what to do about Jerusalem remains unaddressed, so I don't see how a peace treaty could lead to a rebuilt Temple and animal sacrifices. Now, some of these treaties may ultimately lead to a treaty that includes that..
The Barcelona Process, the European Neighborhood Project, the Mediterranean Union are all EU efforts to control this very strategic region. The AoC is dealing with the cultural/ religious/educational component, as well as numerous other organizations.
I think when we hear of a plan that claims to give the solution for the land of Israel specifically, and Jerusalem specifically then we are talking.. Until such time, I personally believe we are moving closer and all of these things are significant, but not the final covenant spoken of by the Prophet Daniel.
I don't think the makeshift structure will do...because Jews believe they should rebuild the Temple...but anything is possible. There have be propositions about putting a Temple next to the Dome of the Rock, but this would be considered improper. There are Jews that believe Messiah will rebuild the Temple, so you can imagine if an anti-messiah type gets the Temple rebuilt, what he will be seen as..
I'm not saying I have the answers...there's all kinds of possibilities:
You might find this interesting:
Matt. 5:11-12 “Blessed are you when people insult you and persecute you, and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of Me. “Rejoice and be glad, for your reward in heaven is great; for ain the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.
Here is my opinion: It seems (to me) improbable if not impossible that sacrifice on the Temple Mount would ever be allowed/agreed to in a treaty. Based on passed behavior, I don't think the parties would ever make such a concession to Israel, not even in the name of peace. Temple sacrifice will likely be resumed only through force, such as war,
like other territories they have acquired in battle. I could see a scenario where a supernatural victory would drive them to worship (sacrifice) and embolden them to do so by whatever means necessary.
I have to wonder if the animal rights laws they are trying to enact are not specifically aimed at thwarting any attempt by Israel to resume sacrifice. If so, a peaceful concession is not a reality.
Of course, this is just my opinion based on what I know today. I could certainly be wrong, I appreciate the dialogue!
Please attempt to take into consideration the comments of others here- even here on THIS very thread.
Although I know that you get super-busy typing away with all of the many things that you share with us, taking even a quick moment to appreciate that there are individuals who DO pay attention to what you say and call you into account with a RETURN DIALOGUE.
YOU brought Catholicism into this conversation from the previous thread, and there were responders to your comments.
In case you missed their dialogue to you, I've taken the liberty of highlighting some of the responses.
"Your comment in the previous thread bashing the belief (of no doubt a Catholic poster) who speculated "Carrie ...[might] intercede for her" is shocking. When people are grieving, bashing their faith is considered insensitive, to say the least. Let Carrie RIP. Respect those who want to honor her in a shared expression of the Catholic faith."
-Anony Commentor 2:45AM
"Joyce stated, "I would like to empower the person that is waiting for Carrie to intercede ..." Yep, while Joyce uses the death of a Catholic blogger to launch into a homelitic diatribe against Catholic piety, I have a question."
-Anony Commentor 3:54AM
I'm simply trying to request that you choose a different place and time-frame to discuss differences with these Catholic friends due to the recent loss of someone dear.
Thanks for your time and consideration of these facts.
By His Grace,
In principle I agree with you that it's impossible to see how it would ever be allowed....but, if enough concessions were made or enough money given, or, or....
You may have never heard of Jerusalem Academy, but take a look at the 209 page proposal for the rebuilding of the Temple.
and this one:
There are all kinds of possibilities. Prophecy will probably become clearer as it plays out..
I enjoy knowing other opinions and observations...time will tell
Peace of Christ be with you ALL...
"In the natural we are all in big trouble"
You can read it here:
"To achieve world government, it is necessary to remove from the minds of men their individualism, loyalty to family tradition, national patriotism, and religious dogmas...We have swallowed all manner of poisonous certainties fed us by our parents, our Sunday and day school teachers, our politicians, our priests...The reinterpretation and eventual eradication of the concept of right and wrong which has been the basis of child training, the substitution of intelligent and rational thinking for faith in the certainties of the old people, these are the belated objectives... for charting the changes in human behavior." (The Utah Independent, Sept 1977
Dr. Cuddy continues a little further on with a quote from the May (1949) issue of PROGRESSIVE EDUCATION, Kenneth Benne, president of the American Education Fellowship, "teachers and school administrators [should] come to see themselves as social engineers. They mush equip themselves as 'change agents'."
*Guess the public school system isn't quite getting this accomplished quickly and effectively enough so now's the time to aim more directly with that 'voluntary service' bill...
By His Grace,
I've been searching for related articles re: your uncle's info.
Not having any luck yet, but I just wanted you to know that I'm searching.
By His Grace,
"The lengthy document, referred to by Phoenix police as a training manual for the Final Exit Network, offers exit guides step-by-step instructions on how to show others how to kill themselves by breathing in helium. Guides also are told how to dispose of the equipment used in the death and position the bodies so they look like they died of natural causes."
"The manual encourages the guides, telling them they are compassionately guiding suffering people to their deaths during 'a special time.' "
"The Georgia-based group’s manual is included in a Phoenix police report obtained by The Associated Press. The police seized the manual at the home of an admitted exit guide during their investigation into the death of a Phoenix woman who committed suicide with the group’s help."
"Final Exit Network members say they offer a painless and compassionate way for people in pain to end their lives by showing them how to suffocate themselves using helium tanks and a plastic hood. Critics call it murder."
Link To Article-
By His Grace,
I'll repeat...I never said a word about Catholicism...You should read my comments more carefully.
It's not because a Catholic blogger misinterpreted my comments that I said something about Catholicism..
I will repeat, I hope that person understand the power of their prayers. and go to the throne of grace for help in their time of need...If you have a problem with this, what can I say?
I think you are beating a dead horse to death. Let's move on to a different topic. Just agree to disagree if you disagree.
Your research inputs on New Age subjects are valuable, but let's try to keep the comments concise.
I've asked myself that very question. I've been praying that the Lord will give me the strength and courage to simply keep my head looking straight up directly in His beautiful face always.
I tend to have a very compassionate heart, but I never want my heart to cause me to turn my head backwards when I'm called to leave behind those that I love to follow His command.
May we keep our eyes on Him alone,
I was happy to let the comments go, but I felt the need to respond to others who keep beating the dead horse. .It gets a little tiring listening to unnecessary remarks..
I will add one more thing...from a spiritual point of view, I find it interesting on this blog when people bring up Scripture on this blog, the accusations fly.
Now I do understand who the "accuser of the brethren is" so I just find it interesting..
Of course our battle is not against flesh and blood, so I do understand this too..
How painful are honest words! But what do your arguments prove?
But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law, because these are unprofitable and useless.
2 Timothy 2:23
Don't have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels.
No one calls for justice; no one pleads his case with integrity. They rely on empty arguments and speak lies; they conceive trouble and give birth to evil.
The Outraged Spleen of Zion
Sickened" at 2.45am.
Sickened, our judge will be the Lord Jesus Christ - not Mary, His mother, who is dead. We should not pray to the dead.
"It gets a little tiring listening to unnecessary remarks.."
YES, CONSTANCE - WE MUST ALL REMEMBER THAT THE ONLY "NECESSARY" REMARKS ARE FROM JOYCE. LOL
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahah . . .
It was never my intent to stir up strife between us.
My original comment to you was the hope that the grace (and mercy) of the Lord would be on your lips at this time.
I would never want to be hypocritical with such a matter as this, and if you feel that you haven't been shown the grace (and mercy) of the Lord on MY lips as well, then you have my sincere apology for that.
By His Grace and Mercy,
History repeats itself.
See Ezra 3:1-7
The remnants of Israel were rebuilding
Jerusalem after the leveling of Jerusalem
70 years earlier and the ensuing
exile/slavery in Babylon.
They had rebuilt the city wall.
The hostility of the surrounding
tribes was intense when Ezra wrote that.
These former exiles had reached
the point where they built the altar.
There was no temple yet, but they
finally set up an altar, and they
began to make sacrifices.
There had been many families living in
Jerusalem for some time at that point.
And the new city wall made the city
All under Cyrus King of Persia's
watch and with his approval. It was
by his sponsorship.
Now, Jerusalem has been in Jewish
hands since 1948.
After the War, the Rothschilds
bought and paid for all that land
called Israel today. The Zionist
Movement is one of their projects.
But there's still is no altar
That would be illegal.
The Temple Mount is in the hands of
uh, er, um,
not the Jews, even though the Temple
Mount is in Jerusalem !
Cyrus King of Persia was a pagan who
didn't believe in God but who did
everything that God told him to do.
I know, I know.
But it's true.
Paul wrote: "Cyrus King of Persia was a pagan who
didn't believe in God but who did
everything that God told him to do."
Why do you think Cyrus did not belie3ve in God? Here is how Ezra Chapter 1 begins:
1 And in the first year of Cyrus, the king of Persia, at the completion of the word of the Lord from the mouth of Jeremiah, the Lord aroused the Spirit of Cyrus, the king of Persia, and he issued a proclamation throughout his kingdom, and also in writing, saying: 2 "So said Cyrus, the king of Persia, 'All the kingdoms of the earth the Lord God of the heavens delivered to me, and He commanded me to build Him a House in Jerusalem, which is in Judea. 3 Who is among you of all His people, may his God be with him, and he may ascend to Jerusalem, which is in Judea, and let him build the House of the Lord, God of Israel; He is the God Who is in Jerusalem. 4 And whoever remains from all the places where he sojourns, the people of his place shall help him with silver and with gold and with possessions and with cattle, with the donation to the House of God, which is in Jerusalem.'
Does that sound like Cyrus doesn't believe?
Peace and blessing,
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